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Old 2008-07-13, 20:37   Link #41
Asrialys
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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From the website's news:
Quote:
12 Jul 2008

We have read a lot of complaints about the quality of the translation. We are listening to the comments and trying to work hard to improve it. But some comments were made for the Beta version of the products. Somebody sneaked into our site during the testing period and bought the BETA version games at the testing price.

We will update the text files of the games for sale every month and make them downloadable.

We need your help to keep providing the quality products from Japan. Let's build the gateway to English localized Japanese animation products together. Your cooperation will be very essential to make it happen. Please contact info@manga-corp.com for the detail.
So I guess I was right in assuming that the Edelweiss trial I was playing was just a beta version. Although, that second paragraph makes me think that I might have to update my games in the middle of playing them. Well, hopefully they're just minor updates and that the text that already comes in the games is mostly correct.

Anyway, they might worry people if their own promo video doesn't even work anymore. lol I wonder if it was flagged...
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Old 2008-07-13, 20:59   Link #42
relentlessflame
 
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Originally Posted by AvatarST View Post
A thousand times this. Paying for the product is simply a way to support it and to do the legit thing rather than pirating. If you really want the game, don't worry; people will find a way around DRM, and even if they go bankrupt, you'll be able to play the game if that's what you care about, since a workaround is bound to come out well before then.
You win. What I wanted to say was "I guess that means that all you people who won't buy because of the clearly unbypassable DRM won't be pirating the game then either!" If the choice were simply between "buy the game with DRM" and "never play it in English", that'd be one thing. Then I could fully respect the DRM criticisms -- I honestly hate the DRM too and wish it weren't there. I don't hate it enough to not buy something because of it, but I could respect someone with those principles if it really meant not having the product. But we'd be fools not to admit that the option of "pirate the game and bypass the DRM" will surely exist. I'll be pretty mightily annoyed if I see any of the people in this thread who said they'd never purchase the game due to the DRM talking about the English translation of the game later on these forums. If you're not buying the game because "DRM will prevent me from playing the way I want", then you'd better not pirate the game and just bypass it. That's not being clever or "sticking it to The Man"; all that's really saying, in effect, is "I'm too cheap to pay for it". That may be true, but don't expect the companies to be sympathetic to your cause. How are they supposed to know that you would've purchased the game anyway? You're only a customer when you buy something.

There really is a legitimate concern about DRM, product packaging, digital delivery and the like. I'm really not trying to dismiss that. But more often than not, I find the legitimate concern is being drowned out by overt hypocrisy. People here obviously don't have a problem with downloading stuff as a concept. And it seems to me that most people seem to somehow find ways around security measures in those cases. So I have a bit of a hard time believing that DRM alone could be the only reason why someone wouldn't buy the game. (Besides that, like I said, I'm quite confident that the company will let people re-activate beyond the limit if you E-mail them your proof of purchase. This isn't a "software rental".) And just to be doubly-clear, I am not accusing anyone here of being a hypocrite or of being insincere about their concerns. Really, I'm not. But I do think we have to be careful in our criticisms and not make mountains out of things that we know, honestly, are molehills. Sometimes you need to work from within the system to bring about change.

Anyway, all that aside, the news that they're aware of our concerns over the translation quality is good. If seemingly every other gaming company on the planet can release games and patch them after release, then I can't be too upset about that. Here's hoping the product quality is worthy of the original works.
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Old 2008-07-14, 20:30   Link #43
DragoonKain3
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In all honesty, this wouldn't be the first, nor be the last game I would 'bypass' the DRM even though I bought the original copy if in the case I did buy it. God knows how many of my PSP UMDs I've ripped to my stick just to decrease load times (though technically not DRM, still 'illegal' since it involves tampering with the firmware), or even how many times I 'ignored' virtual mate (good riddance, I say) on some of my older english eroges that used to come with it.

And I'm not asking like limited edition box set quality. I'm perfectly fine with how some english eroges are published right now; a pretty looking case, with a colour card in the inside with the list and pics of the characters. Heck, even charge us customers who want it like 40 bucks plus S&H ON TOP of the price of the original game; I don't care, I just want it.


But if I'm only buying the virutal copy? It'd be indirectly supporting DRM, and would set a precedent for other companies to folow if successful. On the other hand, I want more of these kind of games coming this side of the pacific, especially with the recent loss of Hirameki on the non-eroge side of things (cuddles his complete collection of them ^_^). So while I'm on the fence right now, if in the case I choose NOT to buy it, I certainly wouldn't try to 'pirate' the game just to play. God knows how much of a backlog I have with my RPGs to even have the time to try and get this game to even work on my computer. >_>
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Old 2008-07-14, 22:56   Link #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
In all honesty, this wouldn't be the first, nor be the last game I would 'bypass' the DRM even though I bought the original copy if in the case I did buy it.
Well, yeah, same here. For example, because I travel a lot and want to bring games with me, I'll often bypass things like CD/DVD checks, simply because I don't want to travel with the discs. So that was sort of my point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
And I'm not asking like limited edition box set quality. I'm perfectly fine with how some english eroges are published right now; a pretty looking case, with a colour card in the inside with the list and pics of the characters. Heck, even charge us customers who want it like 40 bucks plus S&H ON TOP of the price of the original game; I don't care, I just want it.
Well, I suppose you could buy a Japanese boxed edition, but that's definitely overkill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
But if I'm only buying the virutal copy? It'd be indirectly supporting DRM, and would set a precedent for other companies to folow if successful. On the other hand, I want more of these kind of games coming this side of the pacific, especially with the recent loss of Hirameki on the non-eroge side of things (cuddles his complete collection of them ^_^).
The one thing I'm thinking as it relates to this two sides of the argument, is that if people don't buy the game simply because they don't want a download-only version, what they really need to do is to make sure they inform Circus and MangaGamer somehow of the reason they're withholding their purchase. If people simply don't buy and don't tell them, they'll just assume that the English market isn't interested in their games, and that doesn't further the agenda of the second point. So discussing it here is one thing, but it's really the companies who need to be made aware of the impact of their decisions. In this case, they don't really have any basis on which to make a comparison.

The whole thing leaves me wondering whether the MangaGamer people ever thought about approaching the J-List people about some sort of arrangement for a physical product (since they clearly already have the infrastructure to support that sort of thing). That might not be such a bad arrangement, if it were possible.
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Old 2008-07-14, 23:08   Link #45
Asrialys
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I wonder what they will do if they actually end up releasing physical copies. What will they do for those that have already purchased the download beforehand? I hope they would give those people some sort of discount (like pay the hopefully small difference). I certainly don't want to pay for a game twice.
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Old 2008-07-15, 06:56   Link #46
Benoit
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It's great that the market is expanding. But, I don't like the download-only option with DRM. And here's my main reason:

My main computer still runs Win95, and it's sufficient to play most eroges translated to English today. I bought Figures of Happiness on release, but couldn't play it because Virtual Mate was designed for Win98. Then months later, an official patch to remove Virtual Mate came out, and I was able to play the game without any problems.

Since the games MangaGamer is releasing are obviously older games, I'm sure they'd run on Win95 if there was no DRM.
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Old 2008-07-15, 18:49   Link #47
EdenB
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While I don't like the idea of DRM, with this sort of game it doesn't put me off too much. For this type of game I'll tend to try go through every story and CG within about a week or two anyway then proberly not pick it up again. If it's bypassed somehow though I'd proberly be happier and store the download files and any bypass for later installs.

The price is a bit much but not really bad, I'd proberly not even complain about it if it was D.C.P.C.

The only bit I'm really worried about is the translation quality. They say they're "trying to work hard to improve it" but since even their website has lots of grammar problems, some spelling mistakes and lots of awkward sounding phrasing like 'Holding my hand, Nemu starts running while the bell that is hanging from her neck makes sound.' and 'Besides, there are still time left at this academy.' it's not too reassuring. It sounds like whoever's done it doesn't speak English as a native language from the type of mistakes, which would make sense with where it's based. Hopefully they'll at least get it edited by someone better than that with English before it's sent out.

Last edited by EdenB; 2008-07-15 at 22:22.
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Old 2008-07-15, 19:28   Link #48
DarkWarrior
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Price is the only factor for me.. it's just way too high. They seem to be treating the English market as the same as the Japanese one with these ridiculous prices.. and we don't even get pretty boxes. But as tororo said (Circus CEO I believe?) if these games sell well enough, they might lower the prices and even offer physical copies. Until then, I'm not interested.

And DRM I could care less about. Most DRM restrictions I've seen (music, games, etc) are pretty reasonable. Translation quality is also not a big deal, unless it's really, really bad. Ever 17's translation was a sloppy and messy job, but I still enjoyed the title.

Last edited by DarkWarrior; 2008-07-15 at 21:26.
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Old 2008-07-16, 11:07   Link #49
Asrialys
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkWarrior View Post
Price is the only factor for me.. it's just way too high. They seem to be treating the English market as the same as the Japanese one with these ridiculous prices.. and we don't even get pretty boxes. But as tororo said (Circus CEO I believe?) if these games sell well enough, they might lower the prices and even offer physical copies. Until then, I'm not interested.
Well, we can hope that they give a lower opening price once it's released. It's what they've done with the two recently released titles. But I don't know how much lower it'll go. I think Edelweiss went down 15 Euro temporarily? I can't remember what its original price was.
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Old 2008-07-17, 02:43   Link #50
zalas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Since the games MangaGamer is releasing are obviously older games, I'm sure they'd run on Win95 if there was no DRM.
The MangaGamer version requires a 32bit version of either Windows XP or Windows Vista. The Japanese version requires Windows ME/2000/XP. Edelweiss requires DirectX 8.1, which is not available on Windows 95.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asrialys View Post
Well, we can hope that they give a lower opening price once it's released. It's what they've done with the two recently released titles. But I don't know how much lower it'll go. I think Edelweiss went down 15 Euro temporarily? I can't remember what its original price was.
Edelweiss was originally 50 euros and they lowered it to 25 euros (and it still is at that price).
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Old 2008-08-31, 19:33   Link #51
michelous
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zalas View Post
The MangaGamer version requires a 32bit version of either Windows XP or Windows Vista. The Japanese version requires Windows ME/2000/XP. Edelweiss requires DirectX 8.1, which is not available on Windows 95.

Edelweiss was originally 50 euros and they lowered it to 25 euros (and it still is at that price).
the sad thing is right at the moment there is no legal way to get Edelweiss
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Old 2008-09-01, 11:20   Link #52
relentlessflame
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michelous View Post
the sad thing is right at the moment there is no legal way to get Edelweiss
Well, it'll apparently be back on sale on September 10th. I take it they withdrew it to correct the outstanding grammatical issues.
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Old 2008-12-06, 04:07   Link #53
Asrialys
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Hm...I just remembered what else comes out on December 25

Let's hope that their assurance of quality will hold true.
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