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Old 2009-10-10, 15:54   Link #3641
Workworkwork
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vega Lyra View Post
The truth would have been reached, but the fun of the game would go...

Is that what you're trying to say?
No, it was the fact the truth was something you'd expect in real life, but not in a story. In other words, a cheat of a story.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:12   Link #3642
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Originally Posted by Workworkwork View Post
No, it was the fact the truth was something you'd expect in real life, but not in a story. In other words, a cheat of a story.
I wouldn't feel cheated. The point of the game is have fun while you're playing it. When it ends it's over.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryukishi
When you look at the three serial murders up to EP3, you can't even tell what the culprit is thinking. Perhaps it's like the Rule X, Y, Z in the Comiket booklet. Even Bernkastel doesn't understand the rules. Maybe the truth will be left in the dark.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:18   Link #3643
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Originally Posted by Ssol View Post
I wouldn't feel cheated. The point of the game is have fun while you're playing it. When it ends it's over.
I wouldn't have fun if all the investments I had into that "fun" got snatched away.

And I dare you to tell me how leaving the truth in the dark would be a good idea. Because I sure as hell hope Ryu07 doesn't do that.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:23   Link #3644
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Originally Posted by Workworkwork View Post
I wouldn't have fun if all the investments I had into that "fun" got snatched away.

And I dare you to tell me how leaving the truth in the dark would be a good idea. Because I sure as hell hope Ryu07 doesn't do that.
It's a good idea because that way no one can just read some short summary online that says, "ok, X did it using Y method for Z reason".

Only people who fully understand the whole story would know the truth.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:33   Link #3645
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Only people who fully understand the whole story would know the truth.
Would be a really bad move..and you know why? First cause even the people who truely understood the story don't know that. They don't know if they are right or wrong.
Oh and it would be rather stupid of Ryukishi to do that. Ryukishi offically challanges his readers in Umineko if her doesn't solve it...then that can't be a real challange.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:38   Link #3646
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Originally Posted by Kitsu View Post
Would be a really bad move..and you know why? First cause even the people who truely understood the story don't know that. They don't know if they are right or wrong.
Oh and it would be rather stupid of Ryukishi to do that. Ryukishi offically challanges his readers in Umineko if her doesn't solve it...then that can't be a real challange.
It all depends on how it ends. The message or overall theme of the story is what is of main importance regarding the ending.

I'm not making these quotes up by the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryukishi
Umineko no Naku Koro ni is the worst kind of tale, created without any intention of letting all of you solve it.

However, to all of the worst kinds of people, who hear that and just want to challenge it more, welcome.

I am myself sending out this tale to make these worst kinds of people surrender.
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Old 2009-10-10, 16:56   Link #3647
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I'm becoming more and more cynical about Umineko right now... in fact, I almost wish I hadn't started it. But since I don't know how it'll end, that "almost" will have to stay that way until my hopes or fears about this story are confirmed.
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Old 2009-10-10, 17:25   Link #3648
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Originally Posted by Maho Momo View Post
I'm becoming more and more cynical about Umineko right now... in fact, I almost wish I hadn't started it. But since I don't know how it'll end, that "almost" will have to stay that way until my hopes or fears about this story are confirmed.
At least there are scantily-clad women and elegant gothic lolitas to use in various h-doujins of varying quality.
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Old 2009-10-10, 17:42   Link #3649
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Originally Posted by Workworkwork View Post
At least there are scantily-clad women and elegant gothic lolitas to use in various h-doujins of varying quality.
If I was into such things, then I guess that would be good news. Unfortunately it's the opposite for me.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:14   Link #3650
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Originally Posted by Maho Momo View Post
If I was into such things, then I guess that would be good news. Unfortunately it's the opposite for me.
Well, uhhh...

Too deep for you?
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:17   Link #3651
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I'm just finding it strange that people and Ryukishi himself are seemingly trying to justify and defend anything less than a concrete ending. I just don't get how some people wold be satisfied with that, but I'll keep my mouth shut until Ryukishi shows us exactly what he has planned.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:23   Link #3652
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssol View Post
*Ryukishi quotes*
See. The thing is that if the story doesn't answer anything like these quotes suggest it won't (because Umineko is impossible to solve, apparently) then a lot of people are going to be very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very angry.

People read mysteries both because they want to know the answer and because they want to have fun trying to figure it out on their own.

If the mystery has no answer, and is unsolvable, then it ceases to be entertainment and simply becomes a bad joke.

I really hope Ryu knows what he's doing here. Otherwise he's going to lose both credibility as a writer and his entire fanbase.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ssol View Post
I wouldn't feel cheated. The point of the game is have fun while you're playing it. When it ends it's over.
Except you, apparently. If the game ends without answering a single damn thing, I guarantee you you're about one of, like, five people who play this series who will be satisfied.

...I'm really fucking pissed off now.

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Originally Posted by Ssol View Post
Only people who fully understand the whole story would know the truth.
Yeah, see, the problem with that is that there isn't a single person alive besides perhaps Ryukishi (and I doubt that he actually knows the answers to half his 'mysteries') that fully understands the story.

So basically, everyone loses. Except 07th Expansion, who made lots of money off of everyone's tears.

Best fucking series ever.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:28   Link #3653
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You guys are acting like Ryukishi isn't a troll.

Still, I'm sure we'll get some answers :P EP 6 isn't even out and you guys are already fretting.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:29   Link #3654
Workworkwork
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
See. The thing is that if the story doesn't answer anything like these quotes suggest it won't (because Umineko is impossible to solve, apparently) then a lot of people are going to be very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very angry.

People read mysteries both because they want to know the answer and because they want to have fun trying to figure it out on their own.

If the mystery has no answer, and is unsolvable, then it ceases to be entertainment and simply becomes a bad joke.

I really hope Ryu knows what he's doing here. Otherwise he's going to lose both credibility as a writer and his entire fanbase.



Except you, apparently. If the game ends without answering a single damn thing, I guarantee you you're about one of, like, five people who play this series who will be satisfied.

...I'm really fucking pissed off now.



Yeah, see, the problem with that is that there isn't a single person alive besides perhaps Ryukishi (and I doubt that he actually knows the answers to half his 'mysteries') that understands the full story.

So basically, everyone loses. Except 07th Expansion, who made lots of money off of everyone's tears.

Best fucking series ever.

Well, I have fun finding easy double entendres in some of the magic("Endless"...Come on, that's pretty easy to think of what else that could apply to. A "Miracle" would be you having sex with Bernkastel. Etc, etc.).


And..uhhh... Yeah, I said it a couple posts ago.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:30   Link #3655
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Workworkwork View Post
Well, uhhh...

Too deep for you?
Quite the opposite actually.

I'm not sure if Umineko is even one of my favorite stories now. I suppose it all depends on the ending, this episode probably shouldn't be too difficult to answer since Battler wasn't with everyone when everything happened... but I'd still like to know what happened exactly, especially for the previous episodes.

How were Eva and Hideyoshi killed in the second twilight in EP1?
Who murdered Nanjo, Genji, and Kumasawa in the parlor? How?
Who murdered Natsuhi and how?
Who is the Beatrice that Maria keeps seeing?
What's so special about Maria's rose? Is it a red herring?

These are a few questions off of the top of my head, and they all come from EP1... there are way more questions for that arc alone, if he fails to answer most (preferably all... but that probably won't happen.) of the questions... then what was the point? If it's not solvable, then why is it even labeled as a mystery? Why does he want the fans to discuss it so much? Why use the mystery element to begin with? His work with Higurashi already earned him a decent fanbase, he wouldn't have to resort to (what I think are) cheap tricks and gimmicks.

If he fails to let the story live up to what he's been writing so far... then it'll definitely feel like a let down to me. I sure hope he has something up his sleeve that'll impress me later on. ._.;
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:34   Link #3656
Workworkwork
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Originally Posted by Maho Momo View Post
Quite the opposite actually.

I'm not sure if Umineko is even one of my favorite stories now. I suppose it all depends on the ending, this episode probably shouldn't be too difficult to answer since Battler wasn't with everyone when everything happened... but I'd still like to know what happened exactly, especially for the previous episodes.

How were Eva and Hideyoshi killed in the second twilight in EP1?
Who murdered Nanjo, Genji, and Kumasawa in the parlor? How?
Who murdered Natsuhi and how?
Who is the Beatrice that Maria keeps seeing?
What's so special about Maria's rose? Is it a red herring?

These are a few questions off of the top of my head, and they all come from EP1... there are way more questions for that arc alone, if he fails to answer most (preferably all... but that probably won't happen.) of the questions... then what was the point? If it's not solvable, then why is it even labeled as a mystery? Why does he want the fans to discuss it so much? Why use the mystery element to begin with? His work with Higurashi already earned him a decent fanbase, he wouldn't have to resort to (what I think are) cheap tricks and gimmicks.

If he fails to let the story live up to what he's been writing so far... then it'll definitely feel like a let down to me. I sure hope he has something up his sleeve that'll impress me later on. ._.;

Well, he might resort to a gainax-type ending where Battler ignores the actual murder mysteries of how they were done and just "magically" finds the culprit, followed by a lot of morals about how "Money=Evil" and they all dump the gold into the ocean. Or something. Oh god I think I said this before. Oh well.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:39   Link #3657
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
You guys are acting like Ryukishi isn't a troll.
I'm well aware of that. But a troll which way?

Is he a troll in that he's lying in interviews or a troll in that he's telling the truth in interviews?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Still, I'm sure we'll get some answers :P EP 6 isn't even out and you guys are already fretting.
We thought we'd get answers in Ep5 too.

Well, apparently, we sort of did, but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maho Momo View Post
I'm not sure if Umineko is even one of my favorite stories now. I suppose it all depends on the ending
Everyone always says that "the journey is more important" but that's crap.

The ending is easily one of the most important parts of a story given that it's the part people remember most clearly, and I, at least, will gladly sit through a crappy series if the ending is awesome. (See: Evangelion, Code Geass R2, etc.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maho Momo View Post
If he fails to let the story live up to what he's been writing so far... then it'll definitely feel like a let down to me. I sure hope he has something up his sleeve that'll impress me later on. ._.;
The moment when the murderer is revealed is easily the most fuckawesome part of a murder mystery.

Given Umineko's epic, epic soundtrack, if Battler/Erika ever confronts and reveals the killer it will be the most awesome moment ever.

If that actually happens, of course. -_-
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:39   Link #3658
hirahira
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I think you guys are worrying too much. I'm sure things like who the culprit is and how the murders happened will be answered and that's the most important thing
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:40   Link #3659
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hirahira View Post
I think you guys are worrying too much. I'm sure things like who the culprit is and how the murders happened will be answered and that's the most important thing
But we don't know this and that's the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Workworkwork View Post
Well, he might resort to a gainax-type ending where Battler ignores the actual murder mysteries of how they were done and just "magically" finds the culprit, followed by a lot of morals about how "Money=Evil" and they all dump the gold into the ocean. Or something. Oh god I think I said this before. Oh well.
I'd say "there's no setup for this aesop whatsoever", but the sad part is that it actually could happen.
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Old 2009-10-10, 18:42   Link #3660
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If they all dump the gold into the ocean... then ummm... how will they pay for their debts? That's kind of important too. The fact is, they're not trying to get the gold just out of greed. They're trying to get it so that they don't go broke and have to live rather poorly.
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