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Old 2010-02-01, 22:52   Link #6641
Nogitsune
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solstice Cross View Post
Who is Clovis? Oh right! the guy that died RIGHT at the beginning of the series, forgot about him.
Y-you forgot Clovis? Wait, I'm feeling faint...
*takes a deep breath* All right, better.
He was such an awesome older brother! Errr, and to get back on topic, mini!Lelouch must have been quite the little pest to everyone he wanted to annoy. He looks so sweet and harmless on Anya's picture, but we know he and Clovis argued each other to death!
Well, or Lelouch argued Clovis to death in the end if we want to get literal, but that was clearly cheating.

Did I mention I would have liked more information about Lelouch prior to Marianne's death? How many PDs were there again... one? And a Sound Drama in which he is talked about. Not really satisfying.
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Old 2010-02-02, 16:28   Link #6642
Steelsoul
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A couple of pages were talking about how they thought ZR was flawed and how it would never work in real life.

I think that Zero Requiem was more than just giving people a common foe to bond over, it also to give people experience of what true tyrancy is and what it is to be governed by a single person, having everyone's future in the hands of one individual.

If that was indeed what he wanted, he could've just let his father go through with his plan and install Ragnarok, having the same results as his plans, which was people to have a better awareness of everyone around them and the concequences of their actions.

This is something that Lelouch learned in all the happened, is that people's free will matters, not just what one individual thinks it's right.

I find it hilarious that his father thought people were not born equal, but he effectively wanted to merge the entire human race into one individual, making the sense of individual completely redundant.
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Old 2010-02-03, 12:13   Link #6643
Arbitres
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ZR probably wouldn't work in real life.

1) Zero would've been perforated by Knightmare Frame ammunition (They have friends. ALL of them alot faster then Zero.)

2) Lelouch would be in a indestrucible, plastic ball. His clothes (and hat) screamed 'POPE'.

Charlie is a hypocrite, he is darwinistic... BUT he wants to merge all consciousness into a single entity (...Which more or less can be viewed from his point of view as 'Making the perfect being.".)

Just because a person think's they are right, doesn't mean they are. Yes, thats the beauty of free will. It distinguishes, which is what Lelouch may have preferred over his Daddy Biggests'.
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Old 2010-02-03, 14:36   Link #6644
bladeofdarkness
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the whole thing would fail in the real world once people noticed that
1)Lelouch was using zero's personal custom-built knightmare in battle
2)"zero" who used to be in such bad health that he was being protected by a girl, can now run so fast he can dodge bullets and jump over KMFs
3)that the political genius rebel against britannia, is willing to become the new empresses butler (basically)

and most importantly
the plan involves NONE of the people who know Lelouch was zero, would raise ANY opposition to the "new" zero coming along and pretending to be zero (keep in mind, there are more then just the main black knights in on this)
it depends on everyone of them just saying "sure, we were stupid enough to trust a man in a mask once because he saved us, and it backfired spectacularly because he turned out to be a murderous psycho. so lets make the SAME mistake again"
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Old 2010-02-03, 15:30   Link #6645
Charred Knight
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All you need to know about how well Zero Requiem would have worked was to look at what happened after World War II.

Russia took over Eastern Europe, Germany split in two, and America and Russia started mass producing Nuclear missles and aimed them at each other.
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Old 2010-02-03, 17:42   Link #6646
azul120
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Yep. Good times those were.
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Old 2010-02-03, 22:39   Link #6647
Arbitres
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Not fun times. That sprung the idea of Japanese and german stereotypes. Not all germans are 'nazis', nor are japanese 'samurai'.

.... -sigh- Back on topic.

Zero Requiem may have worked considering the effort put into it. But that is quite irrelevant, we're talking about Lelouch, not his machinations. But in a very broad sense, his machinations are apart of him.

broadly speaking of course, his plans weren't perfect, but isolated and direct to his goals, at the end -- His plans benefitted everyone (besides those killed/geassed in the process) thus fitting the bill for character developement.

Too bad he didn't just get off his Royal Emperor Scooter.. platform.. thingy, and just eloped with Kallen. (J/k... well, sort've...)

The elopement wouldn't nearly have been as exciting as the canon ending, and i'm glad it ended as such (hears mob of Lelou/Lulu/Ruru fans approach him with pitchforks and torches.)
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Old 2010-02-04, 01:57   Link #6648
azul120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solstice Cross View Post
Not fun times. That sprung the idea of Japanese and german stereotypes. Not all germans are 'nazis', nor are japanese 'samurai'.
I was putting it facetiously.
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Old 2010-02-04, 03:23   Link #6649
Betteroffer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steelsoul View Post
I find it hilarious that his father thought people were not born equal, but he effectively wanted to merge the entire human race into one individual, making the sense of individual completely redundant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solstice Cross View Post
Charlie is a hypocrite, he is darwinistic... BUT he wants to merge all consciousness into a single entity (...Which more or less can be viewed from his point of view as 'Making the perfect being.".)

Just because a person think's they are right, doesn't mean they are. Yes, thats the beauty of free will. It distinguishes, which is what Lelouch may have preferred over his Daddy Biggests'.
You're misinterpreting Charles' character. The whole idea was that he actually didn't agree with Britannia's methodology hence why he wanted to change it through Ragnarok. Several times in R2 Charles is shown to display dislike for war, and he talks about how Ragnarok will create a gentle world akin to what Euphemia wanted. Why would he do this if he didn't actually WANT a gentle world?

Charles wore the mask of a tyrant in order to stay in power so he could use Britannia's resources to complete Ragnarok. Lelouch himself points this out at one point, stating to Charles that he is "wearing the mask of the Emperor." It is exactly like how Lelouch wore the mask of the Demon King to better the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
the whole thing would fail in the real world once people noticed that
1)Lelouch was using zero's personal custom-built knightmare in battle
The BK reported Shinkirou as stolen when Rolo escaped with it. It could be assumed to be a spy of Lelouch's and it would have given him over a month to practice using it.
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Old 2010-02-04, 04:57   Link #6650
Arbitres
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Oh? I must've been wrong then. Charlie is a unicorn!

....I see, so I was incorrect about him. Thats unfortunate. But I think I get it.

Thank you for the explanation? I prefer to know characters, otherwise their existence is... stale. So quite, thank you.

Anyway, about Lelouch... (single-minded...? maybe.)
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Old 2010-02-04, 17:36   Link #6651
Revolutionist
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Zero Requiem could not work in the real world. Sorry.

With Lelouch gone there would be a huge power vacuum, and with the world's armies either destroyed, or in shambles it would be a free for all, specially within Britannia.


Never mind that the nobles would try to take back their positions, the people themselves would probably not like the fact that Schneizel is still around...you know the guy that blew up the capital and killed a shit ton of his own people, including family.

History has shown that whenever there are drastic regime changes what usually follows is chaos, unrest, repression, insurgencies, etc.

Fall of the Roman Empire - > Dark Ages
Fall of Czarist Russia - > USSR forms, millions of deaths as a result of purges and the Cold War getting hot in Africa and SE Asia.
Fall of Saddam Hussein -> almost a decade of war with no end in sight.

see what I mean?
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Old 2010-02-04, 18:17   Link #6652
azul120
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Indeed.

CG R2 ran on Fridge Logic.
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Old 2010-02-05, 10:45   Link #6653
Nogitsune
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Hum... I wasn't sure whether to bring this up here or in the Q&A thread, but...

I've seen people doubting that Lelouch's birthday is in 1999, as the Japanese fanbase seems to claim it's 2000. So... does anyone have a reliable source that tells us his birthday? I'm currently looking for one, but haven't found anything so far.
One theory even includes that he lied about his age when he came to Ashford (something I find rather unlikely because it was never once mentioned anywhere, but I can't rule it out without proof).

Edit: Maybe anyone knows where that cute little CG timeline comes from? Because that one, at least the translation, clearly states it's 1999.
I'm not completely sure it's official, though.
[But wasn't he ten already when his mother was killed? Does anyone know where that was said? o.o]
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Last edited by Nogitsune; 2010-02-05 at 13:13.
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Old 2010-02-05, 13:26   Link #6654
Arbitres
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Lady Marianne was slain on 2010, meaning he may had been born to 1999-2000

We all know what happens after that, now don't we?

I mean canon, not the "What if Lelouch remained a prince?".... Though I'm trying to work on that, >_>;
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Old 2010-02-05, 13:36   Link #6655
Nogitsune
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solstice Cross View Post
Lady Marianne was slain on 2010, meaning he may had been born to 1999-2000
Mh, but that doesn't answer my question. I think there are official dates - like that Lelouch was ten already during the invasion of Japan, which would mean it's 1999 [but just to be sure, where was it said the invasion was in august? I'm pretty sure it was, but...). Problem is, in episode 5, it's technically Suzaku who says he was ten, and although I'm quite certain he speaks for both of them, I'd like to have some kind of confirmation.

Quote:
We all know what happens after that, now don't we?
*nods*

Quote:
I mean canon, not the "What if Lelouch remained a prince?".... Though I'm trying to work on that, >_>;
If Lelouch had remained a prince, Clovis and Euphie would have stalked him! Well, mostly Clovis, because Euphie was just as fond of Nunnally and could have been distracted...
Errr... anyway, I really need that year of birth. xD
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Old 2010-02-05, 14:01   Link #6656
Arbitres
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Did you try the CG Wiki? Thats where some of my info comes from, considering.

You make it sound like Euphie had the attention span of a fly.. wait, she did.

"Save the japanese!"
"KILL the japanese!"

...Yes, I know.. that was mean, horrible, and uncool...

-ahem- I do recommend CG wiki, however. That, or get on the official site (?? Does that even exist?) and look it up.

Sorry about the Euphie thing, I felt the surge of sadistic sarcasm <_<;
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Old 2010-02-05, 17:08   Link #6657
Nogitsune
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solstice Cross View Post
Did you try the CG Wiki? Thats where some of my info comes from, considering.
Yep, tried that, and it has the timeline, which means 1999. However, it doesn't give a source, so it's not exactly proof. Thanks for the suggestion, though!

Quote:
You make it sound like Euphie had the attention span of a fly..
She didn't?
B-but she had pink hair!

Quote:
wait, she did.
*lets out a breath of relief*

Quote:
...Yes, I know.. that was mean, horrible, and uncool...
*grins* No, it made me smile.
Although I rather like Euphie. ;P

Quote:
That, or get on the official site (?? Does that even exist?)
The ones listed at wikipedia don't have the year of birth. Or at least, I couldn't find it, but that might be because I don't know Japanese.
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Old 2010-02-05, 17:35   Link #6658
Arbitres
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Okay, atleast you tried.

...:P I'm glad you didn't kill me for that comment on Euphie.. >_>;

Pfft.. xD

I'd say wikipedia, but their anime timelines aren't very good... A wiki si your best bet.

Though I think my timeline is more or less accurate. But I can't give a specific month, just a year.
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Old 2010-03-03, 17:15   Link #6659
Cephei Mordred
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It has been suggested that Lelouch has Complex Post Traumatic Stress Disorder bought on by feeling a lack of control.

Problem is, by that standard, who DOESN'T have it to some degree?
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Old 2010-03-03, 17:30   Link #6660
Nogitsune
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cephei Mordred View Post
It has been suggested that Lelouch has Complex Post Traumatic Stress Disorder bought on by feeling a lack of control.

Problem is, by that standard, who DOESN'T have it to some degree?
Hum, actually, that wasn't quite what I said.
I stated that if I had to pick one disorder that sums it all up, it would be that one, as quite a few of the symptoms as well as the cause fit.
Let's see, Wikipedia says...

Quote:

* Difficulties regulating emotions, including symptoms such as persistent sadness, suicidal thoughts, explosive anger, or covert anger

* Variations in consciousness, such as forgetting traumatic events, reliving traumatic events, or having episodes of dissociation (during which one feels detached from one's mental processes or body)

* Changes in self-perception, such as a sense of helplessness, shame, guilt, stigma, and a sense of being completely different from other human beings

* Varied changes in the perception of the perpetrator, such as attributing total power to the perpetrator or becoming preoccupied with the relationship to the perpetrator, including a preoccupation with revenge

* Alterations in relations with others, including isolation, distrust, or a repeated search for a rescuer.

* Loss of, or changes in, one's system of meanings, which may include a loss of sustaining faith or a sense of hopelessness and despair
Lelouch was also sent as a hostage to Japan and rendered completely powerless.

However, I never said that this automatically means Lelouch has this particular disorder, just that he immediately came to mind when I stumbled upon this, and that I find it interesting how much of it fits.
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