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Old 2008-12-31, 06:18   Link #1441
M.I.P.
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Originally Posted by X_Danny_X View Post
Miu beat some durability guy? when was this? anyway, that is not a master in my eyes. a master is a master. he has to be known and stated as a master.
Miu herself said he had masterclass durabilty/stamina. Miu's never used her finishing move on Kenichi so how do we know he can tank it until then it's well within the bounds of reason that this guy has greater durability and Kenichi's stamina/durability isn't masterclass yet.

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Originally Posted by seiji_kun View Post
I mean Kenichi / Shou impressed me 10x as much as a master like Fortuna. Fortuna couldn't take out most of Shinpaku while Shou took 4 of them without even sweating so if Kenichi isn't getting near those low lvl masters then I don't know.
Fortuna fought more members of Shinpaku than Shou did and Shou fought them with Natsu and Siegfried absent. In addition Fortuna wanted to capture them not kill or put them out of commision so he likely used less force than he was capable of.

As for Seikuken Kenichi's isn't masterclass. He can't use it while moving, he can't activate it mentally, it's easily broken or shrunk, it's not particularly large and finally he hasn't mastered RS
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Old 2009-01-02, 10:43   Link #1442
kenjiharima
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Been lagging on Kenichi. Just a quick question, does Miu uses Seikuken like the elder, Ken-chan and the others? Seems she doesn't on my part.

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Old 2009-01-02, 12:15   Link #1443
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no she can't i think she said in previous chapter that's beacuse she's a dou style fighter
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Old 2009-01-02, 14:38   Link #1444
Isekaijin
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Originally Posted by blade82 View Post
no she can't i think she said in previous chapter that's beacuse she's a dou style fighter
I think she can. It was the Ryusui Seikuken the skill that was outside of Miu's reach. But the Seikuken can be used by anyone skilled enough, regardless of the nature... I guess...
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Old 2009-01-02, 15:04   Link #1445
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wrong, she can't. end of discussion.

but what she might be able to learn is the attack trail reading
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Old 2009-01-02, 15:14   Link #1446
Terrean
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Originally Posted by ultimateking View Post
wrong, she can't. end of discussion.

but what she might be able to learn is the attack trail reading
That´s what I think, too

But how can Elder be Dou and Sei at the same time? ^^'
Sure, he is the surpreme martial artists, but...

edit:
forget it... because Ryuto has them too..

Last edited by Terrean; 2009-01-03 at 04:51.
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Old 2009-01-03, 09:54   Link #1447
incube
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I dont think that becoming a master depends on the strength of the person only... you cannot compare those low level master like Mr. Crab or even Fortuna with the shadow fists and the guys in Ryouzanpakou but they are still called masters and aknowleged by everyone.

I think becoming a master means that he or she learned all he could depending on his own limits and all that is left for him to improve must be done by himself. Those limits are that persons own physical conditions and his determination.... like when the elder asked kenichi what did he want to do with his power and he answered protect everyone dear to him and the elder told him to be able to do that he would have to become the strongest martial artist of all.

And as for Mui not using Seikuiken... i think it is because he fighting style is more the agile type and not power or endurance so instead of standing still and taking blows she would dodge them and counter attack with speed. Dou or Sei doesnt have mucht to do since we saw Dou type use it. And also being Dou or Sei doesnt limit the tecniques you can learn or use...
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Old 2009-01-03, 10:44   Link #1448
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I dont think that becoming a master depends on the strength of the person only... you cannot compare those low level master like Mr. Crab or even Fortuna with the shadow fists and the guys in Ryouzanpakou but they are still called masters and aknowleged by everyone.

I think becoming a master means that he or she learned all he could depending on his own limits and all that is left for him to improve must be done by himself. Those limits are that persons own physical conditions and his determination.... like when the elder asked kenichi what did he want to do with his power and he answered protect everyone dear to him and the elder told him to be able to do that he would have to become the strongest martial artist of all.

And as for Mui not using Seikuiken... i think it is because he fighting style is more the agile type and not power or endurance so instead of standing still and taking blows she would dodge them and counter attack with speed. Dou or Sei doesnt have mucht to do since we saw Dou type use it. And also being Dou or Sei doesnt limit the tecniques you can learn or use...
There's a definite point when one goes from not being masterclass to being masterclass. Based only on the words literal meanings masterclass suggests either complete mastery of your fighting style or sufficient mastery to teach others. We've heard of masterclass durability and Shou was said to have the body of a master so it seems masterclass is a definite measurable level rather than a case of you being as strong as you can be. I'd assume Mr Crab for example merely claims the title of masterclass without being tough enough to be masterclass. Failing that the mangaka keeps raising the base level of masterclass so as to prevent the disciples being masters by now.

As for Fortuna as I've pointed out he was stated to be the weakest among the masterclass and yet he was effortlessly owning disciples until they fought him in perfect harmony and even then they needed Natsu's newly learned move to finally take him out. That's impressive if you ask me.
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Old 2009-01-04, 09:46   Link #1449
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What im trying to say is you cannot set a limit of power from wich you determine someone is a master or not. It is a silly idea.... kind of reminds me of that little gadget vegetta brought with him and started measuring the ki of his opponents >.<

As you said the word mastery means reaching a certain level of skill in a subject in wich you have no need for further instruction of others and can even teach what you've learned so far but neither of those aspects can be measured directly.

I'm not saying that anyone can become a master but Ryouzanpakou mastery levels cannot be used to set the limits of a masterclass fighter. I mean in that crazy dojo you have a granpa that can split water like moises, sexy girls that can slice a tank with a katana like butter and a freaking mouse that can ride bycles and beat the crap out every single one of us >.<
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Old 2009-01-04, 09:48   Link #1450
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There seems to be some kind of physical transformation when one becomes a master, though. Shou was on the verge of it.
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Old 2009-01-04, 09:53   Link #1451
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There seems to be some kind of physical transformation when one becomes a master, though. Shou was on the verge of it.
That physical transformation was the ability to get all pumped up withot druging yourself.... in other words being able to bring 100% or more of your power at will. I dont think that alone means the passage between disciple and master.
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Old 2009-01-04, 13:23   Link #1452
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I'm not saying Ryozanpaku masters are the definition of master level I'm saying those who've been definitively stated to be masters have displayed feats greater than those who call themselves disciples. As such saying Kenichi is low level masterclass is an incorrect statement.
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Old 2009-01-04, 14:20   Link #1453
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Originally Posted by M.I.P. View Post
I'm not saying Ryozanpaku masters are the definition of master level I'm saying those who've been definitively stated to be masters have displayed feats greater than those who call themselves disciples. As such saying Kenichi is low level masterclass is an incorrect statement.
Kenichi has not reached master class level, not even low level Master Class, he is still below.

He might reach low level master class if he defeats Saiga´s disciple.
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Old 2009-01-04, 17:01   Link #1454
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Originally Posted by Wargumm1i View Post
Kenichi has not reached master class level, not even low level Master Class, he is still below.

He might reach low level master class if he defeats Saiga´s disciple.
He will reach low masterclass level when his masters say so.... i cant imangine Kenichi standing at the same level as any of his master no matter how many Yomi disiciples he defeats.
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Old 2009-01-04, 19:32   Link #1455
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That's you mistaking masterclass for Ryozanpaku class. When he is history's strongest disciple andthey have no more to teach him then and only then will he be on his way to their level of mastery

After all he has to beat Hayate in order to marry Miu
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Old 2009-01-05, 12:15   Link #1456
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so who made up this master rating system? I say anyone who labels Kenichi is full of poop unless we have something from the manga or the author to confirm.
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Old 2009-01-07, 13:40   Link #1457
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The raw is out at Mangahelpers

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Old 2009-01-08, 03:50   Link #1458
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Old 2009-01-08, 08:10   Link #1459
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Old 2009-01-08, 10:09   Link #1460
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so who made up this master rating system? I say anyone who labels Kenichi is full of poop unless we have something from the manga or the author to confirm.
There is no rating there's only masters and disciples. There's lots of masters or people who appear to be masters but not all of them are desciribed as masterclass. As such masterclass is a rating of one's ability the opposite of which would be non-masterclass. The manga makes no mention of high,mid or low tier masterclass so anyone saying a character is in one of those categories is simply making it up.


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