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Old 2009-03-01, 14:31   Link #61
TinyRedLeaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monir View Post
Spoiler for the sake of viewers who are still awaiting a watch:
Spoiler for further thoughts:

And, by the way...
Spoiler for the heart of the mystery:
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Old 2009-03-02, 22:37   Link #62
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Horribly depressing, but in an extremely satisfying way...Thats what I'll go with as far as kneejerk final impressions from just viewing it are concerned.

One last note though...The aerial footage .especially with some of the larger formations was just fan-f*ckingtastic...wow...
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Old 2009-03-03, 09:41   Link #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiny Red Leaf
Spoiler for the heart of the mystery:
Spoiler for movie specific:


Btw, I'm a fan of GitS: Innocence to the point of raving. I think the movie features the kind of background imagery only Beyond the Cloud can match and no other animated feature came remotely close at matching. Getting through the story was easy after witnessing such visual delight.
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Old 2009-03-03, 13:46   Link #64
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This movie made me sad in a way that....it means these Kildrens will fight this meaningless and absurd war forever, looping again and again until the concept of being human has no meaning at all. It is depressingly bleak.

The commercialization of violence is also hinted here, people become careless with meaning of death since things is for sale, even human souls in Sky Crawlers. My head is spinning thinking on how inhumane on whole setting is.

Spoiler for Spoiler for Kusanagi:
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Old 2009-03-04, 02:16   Link #65
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Loved this Movie

Spoiler for dont read unless you have seen:
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Old 2009-03-04, 02:26   Link #66
TinyRedLeaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stormy001_M1A2 View Post
This movie made me sad in a way that....it means these Kildrens will fight this meaningless and absurd war forever, looping again and again until the concept of being human has no meaning at all. It is depressingly bleak.
Spoiler for my interpretation of the ending:


Quote:
Spoiler for Spoiler for Kusanagi:
Spoiler for Suito Kusanagi:
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Old 2009-03-04, 12:49   Link #67
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Hmm.
Spoiler for Movie:
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Old 2009-03-04, 14:34   Link #68
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Originally Posted by Shiroth View Post
Hmm.
Spoiler for Movie:
He is....his refusal to look at incoming pilots to the bar is a sign of his mental exhaustion. The sorrowful look with thousand yard stare of him is very compelling if you think further. Unlike the villagers who played ignorance, he did feel something is not right with the setup.
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Old 2009-03-04, 14:53   Link #69
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It good to see most of the post are positive about the movie i have been holding off watching till i could see what most people thought of it so i will cut some time out this weekend to watch it and give my own feedback.
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Old 2009-03-04, 15:32   Link #70
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It is pretty tough movie to watch for me since the moral dissonance is so pungent. Mamoru Oshii just present the story as it is, so is the novelist... just the whole idea behind this movie just sickens me so much. Humanity is truly on the brink of moral bankruptcy in Sky Crawlers. Hence my empathy for the exhausted old man in the bar.

It is a good movie no doubt but it is hard to stomach for me.
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Old 2009-03-04, 17:48   Link #71
Shiroth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stormy001_M1A2 View Post
He is....his refusal to look at incoming pilots to the bar is a sign of his mental exhaustion. The sorrowful look with thousand yard stare of him is very compelling if you think further. Unlike the villagers who played ignorance, he did feel something is not right with the setup.
No i know that, i just had the thought that he was going to play a part in the main story of the movie. Looks like i was just looking to much into it. Doesn't matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
It good to see most of the post are positive about the movie i have been holding off watching till i could see what most people thought of it so i will cut some time out this weekend to watch it and give my own feedback.
Make sure you watch it soon. It's one movie that should not be missed.
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Old 2009-03-05, 04:11   Link #72
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It's the typical Japanese War-is-horrible-pacifist bollocks. Clones of the Teacher to keep the fighting going forever?? I say it's just a convenient way for the writer to make the movie seem deep while having no real depth at all. All the different technologies mixed together with the WW2 setting is just an easy cop-out for forsaking research and creative thought that could have made a cohesive, original, fantasy-like setting or a series period-piece.
Spoiler for Spoiler:

At least Ghost in the Shell series has enough plot to it, not to have resort to familiar period pieces and contrived deus ex machina to keep the setting going.

Basically this movie explained away the plot instead of actually developing one.
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Old 2009-03-05, 05:18   Link #73
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I don't know about this one. I *liked* it, but it sure as hell was not the best anime movie I've seen. FAR from it in fact...

For one, the dourness is typical in a Mamoru Oshii is there, but it sort of seems misplaced. Characters angsting out over cigarettes (I don't trust anyone who doesn't smoke! Give me a smoke. Got a smoke? Can I smoke? SMOKE-PLEASE?) was not only weird, but seemed just unnecessary.

A lot of the dialogue was just there to make an 'adult' mood about things instead of focusing more about the theme of the story it seemed.

And of course, the main plot.... oh where do I even begin.... it's like the entire reasoning for the pilots is like a deus ex machina. For one, we are magically supposed to assume that they're immortal due to medicines or something. Then we have two companies engaging in an OPEN HOSTILE WARFARE and the rest of the populace just sits around with this, all fine and dandy. And finally, they're in a Western European nation (let's just say.... The UK), and the pilots are all Japanese? HUH?

It had some moments of good moments, but this movie just felt overlong and the plotdevices are either pointless or just came out of the thin air. Oshii wasted too much time with idle and mindless chatter and unnecessary moments (10 minutes of BOWLING? come on..) took away from what could have been more respectable as a film. TWO HOURS for such little substance as far as the plot and even characterizations? It could've been 1 hour and do everything the main plot set out to do.
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Old 2009-03-05, 08:52   Link #74
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Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles View Post
And finally, they're in a Western European nation (let's just say.... The UK), and the pilots are all Japanese? HUH?
This is like saying if the movie was made in Korea and they'd end up speaking Korean. There's nothing much to it at all.

I can't blame anyone for disliking the slow nature of pretty much every scene in this film, though personally it's one of the parts that i loved so much about it. It's the fact that it didn't have to roll at a normal pace, i loved it for doing something that stands out --- something that Oshii is known for doing.

As for the smoking, it was a good connection between the cast. Especially Kannami and Kusanagi.
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Old 2009-03-05, 11:39   Link #75
TinyRedLeaf
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Originally Posted by lubczyk View Post
It's the typical Japanese War-is-horrible-pacifist bollocks. *snip*
You're entitled to your opinions and certainly, since it's Oshii we're talking about, this movie is bound to attract both critical praise and criticism.

But for f*ck sake, at least have the courtesy to use spoiler tags where necessary.

The movie has barely opened in few cinemas worldwide, R1 DVDs are not yet released, and though the torrent is out at your usual places, you can bet many people have not yet seen the movie. Have some consideration dammit.
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Old 2009-03-05, 13:25   Link #76
lubczyk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
You're entitled to your opinions and certainly, since it's Oshii we're talking about, this movie is bound to attract both critical praise and criticism.

But for f*ck sake, at least have the courtesy to use spoiler tags where necessary.

The movie has barely opened in few cinemas worldwide, R1 DVDs are not yet released, and though the torrent is out at your usual places, you can bet many people have not yet seen the movie. Have some consideration dammit.
Is that really a spoiler? It's something that I'd expect to see on a synopsis. You know "War is Hell!!!" and all that.
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Old 2009-03-06, 03:32   Link #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lubczyk View Post
It's the typical Japanese War-is-horrible-pacifist bollocks. Clones of the Teacher to keep the fighting going forever?? I say it's just a convenient way for the writer to make the movie seem deep while having no real depth at all. All the different technologies mixed together with the WW2 setting is just an easy cop-out for forsaking research and creative thought that could have made a cohesive, original, fantasy-like setting or a series period-piece.
Spoiler for Spoiler:

At least Ghost in the Shell series has enough plot to it, not to have resort to familiar period pieces and contrived deus ex machina to keep the setting going.

Basically this movie explained away the plot instead of actually developing one.
Spoiler for Zzz:
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Old 2009-03-06, 07:30   Link #78
SuperKnuckles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiroth View Post
This is like saying if the movie was made in Korea and they'd end up speaking Korean. There's nothing much to it at all.

I can't blame anyone for disliking the slow nature of pretty much every scene in this film, though personally it's one of the parts that i loved so much about it. It's the fact that it didn't have to roll at a normal pace, i loved it for doing something that stands out --- something that Oshii is known for doing.

As for the smoking, it was a good connection between the cast. Especially Kannami and Kusanagi.
The thing about the nationalities is that they didn't make any effort to make it seem like the Kildren are some naturalized citizens. It looks to me like they purposely chose Japanese pilots as a bit of an unnatural playthings for war. Not only is that messed up, but it just defies logic. Why can't they just get fellow Brits (again, I'm assuming) if they could? I just didn't like how they had to split languages like that. That only made things more confusing and less believable for me. Just make them all speak Japanese for all I care.

And yeah, the smoking had a weird correlation with Kanami and Kusanagi.. weird in that Mamoru Oshii way. Also that weird Basset Hound fetish of Oshii's...
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Old 2009-03-06, 10:16   Link #79
TinyRedLeaf
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Originally Posted by lubczyk View Post
Is that really a spoiler? It's something that I'd expect to see on a synopsis. You know "War is Hell!!!" and all that.
*sigh*

Spoiler for why do I even bother now that the secret is out?:


When it comes to anime, movies or TV programmes, it's very hard to make a show that is both intelligent and entertaining. Usually, most go for the latter: It's easier to entertain people than it is to make them think. That's the exact same problem Oshii suffers as a film-maker. He makes intelligent, but extremely boring, movies. So, yes, I don't blame anyone for hating The Sky Crawlers for being a tedious show, because it is. It expects too much of its audience and it proves that, in the end, it's hard for a leopard to change its spots: Oshii remains very much a self-indulgent storyteller.

Frankly, I do sympathise with you. It's not surprising that all you got from the movie is the message, "War is Hell!", because a lot of its plot is left unspoken; it's been delivered in those pregnant pauses first made famous by the late playwright Harold Pinter, and used frequently in Japanese shows, probably because it fits their stoic national character so well.

At the same time, though, it also indicates that you had not watched the movie closely enough, to understand why quite a number of people think it's a critical — if not a commercial — success. Is that the film-maker's fault, or his audience's? In my opinion, both are equally to blame. The former for being inscrutable; the latter for not trying hard enough to see the few details that he does carefully reveal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles View Post
The thing about the nationalities is that they didn't make any effort to make it seem like the Kildren are some naturalized citizens. It looks to me like they purposely chose Japanese pilots as a bit of an unnatural playthings for war. Not only is that messed up, but it just defies logic.
The way I see it — and this is by no means canon; I don't know how the novels actually handled it — the Kildren are company products, possibly first created in Japan, hence their all-Japanese names. The use of English during radio chatter is probably an acknowledgement of its status as a lingua franca — it allows the pilots to understand each other regardless of which country they are deployed in. The Kildren in Alice Base spoke Japanese, true, but that's possibly because of artistic licence — they could have been speaking some other language, but for the sake of convenience, we hear them speaking Japanese (and whatever language the movie will be dubbed in) instead.

As for the smoking, I think that's simply because it looks cool, and also because it's a Japanese film. The Japanese have fewer hang-ups about tobacco use than Americans do. In fact, most Western Europeans I knew from university hardly care either.
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Old 2009-03-06, 11:27   Link #80
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Well, I'm looking forward to try see this flick because there's Kikuchi and Kuriyama doing VA roles but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
He makes intelligent, but extremely boring, movies. So, yes, I don't blame anyone for hating The Sky Crawlers for being a tedious show, because it is. It expects too much of its audience and it proves that, in the end, it's hard for a leopard to change its spots: Oshii remains very much a self-indulgent storyteller.
Yeah, judging from some Japanese films usually being shown on the late-night WOWOW slots (by experience of many nights till dawn), are art-house, made for an intelligentsia audience, who like very deep philosophical themes and read websites like The Midnight Eye, try to keep awake while watching (maybe not once but three times), ponder and analyze the problems of war, violence and conflict, and Sky Crawlers fits right in as well.

In short, this flick will require me a huge mug of coffee.
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