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Old 2009-04-22, 13:57   Link #41
Xellos-_^
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Maybe Iva trap Croc once when he was younger
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Old 2009-04-22, 13:59   Link #42
Blackbeard D. Kuma
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But still, I guess I'm also wondering why he wouldn't just take the opportunity to do away with Ivankov in order to keep his secret safe? I mean, it's not like he can't find any other powerful (yet disposable) prisoners in levels 5 or 6 to help him bust out of prison now that he's partnered with Luffy. Maybe this shows how the okama king is more of a veteran than he is.....?
You make it sound like Crocodile would be able to pull this off easily, when that is not the case. Like kari-no-sugata mentioned, Luffy, Inazuma, and Jimbei are also there in case Crocodile tries anything funny. He's in no position to be backstabbing anybody right now, and quite frankly why should he? The more temporary allies he has on his side, the better his chances of success are for escaping Impel Down. Furthermore, Ivankov already acknowledged that they can't trust him, and so he is most definitely going to be on his guard should he attempt to betray/backstab them. Inankov knows Crocodile all too well. As for the other prisoners in levels 5 or 6, I don't think they would be of much help since Ivankov took out quite a few of them with his "Death Wink" alone in this chapter. That implies that a lot of them are complete jokes and cannon fodder. The only viable threats right now are Magellan, Shiryuu, and presumably the other level 6 prisoners whose names were mentioned.

Besides all of this, I am most interested in seeing Jimbei finally fight. Someone is going to get seriously beaten down by him.
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:10   Link #43
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Still, I wonder what Crocodile's weakness is. And aohige's translation is a bit strange, "holding weakness"? The only things that may cause obvious troubles for Crocodile are working for the revolutionaries, or doing something to Tenryuubito. Though based on Iva's words, it is likely that Crocodile changed a lot over the years. That means, we also need to learn more about his past. Hopefully it is something much deeper than a simple and quick sex change operation.
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:15   Link #44
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Somebody throw a punch already!
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:26   Link #45
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Oh, I concur. But I still believe that the secret may also have something to do with his old wounds, as well (I highly doubt that it's the whole "ZOMG CROCODILE'S A WOMAN" theory that seems to be gaining popularity ). If Ivankov's familiar with his secret, then Croc must have some connection to the revolutionaries.... maybe he made some shady "business" deals with them during his rookie days? Perhaps they promised to help him become the Pirate King, but betrayed him at the last minute? Perhaps that's why he's so mistrustful.....
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Still, I wonder what Crocodile's weakness is. And aohige's translation is a bit strange, "holding weakness"? The only things that may cause obvious troubles for Crocodile are working for the revolutionaries, or doing something to Tenryuubito. Though based on Iva's words, it is likely that Crocodile changed a lot over the years. That means, we also need to learn more about his past. Hopefully it is something much deeper than a simple and quick sex change operation.

Ok, ok, I get the point.... the third nipple then.........
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:32   Link #46
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Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma View Post
You make it sound like Crocodile would be able to pull this off easily, when that is not the case. Like kari-no-sugata mentioned, Luffy, Inazuma, and Jimbei are also there in case Crocodile tries anything funny. He's in no position to be backstabbing anybody right now, and quite frankly why should he? The more temporary allies he has on his side, the better his chances of success are for escaping Impel Down. Furthermore, Ivankov already acknowledged that they can't trust him, and so he is most definitely going to be on his guard should he attempt to betray/backstab them. Inankov knows Crocodile all too well. As for the other prisoners in levels 5 or 6, I don't think they would be of much help since Ivankov took out quite a few of them with his "Death Wink" alone in this chapter. That implies that a lot of them are complete jokes and cannon fodder. The only viable threats right now are Magellan, Shiryuu, and presumably the other level 6 prisoners whose names were mentioned.

Besides all of this, I am most interested in seeing Jimbei finally fight. Someone is going to get seriously beaten down by him.
Even if Ivankov is 'fresh' (i.e. not tired, not hungry, and battle ready), the fact that he was able to, seemingly, destroy so many Level 6 pirates so easily kind of make you wonder why Iva was placed in Level 5. Especially since he seems to have info on a great many different people within and without the prison. And that is not even getting into the fact that he was soemtype of Captain or General in Dragon's army...
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:37   Link #47
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Wooooooooh...!!
Luffy gaining more allies [predictable]...
Ace hasn't left the prison yet [predictable]...
Yet another set up/build up chapter ahead of us before golden week [predictable]..

ODA U R GENIUS!
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:47   Link #48
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Yet another set up/build up chapter ahead of us before golden week [predictable]..
Unless you wanted Luffy to encounter and then defeat Magellan or Shiryuu in one chapter, how could Oda have not set-up the chapter as a build-up chapter? I mean, unless the chapter was finishing a battle, it would always be build-up, no matter the arc, no matter the storyteller.
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:48   Link #49
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Even if Ivankov is 'fresh' (i.e. not tired, not hungry, and battle ready), the fact that he was able to, seemingly, destroy so many Level 6 pirates so easily kind of make you wonder why Iva was placed in Level 5. Especially since he seems to have info on a great many different people within and without the prison. And that is not even getting into the fact that he was soemtype of Captain or General in Dragon's army...
Very true. Ivankov's profile and occupation should suffice to deem him worthy of being imprisoned in level 6. The trend/pattern so far has been that the lower the floor, the more notorious, dangerous, and powerful the pirates that reside there are. Ivankov has seemingly broken this trend, being that he is only a level 5 prisoner that has effortlessly taken out no-name level 6 prisoners. That being said, there seems to be a little bit of an inconsistency here.
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Old 2009-04-22, 14:53   Link #50
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
Unless you wanted Luffy to encounter and then defeat Magellan or Shiryuu in one chapter, how could Oda have not set-up the chapter as a build-up chapter? I mean, unless the chapter was finishing a battle, it would always be build-up, no matter the arc, no matter the storyteller.
How about at least GETTING to Magellen or Shiryuu?
That would help......
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:01   Link #51
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Getting to them for what.

So that you can hear a single line out of their mouth: "How?" or "So, you've come!"...

How about giving Luffy the pirate king crown and finish the story already!
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:07   Link #52
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Getting to them for what.
To get Ace.....

Quote:
So that you can hear a single line out of their mouth: "How?" or "So, you've come!"...
No, so we can move the story...

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How about giving Luffy the pirate king crown and finish the story already!
He has to FIGHT for the crown, but that dream is on hold anyway.
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:07   Link #53
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Very true. Ivankov's profile and occupation should suffice to deem him worthy of being imprisoned in level 6. The trend/pattern so far has been that the lower the floor, the more notorious, dangerous, and powerful the pirates that reside there are. Ivankov has seemingly broken this trend, being that he is only a level 5 prisoner that has effortlessly taken out no-name level 6 prisoners. That being said, there seems to be a little bit of an inconsistency here.
As I am sure you remember, I was 'complaining' (some might say whinning ) about the fact that Luffy wasn't placed on Level 6, so, or course, when I see Ivankov's "might" I am just back to square one concerning just what Level 6 contains. Maybe Level 5 and 6 have prisoners of equal strength, but Level 6 has prisoners with a greater degree of information concerning the WG...but that still doesn't fit considering the info that Iva must have as a revolutionary. Urgh, this is annoying...

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How about at least GETTING to Magellen or Shiryuu?
That would help......
With or without Shiryuu, this chapter is still quite interesting, if for no other reason that some hints at Crocodile's past (him wanting to defeat Whitebeard = great) and the release of Jinbei and Crocodile (as well as their joining the party for the upcoming battles).

In other words, the constant build-up seems natural to me (the pacing from chapter to chapter is "realistic" imho), and not contrived, so even if somewhat predictable I an not been bored with the currently released info concerning the chapter.
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:11   Link #54
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It's been predicatable/dragging and this happens every arc though.^^^
Nothing happend that shouldn't surprise anyone besides Iva having some dirt on Croc.
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:20   Link #55
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To get Ace.....
No, so we can move the story...
He has to FIGHT for the crown, but that dream is on hold anyway.
I guess I missed the part of the spoiler that mentions Shiryuu was together with Ace, warming him up before the execution. Or, maybe not.

I thought the story was already moving. Considering the two that joined them at the end of this chapter. If this wasn't a movement from the last, then maybe it would be better to ask your sidekick (the one acting like the God) to hand you Oda, so that you can execute him for disobeying your tastes...

FIGHT? Who said he has to fight. Maybe, there is actually a one piece crown, that makes you the king when you wear it. Wouldn't that move the story fast enough for your tastes!
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:21   Link #56
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As I am sure you remember, I was 'complaining' (some might say whinning ) about the fact that Luffy wasn't placed on Level 6, so, or course, when I see Ivankov's "might" I am just back to square one concerning just what Level 6 contains. Maybe Level 5 and 6 have prisoners of equal strength, but Level 6 has prisoners with a greater degree of information concerning the WG...but that still doesn't fit considering the info that Iva must have as a revolutionary. Urgh, this is annoying...
You've never been a whiner at all, but have expressed your discontent or minor complaints with the story like everyone else. I share the same sentiments as you do on this matter. It doesn't really make much sense, and it can be considered a plot hole on Oda's part for the time being. Ivankov should be one of those "monsters" that the World Government wants erased from history, especially when considering his affiliation (Revolutionaries) as you pointed out.
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:23   Link #57
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Nothing happend that shouldn't surprise anyone besides Iva having some dirt on Croc.
It's not about surprising the audience, though. If that was the criteria that we based our criticism of all of the mangaka on, then they would fail far more than they could succeed.

That being said, while I wouldn't mind more info in the chapter(s), I do find the pace to be clear, concise, and relatively fast. This is, arguably, the fastest arc we have seen yet (consdiering that we have only been in Impel Down for 20 or so chapters, and we already know the Big Bad, the main objective, a means of completeing the objective, and a clock counting down to Ace's death).
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Old 2009-04-22, 15:26   Link #58
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I guess I missed the part of the spoiler that mentions Shiryuu was together with Ace, warming him up before the execution. Or, maybe not.I thought the story was already moving. Considering the two that joined them at the end of this chapter. FIGHT? Who said he has to fight. Maybe, there is actually a one piece crown, that makes you the king when you wear it. Wouldn't that move the story fast enough for your desires!
First of all its' Phenomenal...
And adding beaten villains and gaining more allies to your team ain't movement getting to where Ace's location is...

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It's not about surprising the audience, though. If that was the criteria that we based our criticism of all of the mangaka on, then they would fail far more than they could succeed.

That being said, while I wouldn't mind more info in the chapter(s), I do find the pace to be clear, concise, and relatively fast. This is, arguably, the fastest arc we have seen yet (consdiering that we have only been in Impel Down for 20 or so chapters, and we already know the Big Bad, the main objective, a means of completeing the objective, and a clock counting down to Ace's death).
The clock has been counting and done with chapterS ago....Sabondy arc had much better pacing.
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Old 2009-04-22, 16:06   Link #59
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Not that big of a shocker.
True. It's actually kind of predictable. I already envisioned it a long time ago. From the time the chapter came out with the front ministory saying that Croc was transferred to Impel Down, and that information coincided with the data that Ace was in Impel Down...it was pretty obvious that at least a temporary league of power would happen at some time.

In fact, it actually a bit too predictable for anyone to be too shocked.

But I DO so certainly LOVE IT!!!!
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Old 2009-04-22, 16:09   Link #60
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Phenomenal/Jinbei/Master Mold/whatever
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First of all its' Phenomenal...
Naw man, see what you don't get about Flip is that anyone who has a different opinion from him is a dupe. Those guys who disagree with him in the Naruto discussion thread? our dupes, Bleach Discussion thread? our dupes, hobo on the street corner....thats right you guessed it! our DUPES! in fact why am I saying "our" he thinks me and you are one in the same along with the rest of the masses who hold a different colored opinion from him.

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In other words, the constant build-up seems natural to me (the pacing from chapter to chapter is "realistic" imho), and not contrived, so even if somewhat predictable I an not been bored with the currently released info concerning the chapter.
It feels like this chapter could have came out last week or weeks before that if Oda cut out some nonsense, instead of Oda taking yet another break. Going off the spoiler, this chapter seems meh nothing great nothing Epic about it, I would have liked for Oda to have gotten the intros of Shiryuu, Katarina Devon, The Giant Battleship, San Juan Wolf & Basco Shot, the Drunk out of the way.
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