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View Poll Results: Clannad - Episode 22 Rating
Perfect 10 211 60.81%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 49 14.12%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 23 6.63%
7 out of 10 : Good 20 5.76%
6 out of 10 : Average 19 5.48%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 0.86%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 0.86%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 0.58%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 3 0.86%
1 out of 10 : Painful 14 4.03%
Voters: 347. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-03-12, 17:23   Link #41
Seravy
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Join Date: Nov 2003
;_; what wonderful ending. if i could rate it more than 10 i would.
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Old 2009-03-12, 17:37   Link #42
bladeofdarkness
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Age: 30
i made it a point to watch this ep and 21 at the same time (didnt watch last week)
OMG
i was litteraly in tears during the entire first half of the episode
Spoiler for the line that made me cry hardest:

i love this episode to almost no end
clannad has no officially replaced kanon as my #1 keyoani show
couldnt ask for a better ending to it
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Last edited by bladeofdarkness; 2009-03-12 at 18:02.
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Old 2009-03-12, 17:39   Link #43
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panzerfan View Post
Given your attitude about this, I would say that this amount of suspension of disbelief will fall flat on its face Kaioshin. The kind of personality portrayal in Legend of Galactic Heroes is an exception and I don't honestly expect it to ever be replicated in any way, so personally I am judging production based its intended results. In another word, take it easy~
Oh but I am judging the production based on it's intended results (I'm not just another typical RAEGer after all), which is precisely why this ending causes problems with regard to the last 5-6 episodes before it. It's not what happened, but how it conflicts with some other things I thought were done quite well and throws yet more aspects of the show into confusion and chaos. In other words it's something I cannot ignore.
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Old 2009-03-12, 17:40   Link #44
Kaisos Erranon
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Join Date: Nov 2007
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Like I said.

What works in a game does not necessarily work in an anime.

It was fine in the game because it felt like a reward for all the shit you had to go through to get to it.

Is it fine here, when you're not the player character? Not so much.
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Old 2009-03-12, 17:42   Link #45
bladeofdarkness
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ep 24 gave us a tomoyo route OVA
lets hope ep 24 this time gives as a tomoyo after OVA
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Old 2009-03-12, 17:57   Link #46
Proto
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Quote:
Like I said.

What works in a game does not necessarily work in an anime.

It was fine in the game because it felt like a reward for all the shit you had to go through to get to it.

Is it fine here, when you're not the player character? Not so much.
Well, it depends on how much empathy you can feel for the characters. Certainly it is easier when the narrative is in first person, however it's not like empathy is impossible in 3rd person styled narratives.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:02   Link #47
Yukinokesshou
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Excellent production, though having played the VN, everything was somewhat expected. As usual, Kyo Ani stuck very closely to Key's storyline. 10/10 for a fulfilling end to a fulfilling (though completely illogical) series.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
I approve of this episode.

I approve of grownup/teenage Mei. Nice figure without being overdone.
I approve too. *Brings down stamp* APPROVED

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
No idea where Kotomi is, but it has to be someplace they drive on the right side of the road, but have the driver seat on the right side (or she imported her own car).
According to this Wikipedia article... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-h...ating_position ... "Although it drives on the right, North Korea has imported various used RHD vehicles from Japan, from tourist buses to Toyota Land Cruisers."
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:04   Link #48
Ushio
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Join Date: Jan 2009
It was a happy ending, but it still made me sad, because I know I'll never have a perfect family like that. OTL''

Ah, either way, good episode.

Spoiler for But..:
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:15   Link #49
Haruyasha
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Join Date: Oct 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ushio View Post
It was a happy ending, but it still made me sad, because I know I'll never have a perfect family like that. OTL''

Ah, either way, good episode.

Spoiler for But..:
Lol, I was wishing that too.

Spoiler:
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:19   Link #50
Sheba
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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Age: 34
Yeah right, let's all have a Emile Zola miserable ending and get a near pornographic pleasure in others' misery. What was Maeda's intention again? A "naturalistic" study or a "magic realist" story about a group of people in a town?
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:23   Link #51
panzerfan
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Well now now, it's not as if Maeda Jun didn't have a bit of that Tomino-esque kill'em all attitude demonstrated in Ideon. Originally his script goes only as far as episode 21... rather sadistic, and strangely enough Toei didn't opt that way in movie too.

But anyways, that's getting sidetracked from this episode.

This episode has two animation directors and I think you can see how much budget goes into making this sole episode. I hope KyoAni doesn't stretch itself too thin out of this one though.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:30   Link #52
Kaioshin Sama
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Oh and I think this series already gets enough leeway from me as it is....most people don't even seem to bother to really critique it so I wouldn't mind being the first to point out some of the flaws in the overall storyline since it seems like nobody else ever bothers too. It's the finale so I might as well go all out now:

Spoiler for Why I wasn't sold on this ending:


Sorry, but after episode 18 I really did expect a lot more from this series and had raised my expectations. I guess I expected too much. Hence why this episode gets a 6/10. In the end the series will probably end up with a 7/10. I enjoyed quite a few more parts of it then I thought it would, but in the end to me it's just another KeyAni story and to me that's not enough to push it to the next level I was really hoping for after episode 18.

I'm only left to imagine though what would happen if this type of ending happened for any show other then Clannad with it's seemingly impenetrable criticism shield. Holy crap would that show just get ripped to pieces.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:34   Link #53
MeoTwister5
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Might as well download the raw. It would suck so much ass if Torch Hijacks Chiisana Tenohira, but maybe I can forgive them for that.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:35   Link #54
Sheba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post

I'm only left to imagine though what would happen if this type of ending happened for any show other then Clannad with it's seemingly impenetrable criticism shield. Holy crap would that show just get ripped to pieces.
Mai-HiMe, Nanoha A's, need I name more? Oh wait, there be no mechs, no huge war, no politics.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:36   Link #55
Proto
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@KS: Well, that's because you are seeing the magic in the story as a contrived plot device rather than an integral part of the story. The last episodes before 21 weren't in vain, a what if scenario of sort. Under the logic of the story, it was necessary for Tomoya to understand what the message the town was giving him was. That's why the lighting orbs were an ever present element in the story back since Fuuko's arc. Rather than just a 'whoops, nothing to see here' kind of scenario, it was a 'tragedy in order to grow up' kind of path, were he was given a second opportunity exactly because he struggled through unhappiness, and yet emotionally succeeded and accepted it all.

Though, that's the problem with magical realism in general. It's, for its most part presented as a realist kind of show except for some not-so-obvious-at-fist-glance kind of aspects, which sometimes you are expected to weed out yourself in order to see the message the author is trying to convey. As such, one cannot directly apply a 'normal world + deus ex machina' logic to these scenarios.

PS: compound words FTW.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:38   Link #56
MeoTwister5
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Since this is the final episodes and pretty much all spoilers are free territory, the Spoilers thread has all the information you need on the light orbs and the magical nature of the story. I'll be at the gym while it downloads, don't fail me now Chiisana Tenohira.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:41   Link #57
Tempester
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
Oh and I think this series already gets enough leeway from me as it is....most people don't even seem to bother to really critique it so I wouldn't mind being the first to point out some of the flaws in the overall storyline since it seems like nobody else ever bothers too. It's the finale so I might as well go all out now:

Spoiler for Why I wasn't sold on this ending:


Sorry, but after episode 18 I really did expect a lot more from this series and had raised my expectations. I guess I expected too much. Hence why this episode gets a 6/10. In the end the series will probably end up with a 7/10. I enjoyed quite a few more parts of it then I thought it would, but in the end to me it's just another KeyAni story and to me that's not enough to push it to the next level I was really hoping for after episode 18.

I'm only left to imagine though what would happen if this type of ending happened for any show other then Clannad with it's seemingly impenetrable criticism shield. Holy crap would that show just get ripped to pieces.
You took the words out of my mind Kaioshin-sama. I absolutely love the True Ending, it feels justified because Tomoya gets what he deserves in the end after all that emotional pain. But in the end, I think it lost the message of the story. We can relate with Tomoya raising Ushio as a single father and the story ending that way, because people, including our spouses, pass away in real life and they don't come back. But how can we relate to traveling back in time to save your wife from death? True End is a beautiful ending, but at the same time it feels distant and we can't sympathize with the characters anymore.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:42   Link #58
MeoTwister5
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Join Date: Jul 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Proto View Post
@KS: Well, that's because you are seeing the magic in the story as a contrived plot device rather than an integral part of the story. The last episodes before 21 weren't in vain, a what if scenario of sort. Under the logic of the story, it was necessary for Tomoya to understand what the message the town was giving him was. That's why the lighting orbs were an ever present element in the story back since Fuuko's arc. Rather than just a 'whoops, nothing to see here' kind of scenario, it was a 'tragedy in order to grow up' kind of path, were he was given a second opportunity exactly because he struggled through unhappiness, and yet emotionally succeeded and accepted it all.

Though, that's the problem with magical realism in general. It's, for its most part presented as a realist kind of show except for some not-so-obvious-at-fist-glance kind of aspects, which sometimes you are expected to weed out yourself in order to see the message the author is trying to convey. As such, one cannot directly apply a 'normal world + deus ex machina' logic to these scenarios.

PS: compound words FTW.
And as some of us have talked about in the Spoilers thread, it all falls into whether the anime can try to link the "return to that day" into a believable and continuous narrative that the VN didn't actually need so much of. It has to be continuous here because you aren't in the 1st person POV like the VN, so I'll comment more on it later when I watch it.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:42   Link #59
Proto
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Quote:
Since this is the final episodes and pretty much all spoilers are free territory, the Spoilers thread has all the information you need on the light orbs and the magical nature of the story. I'll be at the gym while it downloads, don't fail me now Chiisana Tenohira.
Hmm... well there are still some spoilers left as for the stories in the light novel that might be animated, and the scenarios that didn't made it to the anime (eg: Kyou's, Sanae's, Akio's, half of Yoshino's and Kappei's, heck the guy didn't even get a cameo.) but for the most part the spoiler thread should be safe for everyone now.

Quote:
True End is a beautiful ending, but at the same time it feels distant and we can't sympathize with the characters anymore.
Maybe you can't sympathize, but you definitely can empathize.
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Old 2009-03-12, 18:44   Link #60
Sidestep
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Well I am very pleased. Compared to the game, this felt much more fulfilling.

And wow, Mei, is that you!?
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