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View Poll Results: Eden of the East - Episode 6 Rating
Perfect 10 11 16.42%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 16 23.88%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 14 20.90%
7 out of 10 : Good 13 19.40%
6 out of 10 : Average 6 8.96%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 4.48%
4 out of 10 : Poor 2 2.99%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 1.49%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 1.49%
Voters: 67. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-05-16, 18:58   Link #61
Starry Dust
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Holy cow.
I have to thank some people for explaining the NEET thing in this episode because I kept on scratching my head thinking Hirasawa was crazy acting proud of being a "go-getter NEET?" when I thought it was a bad thing to be in the first place ( considering what Ohsugi said in episode 5 )

Anywayz, another informative episode. It wasn't weak...it just wasn't as captivating as the other episodes. I don't expect every episode to be perfect though ^^
But if Eden is all about recycling stuff and putting so-called NEET activities/people into good use, why did Ohsugi join in the first place? From out of the whole group, he seems to be the only one who has that brain-washed mind of being the typical business man in a suit working day-in and day-out becoming one with society. Did he like missed the memo on what Eden was about I can understand Saki because she just doesn't want to be a burden to Ryousuke and her sister anymore and such but him? (....maybe he joined only for Saki heh )

And I'm starting to think the term "Johnny" is more as an inside joke among the creators or show. I know it's used as another word for penis but it's been used so vaguely now lol. I can't help but chuckle every time I hear it.
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Old 2009-05-16, 19:17   Link #62
BetoJR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingKnight View Post
basically, there are a lot of words that were directly copied from English and then given an entirely different meaning.
That's just it. Some of the people "disputing" the usage of the word do so because they are not aware of this "entirely different meaning" such a word might have, when in use - in whatever context - by japanese people. So, your stance does come out a bit rude, if I may say so.

Nevertheless, what's so different? Does it not mean a person who is Not in Education, Employment or Training, there? Because I was under the impression it did - and there's no age limit there, either, as you can clearly read.
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Old 2009-05-16, 20:09   Link #63
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Quite frank, I was TOTALLY lost in this episode. Subs weren't nearly enough to understand what was going on... you'd have to be extremely familiar with Japanese culture and their terminology to understand what the heck they were talking about.


In any case, this episode did bring one good thing for me... SHIPPING! Micchon and Hirasawa just tripped the ol' osana-najimi radar, and you can bet that I'd be finishing this show if only to see what happens to the two. It also doesn't help that Micchon and Hirasawa reminds me of a certain 'winning' couple in Honey and Clover... XD
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Old 2009-05-16, 20:16   Link #64
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Its.. all.. coming together! Meeting Saki was not a coincidence at all. Oh man.. Akira is one smart guy. Reminds me of Lelouch and his good planning.
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Old 2009-05-16, 20:48   Link #65
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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
Quite frank, I was TOTALLY lost in this episode. Subs weren't nearly enough to understand what was going on... you'd have to be extremely familiar with Japanese culture and their terminology to understand what the heck they were talking about.


In any case, this episode did bring one good thing for me... SHIPPING! Micchon and Hirasawa just tripped the ol' osana-najimi radar, and you can bet that I'd be finishing this show if only to see what happens to the two. It also doesn't help that Micchon and Hirasawa reminds me of a certain 'winning' couple in Honey and Clover... XD
Uh, exactly what sub are you using? You do know that Micchon and Hirasawa are cousins right?
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Old 2009-05-16, 21:39   Link #66
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Quote:
That's just it. Some of the people "disputing" the usage of the word do so because they are not aware of this "entirely different meaning" such a word might have, when in use - in whatever context - by japanese people. So, your stance does come out a bit rude, if I may say so.
Well, sorry for that, it really wasn't my intention to offend anyone. But it's true--assuming that a completely different culture works the same way as yours is kinda silly (*). Pretending to understand anime without trying to understand the Japanese society is even more silly.

(*): I was actually more concerned about people implying that the anime was using a definition that is different from real life. Which is completely pointless, since if it would have been that way they wouldn't have used the word at all, and would have invented a term themselves.

Quote:
Nevertheless, what's so different? Does it not mean a person who is Not in Education, Employment or Training, there? Because I was under the impression it did - and there's no age limit there, either, as you can clearly read.
The term was born in the UK specifically to address people between 16 and 18. Calling it People Between 16 And 18 Not in Education, Employment or Training wouldn't have caught on
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Old 2009-05-16, 22:20   Link #67
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Thumbs up Higashi no Eden Episode 6 resume and theories.

I have finally decided to use some of my studies to make all understand theories about this series. There seems to be multiple theories lurking that some people might not understand because of religious/political/cultural/social studies that my family is well known for but not recognized at all. This being said the episode gives us more people into introductions and more background info into Japanese society but unless you know fact/fiction differences you might not understand. SO HERE I GO!

The episode starts with the worse fears though ever: Ohsugi is captured by Kuroha (STUPID BITCH! I hate her really!) Kuroha says to Ohsugi that meeting her was his worst mistake and that is because I have finally understood that Kuroha is one of those girls which despise men as well as had bad experience with them, well of course since she has a attitude of a bitch guys like me only think of having sex with her and then because of her behavior not deal with her anymore. So wow to show us all how this is, well her cutting the cigar like a penis is WTF? Partially it is to show that men in Japan might be too horny and it is not far off when you think of the mass media of porn exposure despite censoring. Ohsugi was indeed horny and tired of 4 years of being a virgin (too bad because I have been a virgin of 29 years and have no problems with it at all. Am I horny, perhaps but I found techniques to help me with that and NO IT IS NOT MASTURBATION!). So in the end Ohsugi got lucky because Kuroha got a phone call that seemed urgent regarding her company position (I also think her attitude is bad for the company if one considers her hate of men.).

We are then taken to Saki and Akira dropping her off at some friend's place. That friend is no one other than Mikuru (Yup same as the one from the anime Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya anime.) who is a student of science/engineering expert at making computer programs. Saki then phones home saying to her sister that she cannot face Ryosuke due to her failure of not getting a job. Her sister says that he does not mind but Saki has a secret crush on him so due to her timid nature she decided not come home and instead stay at Mikuru's place asking her for a clothes change (Saki is way hot IN HER JOGGING SET FROM MIKURU!).

We then go to the club of the school where Saki studies literature. We are then introduced to Hirasawa Kazuomi which is the club president and the club itself being called EDEN! Which leads to the connection of the anime title. It is also told that EDEN seems to be some kind of business but not what kind exactly. Hirasawa Kazuomi is concerned over Saki and her dealing with Akira as well how all of this turned out such as Akira being naked with .44 magnum pistol. There is the mention that Ohsugi is a virgin of 4 years and is having the horny period (Johny does mean indeed PENIS!). We are also revealed that Hirasawa Kazuomi admits starting to being a NEET (person who is withdrawn from society with no education nor job). Also that Saki covers Hirasawa Kazuomi problems in leadership. We are then suddenly shown Haruo getting out of a cup board desk (I LOL SO HARD AT THAT! Man it was funny. Shows that Haruo is another NEET also.). He tell them that Akira has a huge fortune due to him owning a shopping Mall and that he is not such a bad guy because he loves dogs. Hirasawa Kazuomi gets pissed at that so Haruo hides again.

We then told that the team will go investigate Akira and his shopping Mall with precautions because Hirasawa Kazuomi is of a paranoid (psychological problems arise when you isolate yourself and unless one has religion like me one FAILS AND CAN SUICIDE HIMSELF! This is serious people! I have degrees in psychology.). So Haruo tells to Hirasawa Kazuomi what happened to Ohsugi and that he got drunk because he say Saki getting in with Akira on his motorcycle despite him being able to get a job on his first try. Hirasawa Kazuomi tell Haruo to find him and bring to the club since he is useful.

We are then shown Akira trying to get away from the place he is stuck at and this where I PUT MY NOSE INTO! (What I mean by this is that Ohsugi IS STUPID! If he wanted he could have put his chained hands through a loop over his feet and I am pretty sure he is fit in gym matters. If he did that he could have had taken off the mask and use his cell phone better. He could have also waited for her Kuroha to come back and knock her out with objects lying around. HE IS STUPID AND PATHETIC for a human.). Ohsugi has a apple being knocked off the table and this is reference to the Bible and the garden of Eden as in the forbidden fruit. Ohsugi then tried to take pictures of the place and ask for help, however none comes because the police do not care of Kuroha is using Juiz so block him from calling help. Ohsugi does send the pics on the internet on forum boards.

So the gang goes to Akira's place to investigate and arrive. ( LOL @ Hirasawa Kazuomi using the classical binoculars to spy on the shopping mall's entrance to see if all is ok! Man he is paranoid after all.). Everyone gets in and are mesmerized by the whole thing being huge. Onee is completely entranced by the clothing part while Mikuru is impressed with cell phone/computer store. Saki remarks that Akira is back because of his motorcycle. Hirasawa Kazuomi goes to the VIP room and is suggested by Onee to introduce everyone because he is their representative. So he goes there but is surprised that Akira has camera system and has possibly observed them ( again this Hirasawa Kazuomi's paranoia getting the better of him due to his NEET aspect.). THE BEST IS that there is a sudden Christmas like music that starts playing that is present in many shopping malls (For some reason I LOL SO MUCH at Hirasawa Kazuomi getting all paranoid around there and the music did make LOL also.).

Akira suddenly appears riding some sort of of teddy bear (I LOL so much at too! HAHAHAHAHAHAH! That was way to funny!). Akira then does this switch thing that pops celebration snow like paper pieces going down on all as a welcome thing. Onee finds the dog Mameshiba cute. Everyone sits around and this where the serious things start being talked about. The first is the deed verification that the shopping mall belongs to Akira indeed since Hirasawa Kazuomi does not trust him at all. The other is the image search program that Mikuru created with her knowledge in science/engineering since she is doing studies in that field. Akira says it is useful and Hirasawa Kazuomi explains anyone can use as long as the cell phone is registered on the site where the program is.(Personally I WANT THAT! In fact I want the exact same phone of NOBLESS OBLIGE!)

Akira says to Mikuru that she cute and her blushing shows that she has a timid personality like Saki. Having Akira using the program we learn that Mikuru's full name is KUZUHARA MIKURU and what her studies are as well as that she is doing a Major. We also learn that Saki's studies are a Major in LITERATURE as well the University being Aiji and that she is a poster girl at the Sangetsu's bread store. We learn then that Hirasawa Kazuomi is born in Showa 64 year and that his specialty is ECONOMICS. We also learn that Akira wants to make a paradise for NEETS because he is sick of people being rude to job applicants and doing things like dumping beef bowls on them because they get rejected.

We are then going back to Kuroha and that she driving a white Porsche (slutty girl is rich and fancy.....my, my such arrogance she has!). We are then told that she asks Juiz to have a secretary that can speak Cantonese/French apart from Japanese to assist in some affair of the company that we are not revealed. We are then further explained that EDEN is under investigation from other students because a girl dropped out of it and that EDEN was at first a recycling company. Furthermore EDEN is a success because of some rewrite value of images due to Saki but as to what that is......it is not explained nor what that value is just that students started to subscribe into EDEN and is made somehow into a matchmaking tool.

Hirasawa Kazuomi then says to all that they leaving and Onee asks if Hirasawa Kazuomi did come to terms with Akira. Hirasawa Kazuomi then tells Onee that he does not want to use those who have nothing to do with NEETS and that EDEN OF THE EAST IS A NEET PARADISE! (Wow talk about a shock and sudden revealing so this is now about something to save JAPAN FROM NEETS? WTF.). So Akira reveals that he wants EDEN to help him fulfill his Nobless Oblige and his fundings are as a thank you as well he is having complex problems due to his memory lost. Saki also confirms her wishes to help EDEN prospect. We are then shown that Saki thanks Akira and that she wants to know why he asked her to come to her place but Akira changes the subject by showing so cute clothing that would suit her since she looked as if she was getting timid.

We are the shown Hirasawa Kazuomi/Onee/Saki sitting and eating while Akira prepares some fireworks with Mikuru. Mikuru says she is not so good with fireworks but Akira guides her well. Then Akira lights the fireworks and the result is a smile with cat ears. We are also told that Akira thinks that Mikuru is timid, which is true since I confirmed it also.

The end of this episode leaves a SHOCKER! :yabai: Kuroha might be the Miss Penis taker, which means she cuts off penises and could be responsible for doing that to over 20 000 NEETS assuming all of them are males. This leaves the controversy of Japan's NEETS being perverts that do nothing but MASTURBATE and feed off medias such as this very anime as well as computers in terms of porn (this is indeed a scary though and a TRUTH of how things are indeed. I can confirm this anytime with logic and common sense. The problem is HOW TO CHANGE THEM? Akira tried it already but Kuroha sees as nothing can be done so we kill them by humiliating and then cutting off their genitals. What a bitch! Girls are so selfish after all for some that have money with power.). So in the end Ohsugi needs to be saved somehow and Akira should do so with Juiz's power.(SEND THE SWAT TEAM! SEND THE SPECIAL OPS!).

So it starts with Kuroha. While she is hot, she is nothing more than a girl to have sex with unless her personality gets better.


Poor Ohsugi to be caught like that.


Basically think of the cigar as your penis. O_O NOOOOOOOOOOOO!


Nice scene of Saki and Akira.


I can never get enough of Saki and am in :lovelove::lovelove:
Spoiler:
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Old 2009-05-17, 00:36   Link #68
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I like how you completely ignored the older lady. Was her name ever given? She's listed as "Onee" on the site.
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Old 2009-05-17, 01:34   Link #69
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Wandererknight I perfectly agree when you say that often a foreign word is used in a completely different way than what was supposed to be the original.

However you do realize that the definition of NEET (in japan) you provided differs from what is explained in the very wiki page you posted?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEET

expecially the part that says: "NEET is distinct from freeter"

It is also in direct contrast with the stereotyped image of NEET. I can understand how a group of persons that don't work at all is seen as a social problem, but how can a freeter be a social problem? It can be seen as something odd, but certainly not as a parasite.

There is also the implicit definition expressed by Sato on Welcome to NHK: "As long as you are engaged in some kind of activity you are not a NEET".


This lead me to believe that there is a lot of confusion about this term in Japan, and so the definition might vary depending on the source or the point of view.
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Old 2009-05-17, 02:36   Link #70
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This entire discussion on the terms and definition of NEET is EXACTLY what I think this episode was trying to talk to us about: that definitions, words and especially people, change. That the term NEET itself changes depending on the society, and the terms and conditions that get one labelled as such alters along with it. Further more, it seems a rallying call to the necessity of not wholly labelling people not considered "positive" in the eyes of society under such derogatory terms of which they are unable to get out of. Thumping people down in their NEETness and constantly reminding them of what society calls them further imprisons them in their own socio-economic isolation. These are exactly the people with so much potential if only society would give them a chance.

Furthermore, the definitions and meanings of words themselves change. Words are not a fact of themselves; meanings of words exist as a comparison to other words in order to form a meaning in opposition of sorts to a different one. Jacques Derrida said it best in Differance: that it is precisely the difference in words that gives words their meaning. As such, the meaning of words are dependent on the interplay between them. When these relationships and definitions change, so does meaning.

In the context of the show, as the characters battle and contest the meaning and the values attributed to the term NEET, so does the essential meaning of the word (or more correctly acronym).
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Old 2009-05-17, 02:39   Link #71
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Freeters are people who cycle through low-income jobs while still supported by their family. There's really no significant differences from the standpoint of how Japanese people might see them. If you don't do it the right way, it's just wrong (figuratively speaking, I don't really believe it's right or wrong. I do believe sucking up to your parents when you're 30 is kinda idiotic, though).

Quote:
It is also in direct contrast with the stereotyped image of NEET.
As I said above, it's not about whether you work or not--it's about working the way you are expected to. Social expectations are very particular in Japan.

To conclude, they're essentially the same thing, at least when it comes to what this series wants to put across.

Quote:
There is also the implicit definition expressed by Sato on Welcome to NHK: "As long as you are engaged in some kind of activity you are not a NEET".
I'm fairly sure that show dealt with hikikomori-ism, which is a very well defined term that actually implies total isolation from the outside world. It is a very similar phenomenon, or at least a subset of the same phenomenon. I really don't know whether that quote said NEET or hikikomori, but I remember the latter being much more prevalent overall (I don't think I heard the word NEET in that show, but whatever).
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Old 2009-05-17, 02:42   Link #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kari-no-sugata View Post
To follow-up on what WanderingKnight said above, here NEET is being used pretty much to refer to a class of people (a social/economic group) rather than just a noun. In general it is a derogatory word, though the "Eden of the East" group take a certain amount of pride in it. They're not terribly enthused about becoming an ordinary white-collar worker - looking at all the eps so far, it feels like collage/university graduates are being taken for granted, taken advantage of or basically being looked down upon.

A start-up enterprise is a very interesting way to use money. Potentially, it could make Akira (and the rest) truly rich (without the phone), for example. I wonder just how far this will be developed in the story? Unfortunately, we're progressing just one day at a time in this series, so they might not even get started - unless they do a time-skip I'm not quite sure how this imagine recognition software could start to have an impact at a national level in just a few days. But, you never know, considering what Juiz is capable of.
For people who aren't in the working world yet, it's no secret really that working for other people kinda stinks, especially if you don't really enjoy it. That's why I'm all for Hirasawa and company working to get an interesting and useful app to market and I just wish there were more episodes devoted to getting a startup off its feet because nothing beats doing what you love and making money off of it.
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Old 2009-05-17, 03:25   Link #73
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Originally Posted by izmosmolnar View Post
Yeah but how are they going to find him? Just because we know he is really the missing Oosugi, we still cannot pinpoint his location to save him. The background of a random room is still not sufficient enough to estimate his whereabouts.
I mean, he -is- part of a club whose great accomplishment is a piece of software that can look at his cell phone pictures and point out the name of every building, street, and bridge in those that pointed out the window---and the brands of clothing and furniture on the inside.
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Old 2009-05-17, 03:31   Link #74
izmosmolnar
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Good point!
Well, it might be possible that's what his plan was, although we have no proof whether the program works with static pictures too.
It must be indeed awesome and revolutionary piece of software, if it could figure out the address, solely analyzing a few pictures of an apple and a room (no irony intended).
Still, IMHO there are better, more efficient (and quicker) options he could have done in the situation. In the first place, there are absolutely no guarantees at all, they are going to stumble upon his image.

edit: Slayer could you by any chance use thumbnails proszę? :/ It's killing my bandwidth.

Last edited by izmosmolnar; 2009-05-17 at 05:32. Reason: typo
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Old 2009-05-17, 03:40   Link #75
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For people who aren't in the working world yet, it's no secret really that working for other people kinda stinks, especially if you don't really enjoy it. That's why I'm all for Hirasawa and company working to get an interesting and useful app to market and I just wish there were more episodes devoted to getting a startup off its feet because nothing beats doing what you love and making money off of it.
Apparently, the Japanese conception of "normal" working life is pretty brutal by Western standards. Someone posted a nicely topical comment on Slashdot about this exact subject.
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Old 2009-05-17, 05:08   Link #76
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Yeah. Massive lols when people in this thread are recalling that "go-getter-NEET" thing. That is just ironic, hypocritical and nonsensical all at once.

I can sort of understand the 'non traditiona' and 'Freeter' thing too, but the way this show treats NEETs like social degenerates and outcasts, it doesn't seem to jive with the kind of NEET that was verbally described. It's like they're tossing that word around like it means little to nothing. Oh well. This show name-dropping a bunch of things for no good reason was another nonsensical choice anyway.
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Old 2009-05-17, 05:09   Link #77
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Originally Posted by izmosmolnar View Post
On a different, more happier note: Am I the only one a bit surprised, Saki and Akira didn't shared a goodbye-kiss at the beginning? Or is that not popular in Japan?
I'm not at all surprised by that, it kinda confirmed to me that that kiss was more for comfort than a declaration of love (not saying there's no love there, mind. Just that it wasn't really to context here).

What did surprise me was her behaviour later on in the ep. The whole "I wasn't sure if I could really believe everything Takizawa said then, but it does seem scary. So let's all go together." line followed by waiting in the car while her friends went to scoop out the place seemed kinda odd to me. Of course everyone would be suspicious of Akira, that's not the issue. The thing is that you'd think Saki's would be past that by now, considering how much time she's spent with him, including being at that very mall before.

And this is not meant at you izmosmolnar, but more in general: a circumcision does not mean getting your Johnny cut off
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Old 2009-05-17, 05:34   Link #78
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Originally Posted by BetoJR View Post
The british have been using it - and other parts of the world, too - for the better part of the last 50 years or so.
Just to make a point, I've never heard it being used here in England before, and I'm pretty sure it isn't used in America. Although, I was coined in Britain, I would class is as a Japanese term.
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Old 2009-05-17, 06:52   Link #79
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^

I'm positive it's an American thing. The entire phrase of 'cutting off a Johnny' is not a real phrase though. Just the Johnny wording. But like I said, the anime writers just don't give a crap about how they namedrop a ton of things. I doubt they really care about how exactly they are supposed to be used, much less the origins.
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Old 2009-05-17, 07:21   Link #80
izmosmolnar
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I remember reading the word NEET once in an English newspaper once, but the acronym was detailed there, since probably most people don't even know it's meaning. I never heard it openly either though.
@Field of Lillies. Yeah, actually now that you mention it, it's not that odd if I consider it as a comfort. Fair enough.
@Ihadurca: Her name is O-nee (おネエ) only. Probably it's not her real name, but we don't know about her real name for now.
Spoiler for the translation taken from Kaoru Chujo's blog, and it's translated from the official website:


By the way is it possible to read what's written above the image with the apple? (maybe with the HD version or something, I'm quite curious what's that message is about).
Spoiler for image for reference:

Last edited by izmosmolnar; 2009-05-17 at 10:20.
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