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View Poll Results: Macross Frontier - Episode 22 Rating
Perfect 10 94 58.39%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 41 25.47%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 10 6.21%
7 out of 10 : Good 3 1.86%
6 out of 10 : Average 5 3.11%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 1.24%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 6 3.73%
Voters: 161. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2008-09-05, 20:15   Link #301
cheesie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
Translation: "We don't bash Ranka....but she really is an immature brat." Thanks for proving my point.
I'm sure there's a more eloquent way of describing Ranka's character, and yes, Ranka's fandom could use a bit more positivity, but as it stands now, Ranka's character is flawed, imperfect and immature, no matter how endearing she is... and I believe this is deliberately done so that she would grow out of this. Ranka's time to blossom will come; in fact, we've already seen signs of this in her last resigned confession in Episode 21, when she realized she has to let go of Alto in order to move forward. (I have my own qualms about her leaving Frontier, but that's another story. )
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:18   Link #302
zalem
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You realize some people might be calling Ranka immature, not because of the shipping wars but because she was well...immature in the episode? People will have opinions on characters in their individual capacity without regards to the pairings. Not everyone of course, but some. Like I might think Alto is a dense, boring angsty moron (ha....actually that's pretty close to the truth), even though I am hoping for a Sheryl and Alto end...
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:21   Link #303
TwilightHack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
Translation: "We don't bash Ranka....but she really is an immature brat." Thanks for proving my point.
I like the way you jump to conclusions so easily... especially when you know nothing about me. That just goes to show that you're just generalizing everyone.

Debating and bashing are two entirely different things. While I have nothing against Ranka, I will discuss her character flaws. If you call that bashing, you've a very slim definition of such.
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:25   Link #304
cheesie
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Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
^ Oh I'm moved up from a slave to a partner in crime, I'm honored!
Yes you did, now good luck moving up the hierarchy as there will be wondrous things waiting for you and the people onboard: the honor of serving your Princess Cheese. *gets shot*
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:29   Link #305
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by TwilightHack View Post
I like the way you jump to conclusions so easily... especially when you know nothing about me. That just goes to show that you're just generalizing everyone.

Debating and bashing are two entirely different things. While I have nothing against Ranka, I will discuss her character flaws. If you call that bashing, you've a very slim definition of such.
I am not generalizing everyone. I didnt' say all Sheryl/Alto shippers bash Ranka. I was just calling out to the Sheryl/Alto fans that do bash Ranka on this thread and I see a lot of it.

If what you say isn't bashing then why would the "truth hurt me" as you so eloquently put it? I am not saying Ranka is a perfect character without flaws. But she is certainly not the only character in the show with flaws yet hers seem to be the only ones that constantly get scrutinized.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zalem
You realize some people might be calling Ranka immature, not because of the shipping wars but because she was well...immature in the episode? People will have opinions on characters in their individual capacity without regards to the pairings. Not everyone of course, but some. Like I might think Alto is a dense, boring angsty moron (ha....actually that's pretty close to the truth), even though I am hoping for a Sheryl and Alto end...
So saying goodbye and most likely giving up on Alto for what she felt was right in the last episode was immature?

And for the record everytime I see Ranka's "flaws" get discussed on here it is in relation to the shipping.
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:35   Link #306
Tak
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post

So saying goodbye and most likely giving up on Alto for what she felt was right in the last episode was immature?
Immature probably due to the fact that she picked the worst time and the worst way to do it.

- Tak
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:37   Link #307
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Immature probably due to the fact that she picked the worst time and the worst way to do it.

- Tak

Well I don't think she chose when Ai-kun was going to reveal he was a Vajra. Maybe she felt it wasn't the best time to wait.
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:40   Link #308
Tak
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
Well I don't think she chose when Ai-kun was going to reveal he was a Vajra. Maybe she felt it wasn't the best time to wait.
Exactly, because she 'felt' it was not the best time to wait but all the while never consider the feelings of Alto. This is a trend thats been happening with Ranka's character. She does what she believes to be best for others, but seldom consider their feelings.

Then she had Berera jumped out of nowhere threatening his life and then asking Ranka what her desire was, while Ranka was just standing there. You know, no matter how I look at it, that is just ... a total snafu.

- Tak
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:43   Link #309
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Exactly, because she 'felt' it was not the best time to wait but all the while never consider the feelings of Alto. This is a trend thats been happening with Ranka's character. She does what she believes to be best for others, but seldom consider their feelings.
Perhaps she thought having a Vajra around at the current time would not be the best thing considering the current situation. I don't really think waiting would have been smart. So it wasn't the best time to wait.

Quote:
Then she had Berera jumped out of nowhere threatening his life and then asking Ranka what her desire was, while Ranka was just standing there. You know, no matter how I look at it, that is just ... a total snafu.
I am pretty sure Brera did that on his own. Ranka did not tell Brera to attack Alto. I also don't think she would have watched Brera hurt Alto. Brera was just stopping Alto from killing Ai-kun. But still Brera's actions are entirely his own. If you want to blame someone why don't you blame him?
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:46   Link #310
TwilightHack
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@ Kirarakim

Truth hurts because sometimes its not what you want to hear. Discussions wont always be in your favor and sometimes you may consider it bashing... even if its backed up by a very convincing debate supported by facts. Anyway, I'll let you decide what you consider bashing as opposed to debate.

And by all means, if you feel that Ranka is being over-scrutinized, feel free to add to the discussion and scrutinize other characters or defend her instead of complain about such.

Episode 21, has already been discussed in depth here.
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:46   Link #311
Tak
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
I am pretty sure Brera did that on his own. Ranka did not tell Brera to attack Alto. I also don't think she would have watched Brera hurt Alto. Brera was just stopping Alto from killing Ai-kun. But still Brera's actions are entirely his own. If you want to blame someone why don't you blame him?
Because 1. Ranka brought them over and 2. Ranka did not stop him.

Why can't she choose a place where they can be alone?

- Tak
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:53   Link #312
Kirarakim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwilightHack View Post
Truth hurts because sometimes its not what you want to hear. Discussions wont always be in your favor and sometimes you may consider it bashing... even if its backed up by a very convincing debate. Anyway, I'll let you decide what you consider bashing as opposed to debate.
Quite honestly I don't see much convincing debate. Has Ranka been immature before? Yes she has. Was she immature in the last episode? Well sorry but what she did with Ai-kun was the exact opposite of immature. The truth doesn't hurt because I don't see much truth. Just as some of you are accusing Ranka/Alto fans of not looking closely at scenes (and I agree actually) some of the Sheryl/Alto fans are not looking closely at scenes that concern Ranka either.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
Why can't she choose a place where they can be alone?
Well it's a good thing she didn't because then Ai-kun would have been dead. Ranka did not stop Brera from preventing Alto from killing Ai-kun. She did not let Brera beat Alto senseless.

Last edited by Kirarakim; 2008-09-05 at 21:07.
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Old 2008-09-05, 20:54   Link #313
zalem
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Originally Posted by Kirarakim View Post
So saying goodbye and most likely giving up on Alto for what she felt was right in the last episode was immature?

And for the record everytime I see Ranka's "flaws" get discussed on here it is in relation to the shipping.
I didn't say I was talking about this particular episode. You seemed to be saying that these comments come up all the time in all the episode threads. I'm just saying that there are definitely times where people's complaints are perfectly legit. For instance, episodes 17 and 20...yeah I thought Ranka was extremely immature in those episodes regardless of what I think of the shipping stuff. Not that there isn't bashing going on in relation to the shipping, but it's not all like that.

I actually didn't have an issue with Ranka this episode. I mean, she was barely in it...nothing really to say about her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Then she had Berera jumped out of nowhere threatening his life and then asking Ranka what her desire was, while Ranka was just standing there. You know, no matter how I look at it, that is just ... a total snafu.

- Tak
To be fair, I don't think she ordered Brera to do anything. He shadowed her as usual and he chose to jump in and be aggressive towards Alto. He hit Alto once and that was it. Brera did draw his knife, but considering what an idiot Alto (remember that time he charged Brera in the class room) is I think Brera was just doing that to make sure Alto behaved. Alto wasn't in any immediate danger...I think if Brera really looked like he was going to harm Alto, Ranka would have said something.
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Old 2008-09-05, 21:02   Link #314
Kirarakim
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Originally Posted by zalem View Post
I didn't say I was talking about this particular episode. You seemed to be saying that these comments come up all the time in all the episode threads. I'm just saying that there are definitely times where people's complaints are perfectly legit. For instance, episodes 17 and 20...yeah I thought Ranka was extremely immature in those episodes regardless of what I think of the shipping stuff. Not that there isn't bashing going on in relation to the shipping, but it's not all like that.

I actually didn't have an issue with Ranka this episode. I mean, she was barely in it...nothing really to say about her.
Actually most of the comments I was referring to were talking about how Ranka was immature in the whole Ai-kun situation. I admit Ranka has been immature before but I actually felt she was pretty mature in that scene and yet people use it to hold it against her and why she would be no good for Alto.

Oddly enough I do believe that scene marked the end of Ranka/Alto but it has nothing to do with Ranka's personality flaws. I do think Ranka had an ideal of Alto that was not the real Alto and I think she realized this by the end of the episode.

But as you said Ranka was barely in this episode so why is her immaturity and character flaws being brought up once again? It just gets tiresome.
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Old 2008-09-05, 21:11   Link #315
zalem
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With the ai-kun thing....I don't know, I suppose you could say she was behaving irresponsibly because she is running away with Ai-kun when she agreed to protect the people of Frontier with her song. She is shirking her duties. Of course, I don't hold it against her cause I know Grace and Leon are just using her for some nasty scheme....so anything that throws a wrench in that is ok in my book. And I like ai-kun. Ai-kun FTW!

But thing is, she doesn't know their plans. The only thing she knows is that her songs help them fight the Vajra and protect Frontier and now she is leaving Frontier to fend for itself.

But despite that irresponsibility, I do think she is mature in that when it came down to it she finally let go of Alto. She wasn't clinging on to him and his words to help her make a decision for once. Despite his obvious disapproval she followed through with her plan.
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Old 2008-09-05, 21:25   Link #316
golthin
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You realize some people might be calling Ranka immature, not because of the shipping wars but because she was well...immature in the episode?
I find it funny that people call Ranka, who is a TEENAGER, Immature.... of course she is! I find it also funny that people get mad because they call her immature. I find the most ludicrous that they say that Ranka doesn't deserve Alto because she is Immature! I wonder why they don't call Alto immature. the only mature person in the love triangle was Sheryl, but when you go through what she went, I guess you mature fast, plus being a famous singer help you too.
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Old 2008-09-05, 22:16   Link #317
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Originally Posted by golthin View Post
I find it funny that people call Ranka, who is a TEENAGER, Immature.... of course she is! I find it also funny that people get mad because they call her immature. I find the most ludicrous that they say that Ranka doesn't deserve Alto because she is Immature! I wonder why they don't call Alto immature. the only mature person in the love triangle was Sheryl, but when you go through what she went, I guess you mature fast, plus being a famous singer help you too.
Stupidest excuse ever. Sheryl is a teenager. As is Klan, Michael, Alto.... She is an immature teenager.

Nobody is saying she doesn't "deserve" Alto, but that that her immaturity really shines when she's around him and that she'll never be able to mature if she continued to rely on him for everything. Same thing with Alto, he acts immature at times but Sheryl actually challenges him in some way. Alto x Ranka is not an equal relationship no matter how you slice it. Most Ranka fans will even admit that much.

How the hell did she get brought up anwyay? She wasn't even in the episode for any amount of time. I enjoyed the lack of her tbh.
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Old 2008-09-05, 22:43   Link #318
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Well okay I said my piece so moving on: Sheryl's illness

Personally I think they will find a cure (and the Vajra or Ranka will be the key). It's a common ploy in storytelling to introduce something with no answer (such as an incurable disease) only to find that answer in the end. At this point it wouldn't be surprising if Sheryl dies because we expect her to based on everything that has been said in the story. The surprise will come when they find the cure.
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Old 2008-09-05, 23:01   Link #319
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Originally Posted by Teletha View Post
Stupidest excuse ever. Sheryl is a teenager. As is Klan, Michael, Alto.... She is an immature teenager.
Honestly as much as I like Sheryl I must say that she doesn't act her age at all; I would think she's much older than the rest of the cast both looks-wise and personality-wise if I didn't know better.
Not saying that 17 years old that act like her can't exist, but she is strangely mature for her age indeed. And I guess it's one of the things that make her such a likeable character anyway, would everyone have liked her so much if she acted in a more childish way?


About the scene between Sheryl and Alto: errr dunno, if they kissed that's nice but I'm not really expecting them to have done anything more because Sheryl knows how her disease gets trasmitted o_o After she did so much for Alto's sake would she be so irresponsible to risk infecting him? If she did something like that it would feel a bit out of character for me honestly (and before anyone says they could use protection, even then in her place would you still take the chance of infecting him, no matter how small it could be? I wouldn't D: )
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Old 2008-09-06, 00:07   Link #320
TwilightHack
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Originally Posted by Elehayym View Post
About the scene between Sheryl and Alto: errr dunno, if they kissed that's nice but I'm not really expecting them to have done anything more because Sheryl knows how her disease gets trasmitted o_o After she did so much for Alto's sake would she be so irresponsible to risk infecting him? If she did something like that it would feel a bit out of character for me honestly (and before anyone says they could use protection, even then in her place would you still take the chance of infecting him, no matter how small it could be? I wouldn't D: )
They may have simply been caught up in the moment. It's easy to overlook even the most important details in the moment.

Even so, what was shown is up to the eye of the beholder.
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