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Old 2008-12-18, 00:32   Link #81
KholdStare
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Ithreko my dear, all competitions is mostly popularity contests. From American Idol to the Grammys to SaiMoe, it's about loyalty, hate, and revenge...not moe. We can always play a clean fight, not win, and retain our pride; but to tell you the truth, it's less exciting that way.
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Old 2008-12-18, 00:47   Link #82
Seishi
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It's definitely funner this way. Also, I find it amazing how many arguments, valid or invalid, come from adding the word "moe" to a contest.
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Old 2008-12-18, 01:07   Link #83
wontaek
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So, do we want these 1000+ newcomers? The nuance I feel is 'yes' to this question, but no one answered it directly.
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Old 2008-12-18, 01:30   Link #84
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Depends who they are and where they come from. Most importantly - How much they've watched.
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Old 2008-12-18, 03:54   Link #85
chaosprophet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demi. View Post
Depends who they are and where they come from. Most importantly - How much they've watched.
The people who watched more series are the ones that have more knowledge about the internet and anime so it's probable that they already partcipate or have heard about ISML. So IMO the more people participate in it the bigger is the probability that them didn't watch many series.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wontaek View Post
So, do we want these 1000+ newcomers? The nuance I feel is 'yes' to this question, but no one answered it directly.
Does it matter what we want? We may be able to help the number grown but it should grown anyway as ISML becomes more famous.
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Old 2008-12-18, 04:00   Link #86
LazyCanuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wontaek View Post
So, do we want these 1000+ newcomers? The nuance I feel is 'yes' to this question, but no one answered it directly.
If they vote for everyone I do then yes, otherwise no!



anyway joking aside, it all depends i guess, if the 1000 voters all vote for the same group of people and makes them win every single time then no, the only way I personally would want more voters is if they actually use their brains and have watched a good amount of anime, but as well all know from Korean moe that it usually not the case.
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Old 2008-12-18, 05:53   Link #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wontaek View Post
So, do we want these 1000+ newcomers? The nuance I feel is 'yes' to this question, but no one answered it directly.
I have a feeling that you want my opinion on this issue, so I will comply.

From the admin perspective, if we were still running this tourney on Weebly and pretty much the only guy on the staff is myself, I would have said no, because I wouldn't be able to handle it with all of the stress I've been having lately. But we do have multiple personnel involved in ISML this year that I strongly feel that we can take on up to 5000 newcomers for this tourney without actually burning ourselves out. Of course, more help would be needed, definitely, but I think that 1000 people won't be a problem as our resources have exponentially improved from last year. Of course, if you want a real answer from me, my answer is "as long as we can do vote check in under 30 minutes, we can take as many voters as possible."

From the voting perspective, I'd say yes, as long as people vote in at LEAST 24 arenas. We increased the minimum limit to 8 arenas this time around so that people don't go off voting by one series, but if you start to combine them, voters could possibly get away with voting two series straight. I mean, already we have Clannad + Kanon = 9 arenas maximum, so if people start going by two series, we could be in for a lot of trouble.

I was actually contemplating on having a sixteen arena limit, just so that those who come by to vote for one and only one character can play some sort of random voting method like left side or right side or "whoever I see first" to make things interesting, but that would be totally unfair to the candidates themselves, and we would more likely have the minority actually winning a match because of those swing votes.
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Old 2008-12-18, 06:36   Link #88
kyon.haruhi.suzumiya
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Quote:
We increased the minimum limit to 8 arenas this time around so that people don't go off voting by one series, but if you start to combine them, voters could possibly get away with voting two series straight. I mean, already we have Clannad + Kanon = 9 arenas maximum, so if people start going by two series, we could be in for a lot of trouble.
Well, I didn't see this law at all...? Anyways, might prevent another MD coming out. Yeah, might help. But CLANNAD + Kanon = 9 is a pretty scary thought. And even if you go to 16, the Kyoani bunch already equals 15.

Like: CLANNAD [5], Haruhi [3], Kanon [4], and Lucky Star [3]. I don't see how much difference 16 will make.

And side note: No Canvas2 characters yet? LOLZ.
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Old 2008-12-18, 12:30   Link #89
Ithekro
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Considering how many KyoAni could be added just via nominations, I doubt that will work out as a "anti-block voting" idea. You have 15 now....15 of the 20 from last year. 20 of the "way lots" possible this year. Because you have the 5 that got out last year (Tessa, Kyon's Sister, Tsuruya, Ryou, and Shiori). You now have the potential for adding in (aside from those five), at least three or four girls from CLANNAD, Maybe ten from Lucky Star, and maybe Chidori and Emori...plus there is an opening for AIR characters, and now Munto characters. It won't all happen, but the potential is out there.
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Old 2008-12-18, 12:50   Link #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyon.haruhi.suzumiya View Post
Well, I didn't see this law at all...? Anyways, might prevent another MD coming out. Yeah, might help. But CLANNAD + Kanon = 9 is a pretty scary thought. And even if you go to 16, the Kyoani bunch already equals 15.
Rule III.iii.F.2.A. states, and I Quote:

Quote:
On a voting form containing thirty-two regulation matches, a voter must vote for a Candidate in at least eight matches. In other words, a voter is allowed to abstain from a maximum of twenty-four matches.
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Old 2008-12-18, 14:33   Link #91
KholdStare
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wontaek View Post
So, do we want these 1000+ newcomers? The nuance I feel is 'yes' to this question, but no one answered it directly.
We want people with no life. No seriously. We want others who have participated in a tournament before, so the best would be to get people from SaiMoe (impossible) and Best Moe (maybe), since there's a better chance those people know more anime. Trying to get voters on forums is sadly very inefficient because many of the forums are show-specific or genre-specific. Of course, campaigning on forums is generally effective, as we can see from LSF.

PS: 4chan works too as having people with no life (like us).
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Old 2008-12-18, 16:35   Link #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KholdStare View Post
We want people with no life. No seriously. We want others who have participated in a tournament before, so the best would be to get people from SaiMoe (impossible) and Best Moe (maybe), since there's a better chance those people know more anime. Trying to get voters on forums is sadly very inefficient because many of the forums are show-specific or genre-specific. Of course, campaigning on forums is generally effective, as we can see from LSF.

PS: 4chan works too as having people with no life (like us).
To be honest, KholdStare's right, and probably the reason why the 2008 roster was tightly lopsided to KyoAni was because of my initial planting seeds on forum boards, only to see that the only forum board worth mentioning for SaiMoe is AnimeSuki itself, hence the inexperience by many voters, the lack of strong fanbases from particular candidates (I'm looking at you, Desu-chan), the domination and double necklaces (God), and so forth commenced in 2008.

Unfortunately, probably the ONLY way we can hit a truly experienced international fanbase without having to hire the many translators is a promotional video, and that is extremely hard for us personally given that ISML actually has a theme as opposed to the fixed voting form only in Saimoe Japan that gives free range to their AMVs. I mean, given how this contest actually has a storyline to work with, I would actually have to get somebody from Kyoto Animation and pay him half a million dollars to even get the promotional video ten percent accurate of what I had in mind, and unfortunately, the best I got is KholdStare and his quote unquote, "(expletive) Vista" slowing down creation time.

I mean, if someone has TWICE the skills as the guy who makes the Saimoe Japan videos, I'd love to have his help, but he still wouldn't have the skills to duplicate a tiara or make animations with seven necklaces in 3D, which is really, in this case... needed. I mean, promotional videos are nice, but for ISML personally, that's tough...

Don't get me wrong, I would love to have someone make a promotional video, but half of what I want is pretty much new content, so I would have to be VERY lenient on people if they wanted to try.
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Old 2008-12-18, 21:14   Link #93
Eater of All
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I'd say there can hardly be any rule that can solve block voting and not jeopardize whatever "voters' rights" or contestent fariness that ISML pride themselves so much upon. The voters may believe something is fishy, and declare that there is inside bias going on. Of course ISML is in essence, just an Internet contest, so I'm sure not many fans would lose sleep over any new rules. Yet there are voters that consider moe to be Serious Business, so....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Seishi View Post
It's definitely funner this way. Also, I find it amazing how many arguments, valid or invalid, come from adding the word "moe" to a contest.

That link made me lose two hours of my life, and was the cause of me inserting TV Trope links for the first time ever in a post.
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Old 2008-12-18, 23:03   Link #94
LazyCanuck
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god damn you all and your tropes even Eater is caught in the trap >_<
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Old 2008-12-18, 23:06   Link #95
Seishi
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And you made some more people lose 2+ hours of their lives. It'll keep going...and going. Welcome to the world of TV Tropes.

As for new voters, I can't really see it being any worse than what we have now, so why not, eh?
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Old 2008-12-18, 23:20   Link #96
G.o.S
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minhtam2448 View Post
To be honest, KholdStare's right, and probably the reason why the 2008 roster was tightly lopsided to KyoAni was because of my initial planting seeds on forum boards, only to see that the only forum board worth mentioning for SaiMoe is AnimeSuki itself, hence the inexperience by many voters, the lack of strong fanbases from particular candidates (I'm looking at you, Desu-chan), the domination and double necklaces (God), and so forth commenced in 2008.
Hmm... I know that Suiseiseki used to be quite popular at 4chan. Maybe if somebody has time to do some campaigns over there... er... I mean the /b/ board?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrowKenobi View Post
And more importantly: what can we do to make sure that they stick around for the whole tournament? (I'm looking at you Vietnam!!)


I didn't participate in last year tournament, but I'll try to vote in this year tournament, probably focusing on promoting new faces.
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Old 2008-12-19, 07:03   Link #97
Eisdrache
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If those 1000+ voters mean a 1000+ vote increase for Konata, then they can all go die ><

Joking aside, more people mean (hopefully) more diversity on votes, so as long as ISML can handle it Im fine =3
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Old 2008-12-19, 11:05   Link #98
KholdStare
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Well last year Vietnam left because we started late. Two things should happen this year:

1) We start on time so Vietnam can stay longer.
2) We somehow convince them to vote in the finals (double elimination) even if they don't want to vote in the latter periods.
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Old 2008-12-19, 12:58   Link #99
Demi.
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Vietnam Isn't interested without Negima characters, since that's the only reason they voted in the first place. If Eva makes sweet 16, I'm sure they will stay - Otherwise, no. Never liked how they could mass strategic vote, though. I mean, Ayu defeating Yuki, and Kotomi slaughtering Tomoyo where hilarious, but It's precisely how the fangirls work in Korea. Vote against their major threats, and vote for the few characters series they actually support.
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Old 2008-12-19, 13:05   Link #100
minhtam1638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demi. View Post
Vietnam Isn't interested without Negima characters, since that's the only reason they voted in the first place. If Eva makes sweet 16, I'm sure they will stay - Otherwise, no. Never liked how they could mass strategic vote, though. I mean, Ayu defeting Yuki, and Kotomi slaughtering Tomoyo where hilarious, but It's precisely how the fangirls work in Korea. Vote against their major threats, and vote for the few characters series they actually support.
Personally, I would actually like to see how the Korean fangirls vote strategically this year. With the intricacy of the new tiebreaker system when it comes to necklaces, you pretty much would have to be combination specific by the time (insert Necklace jewel) 9 comes around and there are so many variables that can determine the final winner.
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