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Old 2009-12-22, 22:48   Link #5181
Vexx
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Heh.... Taiwan would be a great idea.... except that it would simply ignite the mainland -- and so far the "not resolved but resolved" psychosis keeps us all from shooting at each other over that.

Now that I think about it though.... the US and the mainland Chinese sharing base resources would be bizarre, but actually thinkable as the economic ties get tighter.
Wow... I would have never even thought that only a few years ago. Shades of Firefly...
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Old 2009-12-22, 22:59   Link #5182
Tiberium Wolf
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Build a damn naval island base like in Red Alert 3 and the problem is solved. Everyone happy that way. Well... except a few marines that won't be able to commit crimes.
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Old 2009-12-22, 23:02   Link #5183
ZephyrLeanne
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Originally Posted by Tiberium Wolf View Post
Build a damn naval island base like in Red Alert 3 and the problem is solved. Everyone happy that way. Well... except a few marines that won't be able to commit crimes.
But where? Every parcel of water in the Asian side of the Pacific is either someone's or claimed by somebody.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Heh.... Taiwan would be a great idea.... except that it would simply ignite the mainland -- and so far the "not resolved but resolved" psychosis keeps us all from shooting at each other over that.

Damn.
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Old 2009-12-22, 23:08   Link #5184
MeoTwister5
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The US having base on the Chinese mainland might actually be more hilarious than worrisome.
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Old 2009-12-22, 23:09   Link #5185
ZephyrLeanne
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Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
The US having base on the Chinese mainland might actually be more hilarious than worrisome.
It's more worrisome than hilarious. Basically, whenever US and China cannot agree, the US starts attacking its own factory and savings account. How very smart.
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Old 2009-12-22, 23:14   Link #5186
MeoTwister5
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Well the US and China have pretty much never agreed on anything since the 50's. Hilarious in the sense that a) It's almost never likely to happen in the next 50 years and b) Chinese citizens interacting with US servicemen.
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Old 2009-12-22, 23:22   Link #5187
ZephyrLeanne
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Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Well the US and China have pretty much never agreed on anything since the 50's. Hilarious in the sense that a) It's almost never likely to happen in the next 50 years and b) Chinese citizens interacting with US servicemen.
It'll look like this.
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Old 2009-12-23, 04:33   Link #5188
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Well the US and China have pretty much never agreed on anything since the 50's. Hilarious in the sense that a) It's almost never likely to happen in the next 50 years and b) Chinese citizens interacting with US servicemen.
It will never happen. You haven't seen how arrogant some Chinamen are and they impose their superiority in the most barbaric style possible. Anti-US sentiments still run high after the Korean war, and some of them even think that they are technologically superior despite the fact that they are plagarising foreign technology.

There are some good moderate ones, but when it comes to their ultra-nationalist countrymen, they are a scourge to every country they visit and are truly downright pathetic. And most of them are in the top echelon of the government and military.

Besides, the USMC has had exchange programs with the Chinese Marines for quite some time already since the 1990s. It is obvious that the USMC lost out to their Chinese counterparts in physical fitness due to their heavy reliance in techniques rather than physical skill.

Korea is a sensitive issue for both sides, much more than Taiwan actually. And frankly speaking, I don't think US can ever have a base in the latter because Taiwan is quoted to be a territory of China. To set up a base there would be a good pretext to start a real war rather than a diplomatic conflict.

Besides, the reason why the US base is there is as a force projection to its interests, mainly South Korea, Taiwan, Japan and Southeast Asia. Their main "enemies" are China, North Korea, old USSR states, and to a small extent, Vietnam, Burma and Muslim countries hosting* terror groups like Jemaah Islamiah, e.g Indonesia and Malaysia.

*Parasite-host relationship, not the mutual host-guest relationship.
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Last edited by SaintessHeart; 2009-12-23 at 04:47.
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Old 2009-12-23, 04:49   Link #5189
ZephyrLeanne
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Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
It will never happen. You haven't seen how arrogant some Chinamen are and they impose their superiority in the most barbaric style possible. Anti-US sentiments still run high after the Korean war, and some of them even think that they are technologically superior despite the fact that they are plagarising foreign technology.
I know what you're talking.

[In TAIPEI]
Falungong people doing taiji at Shilin Food Street's carpark.

[China tour group bus parks RIGHT OPPOSITE the Falungong]
[Chinaman: 咱们不喜欢这些为非作歹的法轮功奸贼,公安!]
(I don't like the sight of these Falungong ppl, where's security!?)
[Chinawoman:台湾回归中国人民共和国吧!死东西,哪有这样的人,中华民国偷走台湾!]
(Taiwan should return to the PRC! Damn ***, the Republic of China stole Taiwan!)

And to think they're GUESTS in Taiwan.

Quote:
There are some good moderate ones
Sure. They're called HONGKONGERS.

Quote:
,but when it comes to their ultra-nationalist countrymen, they are a scourge to every country they visit and are truly downright pathetic. And most of them are in the top echelon of the government and military.
Actually, it's not just limited to them, it's brainwashing, CCP-style.

Quote:
Besides, the USMC has had exchange programs with the Chinese Marines for quite some time already since the 1990s. It is obvious that the USMC lost out to their Chinese counterparts in physical fitness due to their heavy reliance in techniques rather than physical skill.

Korea is a sensitive issue for both sides, much more than Taiwan actually.
Not really. No one would miss DPRK if it were to be nuked tomorrow, not even Russia, since DPRK isn't a huge market for any arms-seller. Taiwan is a major second-buyer of US arms, however. And it's now a second Silicon Valley.

Quote:
And frankly speaking, I don't think US can ever have a base in the latter because Taiwan is quoted to be a territory of China. To set up a base there would be a good pretext to start a real war rather than a diplomatic conflict.
True.

Quote:
Besides, the reason why the US base is there is as a force projection to its interests, mainly South Korea, Taiwan, Japan and Southeast Asia. Their main "enemies" are China, North Korea, old USSR states, and to a small extent, Vietnam, Burma and Muslim countries hosting* terror groups like Jemaah Islamiah, e.g Indonesia and Malaysia.
In other words, it protects the ROK, ROS, ROC, ROP (South Korea, Singapore, Republic of China ~ Taiwan, and the Philippines) and Japan from everyone else in the region!?
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Old 2009-12-23, 05:07   Link #5190
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
I know what you're talking.

[In TAIPEI]
Falungong people doing taiji at Shilin Food Street's carpark.

[China tour group bus parks RIGHT OPPOSITE the Falungong]
[Chinaman: 咱们不喜欢这些为非作歹的法轮功奸贼,公安!]
(I don't like the sight of these Falungong ppl, where's security!?)
[Chinawoman:台湾回归中国人民共和国吧!死东西,哪有这样的人,中华民国偷走台湾!]
(Taiwan should return to the PRC! Damn ***, the Republic of China stole Taiwan!)

And to think they're GUESTS in Taiwan.
Lol you heard of that? I thought it was only discussed during high school GP lessons.

Quote:
Sure. They're called HONGKONGERS.
Actually I had some classmates from China. Some of them came here and wanted to settle permanently because they felt their state ideology was decadent and immoral. Of course, by a margin, most of them are just anti-US, pro-communist, and brazenly wondered why we did not, despite being a Chinese majority independent state, did not go pro-China.

Of course, there was a recent case over here in which a China-woman participated in the CCP Parade and flashed her blue PR Singaporean IC. I have no qualms of her returning to China and being loyal to that land, but at least show my country some damned respect by destroying that blue card in private.

Quote:
Actually, it's not just limited to them, it's brainwashing, CCP-style.
Surprisingly, it is rather effective in controlling the most populous country in the world.

Quote:
Not really. No one would miss DPRK if it were to be nuked tomorrow, not even Russia, since DPRK isn't a huge market for any arms-seller. Taiwan is a major second-buyer of US arms, however. And it's now a second Silicon Valley.
There is someone. The black marketeers. DPRK gets money from selling their arms.

Quote:
In other words, it protects the ROK, ROS, ROC, ROP (South Korea, Singapore, Republic of China ~ Taiwan, and the Philippines) and Japan from everyone else in the region!?
It is SUPPOSED to. Apparently it didn't REALLY work out because the biggest threat is still China, which is numerically superior and can decimate the entire region into oblivion with a single press of a button, not even counting nukes into the equation.

But anywhere US has their bases, there is always their CIA and SIGINT. It neutralises, to a small extent, first strike capabilities while China hasn't launched an anti-GPS program.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.

Last edited by SaintessHeart; 2009-12-23 at 05:20.
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Old 2009-12-23, 05:20   Link #5191
ZephyrLeanne
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Lol you heard of that? I thought it was only discussed during high school GP lessons.
As I said, these are PRC ppl who don't like the sight of perfectly fine ROC citizens practicing Falungong.

And I know what GP is. Don't think just because I'm a gaijin, I wouldn't know. It's a political essay for A-levels, right? Thank God I moved over back to Japan in S4. (and neatly avoided O-levels too)

Quote:
Actually I had some classmates from China. Some of them came here and wanted to settle permanently because they felt their state ideology was decadent and immoral.
Haven't seen any such people yet. Probably they've seen Hongkong.

Quote:
Of course, by a margin, most of them are just anti-US, pro-communist, and brazenly wondered why we did not, despite being a Chinese majority independent state, did not go pro-China.
Because there's the Internal Security Act and a communist crackdown in the 50-60's, followed by a Socialist crackdown in the 70-80's?

Quote:
Of course, there was a recent case over here in which a China-woman participated in the CCP Parade and flashed her blue PR Singaporean IC. I have no qualms of her returning to China and being loyal to that land, but at least show my country some damned respect by destroying that blue card in private.
Huh? Is there a web link to that?

Quote:
Surprisingly, it is rather effective in controlling the most populous country in the world.
Brainwashing is proven to be 100% effective in any case. Or 99.9999% in the case of... this, where the United States of Japan is born... actually, that's not too bad, could end the Okinawa base question.

Quote:
There is someone. The black marketeers. DPRK gets money from selling their arms.
As in, I was talking about states. Not individuals.

Quote:
It is SUPPOSED to. Apparently it didn't REALLY work out because the biggest threat is still China, which is numerically superior and can decimate the entire region into oblivion with a single press of a button, not even counting nukes into the equation.
Sad, huh?
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Old 2009-12-23, 10:50   Link #5192
ClockWorkAngel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
Sure. They're called HONGKONGERS.
We people from Hong Kong don't like to be refereed to as coming from China because of that

@Saintlessheart

I can understand your feelings about the Chinese in general, it differs for person to person as you said. You'll find alot of moderates with a healthy bit of patriotism and those ultra-nationalists you talk of.

To the Base Topic on Hand:

I sincerely doubt that Hatoyama is going to do anything soon. But if he isn't he must be more concise about it if he intends to help his approval ratings.

The US will more than likely keep a base there, for whatever Chinese Invasion they're afraid of.
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Old 2009-12-23, 11:21   Link #5193
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClockWorkAngel View Post
To the Base Topic on Hand:

I sincerely doubt that Hatoyama is going to do anything soon. But if he isn't he must be more concise about it if he intends to help his approval ratings.

The US will more than likely keep a base there, for whatever Chinese Invasion they're afraid of.
I think, for a bigger issue, it would be better to keep a base there as a counter-influence. With China's size and intelligence capabilities, there is a need for someone to match up to them.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2009-12-23, 20:52   Link #5194
ZephyrLeanne
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^Yes. In Tokyo then. Not Okinawa!
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Old 2009-12-23, 20:54   Link #5195
Terrestrial Dream
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Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
I can understand that. The ones in Korea almost never get into trouble. Sometime you wonder what's the secret, and whether their commander can come over to Japan. Maybe the ones in Korea know they are fighting a war (which is correctly labeled as such), while the ones in Japan think Okinawa is a R&R stop.

And the US force in Korea are actually building the local communities there. Like the GOOD NEIGHBOR effort. Not that there isn't such efforts in Japan, but they're limited to teaching English, as if they were just the replacement for the Nova people.




I think it's more of a "elite force in Korea, lacklusters in Japan" kind of idea. I can safely say that the forces in Korea could also be used for defense of the Pacific. Like, the BIGGEST "threat" in the Pacific is... CHINA, so effectively, the force in Korea could also effectively attack China if required.



Is Korean culture easier to understand than Okinawans'?
Biggest difference would be the fact that Korea was never defeated by America. We "let" them have their military bases here and so they might be the probable cause. However I wouldn't say there isn't a problem, I read an article about American soldier accidentally and Koreans wanted to have trial for them but couldn't because they weren't in their jurisdiction.
And call me naive, but I just don't believe there is any so call threat in the pacific. I doubt China would attack anyone because they would probably have more to lose than gain from a war. And North Korea, never saw them as a huge threat that everyone makes it seem to be, the country is on the verge of collapse and their military are outdated and only has numbers. Also I just don't believe that they would want another war.
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Old 2009-12-23, 21:07   Link #5196
LynnieS
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Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
^Yes. In Tokyo then. Not Okinawa!
Good grief. No... There are already enough gaijins in the city! But getting the land for building a base in the Tokyo area will be very hard. The expansion of Narita Airport had been delayed due to that reason, if I'm not mistaken, and that was just out in Chiba. Maybe tear down Tokyo Disneyland and using that land instead would be doable.

Secret nuclear deal between the U.S. and Japan uncovered
Quote:
In a move that repudiates past government denials, a former prime minister's son disclosed the secret agreement allowing the United States to bring nuclear weapons into Okinawa after its reversion to Japan in 1972.
It does seem, though, that no one outside of two people in the government (back then) knew of the agreement, so no political heads will roll as a result.

Obama plans for new jobs bill and a delay to health care reform
Quote:
The White House privately anticipates health care talks to slip into February — past President Barack Obama’s first State of the Union address — and then plans to make a “very hard pivot” to a new jobs bill, according to senior administration officials.
Given the compromises, esp. in the area of abortion rights, there isn't a great chance that the current reform bill will pass. The home buyer credit should expire soon as well, and if it behaves even remotely like the "Cash for Clunkers" program, home sales will crater after that point. Obama and his administration is still shotgun'ing the various problems out there though; while doable in good or average times, IMHO, it's a terrible idea in bad ones.
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Old 2009-12-23, 22:13   Link #5197
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnieS View Post
Obama plans for new jobs bill and a delay to health care reform
Given the compromises, esp. in the area of abortion rights, there isn't a great chance that the current reform bill will pass. The home buyer credit should expire soon as well, and if it behaves even remotely like the "Cash for Clunkers" program, home sales will crater after that point. Obama and his administration is still shotgun'ing the various problems out there though; while doable in good or average times, IMHO, it's a terrible idea in bad ones.
Its the natural result of being given the controls to the train AFTER its started its derailed descent off the cliff. Just keep pushing the buttons all the way down...
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Old 2009-12-23, 22:26   Link #5198
ZephyrLeanne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClockWorkAngel View Post
We people from Hong Kong don't like to be refereed to as coming from China because of that
I understand what you mean. That's why I have a BNO passport.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnieS View Post
Good grief. No... There are already enough gaijins in the city! But getting the land for building a base in the Tokyo area will be very hard. The expansion of Narita Airport had been delayed due to that reason, if I'm not mistaken, and that was just out in Chiba. Maybe tear down Tokyo Disneyland and using that land instead would be doable.
Ok, so Nagatacho and Kasumigaseki are moving, like http://www.mlit.go.jp/kokudokeikaku/...sh/english.htm

So, why not use that space, or better still, go to where they're moving?
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Old 2009-12-24, 12:27   Link #5199
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShimatheKat View Post
Ok, so Nagatacho and Kasumigaseki are moving, like http://www.mlit.go.jp/kokudokeikaku/...sh/english.htm

So, why not use that space, or better still, go to where they're moving?
TIME TO BUILD GUNDAMS AND VARIABLE FIGHTERS!

It seems that it was just past 12am here. Merry Christmas everyone.
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Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2009-12-25, 04:39   Link #5200
Tiberium Wolf
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Woman knocks down pope at Mass

Security these days... tse tse tse...
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