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Old 2008-09-19, 18:32   Link #12021
morbosfist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
So your saying his plan didn't cause for casualties and he wanted everyone who disagreed with him to live, as I recall he said that there will be so much bloodshed that everyone will forget about Euphie, or did you miss that
No, you're trying to say it. There's a difference. If you think twisting my words to an extreme makes your position better, you'd be mistaken. Lelouch gives immediate orders. He doesn't give vague orders, as this would be. Suzaku's role in this is to be Lelouch's sword. Swords aren't supposed to act of their own accord.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:32   Link #12022
Sports72Xtrm
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
So your saying his plan didn't cause for casualties and he wanted everyone who disagreed with him to live, as I recall he said that there will be so much bloodshed that everyone will forget about Euphie, or did you miss that
Yeah seriously, If Lelouch gets mad for his loved ones being casualties he deserves another beat down from Suzaku to wake him up. Bonds and friendships are like Suzaku hiding behind morals and aesthetics back in R1. He needs to serious the fuck up.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:33   Link #12023
Narona
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
Perfect example; Euphiemia, her whole character is the basis of unfair since her actions were to help people no matter how small it was and what happens she is geassed to kill the same people she brought help to and is killed and is forever remembered as a massacre princess
True. Euphie never did anything bad till the massacre of the japanese. That was totally unfair. I feel so much sorry for her fans and the fans of SxE.

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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
Well obviously Lelouch designed the plan, but Lelouch is not the type to give people vague orders like that. It invites woeful misunderstandings.
I think that Lelouch said clearly to suzaku what he has to do during all the plan.
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
Narona your a beacon of light in the dark protruding blindness that is the Kallen discussion thread
It's the same in the other characters thread. So don't blame all the kallen fan (I said "some" not "all").

Do you remember babaganush? a C.C. fan.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:33   Link #12024
Dandylion
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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
it doesn't look good for her because she is against Lulu? what do you mean?

And I highly doubt they will stay enemies till the end..
Uh...Suzaku? And the fact that Zero's Requiem begins regardless in Turn 25
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:34   Link #12025
yvj
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
That was not my point at all. I was just saying that some kallen fans think that taniguchi can't be unfair with kallen, but we can't be sure of that.

I know that a some people in this thread are fans of Kallen, but, and excuse me to say that, some comments are biased because some people only see the good possibilities, while the worst could also happen to her.
No

There's a difference between being unfair to a character and having her development wasted.

Euph killed: Unfair but had impact on plot. Development with Suzaku resolved (reciprocated feelings) and her ideals resolved (She impacted those around her. Lelouch, Nunnally, Suzaku, Nina etc etc)

Shirley Killed: Unfair but had impact on plot. Development with Lelouch (she confessed her feeling though it was not reciprocated) AND her death impacted Lelouch and the Gaess plot.

Kallen: Development Lelouch?
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:36   Link #12026
Revolutionist
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
the beating was the pay back
and not nearly all he deserved mind you
Pay back for what, the punch to her stomach before he attempted to refrain her? He didn't deserve any of that tbh, he did stop before actually injecting her and later apologized for it.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:36   Link #12027
Dandylion
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
No, you're trying to say it. There's a difference. If you think twisting my words to an extreme makes your position better, you'd be mistaken. Lelouch gives immediate orders. He doesn't give vague orders, as this would be. Suzaku's role in this is to be Lelouch's sword. Swords aren't supposed to act of their own accord.
And you just don't get it, do you if Lelouch didn't want Suzaku to attack Kallen he would have said so also he hasn't acted to his own accord like you said but your letting that sword comment he made get to you and that has been the thesis for all your arguments regarding this issue
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:36   Link #12028
lovecakecookies
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
Uh...Suzaku? And the fact that Zero's Requiem begins regardless in Turn 25
Oh never mind, I thought you meant as a character as a whole....my bad... never mind then..

We don't know what Zero Requiem is, too early to say how it will affect anyone..
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:37   Link #12029
Dandylion
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Originally Posted by yvj View Post
No

There's a difference between being unfair to a character and having her development wasted.

Euph killed: Unfair but had impact on plot. Development with Suzaku resolved (reciprocated feelings) and her ideals resolved (She impacted those around her. Lelouch, Nunnally, Suzaku, Nina etc etc)

Shirley Killed: Unfair but had impact on plot. Development with Lelouch (she confessed her feeling though it was not reciprocated) AND her death impacted Lelouch and the Gaess plot.

Kallen: Development Lelouch?
She could die protecting Lelouch
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:39   Link #12030
yvj
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
She could die protecting Lelouch
Like Rolo?

So Kallen development was all leading to her rehashing a cliche plotline that was already done less than ten episodes prior?


Sorry if I think that blows
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:39   Link #12031
lovecakecookies
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
She could die protecting Lelouch
She could.. but she is trying to stop him right now.. it would be a twist... and it could happen..
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:40   Link #12032
morbosfist
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Originally Posted by Dandylion View Post
And you just don't get it, do you if Lelouch didn't want Suzaku to attack Kallen he would have said so also he hasn't acted to his own accord like you said but your letting that sword comment he made get to you and that has been the thesis for all your arguments regarding this issue
I at least have one ominous statement backing my position. What proof do you have that Lelouch is perfectly willing to let Suzaku kill her?
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:41   Link #12033
Narona
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
I at least have one ominous statement backing my position. What proof do you have that Lelouch is perfectly willing to let Suzaku kill her?
The M. Fuji strategy could have killed her. Lelouch never thought even once about her during the battle in 23.

I even thought that we would see him thinking about her, but no, not at all. I was even disappointed because it's like that he doesn't care
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:46   Link #12034
Sports72Xtrm
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
I at least have one ominous statement backing my position. What proof do you have that Lelouch is perfectly willing to let Suzaku kill her?
It should be implied. He may not like it but seriously, does Lelouch expect Suzaku to play with kid gloves against forces trying to kill them? An enemy is an enemy. Nunally is an enemy. What does Lelouch expect him to do? If Kallen is not wearing a Emperor Lelouch army uniform what do you expect him to do?
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:46   Link #12035
morbosfist
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
The M. Fuji strategy could have killed her. Lelouch never thought even once about her during the battle in 23.

I even thought that we will see him thinking about her, but no, not at all. I was even disappointed because it's like that he doesn't care
I would say he's focused on bigger things at the moment, i.e. Nunnally and Damocles. As for Mount Fuji, she was well out of range when he detonated it. The Ikaruga had just used its Hadron Cannons, meaning all their Knightmare units were out of the way.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:46   Link #12036
Eliarine
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Originally Posted by yvj View Post
Like Rolo?

So Kallen development was all leading to her rehashing a cliche plotline that was already done less than ten episodes prior?


Sorry if I think that blows
Or she could, in the end, be one of the last persons alive knowing that Lelouch wasn't really the monster he was trying to pretend to be right before sacrificing himself (assuming he does, we're talking possible endings here). Her whole development toward understanding him could lead to something like that.

I could see Kallen being the narrator for the epilogue for example, telling us viewers that while Lelouch (and Suzaku, if Kallen is to be his only real friend alive at the end) died to make the world a better place, no one will ever thank him for that.

...

(...now where have I heard that before...)
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:48   Link #12037
Narona
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
I would say he's focused on bigger things at the moment, i.e. Nunnally and Damocles. As for Mount Fuji, she was well out of range when he detonated it. The Ikaruga had just used its Hadron Cannons, meaning all their Knightmare units were out of the way.
That doesn't change the fact that given other circumstances she could have died.

He sees nunnaly as an enemy and will not hold back apparently (scene with c.c.)

And you expect him to act differently with kallen?

I don't get your point. but maybe it's just me
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:51   Link #12038
Dandylion
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
I at least have one ominous statement backing my position. What proof do you have that Lelouch is perfectly willing to let Suzaku kill her?
No you don't your assuming everything will go that way because of your bias opinion on the characters rather than what has happened up in to this point like Narona stated she could have die in the impact of Mt. Fuji exploding and the fact that he cares isn't gonna stop him from his plan, he said iy himself that this is something he has to do, the silent treatment he gave to Rivalz and Kallen should click to them that he does not want them involved with what he's planning.
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:52   Link #12039
lovecakecookies
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Originally Posted by Eliarine View Post
Or she could, in the end, be one of the last persons alive knowing that Lelouch wasn't really the monster he was trying to pretend to be right before sacrificing himself (assuming he does, we're talking possible endings here). Her whole development toward understanding him could lead to something like that.

I could see Kallen being the narrator for the epilogue for example, telling us viewers that while Lelouch (and Suzaku, if Kallen is to be his only real friend alive at the end) died to make the world a better place, no one will ever thank him for that.

...

(...now where have I heard that before...)
I actually don't mind this one too much..
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Old 2008-09-19, 18:52   Link #12040
morbosfist
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
That doesn't change the fact that given other circumstances she could have died.

He sees nunnaly as an enemy and will not hold back apparently (scene with c.c.)

And you expect him to act differently with kallen?

I don't get your point. but maybe it's just me
There's always a risk that she could have died, but Lelouch is good at arranging things so such outcomes are unlikely.

I don't expect him to order his forces to ignore her at all costs or anything so blatant, but if he were treating her as a threat same as any other, he would have had Suzaku deal with her right off the bat. Even if she is an enemy, he can still arrange things so victory doesn't have to entail her dying as a part of it.
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