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Old 2009-02-22, 09:02   Link #181
Tri-ring
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In a way it is interesting how they are pushing Ryuji at each other.
Minori is pushing Ryuji towards Taiga because she sees him as a moral crutch for Taiga while Taiga is pushing Ryuji towards Minori saying she doesn't need him as a crutch anymore.

Where does that leave Ryuji, in the storage room for spares?
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Old 2009-02-22, 09:04   Link #182
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Old 2009-02-22, 17:18   Link #183
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Originally Posted by Tri-ring View Post
In a way it is interesting how they are pushing Ryuji at each other.
Minori is pushing Ryuji towards Taiga because she sees him as a moral crutch for Taiga while Taiga is pushing Ryuji towards Minori saying she doesn't need him as a crutch anymore.

Where does that leave Ryuji, in the storage room for spares?
I honestly don't think this version of that trope has ever been done before, ever.
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Old 2009-02-22, 18:02   Link #184
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
I honestly don't think this version of that trope has ever been done before, ever.
I would agree with that - I think this is pretty much a new spin on things. The remarkable thing for me is that in spite of finding both leads generally uninteresting and one (Taiga) unlikable and tiresome, I'm still quite involved in the turning of events. Ami and Minorin are enough to keep me watching, but in spite of my reservations there's something compelling about the dysfunctional co-dependence of Taiga and Ryuji.
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Old 2009-02-26, 14:26   Link #185
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I hope the show not gonna end with a Taiga x Ryuji end...even tough this is the most possible with that much foreshadowing. Because i am kinda bored with the "sudden revelation" style romance endings, where the main hero finds out only at the last epiosdes that she probably loved XY for a long time.
I hope we'll soon learn about Minorin's background...she's hiding something about her surely. Most propably she's the gloomiest of the main characters inside.
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Old 2009-02-26, 16:30   Link #186
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Yeah I hope we get to find out more of Minori's background before the series ends.
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Old 2009-02-26, 18:52   Link #187
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Originally Posted by willyvereb View Post
I hope the show not gonna end with a Taiga x Ryuji end...even tough this is the most possible with that much foreshadowing. Because i am kinda bored with the "sudden revelation" style romance endings, where the main hero finds out only at the last epiosdes that she probably loved XY for a long time.
Except that Ryuuji and Taiga have cared about and looked out for each other since the beginning.

What else do you expect?
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Old 2009-02-26, 19:07   Link #188
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Ami X Ryuji kinda impossible :P
But a Minorin X Ryuji ending possible...
Interesting: I have no problems with the Taga X Ryuji ending until the last 4-5 episodes...
Maybe because i thought that they're finding out their feelings towards each other faster than they're having actual chance to get the one whom they're chasing at the beginning.
(Not to mention that Minorin my favourite character in Toradora:P)
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Old 2009-02-26, 21:26   Link #189
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Maybe because i thought that they're finding out their feelings towards each other faster than they're having actual chance to get the one whom they're chasing at the beginning.
If it happened any other way, it would turn into Kimikiss, School Days, or Canvas 2.

Besides, it's pretty easy to see where each characters' priorities really were even before these last few episodes.
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Old 2009-02-27, 07:16   Link #190
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Originally Posted by willyvereb View Post
I hope the show not gonna end with a Taiga x Ryuji end...even tough this is the most possible with that much foreshadowing. Because i am kinda bored with the "sudden revelation" style romance endings, where the main hero finds out only at the last epiosdes that she probably loved XY for a long time.
I hope we'll soon learn about Minorin's background...she's hiding something about her surely. Most propably she's the gloomiest of the main characters inside.
The ending has been chiseled in stone already. If Ep19 didn't make it any more obvious, Ep21 is another huge clue. Sorry to burst your bubble, but, yeah.
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Old 2009-02-27, 09:35   Link #191
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Well, if you see a TaigaXRyuuji ending from Minori's POV, i think is right with her. From the start she didnt wanna a love, she DID wanna a partner for Taiga, she accepts Ryuuji as the ONE for her...

OK, she likes him, but i think that she believes that she has another goals in life... and she has worked so hard for that.
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Old 2009-02-28, 09:02   Link #192
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Well,
how to say it?
From the beginning of Toradora anime i hoped for some unussual story. What I mean is that 95% of anime with romance aspect does main characters pairing.
We had something different - mains were helping each other to get their loved ones.
This situation was something which made me want to see each new episode.
Episode 19 changed almost everything and episode 21 was the finishing blow. Main characters 'suddenly' realise they feel different? What's wrong with them? You know what I mean... It doesn't get to me in this way.
I hope we don't see it this way but RyujixTaiga ending is highly possible (about 95%).
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Old 2009-02-28, 09:06   Link #193
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There was nothing sudden about it. Taiga just as much as confessed indirectly to Ryuji when she tried to confess to Yuusaku, way back on episode two. No, these feelings were boiling inside her for a long time.

The same goes for Minorin, as ever since the trip to Ami's villa, she has been struggling with her own feelings toward Ryuji - and her friendship with Taiga...
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Old 2009-02-28, 10:16   Link #194
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ok...but somewhat i feel like Minorin needs Ryuji more...
Perhaps it's a weak argument in terms of romance, but remember Ryuji loved her without even knowing her throughly and interacting with at all...so i feel like they're kinda equal in other grounds.
Bercause it's sounds like me:"Let's give everything to the midget...". Somehow it seemes for me that oout of the 3 Taiga is the worst choice.
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Old 2009-02-28, 11:09   Link #195
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ok...but somewhat i feel like Minorin needs Ryuji more...
Minori thinks different... i expect that at the end of the anime everybody could see what (and why) are Minori's goals. It's quite obvious, but Minori has her own needs and Ryuuji doesnt fit in it.

Start thinking in:
Minori as a sport genius, Minori attitude, Minori as a workaholic, Minori's background, Minori and Ryuuji's talk after Taiga throwed her bag at Ryuuji (Minori's brother, what he do, Minori's childhood)...

In fact there is a big explanation to why Minori said Ryuuji at Ami's Villa the thing about ghosts... and why she doesn't want (even need) a boyfriend. In short, that explanation is pretty close to why Sumire rejects Kitamura.



Quote:
Perhaps it's a weak argument in terms of romance, but remember Ryuji loved her without even knowing her throughly and interacting with at all...so i feel like they're kinda equal in other grounds.
Bercause it's sounds like me:"Let's give everything to the midget...". Somehow it seemes for me that oout of the 3 Taiga is the worst choice.
I believe that love isnt about choices but about respect and sincerity. Ryuuji little by little gained respect and sincerity with Taiga, their interaction in a daily basis build a relationship ubersolid.

They started to love being together, being together they reached respect from others, they gained friends, memories... this was a love that grew without warning...

I think that is purest love relationship ever...
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Old 2009-03-02, 14:53   Link #196
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Ok...then another question. What would have happened if Minorin and Ryuji "lived together" instead of taiga?The same...so i think it's not something to be proud of...not to mention that Taiga just like a kid.Ryuji's caring was absolutely one-sided.
It's a pretty weird show/light novel where the main hero got the worst choice of the possible girls...
Maybe it's just because i think Ryuji and Minorin would be a hilarious and great couple...
in terms of good things the other girls far outclasses Taiga.
Perhaps i am statisfied with even if they're solving Minorin's emotionalé prioblem.
It's seemes that she have issues with her parents and that's why she do that many part time jobs...but that's from the begining of the show...what happened with that since then? NOTHING...I hope we'll find out Kushieda's background soon!
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Old 2009-03-02, 15:28   Link #197
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Ok...then another question. What would have happened if Minorin and Ryuji "lived together" instead of taiga?The same...so i think it's not something to be proud of...not to mention that Taiga just like a kid.
It depends... Probably would now Minori's troubles, they will expend some serious talk, find comfort in each other... but still... Minori is a lot more independent than Taiga, because Minori seeks that independence for certain reasons.

Yeah, Taiga is a spoiled child, but the thing is that she GREW with Ryuuji, she could be spoiled until now, absorbing Ryuuji, treating him as an underling, but it doesnt happen... in fact, Taiga now is doing things that she never did before for Ryuuji's sake... and that thing are priceless in a relationship, the sacrifice and the capacity for someone to look for the other before one.

Taiga's character development must be one of the greastest ever... and still ain't over.


Quote:
Ryuji's caring was absolutely one-sided.
No, both are caring each other all the way. The respect that they have is the proof.
Who rescued Ryuuji at the pool despite being a poor swimmer?, who went ballistic about the gossips for Ryuuji's sake?, who give Ryuuji a suit for the party?, who went to Minori's house missing a party?... yeah, Taiga has a lot of weak points, but still she cares Ryuuji to the point of clean her house, to dispose correctly (which in Japan is a pain in the ass) her garbage...


Quote:
It's a pretty weird show/light novel where the main hero got the worst choice of the possible girls...
Love doesn't know about "worst choices"... if you are measuring that, you don't know the true and pure form of love. Toradora shows that, how a love can born in the wide open, without warning, like a tree who grows in a forest without any human intervention. It was too late for both to avoid to be in love for each other.


Quote:
Maybe it's just because i think Ryuji and Minorin would be a hilarious and great couple...
Probably Ryuuji thought that when he saw her for first time... but again, not everything goes smoothly in life...

Quote:
in terms of good things the other girls far outclasses Taiga.
But you're missing the key point... love doesn't know about that... Good girls always picked the worst bastards... and you said "how such cute girl is in love for such weirdo"... you cant command your feelings.
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Old 2009-03-02, 16:41   Link #198
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It depends... Probably would now Minori's troubles, they will expend some serious talk, find comfort in each other... but still... Minori is a lot more independent than Taiga, because Minori seeks that independence for certain reasons.
Yeah...but we heard nothing about that certain reason...for Minorin there's a way too much room for development. We don't know about her much...just that she's constantly suffering because of something and she hides that with her cheerfullness and weirdness.
Quote:
Yeah, Taiga is a spoiled child, but the thing is that she GREW with Ryuuji, she could be spoiled until now, absorbing Ryuuji, treating him as an underling, but it doesnt happen... in fact, Taiga now is doing things that she never did before for Ryuuji's sake... and that thing are priceless in a relationship, the sacrifice and the capacity for someone to look for the other before one.

Taiga's character development must be one of the greastest ever... and still ain't over.
I quess it's Ami's...but hers somewhat unexplained...how she become from a selfish "airhead" a caring, open and intelligent woman.
I can't help it, but Taiga's development somehow similar to a kid who became more and more independent...no wonder that Ryuji behaved with her as if she's his daughter.


Quote:
No, both are caring each other all the way. The respect that they have is the proof.
Who rescued Ryuuji at the pool despite being a poor swimmer?, who went ballistic about the gossips for Ryuuji's sake?, who give Ryuuji a suit for the party?, who went to Minori's house missing a party?... yeah, Taiga has a lot of weak points, but still she cares Ryuuji to the point of clean her house, to dispose correctly (which in Japan is a pain in the ass) her garbage...
True but remember that they were close friends and "accomplices"...It would have been the same for the two other girls...

Quote:
Love doesn't know about "worst choices"... if you are measuring that, you don't know the true and pure form of love. Toradora shows that, how a love can born in the wide open, without warning, like a tree who grows in a forest without any human intervention. It was too late for both to avoid to be in love for each other.
Probably Ryuuji thought that when he saw her for first time... but again, not everything goes smoothly in life...
But you're missing the key point... love doesn't know about that... Good girls always picked the worst bastards... and you said "how such cute girl is in love for such weirdo"... you cant command your feelings.
But story writers and viewers know it! There's no other reason exept that they're suddenly living together and somewhat caring about each other...with that reasoning almost any of the girls could have the Ryuji...this somewhat cheap for the viewers.
The most frustrating thing: Minorin loves Ryuji too, but she loves as much or maybe even more Taiga. She could get Ryuji almost instantly if she act true to her feelings even at ep 21, but she just don't because she won't hurt Taiga, no matter what. And that's why it's frustrating.
It could have written better. In contrast with the other tsundere lolis(Louise, Shana): Shana and Louise were more independent and they have good sides about their personality that other contenders not. Perhaps maybe it's just because every contender were weak compared to the heroine in that stories.

Ok...i have somehow made peace with the Taiga X Ryuji ending, but at last we have to see some Minorin development. Currently both Minorin and Ami suffers more because of their love than Taiga, so the authors must do something to relive them.
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Old 2009-03-02, 16:52   Link #199
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I don't know how you can possibly say the other girls are suffering more. Taiga is emotionally traumatizing herself by trying to get RID of her feelings of love just because she thinks it'll make him happy, you just can't get rid of feelings that strong, and to be honest she has been the only one that really DOES love him. Ami just seems to want something she can't have and expects everything to fall into place and go her way by being an observer of all of this, she never really actively pursues it. Minorin just developed some little crush on him, almost seems forced just to create conflict and tension. There's a fine line between a simple crush and real love.

Last edited by Tango337; 2009-03-02 at 17:40.
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Old 2009-03-02, 17:17   Link #200
Vexx
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Originally Posted by willyvereb View Post
I hope the show not gonna end with a Taiga x Ryuji end...even tough this is the most possible with that much foreshadowing. Because i am kinda bored with the "sudden revelation" style romance endings, where the main hero finds out only at the last epiosdes that she probably loved XY for a long time.
I hope we'll soon learn about Minorin's background...she's hiding something about her surely. Most propably she's the gloomiest of the main characters inside.
ummmm, I'll suggest starting with episode 1, rewatch, and paying more attention to the scenes without Minorin in? No really, if you think this is a "sudden revelation" you missed a lot of clues. Its more of an "onion peel layer of mini-revelations". Ryuuji has "realized" an escalating level of feelings throughout the series - he was just simply propelled by inertia of 'what he originally thought he wanted' -- as have the other characters.

I've lost count of the "I like being with you, Taiga.... o yeah, I'm after Minori, aren't I" moments, the "I like being with Ryuuji, .... o yeah, Kitamura!!!!". This is underscored with harmonies of "O you bleeping pair of idiots, *I* should take Ryuuji!!", "Sumire's gone, nows my chance!!! Why is everyone stopping me and pushing Taiga at him???" and several other lines.

Last edited by Vexx; 2009-03-02 at 17:29.
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