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Old 2009-02-08, 02:32   Link #81
LeaD36
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Well if One Piece was something material it wouldn´t make you pirate king imo.

Since Luffy treasures his friends more than anything else in the world i guess One Piece, is just the metaphorical treasure either fullfilling your dreams or just how important friendship is.

@ Cino why would it be peace and truth? that´d be counterfitting the ideals of pirates and of Gol D. Roger
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Old 2009-02-08, 10:51   Link #82
C.A.
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Originally Posted by DSDSSDWE View Post
I think the whole nakama/friendship thing is a bit too cliche and unfitting for a pirate world. Surely, you don't need to be a pirate, get a crew, be strong and fight countless life and death battles (where some/most of them will most likely die at some point during said battles) to learn of and obtain the prize of all prizes: friendship! Utterly ridiculous. The Care Bears called and they want their freaking theme back!

The most fitting prize in this violent pirate world is something that Luffy himself already hinted at: the guy with the most freedom in this whole ocean is the pirate king. That is what Gold D Rogers left far behind before his head was hacked off: the title and the power that came with being the strongest pirate in all of the seas. To go and do anything you want, not stopped by fellow pirates or the WG or whoever stands in your way. Rogers himself was supposedly unstoppable, but eventually got struck down by a disease and surrendered to the WG himself. That's how WB became the strongest man by default, but that does not mean WB has attained that same strength and freedom that Rogers has attained with his crew.
If you think the concept of Nakama is too cliche and unfitting for this story, then you've probably been watching One Piece with a wrong perspective.

Luffy did hint that he wants to travel through the seas freely and have many great adventures. But he also says that he wants to do so with his Nakama, right from the start of the story. He starts out looking for a crew, a group of Nakama he can sail the seas with and even now he's still looking for more.

The theme of One Piece is Dreams and Nakama, both of equal importance.
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Old 2009-02-08, 18:04   Link #83
DSDSSDWE
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Originally Posted by C.A. View Post
If you think the concept of Nakama is too cliche and unfitting for this story, then you've probably been watching One Piece with a wrong perspective.

Luffy did hint that he wants to travel through the seas freely and have many great adventures. But he also says that he wants to do so with his Nakama, right from the start of the story. He starts out looking for a crew, a group of Nakama he can sail the seas with and even now he's still looking for more.

The theme of One Piece is Dreams and Nakama, both of equal importance.
No, I don't think the concept of nakama is unfitting for the story. I do think it's unfitting as the final treasure (if there is one) of the so called king of pirates.

Yes, having a powerful crew so he can realize his dreams, which is to become pirate king, is important. And the pirate king, by his own definition, is so powerful that he can go anywhere and do anything without being stopped by anyone. If anything, that kind of thing is what signifies the "final" treasure that pirates seek.

Pirates becoming the king of pirates to obtain "true friendship" is ludicrous. To me, that would be a huge slap in the face of piracy and of One Piece, which described an age/world of violent piracy.
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Old 2009-02-08, 18:19   Link #84
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Originally Posted by DSDSSDWE View Post
No, I don't think the concept of nakama is unfitting for the story. I do think it's unfitting as the final treasure (if there is one) of the so called king of pirates.

Yes, having a powerful crew so he can realize his dreams, which is to become pirate king, is important. And the pirate king, by his own definition, is so powerful that he can go anywhere and do anything without being stopped by anyone. If anything, that kind of thing is what signifies the "final" treasure that pirates seek.

Pirates becoming the king of pirates to obtain "true friendship" is ludicrous. To me, that would be a huge slap in the face of piracy and of One Piece, which described an age/world of violent piracy.
Seems like you got the order wrong.

Firstly we like to retain the term Nakama in Japanese because its a term that carries a significance and meaning that can't be fully translated into English. Its not just friendship, crew, comrade or family, it carries something very similar but neither of those does can carry well enough.

And like I said, you got the order wrong.

You don't become the Pirate King to obtain 'true friendship' or Nakama. Its your Nakama that will help you become the Pirate King.

If paper = Pirate king and ash = Nakama. What you got was 'burning ash to get paper'.

If you do not have great Nakama in the first place, you can't be the Pirate King.
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Old 2009-02-08, 20:00   Link #85
DSDSSDWE
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Originally Posted by C.A. View Post
Firstly we like to retain the term Nakama in Japanese because its a term that carries a significance and meaning that can't be fully translated into English. Its not just friendship, crew, comrade or family, it carries something very similar but neither of those does can carry well enough.
That's fine with me. Although I am more replying to the people who think One Piece (the supposed ultimate pirate treasure) is about realizing what friends and friendship mean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by C.A. View Post
And like I said, you got the order wrong.

You don't become the Pirate King to obtain 'true friendship' or Nakama. Its your Nakama that will help you become the Pirate King.

If paper = Pirate king and ash = Nakama. What you got was 'burning ash to get paper'.

If you do not have great Nakama in the first place, you can't be the Pirate King.
No, I don't have the order wrong. As I said, having good nakama to realize the dream of becoming the pirate king is important, no doubt. But the idea that someone becomes a pirate and strives to be the pirate king and to find the "ultimate pirate treasure" that is "true friendship" is very silly. 1. Because "true friendship" has little to do with becoming strong pirates, going on life and death adventures to finally become strong enough to be the pirate king. Hardly something that's worthy of being considered the ultimate treasure for pirates. And 2. It is a pretty big slap in the face of "pirates" even in the world of One Piece if THAT was the ultimate treasure of pirates.

Edit:
Actually, after reading this thread, I find the idea of One Piece having something to do with the void century and overthrowing the WG very likely. I forgot about that particular chapter that covers the idea of the WG doing something evil in the past and trying to conceal it. Very interesting! My thanks for that

Last edited by DSDSSDWE; 2009-02-08 at 20:35.
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Old 2009-02-09, 12:34   Link #86
Wargumm1i
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Originally Posted by DSDSSDWE View Post
Actually, after reading this thread, I find the idea of One Piece having something to do with the void century and overthrowing the WG very likely. I forgot about that particular chapter that covers the idea of the WG doing something evil in the past and trying to conceal it. Very interesting! My thanks for that
I also thought so if you recall Silver Rayleigh said "Even if I were to tell you all about the history right here, right now. As you are right now... you wouldn´t be able to do a thing....!!! No, you take a good long look at the whole world and who knows, you may even reach a diffrent conclusion to the one we arrived at...!"

So its highly possible what you said is possible. Because I mean the way the World Government does things and the people who manipulate there power even thougt there high rank are even more evil than pirates.
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Old 2009-02-09, 12:48   Link #87
Cinocard
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Originally Posted by LeaD36 View Post

@ Cino why would it be peace and truth? that´d be counterfitting the ideals of pirates and of Gol D. Roger
Don't know, it sounds novelistic and cliche, so it popped up in my mind. It can even differ from people to people, since each finds value in different things. But that's the idea, something not materialistic. One Piece primary is a push that give birth to the wave of power strong enough to act according to the will of D.

But why truth conterfitting the ideals of Roger
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Old 2009-07-10, 20:35   Link #88
AddiKtioNn-BlaCk
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I think One Piece may not be anything like a weapon or treasure...
I saw someone on here say it was his flag...
I agree.
If not his flag (or something else he might treasure)...
It may just be the "value of the journey"
or something of that nature
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Old 2009-07-13, 09:25   Link #89
noktown
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Yeah i was thinking about something like that too,it's not about the treasure,it's about the journey and the Nakama you make on the way,overcome trouble together and reach the top in one piece
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Old 2009-07-13, 17:47   Link #90
Fire Elis
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Lightbulb ...

The youth thing doctorine goes on about and flower ossan/lighthouse guy (they suspiciously could be members of Gol’s crew or juz people influenced by his Will of D) seem to have could be it (one piece -that'd suck...) but i wonder... Is Roger executed coz of knowing void history or sumthin (?) or does he turn himself in (?) why does everyone but Roger live (?) does he turn himself in so they’ll survive (?) who, exactly was ABLE to catch Roger, the King? On the swimsuit theory... does it undo side effects of devil fruits?!? I like the idea bout Ace or Nami clones - that is, depending on yer gender of course .... Or it could be a devil fruit that allows ya to eat more than one fruit or completely undoes a former ability done by another fruit or since some give ya certain abilities all the antidotes will be there or mebbe the book of Fruits will be included - along with all unfound fruits - and who was meant to find em or sumthin otherworldly (a.k.a. that meant dumb) like that...
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Old 2009-07-13, 17:57   Link #91
Fire Elis
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wait!!! o no i just realized today was the terrible Monday the 13!!!
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