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Old 2009-03-20, 15:16   Link #61
Ithekro
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Basically, the yellow parts are the show itself and we, the viewer, are actaully starting in the "middle" of the story, after the first (or 12th...whatever) jump back. What we are given is the Second Timeline until Episode 16 where the choice is made. We are shown choice A first...this leads us back to Timeline One (Nagisa dies). We got though Ushio Arc then get sent back to the point of choice (Episode 16/22) and see choice B...Nagisa lives (orange path)

In theory it could mean that the first run we get, Tomoya is short just one orb, and gets in from his father after having skipped it the other times though. Therefore he goes back one last time and is finally able to save Nagisa. If one looks at it in Game terms.

I choose to view it slightly differently, but that is my choice.
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Old 2009-03-20, 15:17   Link #62
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Couldn't the IW, be thought of as a reseptical for the towns happiness? Even though its created by Ushio, I assume from a happiness orb. Also if IW is a vessel for the happiness of the town, it implies that the towns shared happiness is much like the shared happiness within a family and hence the happiness within the town/family brings about the miracle of Nagisa not dying. Of course this could just be my delusional thinking. With the projected feelings of happiness the idea that family is based on a "home" which Nagisa emphasizes to Tomoya in Episode 16 when Tomoya and his father meet in jail for the first time. The concept of home and how it ties in with the town, and the importance of a "home" in a family makes me think that the town's collective happiness brought about the miracle. This is one thing that makes me confused, if all the happiness is used to give Nagisa and Tomoya this miracle, how can IW still exisit? And was there some form of IW when Nagisa was 5 since Akio also made a similar wish for Nagisa?
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Old 2009-03-20, 15:21   Link #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Proto View Post
Yes, he already did. The one who switched contexts wasn't Tomoya himself, but us, as in the viewer when we reached the dimensional crossroad.

Or you could say that prior to his decision both timelines existed simultaneously, in a Schrodinger cat kind of way. It wasn't till he took his decision that both timelines collapsed into timeline 2. In any case we were shown those episodes so we could come to understand:

- The existance of the IW
- The existance of Timeline 2 itself
- The significance of the crossroad were timeline 1 and 2 radically diverge.
Then why does Tomoya seem to be all buddy buddy with Kyou in episode 20 if we the viewer crossed timelines? The graph seems to imply that they never really met or bonded in any meaningful way in Timeline 1 and thus Tomoya lacks the light orbs there.
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Old 2009-03-20, 15:29   Link #64
Proto
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That is something I don't completely agree with the graph.From my POV, the only thing that changed between the past of Timeline 1 and Timeline 2 was the gathering of lights, the unconscious need to gather the happiness and memories from the people from the town.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:34   Link #65
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
Then why does Tomoya seem to be all buddy buddy with Kyou in episode 20 if we the viewer crossed timelines? The graph seems to imply that they never really met or bonded in any meaningful way in Timeline 1 and thus Tomoya lacks the light orbs there.
?

Tomoya and Kyou had been friends since their second year of high school. They're fairly close from the very start of the story.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:36   Link #66
Ithekro
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Also why he calls her by her given name rather than her family name I would guess...since he calls Ryou "Fujibayashi", by Kyou is "Kyou".
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:40   Link #67
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Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Also why he calls her by her given name rather than her family name I would guess...since he calls Ryou "Fujibayashi", by Kyou is "Kyou".
He has trouble getting that out of his mindset in the Twins' route too, which was very amusing.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:40   Link #68
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?

Tomoya and Kyou had been friends since their second year of high school. They're fairly close from the very start of the story.
She talked about how Sunohara, Ryou and Kotomi had talked about paying him a visit. If we take the timeline at face value he shouldn't be that well acquainted with either Ryou or Kotomi, nor should they have any reason to form a cohesive group.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:44   Link #69
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She talked about how Sunohara, Ryou and Kotomi had talked about paying him a visit. If we take the timeline at face value he shouldn't be that well acquainted with either Ryou or Kotomi, nor should they have any reason to form a cohesive group.
Oh, okay then.

Yeah, that timeline is stupid.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:49   Link #70
Ithekro
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Well Ryou is in his own class...so he'll know her at least. Kotomi on the other hand is a question. I suppose it depends on how the route stucture goes. Timeline One has to be able to get into After Story to fuction. If you can do Nagisa's route without interacting with Kotomi, then you have a potental flaw.

However there is something to be said for the yellow path having to follow what came before it...so the Yellow path would have references to Timeline Two even in the Timeline One portion because that is the routes "present" Tomoya had taken up to that point.
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Old 2009-03-20, 17:50   Link #71
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Not really. If they defined Nagisa's "route" in the anime with such cohesion (since the actual events aren't show as different timelines but successive events, which may or may not give a light orb), the fact Tomoya and the rest of the characters are being that close isn't a paradox.

They never implied such thing in the game, but since the anime changed the story to have a single timeline, it still makes sense.
If Tomoya "already helped" the girl from the original timelines, it doesn't actually mean he could have orbs with everyone. Likewise, we cannot claim X or Y events could happen so smoothly before.
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Old 2009-03-20, 18:49   Link #72
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In the game, Kotomi only appears within her own route (and the Sunohara Gay End if you're going for that).

So yeah, the timeline diagram is dumb.
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Old 2009-03-20, 18:58   Link #73
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The diagram is only applied to the anime series, obviously.

To begin with, the game wouldn't need a diagram considering its structure which is much easier to figure as several timelines unlike the anime series.

So the given diagram is hardly anything dumb here.
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Old 2009-03-20, 19:07   Link #74
Kaisos Erranon
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Still doesn't work the way the diagram shows though.

In this case, I'd say Tomoya actually went back in time than into an alternate universe...
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Old 2009-03-20, 19:16   Link #75
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*sighs*

The only orb he collects after Nagisa's death is his father's. The anime depicts one timeline up until the ending. One. There is an implied and undepicted first timeline where he fails and is then sent on his mission, which we see in the anime.

That's my interpretation. The graph overcomplicates things, honestly.
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Old 2009-03-20, 19:20   Link #76
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by VRMN View Post
*sighs*

The only orb he collects after Nagisa's death is his father's. The anime depicts one timeline up until the ending. One. There is an implied and undepicted first timeline where he fails and is then sent on his mission, which we see in the anime.

That's my interpretation. The graph overcomplicates things, honestly.
This works too.
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Old 2009-03-20, 20:50   Link #77
Hamchan
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Timeline kinda makes sense to me but my head is still reeling. I think i'll go play the game now to actually 'get' this. Kinda reminds me of watching lost actually
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Old 2009-03-20, 21:15   Link #78
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Hamchan View Post
Timeline kinda makes sense to me but my head is still reeling. I think i'll go play the game now to actually 'get' this. Kinda reminds me of watching lost actually
The game makes more sense, due to the fact that you (as Tomoya) are actually traveling into a different timeline every time you click "New Game", effectively.
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Old 2009-03-20, 21:39   Link #79
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
In the game, Kotomi only appears within her own route (and the Sunohara Gay End if you're going for that).

So yeah, the timeline diagram is dumb.
You mean sunohara gar end... or sunohara awesome end, the fact that sunohara makes no passes on any girls the entire game brings up the possible siscom or the I like to fence complex.
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Old 2009-03-20, 22:01   Link #80
Kaisos Erranon
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the fact that sunohara makes no passes on any girls the entire game
Have you actually played the game?

Sunohara hits on Sanae, Nagisa, Tomoyo, Misae, Kyou, Yukine, Kotomi (kinda), and Ryou if you make certain choices. (I don't remember him hitting on Fuuko, though I'm probably wrong.)

He's most certainly straight.
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