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View Poll Results: Eden of the East - Episode 7 Rating
Perfect 10 32 39.02%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 25 30.49%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 12 14.63%
7 out of 10 : Good 9 10.98%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 2.44%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 2.44%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-05-24, 03:13   Link #101
Guardian Enzo
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In an era of unambitious formula series, I have to admire this one for being something else altogether. But I'm beginning to feel a bit insulted by the almost smarmy quality to the humor and the general self-indulgence of the writing - there's a lot of creative masturbation going on here. Too many cool Deux ex machina appearing from nowhere. Too much intentional obfuscation that doesn't feel as if it's playing fair with the audience. Considering the pedigree of the people involved, I'm hoping for better things from the final four eps.
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Old 2009-05-24, 03:32   Link #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jp_zer0 View Post
When walking around with a bodybag is sure to attract unwanted attention, seek alternatives.
While using telekinesis, growing wings and flying out of a smashed window of a skyscraper carrying a serial rapist is discrete?
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Old 2009-05-24, 03:32   Link #103
golthin
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Originally Posted by Sackett View Post
How does that work though?

If #9 bought it, then doesn't #11 have to pay the money to #9??

Or did #11 pay to have the deed rerouted to her- which would then legally entitle #9 to a refund??

Using illegal means to get the building wouldn't wash either- as you would have to pay a lot more.
you own it but you don't. Like akira could buy it, so could diana. you don't get your money refunded and you can't sell the hotel and make money. A hotel for 1.6 billion yen is TOO cheap(16 millions dollars. also, Akira and diana both kind of got screwed because of Saki, they use a lot of cash.
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Old 2009-05-24, 03:45   Link #104
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to spend that much "money" to thing that he does need, is xxxx
if I were him, I just use some sort special force to seizure the hotel.less money more effective

the only real reason for him to use that much money is none
.....only to make the plot get interesting later on.
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Old 2009-05-24, 03:53   Link #105
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So who did Diana paid the money for, if Akira didn't get a "refund" in the end?
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Old 2009-05-24, 05:17   Link #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
In an era of unambitious formula series, I have to admire this one for being something else altogether. But I'm beginning to feel a bit insulted by the almost smarmy quality to the humor and the general self-indulgence of the writing - there's a lot of creative masturbation going on here. Too many cool Deux ex machina appearing from nowhere. Too much intentional obfuscation that doesn't feel as if it's playing fair with the audience. Considering the pedigree of the people involved, I'm hoping for better things from the final four eps.
Yeah, maybe. The script probably isn't quite as good as I originally thought (or hoped for), but the story is still really absorbing and interesting, and they're continuing to make good use of a rather unique set-up.
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Old 2009-05-24, 08:18   Link #107
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Why can I just see that Saki will become the annoying little brat who knows nothing but still sticks her foot in it anyway, type character? Gosh I hate those types >.>
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Old 2009-05-24, 08:53   Link #108
Kaoru Chujo
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When we start with a naked man and a gun in front of the White House, that should be a clue to look for style and not take everything perfectly literally as normal reality. This is fantasy. And a very absorbing fantasy at that. Wings. Dramatic exits. Bring them on.

However, I guess I do agree with Guardian Enzo that there is a lot of creative self-indulgence here. Kamiyama's having fun and we're having fun, though, so it's okay by me. I'm pretty close to Sorrow-K's feeling that it isn't quite as good as I thought, but I'm still enjoying it a lot. And the story is continuing to evolve.

A post on 2channel said that $16 million was too little for an exclusive hotel in Roppongi, too. But it's still a lot of money, and could buy a hotel in many places. I'm no expert in hotel prices, but this page says that the average cost per room of building an upscale hotel in the US would be about $200,000, so $16 million would build an 85-room hotel (2001 figures).

I myself wondered how Diana could buy the hotel back from Akira without him having to officially agree. Not sure about that. But buying the hotel was actually a good way of solving the problem. He paid what it was worth, so he can always get the money back. And sending in a strike force would be illegal and would cause all sorts of complications. Just as Diana leaving the building with a guy under her arm would.

I am so struck here, as in the discussion of the Suzuka anime, at how guys seem to blame the girl for everything. How is it Saki's fault that Akira and Diana spend their money? Because she didn't show up for one meal? Because she never told her osananajimi Oosugi to go to heck? Come on. She's not the one who is so blind to reality as to think he still has a chance with Saki, and who instead of canceling the meal invites an underclassman and proceeds to get dead drunk. Saki hasn't caused trouble at all. She is the one who gave the Eden club life, according to Hirasawa. And she is the one who is catalyzing Akira's efforts to reach his goal. She is the heart of this story. Akira is its arms and legs (and other things).

But maybe we'll find Saki is a bit like Oosugi. Does she really have a chance with Akira, or is he just a prince to all people (especially women)?
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Old 2009-05-24, 09:20   Link #109
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Quote:
I am so struck here, as in the discussion of the Suzuka anime, at how guys seem to blame the girl for everything.
It's a well known fact that women aren't allowed a personal opinion on love matters in anime.

Anyone that does must be lynched on sight. Look at the Kannagi incident. God forbid the idea that the fantasy loli dozens of otaku masturbate every night to might not be a virgin! The mangaka should be killed. There was even a guy who filmed himself tearing down his whole Kannagi manga collection.

Sometimes anime fans make me really sick.
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Old 2009-05-24, 10:08   Link #110
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Okay I think the only thing we can all agree with is that this episode is a total WTF. It seems like some people loved it for that, and some others are still WTF. I tend to find myself in the latter group.

The problem is this series is seriously testing its credibility. There's been a lot of hints of that in the past but now any logic boundary has been demolished. But more of that later.

First thing: to note is that as predicted the johnny taker and the the 20.000 NEET abduction cases have been mixed up. At lest this make sense, because as many pointed out it is impossible for a single human to kill that many people one by one in a short time period.

Second: The man Diana kidnapped actually turned out to be not Ohsugi. I commend the guys that noticed the left/right hand discrepancy, it was an important hint. This time I was completley wrong in my predictions, however I find it hard to believe there will be a very satisfying explanation for this. There are many things to consider:

1) Ohsugi is nowhere to be found
2) The man that got "taken" by Diana has Ohsugi's bag
3) The man that got "taken" by Diana has Ohsugi's phone
4) The man that got "taken" by Diana wear the same clothes as Ohsugi (except for the necktie?), I noticed this fact and this was confirmed in this episode
5) This man was able to use Ohsugi's phone, supposedly a phone he never used before, without even looking at it. Maybe it's the same model of hsi phone, but this would be yet another coincidence
6) By taking pictures this man accidentally gave hints of him being ohsugi, like taing a picture of a apple
7) He uploaded the photos on the same site that Ohsugi was often posting to. Someone speculated that that ohsugi's phone was set to automatically upload photos there. But does such a function even exist?

Now the best parts:

8) Diana actually crossed her path with Ohsugi soon before his disappearance and... at that time Ohsugi still had his phone and his bag.
9) Akira could have just asked Juiz "find the location of Ohsugi" but no he thought it was smarter to ask the location of a piano.

I think number 8 is particularly relevant because the obvious explanation of points 1 2 3 and 4 is that ohsugi was found by the rapist who decided to beat the crap out of him and take his clothes his phone and his bag. Now it's hard to understand why he would go as far as to take the clothes and the bag, but even in that case I'd have to think that first Diana was near ohsugi and she just passed by. Then the rapist assaulted Ohsugi and then the rapist was assaulted by Diana.
All of these coincidences put together are just way too much for me.


About the selecao's phones I have previously pointed out how strange is that whenever a selecao uses the money all the others receive a notice. there's still 10 of them and they have to use the phone if they don't want to die, so I'd expect the phone to ding ding ding constantly. And if that would be the case I'm sure one would end up being fed up checking all and every of those messages (expecially considering they are being used for trivial things by Akira). However so far we have only seen that happening in a pretty convenient way. I mean you only see a seleçao being noticed of a certain transaction only when that's relevant for the plot. I imagined that maybe you can set the phone to give a sound notice only in case a particular seleçao makes a move, however I had to dismiss this idea with this episode. Because while I can understand that Diana has a particular interest in number IX, there's no reason to beleive Akira should have a particular interest in number XI. Bu Akira does get a notice as soon as number XI orders to create an incident on the highway.


Now about the whole hotel thing. I performed quite a dramatical facepalm when it's been shown that Akira bought the whole hotel for 1.5 billions. I mean there's a limit at how stupid Akira can be, how can you use more than 15% of your whole money to save a single man (that happened to be the wrong one), how the hell are you supposed to save the whole country if a single life costs that much?!
And yet again my bullshit sensor is dinging, and I'm not the only one that noticed this. It is not logically possible to buy a high class hotel in a matter of minutes. There is a whole homungous bureaucratic system to bypass in order to accomplish that. But that apart, let's suppose that Juiz bought that system as well (but how the hell she managed to make them work at night to compile all the modules?), how the hell she managed to get to the hotel owner and make him sign a contract in a few minutes? We are talking about someone that's loaded with money not someone that it's easy to bribe. I guess the Hotel owner was the outsider himself or something @_@
Now I supposed the ownership was handed to someone of Juiz's men, because Akira could not get it unless he signed the contract himself. Funny thing is that when Diana bought it back Juiz made her pay 1.6 billion. Seeing as how Akira is not going to get 1.6 billions that basically mean Juiz herself sold the hotel to Diana for that amount of money. Well done Juiz, you just recovered 1.6 billion from the original 12 of the whole budget.

Now let's get the most interesting part. Apparently Diana had this great idea of becoming a harpy and literally fly away from the hotel. And apparently she planned all that just to surprise a person she didn't even know. Speculations on how and why she did that abund. I must say i laughed hard at Wooland's comment pointing out that it wasn't certainly the most discrete way to exit the scene.
Now I don't even want to try to imagine how exactly Juiz managed to get a whole hollywoodian SFX team to get on the site and create such illusions from scratch in a matter of minutes... never mind, seriously my brain is going to explode if I try.
Why she did that? She certainly cannot expect Saki to really believe she's got magic powers. I mean the illusion was good and all, but Akira's phone is there to testify the truth, I don't think that at this point Akira can keep the secret.
The effect was truly good but I'm left with the feeling it was only done to surprise the public and nothing else, which is kinda lame.

@izmosmolnar:
Did you notice the reactions of the club members when the junior guy said he went to that dinner with ohsugi? They all became red and were surprised so it seems they do have this kind of mentality that two men going to a high class restaurant together is gay or something. Also that guy recognized that he shouldn't have left Ohsugi roam alone in the night being that drunk. However it seems that the club members were more concerned about making him understand that he shouldn't talk too much in front of Saki rather than leave a drunk friend in the care of rapists and Johnny takers.
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Old 2009-05-24, 10:18   Link #111
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Originally Posted by Deathkillz View Post
Why can I just see that Saki will become the annoying little brat who knows nothing but still sticks her foot in it anyway, type character? Gosh I hate those types >.>
it seem she will be like that until the rest of this season.


I predicting akira will spend more money in next 2 episode.
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Last edited by reverse; 2009-05-24 at 10:46.
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Old 2009-05-24, 11:36   Link #112
Guardian Enzo
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Fitting that Akira rides a motorbike, because I see a big tank full of sharks lurking out there in this show's path...

I guess it's not fair, but I do sort of have to grade Eden on a curve. I.G. is my favorite studio and Kamiyama the director of my (current) favorite series ever (Moribito). If it were Xebec and directed by Allan Smithee I'd probably give it a little more leeway to miss the mark.
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Old 2009-05-24, 12:24   Link #113
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so will this series have some sort of cool sequence in animation, just by the way the story is going, maybe I'm hopping to much

so far thing just look pretty. nothing spectacular.


Of topic
it seem Guardian Enzo trying hard, to make people watch Seirei No Moribito
I guess, you left me no choice
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Old 2009-05-24, 12:37   Link #114
izmosmolnar
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Spoiler for @Jan-Poo:

Last edited by izmosmolnar; 2009-05-24 at 13:27. Reason: typo
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Old 2009-05-24, 13:17   Link #115
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@Jan-Poo

The club members were not reacting to the fact that Kasuga had dinner with Oosugi. They just didn't want Saki to know that they all knew she had ditched Oosugi thus increasing her shame. Look again at the scene and at when Onee decides to punch him (when Saki drops her head). Also remember that Kasuga himself initially said he didn't want to mention it in front of her in ep. 5. It's just that he got carried away in his moment of sympathizing with Oosugi's situation.
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Old 2009-05-24, 16:39   Link #116
golthin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MidNteJ View Post
I just like when she says "I can only be ally to half the world." cause it's true there are certain issues/dilema that is if you are or not.
in this case it was literal because she only can be an ally for women and punish men.

Quote:
Originally Posted by izmosmolnar View Post
So who did Diana paid the money for, if Akira didn't get a "refund" in the end?
nobody, it is always a service. If it wasn't that way they could buy property and then sell it to actually cash in the funds. I think the only thing they can own is things they purchase with their real life jobs. Like Akira owned that bike when he was recruited and diana seems to have a day job.

Quote:
Originally Posted by izmosmolnar View Post
Spoiler for @Jan-Poo:
She did called him, but he was already drunk and too mad to answer her, thus why he threw away his phone.

Last edited by golthin; 2009-05-24 at 16:55.
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Old 2009-05-24, 17:36   Link #117
izmosmolnar
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So what happens with the money they are spending then, if Akira isn't receiving it? It's clear Juiz takes Diana's money (kinda like a monopoly-game ), but what happens with the money? Does Juiz wires it back to Outside somehow?
Additionally they can buy physical wares too (remember the candy in the airport), and they could sell that stuff on the black market or somewhere. It's certainly not impossible to make physical money from the selecao money. It might work the same way with the properties too. IDK.
Spoiler for a bit pointless nit-picking:

Last edited by izmosmolnar; 2009-05-24 at 18:35. Reason: additional thoughts
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Old 2009-05-24, 17:39   Link #118
Kaoru Chujo
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Some enjoyable (and some not so enjoyable) ideas since I posted earlier. I really have to agree with Jan-Poo and izmosmolnar (corrected, sorry) that the whole illusion thing seems to be there just for the wow factor. But I'll wait and think and read and see if something more solid comes up.

But I do disagree with about half the things they say. We saw on the street when Oosugi was drunk that he had already dropped his bag and phone (and apple?). So it was fairly natural for a bad guy to pick them up. And the bad guy didn't take Oosugi's clothes at all, not any part of them. They were both wearing standard-issue Japanese business suits, only with different ties and socks. Period.

In the restaurant, the two guys weren't embarrassed about being thought gay so much as for talking too loudly. That would be a perfectly normal feeling in Japan.

The illogical thing is for Diana to just happen along.

The Scooby Gang doesn't think Saki did anything wrong. Nor should they, because she didn't. They are embarrassed that she might feel she had, however. That's why they stop Kasuga.

We are dealing with very few days here. Only 11 in total for the whole series. So it's not so odd that there hasn't been that much activity on the phone. All Selecao just see the appropriate number flashing when a Selecao makes a purchase, they don't see the records unless they click the number. Akira has just learned the system, so we haven't seen him consult it too often.

As I said before, when Akira bought the hotel it didn't disappear: he could sell it again and make his money back. I bet we'll see his funds over Y8 billion again next episode, since Diana bought it back from him. My only problem is that I thought he would have to approve the sale. Don't facepalm so quickly, lol.

As for the flight, it seems logical that she had several forms of escape planned already, including this one. It may only have been a matter of triggering one of them. We definitely have a bit of magic involved in speed with which Juiz can bring things like this about, but as I said earlier, the very first scenes of this show alerted us that we should be prepared for fantasy.

My point about guys always blaming the girl stands. I was feeling badly about making it until someone else did it again.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2009-05-24 at 20:25.
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Old 2009-05-24, 18:18   Link #119
izmosmolnar
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It's izmosmolnar by the way and not iszmos (izmos = masculine/muscly in hungarian).

I know it's not unreasonable to assume, that a criminally minded rapist would take Osugi's bag and phone when he sees him totally hammered. However I find it one hell of a coincidence, he frequents the same love-related website, pictures an apple unintentionally, and he can expertly use someone else's phone without seeing the screen. All of these together seems a bit implausible for me. However it would be pretty lame, if Diana lied in the end about the rapist not being Osugi. While I agree he's intentionally designed as antipathetic as possible, Osugi is still hardly a criminal, there is no reason to abduct him for her.

I hope they reveal it in the next episode Akira received his money for selling the hotel for Diana. If Juiz would wire the money back to Outside in such cases, it would be possible to hack into the system somehow (according to the previews they will eventually hack either way), and discover through the transactions, where did the transfer eventually went.
At least that episode showed us, that Selecaos can buy other Selecao's belongings. So it seems they can interact with each other in a limited way.

I didn't intended to seem like someone who put the whole blame on Saki, so I apologize if that's the way I came across to you.
However I'm not completely convinced about Saki's innocence either. I know she is most possibly in love, and do things the way like someone who is in love, but I reckon she could have behaved a bit differently in several cases, and she could have avoided some of the difficulties she is in now. Of course I could say the same thing about everyone in the world, including myself, but it bothers me a bit more in Saki for some reason. (It's kinda my nature to be something like "I told you so!", but I don't bear any ill will against anyone).

Last edited by izmosmolnar; 2009-05-24 at 18:46.
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Old 2009-05-24, 18:35   Link #120
Jan-Poo
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@Jan-Poo

The club members were not reacting to the fact that Kasuga had dinner with Oosugi. They just didn't want Saki to know that they all knew she had ditched Oosugi thus increasing her shame. Look again at the scene and at when Onee decides to punch him (when Saki drops her head). Also remember that Kasuga himself initially said he didn't want to mention it in front of her in ep. 5. It's just that he got carried away in his moment of sympathizing with Oosugi's situation.
Uhm no I can't agree with this. Kasuga already decided to spill the bean and told them about the whole Ohsugi's situation. He told them that Ohsugi had a broken heart and all, but there was no reaction at that point (althought it seems like Saki is understanding she's the cause).

After that Kasuga says: "If only I had dragged Ohsugi home after dinner yesterday"

I can't see how this should connect with Saki, he's just talking about a dinner he had with ohsugi. Notice the reactions, there's no anger and no sense of guilt from Saki's part. They all feel embarrased and lean away from him.

Only after Morimi asks if that was the dinner she was supposed to have with ohsugi the old woman had totally different reaction. That is because she's the only one who was still clueless about the situation. Notice how micchon and Hirasawa do not react at all here. (However they did react quite evidently when Kasuga talked about the dinner)

Quote:
In the restaurant, the two guys weren't embarrassed about being thought gay so much as for talking too loudly. That would be a perfectly normal feeling in Japan.
Well the only one who was embarrased was Kasuga and he was embarrased even before they started to shout, also he said "I don't want to be anything more than your Junior".

Quote:
My point about guys always blaming the girl stands. I was feeling badly about making it until someone else did it again.
I actually don't blame Saki that much, I do think she had to be more clear with Ohsugi, but there are many reasons that make me think there's more fault on Ohsugi's behalf than on Saki's. There's a limit on how clueless one can be, Ohsugi should have noticed that Saki wasn't really interested in him. While he's fond of Saki I don't think he actually loves her, reason is he doesn't really try to understand her feelings. He's the typical guy who think a girl is cute and dream about having her as girlfriend and forgets he's dealing with a human being with a personality. He doesn't think about how to make Saki happy he only thinks about how he can make himself happy by having Saki for himself.
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