Hayate no Gotoku manga (raw discussion only)

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Rah

I agree with C.C. & Eva, but you're sort of contradicting yourself there. I say sort of, because, well.. it's hard to put it into words. At least for me, I guess...

Tsunderes are in constant denial, don't accept it, act all mean, embarrassed, etc.. and when you crack em open they turn completely around. I'm comparing that to Eva's actions. Well, perhaps that's the wrong way to put it as well. She does have feelings for Negi, but is perhaps in denial with Nagi. Anywayz, since I always complicate things so that nobody understands me, I'll make it simple (maybe, if that's even possible, and in the future as well.. lol).

Basically she acts all evil, but doesn't have those intentions. Really similar how tsunderes act..

While they share with tsunderes the fact that they keep their true feelings to themselves, their behaviour in general is different to that of tsunderes. Tsunderes are almost always very shy, immature when it comes down to their feelings, and have this aggressive, childish behaviour toward their love interest. C.C. and Eva, on the other hand always keep a cool personality, and they rarely lose it. They also have no qualms when it comes down to teasing, or perhaps even flirting. Additionally, they don't keep their feelings to themselves out of shyness, but they have their own reasons to do so, and they have better things to do than being lovestruck with the main character (it can even be argued if they even love their respective main characters, to begin with).

About Eva, I don't think she sees Negi that way, or, at the very least, for the time being. I'm sure she cares for him, but that's all there is to it. Also, if you check that list about the girls' feelings toward Negi that Akamatsu did, Eva's score in Love and True Love were fairly low (3 and 1, respectively, if I remember correctly). She still seems to have feelings for Nagi, though.

Originally Posted by Rah

Wait till she sees Nagi now, and how powerful he got. Heh, Pactio is imminent!

Nagi or Negi? I don't think Nagi is out to become more powerful.

Originally Posted by Rah

Spoiler for I'm also slightly paedo for Nadeko.:

Admit it. You were expecting this.

As a matter of fact, I did.

Originally Posted by Rah

On Wiki it says that Hayate's brother is not a blood relative. Dunno if it's trustworthy info... :/

I don't remember anything like that from the manga, or those character infos at the end of the volume. But, anyway, Wikipedia.

Originally Posted by zodanhko

I think we pretty much how she acts in a relationship with this arc.

Not really, since at this moment she's not in any relationship, and the current situation is quite complicated. Well, he could see something in the EotW arc, but, all the same, they were little kids back then. I think we'd have to see Athena in a regular situation to see how she really behaves.

[Rah]

Ahh, I keep confusing them. Nagi = Adult version... *glues to Nagi from HnG to remember*

That love chart, eh? Well, it's constantly changing... when she sees him how GAR he's got, and his adult form + all the DARKNESS (lol), that he's got crawling in his skin.. she'll surely hop up to the top 10. He'll form pactios with all of em eventually... .... maybe...

Yeh, that of him being related or unrelated is still an unknown I guess. If he is, then he's probably the one that was with Yukariko, since they're in a similar age group (depends of course if he was in high school or uni...), thus canceling the possibility of a romantic Hayate x Nagi ending. I don't mind it that much, as long as she's happy in the end...

Originally Posted by Used Can

As a matter of fact, I did.

And of course, you're sitting... good... good... ehehehe!

[zodanhko]

Originally Posted by Used Can

Not really, since at this moment she's not in any relationship, and the current situation is quite complicated. Well, he could see something in the EotW arc, but, all the same, they were little kids back then. I think we'd have to see Athena in a regular situation to see how she really behaves.

I think Athena's behavior as a kid is pretty much what she is right now; unlike Hayate and the others, Athena's pretty much had adult-like mature behaviors, her thinking is far from a kid's level.

However, I do agree that we don't know much of her general behavior in a relationship right now; but her actions of what she's willing to do and how she felt about it was my point. But, I assume something like...

Spoiler for something:

is pretty informative.

Compare to Hinagiku:

Spoiler for ...:

[Rah]

Yeah, we all know that Hina is a hardcore tsundere, but she was really close to confessing after the dinner. It's a good thing that she didn't, because her character would completely change if she did. Hayate is the only love interest in this manga, thus she couldn't be her tsundere self with anyone else, unless she turned 180 for Miki. :>

Athena does look happy that Hayate wasn't / still isn't in a relationship with anyone, closely following her teachings. Well, what she though him aside, she's happy that he's still single and innocent like before. Obviously, completely available. Too bad that Midas is in the way, eh?

Midas is such a perv... stealing her body.. making her do ecchi things at night... does that bother you zod?

ehehe~ just messin ^_^

[zodanhko]

It wasn't about happy or not but how they were affected by his words of praise, their reactions to it, which is pretty informative concerning interactions between couples.

Odd. I don't find Athena being happy with that information.

[Rah]

Are you a robot? Does not compute? Perhaps a software upgrade..

[Winged_Gardy]

With the Greek Arc coming to an end (which is awesome because of Athena and Hina), I am still wondering... about this guy.

Is Himegami, Nagi's former butler, going to be a one-shot name just like Klaus (well, pretty much)?

I really thought he would be someone important (like Hayate's unnamed brother or something), but so far, apparently not.

[IndoViking]

Himegami hasn't appeared yet, but i believe he'll have some roles in the coming arc, because there's some mystery that probably he can answer, especially about the stone

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Rah

Ahh, I keep confusing them. Nagi = Adult version... *glues to Nagi from HnG to remember*

Ah... I got confused, because I thought you were thinking about Negi's father.

Originally Posted by Rah

That love chart, eh? Well, it's constantly changing... when she sees him how GAR he's got, and his adult form + all the DARKNESS (lol), that he's got crawling in his skin.. she'll surely hop up to the top 10. He'll form pactios with all of em eventually... .... maybe...

Well...

Spoiler:

She's technically seen him already. If you remember, the fake Eva saw his match against Rakan, and she even congratulated him for it. She even noticed (along with Rakan) his darkness may go out of control at some point, and that they may have to do something about it, eventually. So, she's pretty much aware of Negi's current state.

All the same, I think Eva is yet to be properly developed. Other than the past she told to Asuna and Setsuna, and the whole "my words don't match with my actions" behaviour of hers, I don't think Eva has received much development. But, all the same, Akamatsu can easily keep her like that.

Originally Posted by Rah

Yeh, that of him being related or unrelated is still an unknown I guess. If he is, then he's probably the one that was with Yukariko, since they're in a similar age group (depends of course if he was in high school or uni...), thus canceling the possibility of a romantic Hayate x Nagi ending. I don't mind it that much, as long as she's happy in the end...

We'll have to see. For all we know, Nagi's father's resemblance with Hayate may be Hata just trolling us. But, all the same, at this point, I'd say it's a good possibility Hayate's brother is Nagi's father.

Originally Posted by Rah

And of course, you're sitting... good... good... ehehehe!

Fuck...

Originally Posted by zodanhko

I think Athena's behavior as a kid is pretty much what she is right now; unlike Hayate and the others, Athena's pretty much had adult-like mature behaviors, her thinking is far from a kid's level.

Maybe, maybe not. If we follow what Machina said, Athena has gone through some tough situations. I think it's quite likely she's somehow changed.

Originally Posted by zodanhko

However, I do agree that we don't know much of her general behavior in a relationship right now; but her actions of what she's willing to do and how she felt about it was my point. But, I assume something like...

Spoiler for something:

is pretty informative.

Yes, she showed jealousy, but we've still got to take into account that, before that, she denied knowing about Hayate, and she also hid herself expecting him to leave. Sure, she admitted to herself she still loves him. However, the situation prevents her from being able to express her feelings. That's what I mean we'd have to see her in a normal situation, in which she can express her feelings freely.

[Rah]

Huhu...

We're almost on pg. 250. To celebrate 250 chapters of HnG, the first post on pg. 250 will determine who will Hayate end up with. - or at least influence the possibility by 0.1% :>

Naw, you don't have to say anything, or play along. Just normally reply to the thread. Oh, and also if your reply is 5 mins from your last post or less it doesn't count! (so the second post counts if this happens) ^_^

[zodanhko]

Originally Posted by Used Can

Maybe, maybe not. If we follow what Machina said, Athena has gone through some tough situations. I think it's quite likely she's somehow changed.

Athena had always gone through tough time even before she met Hayate. Even if she puts up more defensive barriers externally, her internal feelings are the same, and I don't think her beliefs changed that much at all, about reality and about relationships.

Originally Posted by Used Can

Yes, she showed jealousy, but we've still got to take into account that, before that, she denied knowing about Hayate, and she also hid herself expecting him to leave. Sure, she admitted to herself she still loves him. However, the situation prevents her from being able to express her feelings. That's what I mean we'd have to see her in a normal situation, in which she can express her feelings freely.

The page I shown you indicated how Athena acts out of her characteristics (freely), meaning the words of praise from Hayate won't have much affect on her; I don't think the situation has anything to do with it.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by zodanhko

Athena had always gone through tough time even before she met Hayate. Even if she puts up more defensive barriers externally, her internal feelings are the same, and I don't think her beliefs changed that much at all, about reality and about relationships.

Yes, but back then Midas wasn't out of control. And I think Midas is quite a huge deal, right now.

Originally Posted by zodanhko

The page I shown you indicated how Athena acts out of her characteristics (freely), meaning the words of praise from Hayate won't have much affect on her; I don't think the situation has anything to do with it.

She indeed showed jealousy, but she still couldn't bring herself to tell Hayate she still loves him. She had no qualms about that during the time they spent in the RG.

[zodanhko]

Originally Posted by Used Can

Yes, but back then Midas wasn't out of control. And I think Midas is quite a huge deal, right now.

If Midas were to still possess her, then she won't be the normal Athena, would she? Then there was no point in discussing this since it already shown that her behavior already changed the moment he took over.

Originally Posted by Used Can

She indeed showed jealousy, but she still couldn't bring herself to tell Hayate she still loves him. She had no qualms about that during the time they spent in the RG

Honestly, I don't understand what you are trying to say right here in reply to my statement with the spoiler I posted.

The current Athena does have jealousy, and she can't say she loves him due to their past. It seems like she believes that she have no right to love him. I didn't say that she were freely in expressing her true feelings to Hayate because it's true that she didn't right now. But that's due to the situation they had, not due to her change in personality/characteristics.

[Master Chibi]

As stirring as the past ten chapters have been, I have no faith in the events about to unfold. I can't see him actually deciding between the two, no matter how much I will for it to happen. Putting Hinagiku out of the picture was enough of a crack in the 'mold' so to speak but I just don't see him breaking said mold any further.

I'll be happy as fuck to eat my own words though. With gusto.

[ChronoReverse]

Coloured Hamster sure was cute in ch250

[aldw]

Originally Posted by zodanhko

The page I shown you indicated how Athena acts out of her characteristics (freely), meaning the words of praise from Hayate won't have much affect on her; I don't think the situation has anything to do with it.

That's more due to present circumstances than her actual self IMHO, once everything is resolved things should be more open between her and Hayate.

[zodanhko]

Originally Posted by aldw

That's more due to present circumstances than her actual self IMHO, once everything is resolved things should be more open between her and Hayate.

I think otherwise, and even if she doesn't act like...

Spoiler for something:

...I don't think Athena is a person who'd become overjoy or fall for a statement of praise such as cute, charming, beautiful; it will work on Nagi, Hinagiku, Ayumu though.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by zodanhko

If Midas were to still possess her, then she won't be the normal Athena, would she? Then there was no point in discussing this since it already shown that her behavior already changed the moment he took over.

I'm not talking about her being possessed. I'm talking about the fact she's aware of Midas, and that she tried to keep Hayate at bay because of him.

Originally Posted by zodanhko

The current Athena does have jealousy, and she can't say she loves him due to their past. It seems like she believes that she have no right to love him. I didn't say that she were freely in expressing her true feelings to Hayate because it's true that she didn't right now. But that's due to the situation they had, not due to her change in personality/characteristics.

That's what I mean, I never said she didn't do it because of her personality, but due to her current and past situation. This is why I said we'd have to see her behaviour in a situation in which she's not burdened by all these problems.

The whole deal I was saying about a possible change in her personality was unrelated to her expressing her feelings. My point was simply that due to the things she's gone through, she's probably changed.

Originally Posted by Rah

We're almost on pg. 250. To celebrate 250 chapters of HnG, the first post on pg. 250 will determine who will Hayate end up with. - or at least influence the possibility by 0.1% :>

Originally Posted by ChronoReverse

Coloured Hamster sure was cute in ch250

SUPREEEEEEME VICTORY!

[zodanhko]

Originally Posted by Used Can

I'm not talking about her being possessed. I'm talking about the fact she's aware of Midas, and that she tried to keep Hayate at bay because of him.

I don't see the connection to her "change" if it's not possession.

That's what I mean, I never said she didn't do it because of her personality, but due to her current and past situation. This is why I said we'd have to see her behaviour in a situation in which she's not burdened by all these problems.

The whole deal I was saying about a possible change in her personality was unrelated to her expressing her feelings. My point was simply that due to the things she's gone through,she's probably changed.

We do have some insights in her true thoughts and how she acts while Hayate was resting and looking for her.

If it's simply change without anything specific, I can't argue with that.

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by zodanhko

I don't see the connection to her "change" if it's not possession.

I wasn't talking about change there, but one of the things that prevent her from expressing herself freely to Hayate (or anyone else).

Originally Posted by zodanhko

We do have some insights in her true thoughts and how she acts while Hayate was resting and looking for her.

If it's simply change without anything specific, I can't argue with that.

I'm talking about change as in people change over time, especially when they have to go through tough things. And I think she has indeed changed. For example, when she first met Hayate (a complete stranger for her, back then) she had no problems showing him a smile. However, right now, she looks like a cold person (even if only in the outside). For example, when she met Hina, even if she did try becoming friends with her, she was still quite serious and a bit distant.