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Old 2008-10-28, 18:20   Link #81
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Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
There's no proof that clare could do such a thing. It seems more probable that this was her original awakened form. For example look at alicia and beth. Alicia has a special black armor for her awakened form therefore it is allways the same because if it wouldn't why forge an armor for her?
The first example of shape shifting is Isley, he has one body, but he can change his arms into anything he wants.

We have Clare asking for something and then getting it.

Agatha (the #2 Ab in Ramona) had 3 different shapes, you can argue that is was the same modified, but at the end of the day, she was able to us her body three different ways.
Big Crab like shape
Big human shape
Small human shape, her true shape.

We have that last Ab that Clare and Cynthia killed. She first used an attack similar to Riful. She then went into a mini Agatha shape. And for the ultimate shape shifting she got wings and flu away. The most interesting thing about her is that she was able to separate her body into two. This allows for allot off possibilities, regardless of what her true Ab form is, in theory she could make her lower half into anything she wanted.

It’s all speculation, in the end Yagi can just make Clare Ab form into a single shape. But with all what have happened in the manga, he has allot of flexibility for an awakened Clare.
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Old 2008-10-29, 14:52   Link #82
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Maybe some Awakeneds can change their body at will but I think if we see Clare almost Awakening again her form should be similar to the one she had against Rigardo
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Old 2008-10-29, 20:02   Link #83
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Originally Posted by MisterJB View Post
Maybe some Awakeneds can change their body at will but I think if we see Clare almost Awakening again her form should be similar to the one she had against Rigardo
Yeah, but hopefully on a totally different scale of "Bad-ass". Or sufficiently dangerous looking to give an Abyssal One second thoughts.
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Old 2008-10-29, 20:17   Link #84
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It was very strong. Her legs were much faster than rigald the speed devil. Clare couldn't control them, that was the problem. The moment she awakened her arms rigardo was a goner.
But perhaps she will "ripen" a bit
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Old 2008-10-29, 20:21   Link #85
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Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
It was very strong. Her legs were much faster than rigald the speed devil. Clare couldn't control them, that was the problem. The moment she awakened her arms rigardo was a goner.
But perhaps she will "ripen" a bit
To be fair he was only a goner due to losing an arm, if he had both arms attached, then the battle may of resulted in something different.
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Old 2008-10-29, 20:26   Link #86
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Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
It was very strong. Her legs were much faster than rigald the speed devil. Clare couldn't control them, that was the problem. The moment she awakened her arms rigardo was a goner.
But perhaps she will "ripen" a bit
Correction...if you go back and read chapter 59 then you'll realize that she DID bring her legs under control. It was only by through doing that that she could take out Rigardo. After all, two awakened arms count for little if you can't get near the guy.
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Old 2008-10-29, 21:05   Link #87
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As far as i remember she controlled her legs with her arms but i read it again.
But as far as i remember rigardo said the same as i said.

okay - scanning done...
clare awakened her left arm a bit to use it as an anchor to control her legs. This isn't a control someone normaly has over his legs.
Clare did improvise as allways in order to win
After she fully awakened her arms rigardo was a goner. Even with both arms he wouldn't stand a chance against 4 limbed awakened clare. She simply would have torn him to lion steaks in millseconds.
But it helped clare that he has only one arm left to awaken her arms and survive until that point - that's 4 sure. There aren't only 2 awakened arms - this is "queen of blades" mode Perhaps she could even prolong them
at will like in the anime was shown. There's no awakened nr. 2 on earth who could last out long against this. Even with her poor control search and destroy would probably be enough to shred someone lik agatha into little pieces in a matter
of seconds with this. What i originally intended to say was that clare's 4 limbed awakening IS actually very strong if she would be able to control her arms and legs normally.
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Old 2008-10-30, 00:26   Link #88
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Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
As far as i remember she controlled her legs with her arms but i read it again.
But as far as i remember rigardo said the same as i said.

okay - scanning done...
clare awakened her left arm a bit to use it as an anchor to control her legs. This isn't a control someone normaly has over his legs.
Clare did improvise as allways in order to win
After she fully awakened her arms rigardo was a goner. Even with both arms he wouldn't stand a chance against 4 limbed awakened clare. She simply would have torn him to lion steaks in millseconds.
But it helped clare that he has only one arm left to awaken her arms and survive until that point - that's 4 sure. There aren't only 2 awakened arms - this is "queen of blades" mode Perhaps she could even prolong them
at will like in the anime was shown. There's no awakened nr. 2 on earth who could last out long against this. Even with her poor control search and destroy would probably be enough to shred someone lik agatha into little pieces in a matter
of seconds with this. What i originally intended to say was that clare's 4 limbed awakening IS actually very strong if she would be able to control her arms and legs normally.
The key question for the Island War thread has to be whether it'll be enough...enough to take down an Abyssal One without Claire awakening all the way and losing her mind herself? She can kill awakened number 2s, so even if an Abyssal is considerably more powerful, Claire should stand a fighting chance with all four limbs awakened.
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Old 2008-10-30, 01:17   Link #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterJB View Post
Maybe some Awakeneds can change their body at will but I think if we see Clare almost Awakening again her form should be similar to the one she had against Rigardo
My instincts tell me it will be different. At least for a final awakening, the one that fought Rigardo isn't spectacular enough for my standards. Clares final awakened form should make people gasp.
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Old 2008-10-30, 11:44   Link #90
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Originally Posted by revan5
Claire should stand a fighting chance with all four limbs awakened.
If she is able to control her legs and arms in an normal way she probably would stand more than a chance. Rigardo said that isley is faster despite his huge frame of motion but if he would have the speed as clare's legs have he had probably said that isley is waayyyy more faster than him. But this is spekulation. IMO isley has not the speed clare had with her legs. rigardo also tried to fight isley so he hoped he could beat him somehow. therefore the speed gap between those two shouldn't be that large. But again, only spekulation. And besides. Isley isn't probably the most dangerous enemy clare will have to face. There is raciella and priscilla which are probably way more stronger than isley or riful. There are the dragon kin and there is rubel. Perhaps rubel can fight too and if he can i bet it will be in some kind of nasty way.
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Old 2008-10-30, 11:47   Link #91
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Well Based on Shape Clare would have a chance against Riful and Alica in her "Blade Queen Mode", but Isley can fight from a distance so its a little harder. Even if Clare can get to a spot in a instant if she "aims" a little first. Well it will be interesting to see whats changed in her form the next time she does it.
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Old 2008-10-30, 23:55   Link #92
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Originally Posted by Sordes Pilosus View Post
Well Based on Shape Clare would have a chance against Riful and Alica in her "Blade Queen Mode", but Isley can fight from a distance so its a little harder. Even if Clare can get to a spot in a instant if she "aims" a little first. Well it will be interesting to see whats changed in her form the next time she does it.
That would be interesting.

Now then, it's about time we thought about "turning" points in the upcoming Island War (well technically it started off once the Ghosts came back to Rabona to kick off their rebellion). I've thought of a few we've already seen.

1. Capture of Organization's "Eye", No. 6, Renee
-essentially this is doubly damaging for the Organization...not only does it give Riful a way to completely shift the balance of power on the island, but it also takes away a strong fighter & skilled observer upon whom the Organization depends for its intelligence

2. Miata/Clarice deserting the Organization
-While it is still too early to say that they are on the Ghosts' side, they seem to have deserted the Organization completely. Still it seems likely they'll fight alongside the Ghosts with Galatea helping, and consequently their strength robs the Organization of both a potential new No 1 & also dramatically strengthens the Ghosts' fighting power.

So far the Ghosts have been the only faction to gain more power. Riful may yet gain dramatically more power as part of the "Western Abyssal(s)" faction if she can awaken a new Abyssal One.

The question has to be, if just a few more single digits join the Ghosts (I'd guess No 6 Renee might), then when do we reach tipping point? When do the Ghosts' equal the Organization in strength? What happens when the Organization realizes it's being overpowered? Does it call in backup when that happens or do their enemies intervene as Rubel suggested when they're at a "suicidal" level?

As for Riful, how big a threat would her faction be if she had a new Abyssal ally to the Organization, Alicia & Beth? How big a threat to the Ghosts or the Southern Abyssals?
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Old 2008-10-31, 12:26   Link #93
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I don't think Renned would betray the Organization.
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:09   Link #94
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I don't think Renned would betray the Organization.
But yet I can't see them forgiving her for awakening a new Abyssal One. It would seem not so plausible at the moment for her to join the Ghosts, but bear in mind the Ghosts have unparalleled intelligence on the Organization's true motives. Additionally they are the only ones with the ability to even consider rescuing her. Even someone like Renee might be swayed if the evidence of the Organization's true motives were sufficiently powerful.

Or if they let her go perhaps she'll spread the story around...causing conflicting opinions and dissent amongst the Organization's Claymores. You can imagine it now...do we believe these ex-Claymores who saved our comrades' butts on several occasions or our own bosses?

That in turn might be a key turning point...when the Organization's formerly loyal fighters begin to fight amongst themselves.
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:12   Link #95
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But yet I can't see them forgiving her for awakening a new Abyssal One. It would seem not so plausible at the moment for her to join the Ghosts, but bear in mind the Ghosts have unparalleled intelligence on the Organization's true motives. Additionally they are the only ones with the ability to even consider rescuing her. Even someone like Renee might be swayed if the evidence of the Organization's true motives were sufficiently powerful.

Or if they let her go perhaps she'll spread the story around...causing conflicting opinions and dissent amongst the Organization's Claymores. You can imagine it now...do we believe these ex-Claymores who saved our comrades' butts on several occasions or our own bosses?

That in turn might be a key turning point...when the Organization's formerly loyal fighters begin to fight amongst themselves.
with that I agree, she probrably will become a spy for the Ghosts in the Organization
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:16   Link #96
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with that I agree, she probrably will become a spy for the Ghosts in the Organization
That would be one heck of a spy. That'd give them info from 3 "Eyes", giving them an absolutely unrivaled ability to know what's going on. Surely having 2 "Eyes" now and perhaps with Renee 3 in the future will be an incredible advantage. The Organization is dangerously reliant upon her for intelligence...and the Ghosts might just be able to take advantage of that.
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:27   Link #97
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That would be one heck of a spy. That'd give them info from 3 "Eyes", giving them an absolutely unrivaled ability to know what's going on. Surely having 2 "Eyes" now and perhaps with Renee 3 in the future will be an incredible advantage. The Organization is dangerously reliant upon her for intelligence...and the Ghosts might just be able to take advantage of that.
but it would be very hard for Rene to fool the Organization
remember Galatea? SHe lied to the Organization and they somehow found it out very quickly
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:32   Link #98
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but it would be very hard for Rene to fool the Organization
remember Galatea? SHe lied to the Organization and they somehow found it out very quickly
Well then her only other choice then by your own logic would be to join the Ghosts...if I'm reading you right. If they tell Renee what they know you think the Organization will really want to have her back if they know she's been "tampered" with? More likely just by hearing it Renee will realize it will be impossible to go back.

After all, why would you trust someone if you knew she'd been told your side was the bad guys? It is very hard for me to see Renee coming back if she hears what the Ghosts know. I'd guess she might be in the same boat as Clarice/Miata. Still, her loss, while not as devastating war power wise as Miata's, will hammer the Organization's ability to know what is going on within the island. Utter chaos will likely reign until they get another "Eye" to make up for her loss. Whether she dies or joins the Ghosts, her loss means an incredible disadvantage for the Organization in the upcoming fight.
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:39   Link #99
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Well then her only other choice then by your own logic would be to join the Ghosts...if I'm reading you right. If they tell Renee what they know you think the Organization will really want to have her back if they know she's been "tampered" with? More likely just by hearing it Renee will realize it will be impossible to go back.

After all, why would you trust someone if you knew she'd been told your side was the bad guys? It is very hard for me to see Renee coming back if she hears what the Ghosts know. I'd guess she might be in the same boat as Clarice/Miata. Still, her loss, while not as devastating war power wise as Miata's, will hammer the Organization's ability to know what is going on within the island. Utter chaos will likely reign until they get another "Eye" to make up for her loss. Whether she dies or joins the Ghosts, her loss means an incredible disadvantage for the Organization in the upcoming fight.
Well my logic is a little messed up

Renee doesn't seem the kind to betray the Organization and even if Clare don't tell her what she knows if she comes back to the Organization and they find out she was the one creating Raciella she will probrably be killed on the spot
And I think she will not die because it would be a waste to the series however we have seen that hapening in the past (Flora, Undine, etc)

SO she has two choice, she can hide in Rabona, just like Clarice and MIata or she can go back to the Organization and hope she is useful enough for they to be merciful
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Old 2008-10-31, 13:58   Link #100
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You guys do know that maybe it's not Renee who awakens Raciella. Maybe the part that was Raphaela senses a familiar presence as in Teresa from Clare, and that is enough to get it out of its slumber. I mean think of poor Renee if she does everything not to awaken it, and then it happens anyway.
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