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Old 2009-04-02, 16:15   Link #421
Meisterdieb
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Originally Posted by kagato3 View Post
Well, not that I belive he is the king, Azien did claim the throne of hevaen was empty.
Ok, that's at least a nice catch.

Still, I don't think that Aizen was talking about SS when speaking of Heaven.
And when you lok at his "ascension" at the end of SS arc, you'll maybe understand why I believe he meant something else then.
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Old 2009-04-03, 04:57   Link #422
Bazoki
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Well all i know is that Isshin is a kickass shinigami of captain level. That's enough for me. Time will reveal who he really is.
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Old 2009-04-03, 12:56   Link #423
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I have this theory that the remaining Kurosaki family is one of the four great noble families of Soul Society, the only other two known being the Shihouin family and the Kuchiki family. The fact that Ichigo has his (human?) mother's hair and the family name, Kurosaki, probably being his mother's or a made up one by his father. There are a few flaws, since the four noble families seem to be interacting alot (Byakuya and Yuruichi's friendship for instance) and Rukia has seem both Ichigo's father and black haired sister, but yeah. I think its pretty probable that Ichigo comes from some renowned family atleast, if not the king's.
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Old 2009-04-03, 20:21   Link #424
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oh yea...i completely forgot the other 2 noble families haven't even been mentioned yet...i think.
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Old 2009-04-03, 21:18   Link #425
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So I have a question. If Isshin is from SS then how did a dead man produce children? Do we believe the gigai have the ability to produce offspring when inhabited by a soul?? I don't believe that.

So I now propose that Isshin is human and one of the humans which Ukitake referred to when he gave Ichigo the Combat Badge.

So what about the shihatso? We don't know how he got that. He could have gotten shimigami powers from a captain back in the day, similar to how Ichigo got power from Rukia. If he got powers from a captain maybe a form of captains robes appeared on him when he transformed to soul form.

Also I think Kurosaki is actually his wife's last name
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Old 2009-04-03, 23:10   Link #426
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Souls would have to be able to procreate otherwise we wouldn't be able to have "Noble families". unless they are all adopted into the family or something.
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Old 2009-04-04, 05:34   Link #427
Uncreativex
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Originally Posted by FanFan View Post
So I have a question. If Isshin is from SS then how did a dead man produce children? Do we believe the gigai have the ability to produce offspring when inhabited by a soul?? I don't believe that.


Also I think Kurosaki is actually his wife's last name
If gigai have the function of being able to move, then they should have the function to procreate. I got the impression that Gigai are exactly like normal bodies, only without souls and made "artificially." Nothing suggests impotence.
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Old 2009-04-04, 12:05   Link #428
Chaos Zangetsu
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If Isshin was the king of Soul Society don't you think SOMEONE would notice their freakin king is missing?! Unless the Zero division is hiding under his bed, protecting him all the time.
The reason they wouldn't notice is the King lives in a separate dimension. That is what the King's Key does is open a path to that dimension. The King of Soul Society has therefore never been seen by anyone except those who use the key, and only the Captain Commanders know where the key was. None of the Captains knew where it was, which is why Aizen is gonna try to make a new one with the destruction of Ichigo's town that's full of spirit enriched land that's needed to make the key.
Yammamoto may know about Ichgo, but that's unlikely since Ichigo had to have been born in the human world. Yammamoto has probaly never been in the human world much and with Isshin's non-existant powers(until he got them back) being surpressed in the Gigai he probaly had on since getting to the human world, he still wouldn't have been noticed by Yammmamoto, even if Yammamoto had actually seen the king before and knew his reiatsu.
This all supports the reasoning Isshin is the King.

The questions that may be asked to fully know the situation is:

1. If Ichigo has powers and Isshin has powers, does Ichigo's sisters have hidden Shinigami powers like Ichigo and if their mother was a quincy or shinigami(not likely since she could've destroyed the hollow when it was attacking Ichigo instead of dying to save him.), do they have quincy powers too?
2. If Isshin is the king, why did he lose his powers and how?
3. What happened to make Isshin come to the human world?
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Old 2009-04-04, 12:44   Link #429
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Ichigo's sisters undoubtly also have latent powers, but I doubt we'll see any of it in the series. There is also absolutely nothing but the dislike between Isshin and Ishida's father that suggests that Ichigo's mother was a quincy, and I consider it ridiculous.
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Old 2009-04-04, 12:52   Link #430
Vinak
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his mother may not have been a Quincy herself, but she could very well be related to them. This brings fourth the possibility of a Romeo and Juliet relationship between Isshin and Ishida. In fact if might be very possible that Ichigo's mother is actually Ishida's sister. [pure speculation based on little or no evidence] This can explain why Isshin and Ishida know each other and why Ichigo has or had a blue aura.

I also don't see why we wouldn't see Ichigo's sisters and/or his friends displaying some sort of power in the series. the whole thing about them fighting Hollows and developing the ability to see spirits is kind of pointless otherwise.
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Old 2009-04-04, 16:57   Link #431
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he had a captain haori over his shoulder so at least it narrows it down to him being one of the captains at least 20 years ago. That rules out yamamoto, unohana, kyoraku, joushiro, soi fon (yourichi was before her), 3rd division (rose then gin), 5th division (shinji then aizen), 6th division (ginrei then byakuya), 7th division (love then komamura), 9th division (kensei then tosen), 11th division (last one was killed and isshin is alive), 12th division (kirio hikifune promoted, then urahara, then mayuri), and kido corps (tessai).

The only one left is Hitsuguya's 10th division and i think its probably that since it fits into the timeframe and the 'captain' thing.
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Old 2009-04-04, 19:43   Link #432
FanFan
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Souls would have to be able to procreate otherwise we wouldn't be able to have "Noble families". unless they are all adopted into the family or something.
Souls are adopted into families. As was stated in the beginning of the SS arc when Chad meets up with that bird/kid again. How does a family become Noble? They are favored by the King, and the other people accept it.

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If gigai have the function of being able to move, then they should have the function to procreate. I got the impression that Gigai are exactly like normal bodies, only without souls and made "artificially." Nothing suggests impotence.
I never got this impression. In fact the only impression I got was that the gigai was needed to move around and interact with the living world. However a soul could be seen if they use a special projecting device, as we saw in the episode when Hanatarō Yamada comes to the living world with that soul (can't think of name) from the science and tech bureau.
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Old 2009-04-05, 03:20   Link #433
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i guess this is one of those 'mr tite please explain this' things. personally i think procreation is possible in soul society.
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Old 2009-04-05, 04:30   Link #434
Uncreativex
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Originally Posted by FanFan View Post
Souls are adopted into families. As was stated in the beginning of the SS arc when Chad meets up with that bird/kid again. How does a family become Noble? They are favored by the King, and the other people accept it.
Despite having watched and read that arch, I never heard something similar. I honestly think the idea of Byakuya adopting Rukia was out of the norm, and opposed by others in the family and only done for Rukia's sister's sake. Byakuya also spent alot of time mourning his parents rather personally, and there are similarities between Byakuya and his grandfather.
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Old 2009-04-05, 13:22   Link #435
wrenchan
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Despite having watched and read that arch, I never heard something similar. I honestly think the idea of Byakuya adopting Rukia was out of the norm, and opposed by others in the family and only done for Rukia's sister's sake. Byakuya also spent alot of time mourning his parents rather personally, and there are similarities between Byakuya and his grandfather.
This. He had already gone against convention by taking a non-noble wife, and when he took in Rukia as his sister out of respect for his wife he swore he'd never break the rules again (hence why he refused to intervene when the "rules" said Rukia had to be executed), so that tells me they don't regularly adopt just anyone.
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Old 2009-04-05, 13:36   Link #436
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Ok lets be honest here and put the vague pieces of puzzle together...or at least try to fit 'em. 1. you can get married is ss as shown by byakuya. 2. if you can get married then obviously there's going to be some intimacy. 3. as hinted by mayuri you can blow your wad (i would think he was putting his 'life force' in nemu (i mean c'mon, if it couldn't be aired what else could it possibly be???).....soooooo in conclusion i think those are hints enough (for me anyways) to let one know you can have kids.

and yes i agree with Uncreativex...i've never come across anywhere where it says the king favors the noble family and people accept them. Since adopting rukia was breaking the rules...the opposite view of that would be.....you can't adopt (except in certain circumstances) which leads one to believe that if you can't adopt you have to bang (for the lack of a better word at the moment) and conceive.


ps- oh my god....im painting this new quote on my car like the cop do their 'to serve and protect 'cept mines is gonna read 'to bang and conceive'.
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Old 2009-04-05, 14:30   Link #437
FanFan
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Despite having watched and read that arch, I never heard something similar.
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and yes i agree with Uncreativex...i've never come across anywhere where it says the king favors the noble family and people accept them.
Watch and/or read it again because you missed the explanation about adopting. Also it would make sense that the nobles just don't adopt or marry anyone, they are "noble" after all. As for the favor of the King and acceptance of the people, thats just common sense. How else would a family become noble. The only other way would be that the Family has immense reiatsu, but still they would have to have some sort of favor of the king or acceptance of the people. Otherwise all the captains would be classified as "noble", including Ken. Also if we go on the assumption of immense reiatsu then that would mean the thrown would change several times because the strongest would rule. However SS does not appear to be like that.

Quote:
Since adopting rukia was breaking the rules...the opposite view of that would be.....you can't adopt (except in certain circumstances) which leads one to believe that if you can't adopt you have to bang (for the lack of a better word at the moment) and conceive.
I would agree with this if you were talking about the living world however souls exist much much much much longer in SS than when they lived in the living world. So the "nobles" would not have to adopt often. I agree adopting Rukia was against what the family advised but Byakuya is the leader of the house and they do as he says. Its not a democracy. If the king came down and said "no you can't" then it would not have happened, but he didn't so it either means he didn't care or didn't know. More likely he didn't care and there by gave his approval.

just as Wrenchan said:
Quote:
He had already gone against convention by taking a non-noble wife, and when he took in Rukia as his sister out of respect for his wife he swore he'd never break the rules again (hence why he refused to intervene when the "rules" said Rukia had to be executed), so that tells me they don't regularly adopt just anyone.
Quote:
Ok lets be honest here and put the vague pieces of puzzle together...or at least try to fit 'em. 1. you can get married is ss as shown by byakuya. 2. if you can get married then obviously there's going to be some intimacy. 3. as hinted by mayuri you can blow your wad (i would think he was putting his 'life force' in nemu (i mean c'mon, if it couldn't be aired what else could it possibly be???).....soooooo in conclusion i think those are hints enough (for me anyways) to let one know you can have kids.
1 is correct. 2: this is a vague statement. interpersonal intimacy or sex? part a, yes, part b, maybe but that dosen't mean it will lead to kids. 3: I read and watch the translations and I don't remember him ever saying "wad", also Mayuri did say that Rengi and Ishida had filthy minds because he didn't do anything that couldn't be aired on TV. Besides, Nemui has been ripped apart, poisoned and had an "alien" pop out of her and yet she still goes on. I'm pretty sure Nemui is a mod soul in a gigai, she was after all created by Myuri and therefor can easily be restored by him.

I still think Isshin is a substitute. like father like son.
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Old 2009-04-05, 17:32   Link #438
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yea i meant sex...ok but seriously you can't expect me to believe someone will get married and won't have sex. secondly...mayuri's idea of what and what is not 'airable' might differ from most people...but i get what you are saying though and of course you're right about what nemu is and how she functions.

'wad' was added for entertainment purposes...by yours truly....but man how funny would it be if he did say it??...phoo

Isshin had a captain's haori so i don't think they would have allowed a substitute to do that. Of course we can't be sure of anything at this point so everything is pure speculation. Knowing mister Tite anyone could be right at this point...especially considering what has happened recently. Isshin could also be a special situation person...guess we'll just wait and find out ^[o_o]^ <-------- thats supposed to be something raising its hands and saying 'banzaaaaiiiii' or something...not flicking off....i didn't know how else i could do it...just to be sure....alrighty then
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Old 2009-04-05, 17:51   Link #439
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Yea that scene was funny to start and it would have been hilarious if he said "wad" meaning a bolus of life force. hahaha
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Old 2009-04-05, 19:29   Link #440
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highly disturbing though seeing as how she's his daughter....but we've all come to know morals/ethics and mayuri are not compatible with each other.
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