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Old 2008-10-06, 03:59   Link #41
Revliss
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can i have a VF-25 Strike Witches ?
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Old 2008-10-06, 04:18   Link #42
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No. The charm of Strike Witches is that everything is based on real-life military vehicles, something the VF-25 is not.

In terms of looks, the closest thing to it (at least in terms of fuselage design) is the Su-27 Flanker (look at their noses). In fact, the prototypes sported a nose gear position similar to the VF-25's.
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Old 2008-10-06, 04:23   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kct View Post
No. The charm of Strike Witches is that everything is based on real-life military vehicles, something the VF-25 is not.

In terms of looks, the closest thing to it (at least in terms of fuselage design) is the Su-27 Flanker (look at their noses). In fact, the prototypes sported a nose gear position similar to the VF-25's.
Or he could just use this...
Spoiler for Size:
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Old 2008-10-06, 04:32   Link #44
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And there's that option right there.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Slight problem: There was no Minigun in world war II. Ever.
Couldn't General Electric got a brainwave slightly earlier? It doesn't take a Thomas Edison to see adapting gatlings to be smaller and carried by Witches and Wizards would help the war; after all, witches do fit into the chopper niche.
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Old 2008-10-06, 05:26   Link #45
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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
It looks good, streamlines the gatling, gives the familiar a place to sit and possible act in tandem with the Wizard, provides a flat surface for the Wizard to perform his barrier tricks, mount an M202 launcher that carries proper-sized sabots while acting as a deflector for the backblast, not to mention distinguishes the Wizard further... I'll keep it.
This may be just me, but I see no reason to 'distinguish' the wizard at all, aside from being a guy.

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Originally Posted by Kha View Post
Try singing. You know how aliens often get defeated by song, or at least get turned into fanboys.
I've got a horrible singing voice, so I'll pass on that idea.

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Originally Posted by selkirk View Post
Actually, the main setting designer works on most of the material (all 3 novels, side novel, doujinshi, anime, don't know if he has a hand in either manga though), and there are actually fairly few places that don't match up or couldn't be explained easily enough. There are probably some honest mistakes, like the map in the doujinshi, and some of the older material has gotten outdated or replaced, but considering it all happens in different years (during which there were big technological advances even in the real world), some things like the Neuroi beam weaponry could be chalked up to new technology. Maybe.
Really? That's a relief. That means the novels will maintain a decent coherency, barring a mistake or two.

And yes, Neuroi are probably the biggest enigma in the anime, considering how much they contrast the other sources. I wonder why their design was changes so much? I mean, its not just late-war development, the first episode shows that the initial Neuroi were already of the anime-type.

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Originally Posted by kct View Post
That is the reason the main supporting guys for the girls in my fic would be flying actual mud-movers (hence the use of a Strike Eagle or a Super Tomcat), rather than strain the girls with something they can't do (although they can do things like tagging targets with lasers and the like, and send a Paveway into the @$$ of the target).
Of course, when sending normal material to fight Neuroi you have to remember their metal-corroding miasma. Normal equipment would survive far less longer against Neuroi then Witches, and would be in need of replacement fairly rapidly, especially the more often it is send out.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Well the problem is sort of that fighters grew after the war and to remain relevant Striker would probably have too as well. I'm also not sure how "against" the setting it really is if you look at some of the earlier designs I personally think it’s the Art Style even more then the exact technical details that matter.
A good way to remember the setting of a fiction work is to remember the time it is set in. For example, Slayers is set in the middle ages, so as far as technology goes you'll see technology limited to the middle ages (I'll admit this is a more global example, but its the first that came to mind). The Strike Witches setting is WWII era, so until the story itself spreads to other eras WWII is the setting that we base ourselves on.

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Depends the danger exists since the impact tends to detonate the incoming round, but honestly what the hell would civilians be doing in the middle of a fight between a tank and RPG teams?!
You're assuming the civilians knowingly put themselves between a tank and a guy with an RPG. Of course they didn't know that, the guy with an RPG placed himself in the middle of a crowd, fired, and used the crowd as cover to get away.

I may not be a military expert, but I know a sneaky tactic when I see one.
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Old 2008-10-06, 05:46   Link #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
This may be just me, but I see no reason to 'distinguish' the wizard at all, aside from being a guy.
Neither do I.

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Of course, when sending normal material to fight Neuroi you have to remember their metal-corroding miasma. Normal equipment would survive far less longer against Neuroi then Witches, and would be in need of replacement fairly rapidly, especially the more often it is send out.
Except when they aren't using it... which seems to be rather often. It also seems to be some kind of gas type thing thus it's somewhat questionable if it would do anything to a jet screaming by at say 30,000 feet. It's even More questionable when the jet is just lobbing missiles from 30+ miles away. This might not even matter though as it also assumes that in 60 odd years no one invents a single viable countermeasure to the stuff.

More information is needed, but given that normal unprotected infantry can in some circumstances fight Neuroi it seems probable jets could do so as well.

Quote:
A good way to remember the setting of a fiction work is to remember the time it is set in. For example, Slayers is set in the middle ages, so as far as technology goes you'll see technology limited to the middle ages (I'll admit this is a more global example, but its the first that came to mind). The Strike Witches setting is WWII era, so until the story itself spreads to other eras WWII is the setting that we base ourselves on.
Yeah that's great too but my point was made in relation to characters moving away from the WWII setting. I don't find the idea of Strikers having bulked out in modern times at all odd or somehow against the setting.

Quote:
You're assuming the civilians knowingly put themselves between a tank and a guy with an RPG. Of course they didn't know that, the guy with an RPG placed himself in the middle of a crowd, fired, and used the crowd as cover to get away.
Yeah okay there are armored vehicles clanking into the city, guys are running around with rocket launchers on there shoulders (you can't hide a fucking RPG under your coat) and gunfire can be heard all around, but apparently no one is fleeing the area and are in fact crowding around the armored vehicles/fire magnets.

Quote:
I may not be a military expert, but I know a sneaky tactic when I see one.
This would just never happen people flee at the THREAT of battle when the tanks are actually rolling in everyone is long gone or running. (Tanks rolling down the streets tend to be mean Bad Things™ are about to go down.) Further more that's actually a clue when you roll up somewhere and everyone is gone expect an ambush. People aren't stupid and they don't fail to notice stuff going on in there own neighborhood.
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Old 2008-10-06, 08:00   Link #47
Keroko
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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Except when they aren't using it... which seems to be rather often. It also seems to be some kind of gas type thing thus it's somewhat questionable if it would do anything to a jet screaming by at say 30,000 feet. It's even More questionable when the jet is just lobbing missiles from 30+ miles away. This might not even matter though as it also assumes that in 60 odd years no one invents a single viable countermeasure to the stuff.
What also needs to be taken into account is how potent the stuff is. The Neuroi use it to devour entire cities, but we don't know how long it takes. It obviously works fast enough to note a Witches immunity to it, also despite how little I may know of aircraft, I don't think any pilot would like to have any form of metal eating substance clogging their air intakes.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
More information is needed, but given that normal unprotected infantry can in some circumstances fight Neuroi it seems probable jets could do so as well.
I'm not saying it will be instant death for any craft who flies in, however in the long term normal aircraft will suffer substantially more damage substantially faster when fighting in Neuroi territory.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Yeah that's great too but my point was made in relation to characters moving away from the WWII setting. I don't find the idea of Strikers having bulked out in modern times at all odd or somehow against the setting.
Ah, missed that part. Well, I myself see adjustments coming from a different angle. For one, I expect jet Strikers to become commonplace, HUD's would probably come in the form of glasses or visors (single eye visors a-la mass effect would look awesome methinks) missiles... are somewhat more of an enigma. They'd be downsized, probably, like Sanya's missiles, that despite being smaller still have quite an impressive blastradius. Its also possible they'll be holding the now downsized missiles similarly to how they are attached to a fighter. Of course this means that witches will be able to carry less missiles into battle then a normal fighter, but that only stays closer to the current setting, where ammunition is already an issue.

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Yeah okay there are armored vehicles clanking into the city, guys are running around with rocket launchers on there shoulders (you can't hide a fucking RPG under your coat) and gunfire can be heard all around, but apparently no one is fleeing the area and are in fact crowding around the armored vehicles/fire magnets.

This would just never happen people flee at the THREAT of battle when the tanks are actually rolling in everyone is long gone or running. (Tanks rolling down the streets tend to be mean Bad Things™ are about to go down.) Further more that's actually a clue when you roll up somewhere and everyone is gone expect an ambush. People aren't stupid and they don't fail to notice stuff going on in there own neighborhood.
I was more talking about guerrilla strikes, not open warfare. When one side is in theoretical control of the city, tanks and other vehicles are stationed in the city, that sort of scenario. In such a scenario all it takes is someone to step outside in a crowded area, fire before the crowd realizes what he's holding, and use the ensuing chaos to escape. If the crowd is formed out of a mob that already wants to see the tank blown to pieces, the firer can take more time aiming too. Pump up the civilians until they start raging against the 'oppressors and murderers' and you'll eventually have a raging mob that will be brave enough to start yelling and throwing stuff at the military. In such a mob, one or two guys with RPG's are damn near invisible until they start aiming and shooting. After they shoot the mob is likely to panic and get the hell out. These tactics are in fact employed in Iraq as we speak (though the step-and-fire one more often so, as the insurgents aren't able to rile up the population to that degree so easily), so I'm surprised to see a military buff like yourself label them off as ridiculous.
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Old 2008-10-06, 08:38   Link #48
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Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
I was more talking about guerrilla strikes, not open warfare. When one side is in theoretical control of the city, tanks and other vehicles are stationed in the city, that sort of scenario. In such a scenario all it takes is someone to step outside in a crowded area, fire before the crowd realizes what he's holding, and use the ensuing chaos to escape. If the crowd is formed out of a mob that already wants to see the tank blown to pieces, the firer can take more time aiming too. Pump up the civilians until they start raging against the 'oppressors and murderers' and you'll eventually have a raging mob that will be brave enough to start yelling and throwing stuff at the military. In such a mob, one or two guys with RPG's are damn near invisible until they start aiming and shooting. After they shoot the mob is likely to panic and get the hell out. These tactics are in fact employed in Iraq as we speak (though the step-and-fire one more often so, as the insurgents aren't able to rile up the population to that degree so easily), so I'm surprised to see a military buff like yourself label them off as ridiculous.
That is why I took the Merkava as an example, since you know, it is an Israeli tank, and uh...not going there. And the fact that survival of its occupants was placed as the utmost priority, not to mention that these guys are probably exposed to urban situations on a daily basis.

Also, the thing about spread of miasma. That is when we said SCREW THE RULES OF ENGAGEMENT and, well, do our best. I know they might corrode metal and such, but then again, wear and tear is a normal situation faced by normal jet fighters (especially if they fly supersonic more than half of the time...). However, the main point is that we are talking about a group of people who knew what they are getting into, instead of charging blindly at the enemy like what typical grunts ala Gundam (before 00) does.
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Old 2008-10-06, 10:23   Link #49
Daniel E.
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Originally Posted by AtomicoX View Post
This thread is in a sense the Nanoha OCT, copied into Strike Witches form. Whoever wrote the first page did a copy-and-paste from one of the Nanoha threads and forgot to format it properly.
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It says that because it's Copypasta from the Nanoha OC threads first post.

Thanks for clearing that up. It's best to know than simply trying to guess.
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Old 2008-10-06, 11:09   Link #50
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Muhahaha Now I shall be the first the post an actual profile!
Spoiler for Who could this be...:
Oh yeah I WENT there!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
What also needs to be taken into account is how potent the stuff is. The Neuroi use it to devour entire cities, but we don't know how long it takes. It obviously works fast enough to note a Witches immunity to it, also despite how little I may know of aircraft, I don't think any pilot would like to have any form of metal eating substance clogging their air intakes.
Dosen't look too fast since we see cities and such that while clearly damaged are not gone. I also seem to recall something about how it's dangerous, but not like instantly fatal which sets another benchmark.

You also haven't countered my point that it might simply not be a factor I mean how high up could this stuff possibly go? To outer space? And again there is the distance factor in WW2 a fighter would to close to within a few hundred feet to engage. A modern jet could be attacking from dozens of miles out.

Quote:
I'm not saying it will be instant death for any craft who flies in, however in the long term normal aircraft will suffer substantially more damage substantially faster when fighting in Neuroi territory.
Perhaps though you've still yet to explain why given what I've pointed out above.


Quote:
I was more talking about guerrilla strikes, not open warfare. When one side is in theoretical control of the city, tanks and other vehicles are stationed in the city, that sort of scenario.
Still fails because vehicles are not just parked somewhere where crowds of people can wander up to them nor would that be allowed too. In fact this is never allowed period the only time anyone is allowed near troops or vehicles is for the most part when invited otherwise a buffer zone is in effect and trying to violate it will at least get you stopped if not shot.

Quote:
In such a scenario all it takes is someone to step outside in a crowded area, fire before the crowd realizes what he's holding, and use the ensuing chaos to escape.
See above, but even more then that the idea of random angry mobs is acutally largely fiction they simply don't appear with any sort of regularity. Certainly not when the occupying army is around to watch... The guys that form such mobs tend to be gutless wonders they talk shit when no one is around, but a humvee roles up and everyone leaves.

Quote:
If the crowd is formed out of a mob that already wants to see the tank blown to pieces, the firer can take more time aiming too.
This hypothetical crowd is never going to be allowed to escalate to this level and if the forces to stop it weren't present the troops would just back off and wait for support. This entire stupid set up seems to rely on the troops sitting around picking their butts for hours as a huge raging mob forms 50 feet away...

Quote:
Pump up the civilians until they start raging against the 'oppressors and murderers' and you'll eventually have a raging mob that will be brave enough to start yelling and throwing stuff at the military.
You seem to be confusing the army with the police... The Army does not have to respect your rights not does it give much of a shit about them. They can
Spoiler for I think I could spot that guy in a crowd myself:



Quote:
These tactics are in fact employed in Iraq as we speak (though the step-and-fire one more often so, as the insurgents aren't able to rile up the population to that degree so easily), so I'm surprised to see a military buff like yourself label them off as ridiculous.
Really? Funny I don't recall reading about the tons angry mobs forming all the time right next to military check points and guys firing RPGs out of them...
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Old 2008-10-06, 11:22   Link #51
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Muhahaha Now I shall be the first the post an actual profile!
Spoiler for Who could this be...:
Oh yeah I WENT there!
The first of many.

And expect mucha swirlz from Pte serial "008R" Erin

As with the IRC, I'm wondering what a Kha-chan x Anita-kun might turn out as... Abusive relationship? >.>
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Old 2008-10-06, 11:29   Link #52
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Abusive? You're the abusive one here! And how many times did you just run off and do projects like this, leaving me alone?!

*obscures nailbat*

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Old 2008-10-06, 11:30   Link #53
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Not very convincing Anita... ^^;;;;;;;;;
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Old 2008-10-06, 11:47   Link #54
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I should point out, just before I sleep, that the original novel Super Sylph and Sylhid were based off the F-15 SMTD; model kits I've seen of the novel version Super Sylph show that it's very similar in design to the SMTD, but with the wings swept more back and stealthing added, and outward canted tail stabilisers.

As for the Tomcat machining tools being destroyed, that was CHeney's fault. Grumman tried to sell the Navy the Super Tomcat 21 that was an expensive uber-Tomcat. Cheney said "Oh no you don't, two can play at being asshats" and ordered all Tomcat machining equipment destroyed.
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Old 2008-10-06, 14:19   Link #55
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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Dosen't look too fast since we see cities and such that while clearly damaged are not gone. I also seem to recall something about how it's dangerous, but not like instantly fatal which sets another benchmark.

You also haven't countered my point that it might simply not be a factor I mean how high up could this stuff possibly go? To outer space? And again there is the distance factor in WW2 a fighter would to close to within a few hundred feet to engage. A modern jet could be attacking from dozens of miles out.

Perhaps though you've still yet to explain why given what I've pointed out above.
I don't see why you're arguing about modern jets, when SW isn't set in a modern era. It's a WW2 show; modern jets don't factor into the equation. You can't argue how knights in some medieval era show are useless since you could cut them down with a squad of riflemen, now can you? It's not really Strike Witches any more if you take it out of its setting. I mean, if you can't figure out a way to deal with it with WW2 technology, then those modern jets wouldn't even exist, considering all of humanity would probably be dead.

And while it might not be instantaneously fatal, I doubt it's in anyone's best interest to fly into what is essentially poison gas. You might not die immediately, but I'll bet it'd at least incapacitate you to some degree. As for the cities, if you're talking about the anime, then they don't even show any Neuroi-occupied cities... of course it won't be covered in miasma. Ostmark was the first country to fall in the Neuroi invasion, and the entire country, or former country as stressed in the book, is described as a barren wasteland covered in the miasma. That's kind of a wide area of poison gas to cross. Even if it doesn't reach very high (and there's nothing saying it doesn't reach as high as their floating hives or higher, considering the hives spew it out as well), most of Book 2 talks about the liberation of one Neuroi-occupied city, where no amount of aerial bombing can put even the slightest dent in the Neuroi forces. They just make new ones by breaking the city down, faster than they can be destroyed, and in the end, it takes a large-scale joint air and ground operation assembled from all over Suomus to really clear the Neuroi out of just the one city. Moral of the story, so what if planes can go over it? That's not going to do anything to help you win the war.
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Old 2008-10-06, 14:28   Link #56
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I don't see why you're arguing about modern jets, when SW isn't set in a modern era. It's a WW2 show; modern jets don't factor into the equation. You can't argue how knights in some medieval era show are useless since you could cut them down with a squad of riflemen, now can you? It's not really Strike Witches any more if you take it out of its setting. I mean, if you can't figure out a way to deal with it with WW2 technology, then those modern jets wouldn't even exist, considering all of humanity would probably be dead.
Because the discussion was about a future setting fan fic featuring said jets... So presumably they did deal with it, but they came back later. I also happen to be interested in the topic because I write crossover crack for my own amusement that involves modern aircraft in the setting hence I'm interested in what others think on the topic.

Quote:
And while it might not be instantaneously fatal, I doubt it's in anyone's best interest to fly into what is essentially poison gas. You might not die immediately, but I'll bet it'd at least incapacitate you to some degree. Ostmark was the first country to fall in the Neuroi invasion, and the entire country, or former country as stressed in the book, is described as a barren wasteland covered in the miasma. That's kind of a wide area of poison gas to cross.
Yeah it would be on the ground, but in a nearly supersonic fighter you could probably breeze by it in less then a hour at 50,000 feet.

Quote:
Even if it doesn't reach very high (and there's nothing saying it doesn't reach as high as their floating hives or higher, considering the hives spew it out as well),
Well if it dosen't reach very high (REALLY high acutally) then the jets can just fly over it so it's a non-issue...

Quote:
most of Book 2 talks about the liberation of one Neuroi-occupied city, where no amount of aerial bombing can put even the slightest dent in the Neuroi forces. They just make new ones by breaking the city down, faster than they can be destroyed, and in the end, it takes a large-scale joint air and ground operation assembled from all over Suomus to really clear the Neuroi out of just the one city. Moral of the story, so what if planes can go over it? That's not going to do anything to help you win the war.
Except you know by your own admission they took back the city with help from air forces. It sounds more like they problem was they just didn't have enough guys to make the bombing work and being able to use normal planes to help drop those bombs would seem to help quite a bit with that.
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Old 2008-10-06, 15:19   Link #57
Keroko
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Muhahaha Now I shall be the first the post an actual profile!
Spoiler for Who could this be...:
Oh yeah I WENT there!
And thus, the flood commenced. :3

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Dosen't look too fast since we see cities and such that while clearly damaged are not gone. I also seem to recall something about how it's dangerous, but not like instantly fatal which sets another benchmark.
Well, the only cities we saw were coastal ones, and the miasma seems to stay away from the sea-lines, so that could have been a factor why that city wasn't eaten down.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
You also haven't countered my point that it might simply not be a factor I mean how high up could this stuff possibly go? To outer space? And again there is the distance factor in WW2 a fighter would to close to within a few hundred feet to engage. A modern jet could be attacking from dozens of miles out.
It obviously slipped by you that I was pointing out another piece we needed info on. The 'but we don't know how long it takes' should have tipped that off, though thanks to Selkirk we know that they can do so damn fast if they want to. The second bit was only to note that flying through at high speeds does not guarantee immunity.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Perhaps though you've still yet to explain why given what I've pointed out above.
Selkirk already handled the height issue. Now as for the range... well, that is assuming the Neuroi of now will still be the same Neuroi in the jet-fighter era. Neuroi advance in technology too, they too develop new strategies. Neuroi use projectile weaponry as well, what's to stop them from using long-range missiles themselves?

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Still fails because vehicles are not just parked somewhere where crowds of people can wander up to them nor would that be allowed too. In fact this is never allowed period the only time anyone is allowed near troops or vehicles is for the most part when invited otherwise a buffer zone is in effect and trying to violate it will at least get you stopped if not shot.
Wander up? they don't need to wander up, they just need to be close enough for a guy with an RPG to get a shot off. Are you saying that military vehicles always clear away every civilian in a 50+ meter radius before driving through a city?

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
See above, but even more then that the idea of random angry mobs is acutally largely fiction they simply don't appear with any sort of regularity. Certainly not when the occupying army is around to watch... The guys that form such mobs tend to be gutless wonders they talk shit when no one is around, but a humvee roles up and everyone leaves.
Please remind me where I said often. Such a tactic doesn't even work if the population doesn't outright hate the occupants with a fervor, however there are times when such riots happen. Usually when open rebellion is only a few steps away.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
You seem to be confusing the army with the police... The Army does not have to respect your rights not does it give much of a shit about them. They can
Spoiler for I think I could spot that guy in a crowd myself:
You picked a lone guy with an RPG standing in an open area right in front of he camera. Now find an image of a guy with an RPG standing in a crowd 50 meters away.

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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Really? Funny I don't recall reading about the tons angry mobs forming all the time right next to military check points and guys firing RPGs out of them...
Once again, even though I specifically mention that the angry mob method doesn't work in Iraq, you take that part and blow it out of proportion. Crowds (note, crowd. Not angry mob) form, it happens in busy cities. Insurgents use these crowds for cover while they fire. These shots usually miss (after all, you try to aim at a vehicle in the distance with only a few seconds before everyone notices what you're holding and what you're planning with it) but regardless of hit or miss, the military does not have the option of simply firing back.
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Old 2008-10-06, 16:41   Link #58
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Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
And thus, the flood commenced. :3
That was acutally meant to get Aaron swrilling on IRC mostly, worked quite well by the way hell it triggered a TK breaker!

Quote:
It obviously slipped by you that I was pointing out another piece we needed info on. The 'but we don't know how long it takes' should have tipped that off, though thanks to Selkirk we know that they can do so damn fast if they want to. The second bit was only to note that flying through at high speeds does not guarantee immunity.
This still doesn't get around the fact that many of the units don't even acutally seem to make the stuff at all so you could kill them easily even if you have to avoid certain areas. Either way this hardly makes normal fighters useless.

Quote:
Selkirk already handled the height issue. Now as for the range... well, that is assuming the Neuroi of now will still be the same Neuroi in the jet-fighter era. Neuroi advance in technology too, they too develop new strategies. Neuroi use projectile weaponry as well, what's to stop them from using long-range missiles themselves?
Handled it how he didn't really give a number that would prove jets couldn't fly over it which leaves the door open. As for the second bit yeah they might develop more tech in the future or they might not that's rather up to the author of the work to decide (as apparently are some of the finer details of the Neuroi fart cloud), but for someone say planning a straight crossover that's not really an issue.

As for the entire mob thing it's getting OT and I want to try and keep this topic vaugely about stuff related to SWs so let's just drop it.
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Old 2008-10-06, 18:40   Link #59
kct
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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Originally Posted by Tk3997 View Post
Because the discussion was about a future setting fan fic featuring said jets... So presumably they did deal with it, but they came back later. I also happen to be interested in the topic because I write crossover crack for my own amusement that involves modern aircraft in the setting hence I'm interested in what others think on the topic.
Plus the fact that in the 50-60+ year gap between the current setting, they could be throwing skirmishes at each other, with neither side winning the war, until the present. What I am trying to break here is the timeline factor, I'm fine if the others want to stay in WWII (more than enough people can deal with it), but people want to see what happens after the initial war was stopped (something like post-1945, not to mention IMHO WWII has been done to death, even if it is an alternate universe), and the world entered into something equivalent of a Cold War. Of course, the kicker would be if someone decided to have the TSAB cross over in the modern setting (don't deny it, I know some of the people here have ideas like that).

Of course, as expected, the Neuroi would advance like what humans did, but they might advance to a point where they need to sacrifice firepower to attain the sort of speed and maneuverability comparable to that of a fighter jets (even if that means that they pack only a single laser and a couple of missiles). It is all about the trade-off to balance it out (well, more so, since Neuroi are SUPPOSEDLY based on the things they ate). Obviously, results from the Me-262 prompted development of Jet Strikers (although not all Striker equivalent of post-WWII aircraft would be developed, for example, the cost of developing the F-14 Tomcat is so great that their Striker equivalents was not given the green light, ceding development to the Striker version of the VFAX, which end up being the F/A-18 Hornet) plus newer generation of weaponry, but they would still prove to be buggy in the initial phases for example, problems associated with the M60 in the Vietnam War, waged on the Neurois who decided to concentrate on Asia, entering a hole those in Europe did not expect. On the air combat front, missiles did not perform as everyone hoped, bringing many-a-fatal end to the gunless birds.

Also, the plans I have is to initially concentrate on a squadron of Witches, backed by a naval fighter squadron (no romance), operating off a Nimitz-class carrier (there are other squadrons on board the CVN, but I would focus on one). No, it wouldn't be eaten like Akagi, although its compatriots might. Fighting Neurois was one problem. They didn't know that there was an organization bent on letting the Neurois take over the entire Earth (that was where all the BS superplanes, flying fortresses, and the like might come in).

Last edited by kct; 2008-10-06 at 19:56.
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Old 2008-10-06, 20:06   Link #60
Kha
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Join Date: Apr 2007
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Originally Posted by selkirk View Post
I don't see why you're arguing about modern jets, when SW isn't set in a modern era. It's a WW2 show; modern jets don't factor into the equation. You can't argue how knights in some medieval era show are useless since you could cut them down with a squad of riflemen, now can you? It's not really Strike Witches any more if you take it out of its setting. I mean, if you can't figure out a way to deal with it with WW2 technology, then those modern jets wouldn't even exist, considering all of humanity would probably be dead.

And while it might not be instantaneously fatal, I doubt it's in anyone's best interest to fly into what is essentially poison gas. You might not die immediately, but I'll bet it'd at least incapacitate you to some degree. As for the cities, if you're talking about the anime, then they don't even show any Neuroi-occupied cities... of course it won't be covered in miasma. Ostmark was the first country to fall in the Neuroi invasion, and the entire country, or former country as stressed in the book, is described as a barren wasteland covered in the miasma. That's kind of a wide area of poison gas to cross. Even if it doesn't reach very high (and there's nothing saying it doesn't reach as high as their floating hives or higher, considering the hives spew it out as well), most of Book 2 talks about the liberation of one Neuroi-occupied city, where no amount of aerial bombing can put even the slightest dent in the Neuroi forces. They just make new ones by breaking the city down, faster than they can be destroyed, and in the end, it takes a large-scale joint air and ground operation assembled from all over Suomus to really clear the Neuroi out of just the one city. Moral of the story, so what if planes can go over it? That's not going to do anything to help you win the war.
Considering that the Neuroi digest metal in this manner, the miasma must be a very rich substance. If there was a means to vacuum the stuff up and use it, imagine armor trucks driving into a cloud and...

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Originally Posted by kct View Post
Plus the fact that in the 50-60+ year gap between the current setting, they could be throwing skirmishes at each other, with neither side winning the war, until the present. What I am trying to break here is the timeline factor, I'm fine if the others want to stay in WWII (more than enough people can deal with it), but people want to see what happens after the initial war was stopped (something like post-1945, not to mention IMHO WWII has been done to death, even if it is an alternate universe), and the world entered into something equivalent of a Cold War. Of course, the kicker would be if someone decided to have the TSAB cross over in the modern setting (don't deny it, I know some of the people here have ideas like that).

Of course, as expected, the Neuroi would advance like what humans did, but they might advance to a point where they need to sacrifice firepower to attain the sort of speed and maneuverability comparable to that of a fighter jets (even if that means that they pack only a single laser and a couple of missiles). It is all about the trade-off to balance it out (well, more so, since Neuroi are SUPPOSEDLY based on the things they ate). Obviously, results from the Me-262 prompted development of Jet Strikers (although not all Striker equivalent of post-WWII aircraft would be developed, for example, the cost of developing the F-14 Tomcat is so great that their Striker equivalents was not given the green light, ceding development to the Striker version of the VFAX, which end up being the F/A-18 Hornet) plus newer generation of weaponry, but they would still prove to be buggy in the initial phases for example, problems associated with the M60 in the Vietnam War, waged on the Neurois who decided to concentrate on Asia, entering a hole those in Europe did not expect. On the air combat front, missiles did not perform as everyone hoped, bringing many-a-fatal end to the gunless birds.

Also, the plans I have is to initially concentrate on a squadron of Witches, backed by a naval fighter squadron (no romance), operating off a Nimitz-class carrier (there are other squadrons on board the CVN, but I would focus on one). No, it wouldn't be eaten like Akagi, although its compatriots might. Fighting Neurois was one problem. They didn't know that there was an organization bent on letting the Neurois take over the entire Earth (that was where all the BS superplanes, flying fortresses, and the like might come in).
Erm, first Miasium, now the Brotherhood of Roi?

This might frighten the OC vets, but I'm... inspired.
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