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Old 2009-12-09, 09:07   Link #41
Yot-chan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
Did someone from the MacrossWorld flamewars slither over here?
Youtube, actually:

http://www.youtube.com/user/Robotechtehbest

I get the feeling he's actually a Macross fan PRETENDING to be a rapid Robotech fan.
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Old 2009-12-09, 09:42   Link #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
Youtube, actually:

http://www.youtube.com/user/Robotechtehbest

I get the feeling he's actually a Macross fan PRETENDING to be a rapid Robotech fan.
Oh, *that* guy. Yeah, well, who really cares. I loved Robotech when I didn't have the chance to see Macross, now I love Macross, because it simply has a better narrative and a much better expanded universe ( see: Macross Frontier and all the other series which came before. Yeah, even Macross 7 ).
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Old 2009-12-11, 20:07   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robotechtehbest View Post
Harmony Gold legal use macross, Harmony Gold did buy to Tatsunoko Macross Rights. So Macross Fanboy no complain, Robotech legal use Macross design.
go www.robotech.com, it say "CAN USE ALL ROBOTECH", so can use macross design too. By contract Harmony Gold use too macross sequel design.
Ah yes, another RT fanboy.

My friend what you have been told on the RT fan boards is misleading. Tatsunoko owns the "Maker's Rights" to SDFM, which means they own the animation that they created for the series, outside of Japan. BigWest has "Author's Rights" what we call here "Intellectual Property" rights, which means the story, the designs, the franchise itself is owned by those who created it.

Harmoney Gold can only own what Tatsunoko can sell and that is title to the animation itself. One of the reasons I believe all subsequent Macross shows tend to reference art and scenes from DYRL and not SDFM.

HG owns an erroneous trademark on a name that they have tenuous legal rights to. The only way they could control the importation of Macross named productions in the West and protect their little RT franchise from superior BigWest productions. To further their control they've gotten into bed with Manga Entertainment, the only other licenser of Macross material in the US.
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Old 2009-12-11, 20:24   Link #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
And I am not too sure if I'd agree to the claim that Macross not being a major title for Bandai. Certainly it is the second largest mecha franchise in Japan. I think the issue here is that Bandai doesn't really care about the anime market here in North America. After all, East Asia is where all the money is (for now). Moreover, since Gundam will never suffer from the same legal issues, we can't really use it as a gauge. On a further note, anime merchandise sales in NA pales in comparison when the East Asian market is considered. Therefore, how much emphasis do Japanese companies place on our market begs to be asked.

- Tak
I suspect that is the biggest reason why BW isn't fighting to get it's TM back. The cost benefit ratio is too low for the West. Asia is still an open market for Macross merch and that is where the focus is going to be. Follow the money and the rest will make sense. RT is a niche within a niche market in the West, so HG will agressively try to protect it, but the reality is that HG made its money from licensing foreign films, dubbing them and them selling them in the West. RT was more an accident for them rather than a conscious business plan.

They abandoned the franchise in the 90's due to lack of interest and the better ROI on doing their regular business of import sales. It wasn't until DVD became mainstream and the Anime market matured that they started peddling the show again.
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Old 2009-12-12, 07:52   Link #45
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A one year anniversary before a response.

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/inde...dpost&p=798935

All there is to know about Macross IP rights.

@Yot-chan

I've seen this idiot's claims ripped to pieces at 4chan's /m/. For that matter anything Robotech.
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Old 2009-12-12, 18:00   Link #46
Tak
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I find it rather surprising that nobody ever posted the original court documents, but they are located here

It is actually a bit more in depth than what was written in Macross World.

The original case is the pdf file on the left, with supplementary documents to the right. Two most notable sections of the court ruling are:



Which states that Tatsunoko Productions possesses the rights to merchandising and licensing of SDF: Macross overseas while obtaining all of the profit generated from the overseas market only. However, the oft-missed point is that, domestic profit is to be shared. So yes, Tatsu gets a piece of the pie for the domestic market, as well.

Then here is the other key factor:



This article indicates that Studio Nue possesses the intellectual property rights listed from index 1 - 41 of the supplementary material. They are the sole party able to utilize the properties listed from 1 - 41 and manipulate the said properties as they see fit. This excludes Tatsunoko Productions entirely.

No where on the court document indicates that Tatsu has the right to manipulate the original series or any of its sequels internationally and/or domestically. Therefore, it certainly does not give them the right to all future derivatives of Macross overseas. That was not part of the original document. Based on my personal interpretation, this may also mean that HG committed an illegal act by creating Robotech or the more recent Shadow Chronicles.

So this is the original court statement and proceeding document. Does it change anything? Not quite, but since I never saw a single post of the original document, I suppose I should do that for everyone.

Again, no legal action was brought against HG for obvious profit reasons. To be honest, I am less interested in seeing Macross merchandise legally being retailed here than to actually see Harmony Gold choke on its own words and burn in legal hell.

- Tak
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Old 2009-12-12, 20:28   Link #47
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Also, preventing a Robotech movie would be high on my list. Although, as people discussed extensively ( only 60+ pages for the first thread. ) on MW, it'd probably be a re-imaging which has the "Robotech" title slapped on it.

And welcome back, Tak. Get yourself over to the light novel thread, where important developments have happened. I want your opinions on them.
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Old 2009-12-12, 20:59   Link #48
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The court documents were discussed in depth in older versions of the thread on MW. Feel free to read it at leasure but it's a massive thread.

The way I understand it, the current status quo after the lawsuit in Japan is in short: Big West/Studio Nue and Tatsunoko share the copyright to SDFM, Big West and SN own the moral rights which is pretty much the designs and the right to make derivatives (aka authors right), Tatsunoko owns the economic rights which translates in them owning the footage of SDFM. Tats controls the distribution of SDFM ouside of Japan and has the world wide merchandise licensing rights again outside of Japan due to the original production agreements. Which in turn allowed HG as a licensee to use the footage and edit it but not create any derivatives other then merchandise (which oddly contains books comics and videogames). This explains why games like RT: Battlecry can use Macross character designs but RT animated sequels like Sentinels and Shadow Chronicles can't.

The problem with Harmony Gold is that they trademarked the name "Macross" in 1999-2001 in North America and most of Western Europe. The trademarks allows HG to prevent the sale of any shows or merchandise using the name Macross in these countries without HGs consent. Big West tried to get the trademark in the US at the same time as HG but the trademark agency awarded it to HG. HG recently prolonged all those trademarks (they last 10 years) to the end of the next decade.
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Old 2009-12-12, 23:53   Link #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bri View Post
Which in turn allowed HG as a licensee to use the footage and edit it but not create any derivatives other then merchandise (which oddly contains books comics and videogames). This explains why games like RT: Battlecry can use Macross character designs but RT animated sequels like Sentinels and Shadow Chronicles can't.
However, I have noticed a lack of new merchandise and/or other relevant materials being created as of late, perhaps it had something to do with the decision of the Japanese court, which barred Tats from creating any derivatives. Tats did attempt to appeal, but failed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bri View Post
Big West tried to get the trademark in the US at the same time as HG but the trademark agency awarded it to HG. HG recently prolonged all those trademarks (they last 10 years) to the end of the next decade.
Not surprising, HG is an American corporation, and Big West at the time was standing on shaky legal grounds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
And welcome back, Tak. Get yourself over to the light novel thread, where important developments have happened. I want your opinions on them.
Define 'important developments', because I have very specific and narrow requirements, such as Alto and Sheryl having kids...

- Tak
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Old 2009-12-13, 04:28   Link #50
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Define 'important developments', because I have very specific and narrow requirements, such as Alto and Sheryl having kids...- Tak
How about confirmation of them having made love during episode 22, plus a very sweet "after the fact" scene being in the light novels?
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Old 2009-12-13, 11:22   Link #51
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Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
How about confirmation of them having made love during episode 22, plus a very sweet "after the fact" scene being in the light novels?
Well, see... I knew that. In fact, I was the only person to stand firm on the belief here, remember?

- Tak
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"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
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Old 2009-12-13, 11:57   Link #52
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Well, see... I knew that. In fact, I was the only person to stand firm on the belief here, remember?

- Tak
Rather the first person ( although in chat, not on the board ), but as soon as I got convinced, I stayed there right with you.
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Old 2010-08-19, 11:51   Link #53
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Last year, Catalyst Game Labs (successors to FASA as owners of the Battletech franchise) announced that they had received licenses to resume use of the anime-derived mecha designs they had dropped use of. At first they stated they had recovered licenses for all of the original art, including the items from Macross, Dougram, and other licensees.

They then retracted that announcement, stating that they were not able to proceed with the Macross designs but did confirm their rights to the other licensed material.

Part of the announcement stated that they had been presented with what purported to be a closed legal decision granting Palladium Books permanent exclusive rights to any Macross-derived game material in the US.

Does anyone have more detail on this? Verification?
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Old 2010-08-19, 12:26   Link #54
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Eh? Palladium Books? They ever did publish that book on the Shadow Chronicles?
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