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Old 2009-03-26, 19:54   Link #821
alarmadadna hadi
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: With the runaways
Please recite:
-Genji did not talk to kinzo after the first twilight.
-George did not commit suicide.
-The culprit rudof attacked had no weapon.

Also, for the dissapearence of bodies:
-Culprit changed the location of the first twilight victims so that him being alive is not discovered and so that not double checking the bodies can be used as an excuse for
him being alive, which is how battler believed he wasn't "supposed" to be dead.


As a side note, for battlers "suicide" position...if we assume eva's the culprit, then maybe George was being forced to be her accomplice, which drove him to suicide, thus eva wanted to stage battlers death like that out of spite.
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Old 2009-03-26, 20:06   Link #822
Haruyan
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Mexico
Age: 25
-George did not commit suicide.

The body disappearance theory is correct, but Battler had another reason for thinking one of the first victims was not "supposed" to be dead.
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Old 2009-03-27, 09:55   Link #823
Jan-Poo
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
Quote:
Originally Posted by alarmadadna hadi View Post
Please recite:
-Genji did not talk to kinzo after the first twilight.
-George did not commit suicide.
-The culprit rudof attacked had no weapon.

Also, for the dissapearence of bodies:
-Culprit changed the location of the first twilight victims so that him being alive is not discovered and so that not double checking the bodies can be used as an excuse for
him being alive, which is how battler believed he wasn't "supposed" to be dead.


As a side note, for battlers "suicide" position...if we assume eva's the culprit, then maybe George was being forced to be her accomplice, which drove him to suicide, thus eva wanted to stage battlers death like that out of spite.
Eva IS the culprit in Battler's death. For simplicity i'll post all the blue theories that have been confirmed:


-Kanon and Jessica were talking side by side about the first twilight and something else
-Eva waited outside the guest house till the wind and the rain were convenient
-Then she climbed up to the window maybe she used a ladder
- She used the chance to kill jessica and Kanon because she heard them talking, she came into the house without concrete knowing who he would kill or maybe she just wanted to drug the survivors
-She came from behind and knocked Jessica out of conscious with a dull object
-Kanon noticed that of course and wanted to turn around
-While catching a glimpse of the murderer he was also knocked out
-then she strangled Jessica to death and after that Kanon
-because Eva thought it was funny he gave pose natural poses which could have fit the situation

Eva has the master key (kumasawa's)
After murdering Gohda, Eva went to hide in the service room.
In the service room, Eva awaited till everyone left the mansion to search for Shannon before leaving the guesthouse.

Shannon knows the culprit is out there
She went to the shed with the sole intention of getting the weapons for protection.
She locked the shed because she was afriad she might get attacked.
She frantically searched for the weapons and the shelf collapsed on her.
Shannon death was not a murder

Rudolf didn't expect the deaths of Jessica, Kanon and Gohda
Rudolf at first didn't know who was doing all that
When he said "at least i know that it isn't one of us" he realized that it had to be one of the six in the mansion
Therefore Rudolf wanted to go back there and check
This is why Rudolf proposed to go back to the mansion
However Eva knew that Rudolf would do that
And that's also why she hid the corpses of the first twilight
So that Rudolf wouldn't know who was his enemy

-Eva talks to battler and give him a reason to go inside the chapel
-Battler goes with Eva and Maria to the church
-Battler trusts Eva
-Eva already has the winchester and the camera with himself
-Eva posses a master key
-Eva, Battler and Maria enter the church
-Maria takes a picture of Battler
-Eva kills Battler
-Eva reason in this case is vengeance against Rudolf

Nanjo and Genji left the kitchen alone
The culprit killed Nanjo
Nanjo's body found in the boiler room is actually Nanjo's body
The body found inside the incinerator is Kinzo's body
Rudolf confronted the culprit
Rudolf killed the culprit




also these red truths have been stated recently:

Quote:

There's two murderers apart from Hideyoshi.
There's three murderers in the island.
Hideyoshi only killed Natsuhi
The other two murderers are responsible for all the other deaths, except Shannon's
Only one of the murderers had a weapon after the first twilight
There are at least two accomplices
In other words the culprits are Eva and Rudolf. The only thing that's left to do is finding out who killed who and why.
We also need to clarify how the first twilight happened, and how Kinzo, Eva, Rudolf and Genji died.
Lastly we need to pinpoint who are the two (or more) accomplices.

Confirmed murders:
Eva killed: Jessica, Kanon, Gohda, Battler, Nanjo
Rudolf killed: Eva
Hideyoshi killed: Natsuhi

Shannon died by an accident

Other confirmed "deaths":
George
Kumasawa
Kyrie
Rosa
Krauss
Rudolf
Kinzo
Genji

People whose death has never been stated:
Hideyoshi
Maria
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Last edited by Jan-Poo; 2009-03-27 at 10:13.
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Old 2009-03-27, 10:26   Link #824
Jan-Poo
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
theory


All the five persons who died in the first twilight were killed by the same murderer
The one who planned the first twilight and the one who actually killed the five victims are the same person
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Last edited by Jan-Poo; 2009-03-27 at 10:51.
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Old 2009-03-27, 12:35   Link #825
Haruyan
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Mexico
Age: 25
Sorry, but wrong.

And remember, tomorrow is the last day to figure it out.
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Old 2009-03-27, 12:57   Link #826
Jan-Poo
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
I give up.
I mean i could get to it given time but at the current pace it would take months, there are just too many possibilities and not enough elements to reach a conlcusion. Now that it is clear that the first twilight was performed by two persons, probably fighting each other, i guess i could go on with trial and error asking who died first. Something like: Kyrie died first, if no: Krauss died first and so on untill i get the right order, and only after that i could try to imagine who killed who and why. But as i said that would take too long.
There is also no info about Kinzo Genji Eva and Rudolf, i only know they are dead, but Kinzo apart i don't even know where are their bodies what kind of wounds they show and when exactly all those people died.

Even so i'm quite satisfied with everyone's effort since we managed to found out the two culprits and how most of the deaths happened.
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Old 2009-03-27, 20:54   Link #827
hodil
Solve me...
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
=.= " lawl... too busy playing fate/stay night... u might wanna give us humans a last chance with that unlimited red works 2... rite witch?

I always loved the endings of the umineko games when the deaths would appear scrolling across your screen.. kinda cool

Credits
Kinzo - Killed by Eva of lust
Krauss - Killed by Rudolph of greed
Natsuhi - Killed by Hideyoshi of gluttony
Hideyoshi - Killed by Rudolph of greed
Eva - Killed by Rudolph of greed
Rudolph - Survived
Kyrie - Killed by Eva of lust
Rosa - Accomplice of both Rudolph and Eva. Killed by Rudolph of greed
Jessica - Killed by Eva of lust
George - Killed by Rudolph of greed
Battler - Killed by Eva of lust
Maria - Killed by Hideyoshi of gluttony
Genji- Killed by Eva of lust
Gohda - Killed by Eva of lust
Kumasawa - Killed by Rudolph of greed
Kanon - Killed by Eva of lust
Shannon - Staked in the stomach by her own carelessness
Nanjo - Killed by Eva of lust


Beatrice's explanation of the first twilight
-Rudolph approached Rosa even before Eva did.
-Rudolph wanted Rosa to be an accomplice
-Eva later approached Rosa
-Rosa agreed to be her accomplice too
-Rudolph excuted the first twilight
-Rudolph killed Krauss, Kumasawa, George.
-Eva killed Kyrie to avenge George
-Rosa was sent to kill Eva by Rudolph
-Rosa confronted Eva but did not kill her
-They were both accomplices
-Rosa allowed Eva to play dead
-After Rosa's use was over, Rudolph killed her
-Rudolph also believed that Eva was dead

This does not contain the full motive.. but im more intrigued by how the first twilight was even done.

The police arrived on Oct 6th and discovered a large piles of mixed up body parts in the hall before the portrait of the witch. It is impossible to tell which body belonged to who, they were all horribly disfigured. A letter was found on the chapel's altar.

I, Ushiromiya Hideyoshi, is being targeted.
Why someone is after my life, I dont know.
The only thing that I do know is that it has something to do with Beatrice-sama.
RenaMaria and MionNatsuhi were the culprits.
There were also four to five adults.my wife and my brother-in-law.
Eva owned a winchester.
Why this has happened, I dont know.
By the time you have read this, i will probably be dead.
The difference would be whether i have a body or not.
Please expose the truth, whoever may be reading this.
Thats all i wish.
-Ushiromiya Hideyoshi
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Old 2009-03-28, 03:12   Link #828
alarmadadna hadi
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: With the runaways
Some final death throes here
Then what about this:
-Eva changed the location of the first twilight victims so that hir being alive is not discovered and so that not double checking the bodies can be used as an excuse for
her being alive. Battler believed Beatrice saved eva, and possibly the others, from death.


The accomplices are: Nanjo and Maria, Maria is considered an accomplice because she covers up on eva as Beatrice and took battlers photo, coz she is tricked to believe eva is carrying out beatrices will. Nanjo became an accomplice because of being threatened with his life.

And for the motives of the final murders:
-Genji was killed protecting kinzo from eva’s gunfire.
-Eva killed nanjo to get rid of the knowing accomplice.
-Rudolf was devastated by the turn of events and battlers death and kills himself as a fitting end for the siblings fight over money.

Or:
-Rudolf was who set battlers death like suicide so that the ugly siblings fight over money wouldn’t be reviled to the world

One more crazy theory to go, you refused to state in red that gohda noticed something heavy in rosas luggage, and I’m gonna jump on that:
-Rosa had ingots of gold with her and was afraid when Gohda held her lluggage he’d find out about them.
-So that when finding the 10 tons of gold she wouldn’t be forcefully denied heirship, she initiated the first twilight murders.
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Old 2009-03-30, 15:07   Link #829
Jan-Poo
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: forever lost inside a logic error
Hey Haruyan, what happened? I'm waiting to see the full solution of this mistery! ^^
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Old 2009-03-31, 08:28   Link #830
hodil
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Lol is it possible that Haruyan created a mystery she couldnt solve herself ? o0 maybe thats how Ryukishi does it.. create a mystery first... solution later... Lol!

*patiently awaits the truth that will turn us all into furniture*
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Old 2009-04-02, 00:35   Link #831
alarmadadna hadi
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: With the runaways
Quote:
*patiently awaits the truth that will turn us all into furniture*
Which reminds me, I'll be the doormat!
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Old 2009-04-03, 00:56   Link #832
hodil
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Join Date: Mar 2009
I'm content being Asmodeus ^^
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Old 2009-04-03, 06:16   Link #833
HigurashinoUmineko
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Join Date: Nov 2008
I call being Ronove!! (God I haven't done anything in this....I might as well be furniture XD)
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Old 2009-04-03, 11:01   Link #834
Kitsu
The unlucky one
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hiding
Tz,tz you two you think you would get such important roles, we are going to be the lowest furniture of all. A doormat is quite a good example.
Well I would like to be a bookshelf or something
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Old 2009-04-03, 19:37   Link #835
HigurashinoUmineko
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Good point.

Fine then I'll be a...carpet
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Old 2009-04-04, 02:42   Link #836
hodil
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meh we did solve some of the crimes lol.. asmodeus is fine.. or maybe the chessboard..
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Old 2009-04-05, 00:53   Link #837
HigurashinoUmineko
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Join Date: Nov 2008
I've gotten seriously bored so I made this in hopes that we'll find out the mystery: BTW: I may have gotten some of the Twilights wrong..

Spoiler for Umineko -FanFic Version Pics:
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Old 2009-04-06, 05:32   Link #838
hodil
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Join Date: Mar 2009
i'm writing a fanfic in the footsteps of Haruyan-san while she does up the anwser arc...

hmmm... might need some time ^^
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