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Old 2010-02-06, 00:08   Link #61
Alchemist007
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There's cheaper things for just manga reading.
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Old 2010-02-06, 03:33   Link #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lixuelai View Post
I might buy one to read manga with.
lol, indd cheaper things to read manga with.. let alone Ipad can only open one application at a time.. why would you want such a thing.. so no music watching while you do something, heck it cannot even play movies in its highest quality..
I was shocked when I read that it could only run one application at a time, I read it in a news paper report of the presentation
Having multiple applications running is a must

Also the aspect ratio for movies is bad as well, let alone the darned thing cannot handle playing one that is of suberb quality
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Old 2010-02-06, 18:00   Link #63
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I'm just saying It's a over-expensive, over-sized Ipod Touch. I wouldn't want to be carrying that around.
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Old 2010-02-07, 01:14   Link #64
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Originally Posted by Theowne View Post
Some smartphones also crash. I think people are really overlooking the fact that Jobs wasn't trying to create a tablet or a PC. He was trying to create an "appliance", a reliable media consumption device for the mainstream. A device that your grandmother could pick up and use without thinking, "this is a computer". In this scenario, multitasking isn't necessary, and Apple is able to make the device more reliable and predictable without it. Same goes for flash content.

Don't get me wrong, thats the same reason I would not need or want one. But I, or other PC enthusiasts, am not the market for this new device.
Agreed... but I'm trying to figure who would NOT want to "read mail, have music playing, and a google-search" running at the same time.

Think about it. My grandma is running her iTune app or just running an MP3 tune ... and decides she wants to browse something she just thought of. Or wants to email something that just popped into her head.

The iPad apparently can't do that - that IS the typical scenario for 'appliance people'.

Help me here... in my local survey, NONE of my computer-illiterate friends say they'll buy a device that can't handle more than one thing at a time. At my age, I have a fair number of peers who qualify as compu-challenged.

The -save- here would be if there were a single executable they were developing (like the old Lotus Symphony or a mutated OpenOffice) that handled these things. Haven't heard anything about that though.

I can think of all sorts of *business* uses for an iPad. It'd be like a totally reprogrammable app hand-held device for warehousing, inventory, pharmacy apps, etc. Run the one business app and its good.
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Old 2010-02-07, 19:26   Link #65
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I'm not sure if the iPad can play music while doing other things. The iPhone and iPod Touch can, but those devices don't require an app to do it, while the iPad uses the iTunes App to play music. And since it doesn't allow more than one app to run at a time... the iPad may have far less functionality there than the iPod Touch does.
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Old 2010-02-08, 18:00   Link #66
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If iPad doesn't satisfy you, there is always the Axiotron Modbook, which is essentially is a modified Macbook with a Wacom Tablet Screen put on it. The only problem is that it's alot heavier and it uses a pen, but it's more ideal for taking notes or photoshop.
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Old 2010-02-08, 18:19   Link #67
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Apple stuff is always crap anyway. I really hate Apple.

umm.. Sorry but it's just my opinion.. :[
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Old 2010-02-09, 00:56   Link #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chikorita157 View Post
If iPad doesn't satisfy you, there is always the Axiotron Modbook, which is essentially is a modified Macbook with a Wacom Tablet Screen put on it. The only problem is that it's alot heavier and it uses a pen, but it's more ideal for taking notes or photoshop.
You hit on an important point here that I think a lot of folks are missing. Most of the new tablet ideas coming out since and before the iPad announcement have multitouch capacitive touchscreens without stylus support.

What a lot of my friends who are artists would like to see is something very much like the Modbook, but lighter and with better battery life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
Apple stuff is always crap anyway. I really hate Apple.
Apple isn't crap across the board. They've had far more hits than misses, and the iPod really invigorated the DAP market. The unibody Macbook Pros are incredibly well-built and sturdy; they just feel good, and they took the very smart route of using nvidia 9400M IGP in their 13" models, while most 13" Windows laptops generally use crappy Intel IGPs.

The problem with Apple is much like other stylish brands, they're often more flash than substance. Apple computers doesn't generally give you a very good price-performance ratio. You're paying a significant premium for the weight of the brand rather than the guts of the system.

I'm not terribly fond of Apple's aesthetics myself, but I have to admit their hardware is quite well put together. I personally prefer Sony's hard-edged "Eighties Time Warp" style, or the Thinkpad's no-nonsense, means-business plainness to the Star Trek-esque curves and bare minimalism of Apple designs.
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Old 2010-02-09, 02:33   Link #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
Apple stuff is always crap anyway. I really hate Apple.
That was unhelpful and pointless, possibly just flamebait. I'm not a fan of Apple but actual specifics are preferable in a discussion.
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Old 2010-02-09, 03:23   Link #70
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The iPad isn't amazing and mind-blowing because the iPhone already was. Some UI designers have been frothing at the mouth for years, lost in visions of "appliance devices". It was a pretty stupid idea... until capacitive touch screens on mobile devices made it practical to convert one device that itself wasn't inherently good at multitasking could itself become multiple appliance devices.

The iPhone, for its flaws, changed how people interacted with data. No, they weren't using it in new ways, but they were integrating it into their lives in ways they hadn't. Internet/email/music/GPS maps and routing weren't just something a phone "could do" (with enough fiddling and head-to-desk impact). They just were. The functionality was constantly available in a usable fashion.

And, it turns out, for a lot of people, the iPhone was almost enough to take care of their needs. A bit bigger, and it is enough. Enough to replace a PC for some people, and enough to replace a laptop for a lot of people (nearly the entire netbook market). We're really talking about a revolution in user-interface here.

To the more rabid complainers: The iPhone doesn't do everything you want? That doesn't make it garbage... that makes it targeted at a demographic that is not you. (Seriously, to cast insults because you aren't the target market takes some ego...)

It may multitask the basic tasks that 95% of people need multitasked, but if I'm going to haul anything around the way I do my laptop, it would need to do the things I need a laptop for. I'm not the market for it, either. (Heh, well, I use a laptop for way more than the iPad could do even if it multitasked.) I'm not fond of Apple's strong-lock on the app market or lack of multitasking (among other things...). I understand why they do it, but I disagree with them. That means I'll tell my mom that the iPad is completely awesome... and if I think I need a "tablet device" I'll hold out for an Android driven one.

From my point of view, the iPad rates a "Well, how about that". It's not going to change the face of computing... yet. When it does (and I think it will make a significant impact over time), I'll be on another platform. The big news out of the iPad is twofold:
a) PA Semi is making custom chips for Apple. This was expected from previous reports, but kind of a Big Deal. It rumbles interesting things about the future of the chip manufacturing market.
b) The future of ebooks is now visible. Apple chose epub. Mobi's lost any significant traction it had outside of Amazon. I'm hoping, really hoping, that Apple drags the book market toward freedom from DRM the way he did music. For any complaints about Steve Jobs, I will always respect the gutsy, masterful play he made in forcing the hands of the entire music industry to drop DRM. We were probably saved around a decade of struggle thanks to that... and that's something he personally made happen.
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Old 2010-02-09, 07:06   Link #71
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I just thought of a demographic this could appeal to.
Housewives too dumb to use laptops.

"Oh, what did Billy want me to do? Oh yeah order tickets on fandango!" *manipulates maxiiPad to get online, drops it on floor and breaks it*

Seriously, what in the hell demographic does this pertain to that can't use a laptop as a cheaper and more capable substitute? It's not like it's harder to use.


edit: laughed real hard http://news.yahoo.com/s/infoworld/20...foworld/112608
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Old 2010-02-09, 09:26   Link #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
Apple stuff is always crap anyway. I really hate Apple.
Apple isn't crap across the board. They've had far more hits than misses, and the iPod really invigorated the DAP market. The unibody Macbook Pros are incredibly well-built and sturdy; they just feel good, and they took the very smart route of using nvidia 9400M IGP in their 13" models, while most 13" Windows laptops generally use crappy Intel IGPs.

The problem with Apple is much like other stylish brands, they're often more flash than substance. Apple computers doesn't generally give you a very good price-performance ratio. You're paying a significant premium for the weight of the brand rather than the guts of the system.

I'm not terribly fond of Apple's aesthetics myself, but I have to admit their hardware is quite well put together. I personally prefer Sony's hard-edged "Eighties Time Warp" style, or the Thinkpad's no-nonsense, means-business plainness to the Star Trek-esque curves and bare minimalism of Apple designs.
While I'm not much of an Apple fan (I got a Blackberry and I LOOOOVE my PC notebook) I've got to say that was an awesome response to a pretty generic criticism that could have been easily interpreted as a ploy for flame-bait. There are so many good posters in this forum that it is worth the trip every time. Some cookies are in order!
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Last edited by monir; 2010-02-09 at 11:55. Reason: fixed! ^^
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Old 2010-02-09, 09:53   Link #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monir View Post
While I'm not much of an Apple fan (I got a Blackberry and I LOOOOVE my PC notebook) I've got to say that was an awesome response to a pretty generic criticism that could have been easily interpreted as a ploy for flame-bait. There are so many good posters in this forum that it is worth the trip every time. Some cookies are in order!
Well, not everything is perfect... Although I like Apple products since they are reliable than the Dells and HPs I have in the past and I have less problems, but I don't agree completely with Apple on stuff like Jailbreaking and that sort of stuff nor I worship Apple. I also used other OSes such as Ubuntu and I think Linux is just as good of an OS opposed to Windows, where I have problems . I'm just an Apple user.

Constructive criticism is good since you don't have to like the product, but posting outright flamebait isn't, which is a reason I don't have a particular liking to fanboys. You have to realize that without Apple, stuff like Android, Palm Pre and even Windows 7 won't exist since Apple drives competition, which is a good thing.
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Old 2010-02-09, 11:40   Link #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
Apple stuff is always crap anyway. I really hate Apple.

umm.. Sorry but it's just my opinion.. :[
Apple isn't that bad. Some people hate it because we are so used to Intel and Windows, thus the difficulty in adjusting to the Apple systems.

I have an Ipod and I think it is a good piece of equipment before I bought my PSP. That is just about the only Apple product I own, and the only bone I have to pick is with the customer service in my region : there are only a couple of providers on the entire island.

Buy a Mac and give it a try, you would be surprised by how much more efficient it is for graphic design than normal PCs.
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Old 2010-02-09, 11:52   Link #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monir View Post
While I'm not much of an Apple fan (I got a Blackberry and I LOOOOVE my PC notebook) I've got to say that was an awesome response to a pretty generic criticism that could have been easily interpreted as a ploy for flame-bait. There are so many good posters in this forum that it is worth the trip every time. Some cookies are in order!
Thanks, even though you mixed up the quote tags and have chikorita157's name on my post. ^^;

Quote:
Originally Posted by chikorita157 View Post
Well, not everything is perfect... Although I like Apple products since they are reliable than the Dells and HPs I have in the past and I have less problems, but I don't agree completely with Apple on stuff like Jailbreaking and that sort of stuff nor I worship Apple. I also used other OSes such as Ubuntu and I think Linux is just as good of an OS opposed to Windows, where I have problems . I'm just an Apple user.

Constructive criticism is good since you don't have to like the product, but posting outright flamebait isn't, which is a reason I don't have a particular liking to fanboys. You have to realize that without Apple, stuff like Android, Palm Pre and even Windows 7 won't exist since Apple drives competition, which is a good thing.
I really think Apple needs to break away from their restrictive business model. Seriously Mr. Jobs, give Microsoft a run for their money!

Add third-party x86 system hardware support for OSX. Stop blasting Hackintoshers, but praise them! Get OSX working on all Intel x86-64 platforms... and how about AMD while you're at it?

Raise the price of the OS, since it's no longer tied to Apple hardware (while continuing to sell for bargain-basement prices to those who buy Apple hardware), but be cheaper than Windows 7. And use your awesome marketing muscle to show the world that Windows 7 is largely an Expy of OSX in the first place.

The way Apple's puttering along now, they'll never have much more than 10-15% of the market. Does anyone really think Microsoft would have as much of the OS market if they only allowed Windows to be installed on Dells?

If Apple manages to get a good chunk of the OS market, we might see more games ported to OSX, which would be a great thing for gamers who are fed up with Windows and its various instabilities.
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Old 2010-02-09, 13:37   Link #76
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Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
Thanks, even though you mixed up the quote tags and have chikorita157's name on my post. ^^;



I really think Apple needs to break away from their restrictive business model. Seriously Mr. Jobs, give Microsoft a run for their money!

Add third-party x86 system hardware support for OSX. Stop blasting Hackintoshers, but praise them! Get OSX working on all Intel x86-64 platforms... and how about AMD while you're at it?

Raise the price of the OS, since it's no longer tied to Apple hardware (while continuing to sell for bargain-basement prices to those who buy Apple hardware), but be cheaper than Windows 7. And use your awesome marketing muscle to show the world that Windows 7 is largely an Expy of OSX in the first place.

The way Apple's puttering along now, they'll never have much more than 10-15% of the market. Does anyone really think Microsoft would have as much of the OS market if they only allowed Windows to be installed on Dells?

If Apple manages to get a good chunk of the OS market, we might see more games ported to OSX, which would be a great thing for gamers who are fed up with Windows and its various instabilities.
If you recall in the 1990s when Apple got into the clones market, it hurt them alot since it took away existing Apple customers for cheaper machines that basically used the same hardware, but in the different company. It's mostly a hardware company compared to Microsoft, which is a software company... but they should leave the users who want to install Mac OS X on their unsupported PCs and not take any action towards them, but have the community to support them. It will cost more money to also write and develop drivers and also the experience might not be the same because of the difference in hardware. There is already a Hackintosh community out there to support users who want to install it on their systems (see OSX86 Project and other related sites) and it's already possible if you have compatible hardware and some time.

Linux is a great alternative to Mac OS X for those who aren't willing to spend the time getting it to work since they are both POSIX and Unix like OSes. However, I did managed to get Mac OS X Tiger to work in 2006 on a old Dell Desktop I had, which sparked my interest in switching to Macs.
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Old 2010-02-09, 13:47   Link #77
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I know what you're saying, but things are different now that Apple is using Intel based hardware. When Apple still used PowerPC processors, it was different. There was a stronger reason to lean Apple, because not only did you get a different OS experience, but a wholly different architecture and different type of performance.

I kinda wish Apple would have stuck with the Power architecture, but I know why they left, due to the G5's heat problems and inability to stick it in a laptop.

Basically Apple's holding onto their market share with anti-competitive practices similar to what Microsoft did with Internet Explorer years ago. That's not cool. They're making money because of the legal fuckery they do with OSX being only legally permitted on approved hardware. That basically enables them to price their systems uncompetitively and still sell them. An enviable position for sure, but kind of shady.

In 2010, choosing an Apple computer means choosing OSX. The hardware is virtually identical to a PC these days, and usually Apple charges much, much more for their hardware than other hardware vendors. For the same price as a MBP, I can get a Sony Vaio SR with 40% more power for less money. And Sony is considered an expensive brand, too.

Because of these things, it does not really surprise me Apple can't manage to get much more of the market.
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Old 2010-02-09, 23:55   Link #78
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Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
What a lot of my friends who are artists would like to see is something very much like the Modbook, but lighter and with better battery life.
The battery life is probably decent because Apple's new Macbooks get great battery life. But 5.3 pounds? Weren't there 14 inch PC convertibles (the ones that can switch between tablet and regular PC modes) that weighed that much?
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Old 2010-02-10, 03:37   Link #79
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Originally Posted by Sykez View Post
I'm just saying It's a over-expensive, over-sized Ipod Touch. I wouldn't want to be carrying that around.
There's a high rate of iPod/Phone-related robberies 'round my neck-of-the-wood, so having an iPad wouldn't be such a good idea...

Any self-publishing tools in the SDK?
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Old 2010-02-10, 03:58   Link #80
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There are two major problems with Apple releasing a PC-friendly OSX:

1. They, in all honesty, probably can't afford the driver support. Even with no work to stop hardware from working, there's a lot of incompatible hardware. An Apple certification program could help substantially, but even then, I'm not entirely sure Apple is equipped to handle the support necessary to make this work. And of course there's the issue of the amount of sales they'll lose on their Mac line if they do this.

2. Far more importantly, Apple's not doing bad. Yes, they have a crappy share of the desktop market (which they don't even seem to care much about, especially given that their Mac Pro didn't see a video card update for two years, and that was a x300 series card), and of course they don't have any notebooks under $1000, but for notebooks in their price range, at least in the states, they are slaughtering.

At the moment, it seems that we'll be perpetually in the spot where Microsoft rules over the low end notebook sector and desktops while Apple continues to gain ground in the high end notebook sector.

I still think it wasn't a great idea to release a tablet without the semblance of flash or even a book-friendly screen, but I'm sure it'll do well among the iDevice market, so it's really hard to fault them. Then again, it could easily end up like the AppleTV, where it's a niche device at best. Either way, I plan on going to whoever gets a nice sub-$400 ($399 is fine) tablet with ION or Tegra (or equivalent chipset). PixelQi or Mirasol both look nice (tho I worry about what seems to be a slow refresh rate on the latter), but I'll settle for regular LCD if it's under $250. At $500 for a 10" iPod Touch tho, their pad's just not for me.
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