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Old 2009-05-09, 01:39   Link #81
Kid Ying
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Wow, i read my post and the end was really ambiguous, looks like she will never see Lelouch again, sorry. It's her father, sure.

And i'm strictly talking about the characters emotions, otherwise, it's a tough call between her death and the kiss, hehe. Including our feelings, the death gains a lot of emotional power.
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Old 2009-05-09, 01:53   Link #82
Nobodyman9
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Wow, i read my post and the end was really ambiguous, looks like she will never see Lelouch again, sorry. It's her father, sure.
Ha ha, it's all right

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And i'm strictly talking about the characters emotions, otherwise, it's a tough call between her death and the kiss, hehe. Including our feelings, the death gains a lot of emotional power.
Well yeah, if only considering Shirley emotions, sure, the kiss scene was probably sadder. Really though, I couldn't tell you how mortified I was when I found out that Shirley was gonna die. I first found out about it from the spoilers from this forum (boy, that was one crazy week) And then seeing it for real, it was like a dark void had formed in my chest. Hmm, that could be a topic for discussion, what was the saddest Shirley moment. Since that seems to be almost all we get from her ...........................oh, I made myself sad

P.S. I do try to take some solace in knowing that Shirley did die happy with the man she loved by her side.
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Old 2009-05-09, 11:35   Link #83
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Originally Posted by Nobodyman9 View Post
Really though, I couldn't tell you how mortified I was when I found out that Shirley was gonna die. I first found out about it from the spoilers from this forum (boy, that was one crazy week) And then seeing it for real, it was like a dark void had formed in my chest.
Actually, ironically enough, that was mostly the reason i joined the forum back then, to rave about the spoilers. They were out, since like epi 11 i believe. Strong rumors. Yep, Halcyon-sad-days on some level. //i should have stayed out of them, like i did for S1, but once you get your hand in the choco-butter, it is hard to get it out. 8D
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Old 2009-05-09, 12:08   Link #84
Cosmic Eagle
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Ah, good to know. Don't worry, I know how busy you are, and really I can't thank you enough for giving us such awesome comics I'll be patient.


Yep. I think she's a character who got one of, if not the, worst and most undeserved endings of any of the characters. Then again, I guess we don't know much about. Hmm, perhaps we should move on to a more pleasant topic, so...

Hmmmmmmmm............Dangit, we gotta keep this thread going people. We need a good topic. Something debatable that could spark some difference of opinion.

All right, I have an idea. What do you all think of the kiss at the end of Stage 12? Do you think that Shirley was just using Lelouch for emotional support and to steal a kiss from him, or do you think it was just a very difficult time for her and she just reached out to him because she didn't know what else to do? Well, I am looking through orange-tinted glasses, so I am more inclined to go with the latter.
The latter. Seriously. Her father whom she'd obviously been close to just died, buried under tons of mud and rock and she saw the corpse. Mudslide victims ain't pretty. You think she'd care about stealing a kiss from Lelouch?

Quote:
Well yeah, if only considering Shirley emotions, sure, the kiss scene was probably sadder. Really though, I couldn't tell you how mortified I was when I found out that Shirley was gonna die. I first found out about it from the spoilers from this forum (boy, that was one crazy week) And then seeing it for real, it was like a dark void had formed in my chest. Hmm, that could be a topic for discussion, what was the saddest Shirley moment. Since that seems to be almost all we get from her ...........................oh, I made myself sad

P.S. I do try to take some solace in knowing that Shirley did die happy with the man she loved by her side.
Well at least it steeled you for what was to come. I found out about it on Wikipedia......Sad right?
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Old 2009-05-09, 23:53   Link #85
germanturkey
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i am so happy this thread was made. she was by far the one i shipped for, and it made me so sad that she was killed off like that. her death scene was absolutely beautiful, as was her mind fuck scene in season 1. both were so well done and emotionally powerful.

as for her character, she was one of the only characters that got real closure in this series. she died happily knowing the person she loved knew her feelings and she believe that since they had overcome so many obstacles in their relationship, that they would eventually meet again in the next life. thinking back on the series, she was the only one who would fit in a relationship with Lelouch. everyone else had ulterior motives or issues..
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Old 2009-05-10, 00:10   Link #86
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thinking back on the series, she was the only one who would fit in a relationship with Lelouch. everyone else had ulterior motives or issues..
I ask you, how is this a bad thing? Is it wrong to expect something, particularly in their situations? Furthermore, what does that have to do with the love they felt for him?
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Old 2009-05-10, 00:17   Link #87
germanturkey
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there's nothing wrong with the other girls going for him, but she's the only one who could have developed a normal relationship with him, since she was the only "normal" one. she obviously had her flaws, but they were quite typical in comparison to the other girls.
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Old 2009-05-10, 00:20   Link #88
morbosfist
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there's nothing wrong with the other girls going for him, but she's the only one who could have developed a normal relationship with him, since she was the only "normal" one. she obviously had her flaws, but they were quite typical in comparison to the other girls.
Lelouch himself isn't normal, so how would a "normal" (this is a seriously misused description) girl like Shirley have developed a normal relationship with a person as abnormal as Lelouch? I don't mind the relationship itself, but the rationale you give is just confusing.
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Old 2009-05-10, 00:29   Link #89
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Lelouch wasn't normal, but Shirley was the only thing tying him down to any semblance of normalcy, which Lelouch wanted.
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Old 2009-05-10, 02:05   Link #90
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Lelouch wasn't normal, but Shirley was the only thing tying him down to any semblance of normalcy, which Lelouch wanted.
You could argue the same for Kallen, who he wanted to go back to Ashford with him, or Nunnally, his sister. Shirley isn't the only thing tying him back to a normal life.
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Old 2009-05-10, 04:21   Link #91
Rising Dragon
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Originally Posted by morbosfist View Post
You could argue the same for Kallen, who he wanted to go back to Ashford with him, or Nunnally, his sister. Shirley isn't the only thing tying him back to a normal life.
Though really, neither Kallen nor Nunnally could be considered "normal" in the sense Shirley is. Shirley is your average seventeen-year-old middle-class high school girl, who lives an average, everyday life like most people her age.

Kallen is your not-so-average seventeen-year-old high-class school girl who is also a guerrilla-warfare-waging terrorist, trapped in a double life that is slowly affecting her own lifestyle. Not normal.

Nunnally is the blind, crippled young lady who is also exiled royalty who, along with Lelouch, is in danger of possible assassination should her true identity at being the heir to the Britannian throne come to light. Not normal.

While I admit that Kallen and Nunnally can represent Lelouch's desire for normalcy, they're not the ideal representation for it because they are as far from normal as you can get without being a space-faring alien or an interdimensional demonic creature or a pizza-craving immortal witch. Shirley, on the other hand, represents it perfectly. A little too perfectly, really, as this is why she became such a tragic character in the first place.
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Old 2009-05-10, 11:05   Link #92
Levy
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Good analysys Rising, I agree...

in other words: c'mon, morbos, Kallen can be important for Lelouch even if she's not the typicall normal girl of seventeen, to each his character, to each his role... XD
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Old 2009-05-10, 12:40   Link #93
ginran
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Lelouch wasn't normal, but Shirley was the only thing tying him down to any semblance of normalcy, which Lelouch wanted.
This and what Rising said, I agree. I always thought Shirley was the closest to normal(as far as Lelouch's LIs), and I always thought it was a good thing for Lelouch. The only thing abnormal(in a completely good way) was the way she loved Lelouch, falling for him no matter how many times her memory was erased or altered.

Also, I agree with you too Levy, on their roles. Shirley was the most normal, and my favorite LI for Lelouch, but that doesnt mean Nunally and Kallen werent important. They each had their own respective roles.
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Old 2009-05-10, 12:41   Link #94
morbosfist
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Originally Posted by Rising Dragon View Post
Though really, neither Kallen nor Nunnally could be considered "normal" in the sense Shirley is. Shirley is your average seventeen-year-old middle-class high school girl, who lives an average, everyday life like most people her age.

Kallen is your not-so-average seventeen-year-old high-class school girl who is also a guerrilla-warfare-waging terrorist, trapped in a double life that is slowly affecting her own lifestyle. Not normal.

Nunnally is the blind, crippled young lady who is also exiled royalty who, along with Lelouch, is in danger of possible assassination should her true identity at being the heir to the Britannian throne come to light. Not normal.

While I admit that Kallen and Nunnally can represent Lelouch's desire for normalcy, they're not the ideal representation for it because they are as far from normal as you can get without being a space-faring alien or an interdimensional demonic creature or a pizza-craving immortal witch. Shirley, on the other hand, represents it perfectly. A little too perfectly, really, as this is why she became such a tragic character in the first place.
This I do agree with. It's a nice way to spell it out.
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Old 2009-05-10, 12:57   Link #95
ginran
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Also, this is old news, but I dont think I'll ever be able to watch the World End OP without being bothered by the fact that they completely left Shirley and Euphie out. The last OP for the series and they didnt put them in there? Practically every other character was in it too. I always think that everytime I watch the part where the characters all "fly" forward, it'll be different and they'll show up... but then again, if it were up to me, I'd try to fit all the characters(minor and major) in and the OP would be longer than the episode...XD

But seriously, why would they do that? Sorry if its a weird question, and its late to ask, but I'm just wondering. XD
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Old 2009-05-10, 14:03   Link #96
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The answer is the most sad and obvious, I guess, but be happy with the fact that Shirley got a single - and really nice - portrait in the ending.
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Old 2009-05-10, 14:11   Link #97
Kid Ying
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Also, this is old news, but I dont think I'll ever be able to watch the World End OP without being bothered by the fact that they completely left Shirley and Euphie out. The last OP for the series and they didnt put them in there? Practically every other character was in it too. I always think that everytime I watch the part where the characters all "fly" forward, it'll be different and they'll show up... but then again, if it were up to me, I'd try to fit all the characters(minor and major) in and the OP would be longer than the episode...XD

But seriously, why would they do that? Sorry if its a weird question, and its late to ask, but I'm just wondering. XD
Well, it's not like Euphie got a cameo in the previous opening either. I really like her, but since she didn't appeared at all in R2, i think it's natural, hehe.
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Old 2009-05-10, 21:16   Link #98
Nobodyman9
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Actually, ironically enough, that was mostly the reason i joined the forum back then, to rave about the spoilers. They were out, since like epi 11 i believe. Strong rumors. Yep, Halcyon-sad-days on some level. //i should have stayed out of them, like i did for S1, but once you get your hand in the choco-butter, it is hard to get it out. 8D
Wow, quite the coincidence indeed. I checked and I actually joined the forum 8 days after you did. Weird huh? I guess we're not so different you and I

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The answer is the most sad and obvious, I guess, but be happy with the fact that Shirley got a single - and really nice - portrait in the ending.
That reminds me of this story I heard about how they were originally planning to put that Shirley portrait in the third ending, but they thought it would give away the fact that she was going to die. And while I can see where they're coming from, what with the angelic image and all, well...doesn't pretty much everyone else have angel or demon wings in those pics? Just because someone has white angel wings doesn't mean they're going to die. Beautiful picture all the same.

@RD: Excellent analysis. Bonus points for you.
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Old 2009-05-10, 22:57   Link #99
azul120
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I think the angel/demon wings in the first R2 ED represented law vs. chaos.

Seeing Euphie as an angel resting on Cornelia's lap in that ending made me a little sad, as it reminded me of her demise.

Oddly enough, Shirley's angel picture in the following ending didn't make me as sad, because she looked so full of life there.
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Old 2009-05-10, 23:17   Link #100
Nobodyman9
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I think the angel/demon wings in the first R2 ED represented law vs. chaos.
I think that's a very fair assumption. Of course now I'm trying to remember which had white wings (law) and which had black wings (chaos). I know Lelouch was frequently featured with black wings, naturally.

Quote:
Seeing Euphie as an angel resting on Cornelia's lap in that ending made me a little sad, as it reminded me of her demise.
Seconded.

Quote:
Oddly enough, Shirley's angel picture in the following ending didn't make me as sad, because she looked so full of life there.
Also seconded.

Anyway, I'd just like to say good job everybody on reaching our first 100 posts, and hopefully we can keep this thread going for a lot longer.
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