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Old 2008-11-27, 20:28   Link #1121
TinyRedLeaf
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Singapore
Age: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
You do realize some people may not like it for they see this as an insult, making cheap cash outta the bible, disrespectful or other negative reasons. Go back to that link & read some of the comments left by readers.
Oh I have. It's par on course for what I'd expect from some people.

Whoever mandated that Christianity must be a stuffy, boring affair in order to be "respectable"?

Is it any wonder that church attendance is falling across Europe? Between the long-winded sermon of a dowdy, didactic pastor, and the singing, clapping, foot-tapping congregation of a black gospel church, which do you think most church-goers would prefer?

If Paul the Apostle were alive today, how do you think he'd go about spreading the New Testament to as many people as possible? Bearing in mind that he was the one who did more than any other disciple, personally travelling the length and breadth of the Mediterranean, to spread Jesus' good news?

Let's not forget, too, that one of the many reasons the late Pope John Paul was so popular was because he was an immensely telegenic man.

It's all about spreading the good Word, to as many people as possible. So I say, free your mind. Don't stay stuck in the past. Use what works today.
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Old 2008-11-27, 21:19   Link #1122
Mystique
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But there requries a balance TRL, and that (to me) crosses it. The example you're using speaks of catholism, the side of christianity that pertains mainly to rituals and old traditions.
So yes, with the world and society changing drastically as it is in the last 50 years (last 10 with the internet), less people are inclined to go to church, but that isn't pinned down merely the style of the service, but simply to the attitudes of society. Lot more athiests about, lots more agonostic people, lots more others who are willing to use religion as a custom to regluate their lives rather than actually believing in something simply cause they can't see it.
Saying that, Christianity has been poked at and challenged and parodied so many times esp from the 70's onwards, that those who do feel offended and protest are now seen as 'annoying people'
What does that say about us all then?
Glance at the danish event with the muslim comic strip and you saw the reaction there.
A century or so ago when the church did have more power, it'd have provoked a similar response in England. Even to say something bout the king/queen at the time could be a neck-chopping offense.

And while there are methodists, baptists, and tons more diverse branches of christianity, some others that may seem more 'fun', the bible at the end of the day still remains in some form of '1 thick book'.
Besides you guys should go browse christian bookstores more, there are tons of material and versions of chapters of the bible or testaments of it in colour, with pictures or designs.
Lots broken down into simple explaination, kids bible stories and so on; it's not like we've only just realised that we need to keep with the times
Saying that, it tends to be key words that turn people off regardless.
Testament, bible, good word, the great book...
Once people get wind of what it's an interpretation of, they kinda tune out (this is something she's personally noticed)
Swedish dude is just making a buck tho, one of the things about the bible is that it's subject to interpretation (which causes all kinds of fun as we all know)
So why take more of the text out of context and place it in a visual media and imagery that has nothing to do with it?
Some of you may say 'but it helps young people to relate' - i'll counter that with 'again... visit a few christian bookstores and stuff, it's not an idea that has just recently clocked on'
It looks good on a general 'ohh let's have a peek at it', but those not into christianity or have never touched a bible will not gain anything significant from it methinks, nor gain a feeling to suddenly visit lots of various branches of christianity to see what each style of service is like, in addition, "with no chapter or verse numbers" - means that if someone did like a certain aspect of a chapter, they wouldn't be able to relate the passage to cross reference it.
It's like using journals without footnotes, reading a fiction book without page numbers or chapters.
Secondly, many public places (uk wise) don't allow religion related material in shops, cafes or (in my case, libraries) if it's not part of the business itself, because if it trips one off, others are wanna gonna do the same and we begin again with possible confrontation.

PS:
cockney bible rules xD
(Purely for laughs)
Quote:
In it, Jesus feeds "five thousand geezers" with "five loaves of Uncle Fred and two Lillian Gish". The Lord's Prayer morphs from "For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory" to "You're the Boss, God, and will be for ever, innit?"
And the lego dudes/lego bible are cute too

edit: speaking about the queen xD
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/e...re/7751770.stm
Well, it's just an arrestable offence for now i guess :P

and those doing their bit for nature, by getting down with nature...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/7752852.stm
(it's a vid, keep an eye about 30secs in, lol)

And from BBC's top ten Odd Box, for funky news around the world (number 1 rules, lol)

Frozen turkey bingo, the world's biggest pillow fight and the cat with far too many toes. It's Newsbeat's Odd Box with Dominic Byrne.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/hi/en...00/7753638.stm
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Last edited by Mystique; 2008-11-27 at 21:34.
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Old 2008-11-28, 07:57   Link #1123
TinyRedLeaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
So yes, with the world and society changing drastically as it is in the last 50 years (last 10 with the internet), less people are inclined to go to church, but that isn't pinned down merely the style of the service, but simply to the attitudes of society. Lot more athiests about, lots more agonostic people, lots more others who are willing to use religion as a custom to regluate their lives rather than actually believing in something simply cause they can't see it.
Actually, it's worth asking whether religion is in global "decline", especially in the past 10 to 20 years. When confronted with the mystery of existence, people still tend to seek answers from faith. Quite clearly, despite our apparently secular times, God is still very far from dead.

Quote:
Saying that, Christianity has been poked at and challenged and parodied so many times esp from the 70's onwards, that those who do feel offended and protest are now seen as 'annoying people'...

...many public places (uk wise) don't allow religion related material in shops, cafes or (in my case, libraries) if it's not part of the business itself, because if it trips one off, others are wanna gonna do the same and we begin again with possible confrontation....

What does that say about us all then?
It says that, all too often, people react before they think.

It seems to me that more people are protesting the perceived trivialisation of Christianity, rather than the supposed weaknesses of the glossy magazine format for transmitting the words of the Bible. Which ought to be surprising, considering how the Bible used to be published, before the days of the printing press. As the article said: "At first the Bible was a collection of scrolls, then illustrated handwritten volumes. When printing was invented they were produced in Latin with pictures."

Wow, pictures. How scandalous.

Simply put, before having seen or read the Bible Illuminated, I reserve judgment on whether it's actually sacrilegious. Until then, I'd stick to my first impression: "Wow, how original. Why didn't I think of it before?"

Quote:
Glance at the danish event with the muslim comic strip and you saw the reaction there.
As for the Muslim reaction to the Danish cartoons, well, that's a different religion and a different culture, so naturally, a different answer applies. Still, it's worth asking whether Muslims felt insulted because of what the satirical cartoon said about them as a people, rather than what it supposedly insinuated about Islam.

Quote:
It looks good on a general 'ohh let's have a peek at it', but those not into christianity or have never touched a bible will not gain anything significant from it methinks, nor gain a feeling to suddenly visit lots of various branches of christianity to see what each style of service is like, in addition, "with no chapter or verse numbers" - means that if someone did like a certain aspect of a chapter, they wouldn't be able to relate the passage to cross reference it.
It's like using journals without footnotes, reading a fiction book without page numbers or chapters.
You know, I wonder how many practising Christians have actually read the Bible from cover to cover. And if they have, how many, I wonder, have seriously reflected on message behind the words.

It's not my intention to inflame opinions on the matter. But in the end, the reactions to the Bible Illuminated are not unlike the reactions I hear from theatre critics who debate whether Shakespeare's plays would "lose their meaning" if they are staged with modern sets and costumes.

I hugely enjoyed Baz Luhrman's Romeo + Juliet. If the Bard were alive today, I'd fully expect him to make a movie like that.
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Old 2008-11-28, 09:34   Link #1124
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
I hugely enjoyed Baz Luhrman's Romeo + Juliet. If the Bard were alive today, I'd fully expect him to make a movie like that.
That crossed my mind as i was writing my reply, in reference to using old source material and placing it in a modern context. The thing with that movie was that the language was kept the same. The modern context with the guns and the helicopters and the swimming pool scene and the rest help to set the scene and give modern references so people had some idea of what was going on, since the language itself is kinda hard to get around.

But the bible linguistically has been updated and translated and simplified and jazzed, so it's not the language itself that we have issues with now. If someone really wants a simple, illustrated guide, they can have it, but that magazine is just that:
A maagzine with references from the bible.
well i can only go as far as what the bbc have said, but i don't particulary see it as anything innovative except maybe in design.

Btw, you've re arranged some of my sentences and then answered each section as a group, which has taken it out of context to how i arranged and linked it all when i composed that.
Please take care of how you answer. The muslim example was linked to how attitudes of christianity have changed, but it was very similar in terms of how sensitive people were... only hundreds of years ago perhaps.
we get south park, where jesus is fighting santa and we can take it with a pinch of salt. And then we get a comic strip, which almost causes riots, since people see it as an 'insult'
Different religions, yes, but i doubt within muslim societies, there's much room for parody concerning islam, I'd be curious to see a 'modified' magazine version of the Qu’uran for those who aren't muslim, just to get a feel for the other religion and perhaps understand it better.
Somehow, i don't see it happening anytime soon though...

As for the public places sentence i put, that was related to the article, where the creator says he'd like to see this in cafes and shops, but religious material is still religious material (unless totally obsecure); many may feel reluntant to distrubute it.
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Old 2008-11-28, 12:44   Link #1125
MrTerrorist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
I'd be curious to see a 'modified' magazine version of the Qu’uran for those who aren't muslim, just to get a feel for the other religion and perhaps understand it better.
Somehow, i don't see it happening anytime soon though...

Actually they do exist... in a way. I went to Malaysia a long time ago, and there were some magazine dedicated to Islam for different demographics for lifestyle, women, fashion, kids and even comics. Yet what all of them have common at least is the fact they have verses from the Koran (called the Quran in some places in the world) which had anything related to the subject they cover.

Surprisingly there's also some smaller magazines which talk about today society with a mix of the supernatural and weird stories that 'claim' to be true(which some i doubt happen) and philosophy talk. There even books by philosophers about living the modern life yet still being religious but one book that caught my attention was about what Muslim can do and cannot do in sex?!


In an unrelated note:

One story from those smaller magazines that took my notice was well....

Spoiler for So NSFW:



Of course some of these books tend to be confiscated by the government especially if they are religious study books which misinterpreted & contradict Islamic values but surprisingly those smaller trashy magazine still continue. Go Figure.
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Old 2008-11-28, 14:28   Link #1126
RAVNEN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
Actually they do exist... in a way. I went to Malaysia a long time ago, and there were some magazine dedicated to Islam for different demographics for lifestyle, women, fashion, kids and even comics. Yet what all of them have common at least is the fact they have verses from the Koran (called the Quran in some places in the world) which had anything related to the subject they cover.

Surprisingly there's also some smaller magazines which talk about today society with a mix of the supernatural and weird stories that 'claim' to be true(which some i doubt happen) and philosophy talk. There even books by philosophers about living the modern life yet still being religious but one book that caught my attention was about what Muslim can do and cannot do in sex?!


In an unrelated note:

One story from those smaller magazines that took my notice was well....

Spoiler for So NSFW:



Of course some of these books tend to be confiscated by the government especially if they are religious study books which misinterpreted & contradict Islamic values but surprisingly those smaller trashy magazine still continue. Go Figure.
Huh,lucky me,I've read some of those small mags,especially the mystery one.Many supernatural in Malaysia are hostile,believe me I exprience it first hand.

Yeah,those mags still exist & getting better with some diversity.They even has fashion column for Muslim women,that is breathtaking for sure.
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Old 2008-11-28, 18:26   Link #1127
Mystique
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@ MrTerrorist

I dunno, I was expecting something actually explicit within your spoiler, I feel somewhat cheated. xD
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAVNEN View Post
Yeah,those mags still exist & getting better with some diversity.They even has fashion column for Muslim women,that is breathtaking for sure.
Nice to be proven wrong in this case, sounds interesting tho
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Old 2008-11-28, 23:34   Link #1128
MrTerrorist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
@ MrTerrorist

I dunno, I was expecting something actually explicit within your spoiler, I feel somewhat cheated. xD
I could but the problem is some these 'sexual' stories tend to bland in their description of what they were doing but will sometime mention explicit content. Furthermore, if i do tell you about them, i will get banned for posting +18 stories on this thread. (And by way the some theses stories are really +18 materials but with mixture of Aesop's and morals in them, it makes you wonder if the magazine publishers are just making smutty stories under the guise of moral values.)
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Old 2008-11-29, 08:19   Link #1129
RAVNEN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
I could but the problem is some these 'sexual' stories tend to bland in their description of what they were doing but will sometime mention explicit content. Furthermore, if i do tell you about them, i will get banned for posting +18 stories on this thread. (And by way the some theses stories are really +18 materials but with mixture of Aesop's and morals in them, it makes you wonder if the magazine publishers are just making smutty stories under the guise of moral values.)
You mean you read +18 mags in Malaysia? According to my experience,many of those +18 mags were import from Japan & other country in Asia.Believe me I know,I've recently visit one the local bookstore.They say those mags & books somehow manage to distribute by some individuals or groups.

My earlier post on this thread does'nt involve those +18 mags,I was talking about other more educative & thoughtfull mags for example Saji,Wanita,Mastika & others.Is it so many I can barely post it here.
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Old 2008-11-29, 12:26   Link #1130
MrTerrorist
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Originally Posted by RAVNEN View Post
You mean you read +18 mags in Malaysia? According to my experience,many of those +18 mags were import from Japan & other country in Asia.Believe me I know,I've recently visit one the local bookstore.They say those mags & books somehow manage to distribute by some individuals or groups.

My earlier post on this thread does'nt involve those +18 mags,I was talking about other more educative & thoughtfull mags for example Saji,Wanita,Mastika & others.Is it so many I can barely post it here.
When i said 18+ stuff, i was talking about the stories that appeared in those magazines you know and mention when the stories they publish not only about ghosts and possessions along with stories of rape, secret orgies, incest, lust, immoral behavior, gambling, death and god knows what they do know since its been a long that i read one since my last visit to Malaysia.
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Old 2008-11-29, 12:42   Link #1131
RAVNEN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTerrorist View Post
When i said 18+ stuff, i was talking about the stories that appeared in those magazines you know and mention when the stories they publish not only about ghosts and possessions along with stories of rape, secret orgies, incest, lust, immoral behavior, gambling, death and god knows what they do know since its been a long that i read one since my last visit to Malaysia.
Oh,that mags must the one that start with letter M.That mags still running & getting better by day.Yeah,many shock stories in there,I prefer the ghost one coz I 've expirience it.Ofcourse I still read that mags now.

Hmm...I heard that some Koreans TV station are doing some investigation about shaman(bomoh) in Malaysia.According to their thoroughful research,many of shaman tricks can actually be done by science.I don't know about them,from my exprience usually these shaman use many tricks that can hurt people.
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Old 2008-11-29, 23:32   Link #1132
TinyRedLeaf
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The land of warm, friendly toilets
Quote:
Japan (Nov 29, 2008): No country takes toilets quite so seriously as Japan. Machines with heated seats, built-in bidets and a dynamic range of flushing options are almost ubiquitous in homes and public buildings.

A poem recently published by a stressed-out salary man captured their comforting appeal with haiku-like brevity. "The only warmth in my life is the toilet seat," he mourned.

Booming market

The master of the modern convenience is the Panasonic Corporation. At its Tokyo showroom, located in a skyscraper near the BBC's office, a group of smart young women, dressed in uniforms resembling flight attendants, showed me the company's latest wares.

The lids lifted up when I approached. If I stood in front of one, it took a guess at my gender and lifted up the seat as well. There was a loo that glowed in the dark and another that had built-in loudspeakers.

With manicured fingernails, the demonstrator pushed the control panel beside the seat and gentle light classical music began to play. Pleasant enough, I thought, although I preferred a pastoral sound effect that provided the impression one was seated upon a white plastic throne surrounded by songbirds in a springtime meadow.

Ms Kyoko Ishii, who heads the public relations department for Panasonic, explained that most of the people who choose luxury loos are older women, so this is a booming market in rapidly ageing Japan. She says that for this core customer group, the emphasis now is less on the gadgetry and more on convenience and cleanliness.

Clean culture

A visitor to Tokyo recently told me that he was surprised to find Japanese women rather than foreigners cleaning the toilets in his hotel.

It is of course often immigrants who take on such jobs in rich countries. But foreign-born workers are rare here as only about 1.5% of the population are made up of non-native Japanese.

However, the low immigration level is only part of the explanation. Japanese people do not see cleaning as a demeaning or shameful job. School children are trained from a young age to sweep their classrooms and scour the playground for litter. Lorry drivers wash their trucks at the end of every day.

No restaurant serves a meal without first offering the customer a cleansing towel.

Source of comfort

The Japanese are happy to think of a toilet as their comfort and their friend.

The other day, while catching a commuter train to work, I found myself transfixed by an advertisement which was being screened on a TV inside the carriage.

A young girl slowly walked towards a loo, which automatically raised its lid to greet her. The toilet then appeared to give a welcoming robotic smile and its seat began to glow an inviting orange colour as it heated up, ready for action.

Fortunately, the advertisement ended there. But not before a broad and appreciative smile broke out across the face of the girl.

- BBC NEWS
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Old 2008-11-29, 23:49   Link #1133
LeoXiao
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hehe, Japanese people are amusing in that way.
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Old 2008-11-30, 05:36   Link #1134
Solais
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I still remember, when I was a kid, the first thing I heard about Japan, is that they have extraordinary toilets.
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Old 2008-11-30, 06:19   Link #1135
Irenicus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solais View Post
I still remember, when I was a kid, the first thing I heard about Japan, is that they have extraordinary toilets.
That's actually a pretty good thing to remember about a country.

I mean, people don't appreciate what a good toilet seat does to your quality of life, no sir. People just don't appreciate what a good life really is, and how big good toiletries play a role. It's the day for world peace when there are good toilets for everyone.
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Old 2008-11-30, 07:43   Link #1136
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Originally Posted by Irenicus View Post
That's actually a pretty good thing to remember about a country.

I mean, people don't appreciate what a good toilet seat does to your quality of life, no sir. People just don't appreciate what a good life really is, and how big good toiletries play a role. It's the day for world peace when there are good toilets for everyone.
Funny how the World Toilet College isn't in Japan, but in Singapore, however.
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Old 2008-11-30, 09:16   Link #1137
kyon.haruhi.suzumiya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
Funny how the World Toilet College isn't in Japan, but in Singapore, however.
Complex control panels in toilets are a way of life in Japan, especially on the NEXCO tollways.

Watch this.


Translation
1: 大 (ookii, big) causes to a large flush for large size waste (大便, daiben, feces)
2: 小 (chiisai, small) causes a small flush for small size waste (小便. shonben or shouben, urine).
3: Lowers the lid and closes the seat
4: Lowers the seat and raises the lid
5 Raises both the lid and the seat
6: Stops all operations
7: おしり(oshiri, Butt): Washing of the anus, regular
8: やわらか (yawaraka, tender): Washing of the anus, soft mode
9: ビデ: (Bide, Bidet): Washing of the private parts.
10: 乾燥 (kansou, dry): Blow dryer for drying the private parts
11: ムーブ (入/切)(Muubu, Move): Rotates the nozzle sideways back and forth
12: マッサージ (入/切) (Massaji, Massage): Cyclic increase in the nozzle pressure for a masage of the anus. Button for On/Off

Credit to wikipedia.
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Old 2008-11-30, 09:49   Link #1138
Spring_sakura111
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Wow...that's too complicated for a toilet~
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Old 2008-11-30, 11:05   Link #1139
Shadow Kira01
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyon.haruhi.suzumiya View Post
Complex control panels in toilets are a way of life in Japan, especially on the NEXCO tollways.

Watch this.
Spoiler:


Translation
1: ? (ookii, big) causes to a large flush for large size waste (??, daiben, feces)
2: ? (chiisai, small) causes a small flush for small size waste (??. shonben or shouben, urine).
3: Lowers the lid and closes the seat
4: Lowers the seat and raises the lid
5 Raises both the lid and the seat
6: Stops all operations
7: ???(oshiri, Butt): Washing of the anus, regular
8: ???? (yawaraka, tender): Washing of the anus, soft mode
9: ??: (Bide, Bidet): Washing of the private parts.
10: ?? (kansou, dry): Blow dryer for drying the private parts
11: ??? (?/?)(Muubu, Move): Rotates the nozzle sideways back and forth
12: ????? (?/?) (Massaji, Massage): Cyclic increase in the nozzle pressure for a masage of the anus. Button for On/Off

Credit to wikipedia.
This toilet control system must be pretty expensive. Most people can't afford it.
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Old 2008-11-30, 14:06   Link #1140
WanderingKnight
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Quote:
1: 大 (ookii, big) causes to a large flush for large size waste (大便, daiben, feces)
2: 小 (chiisai, small) causes a small flush for small size waste (小便. shonben or shouben, urine).
I know the whole thing's pretty ridiculous, but these two functionalities, all in all, aren't such a bad idea. I was wondering the other day if there's some way to make a smaller flush for things like pee since blowing 6 liters away just for that is kind of wasting a lot of water.
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