AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-06-18, 07:21   Link #221
Kanon
Kana Hanazawa ♥
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: France
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quarkboy View Post
One other thought: Does anyone else think it might be more than coincidence that the name "Neko Ramen" and "Lucky Cat Chinese Restaurant" both have to do with cats?
Remember is was the master of the Neko Ramen stand who saved Ozu and Watashi from Honwaka and Aijima mysteriously... I think that the master of Neko Ramen is actually the "big boss" of the Lucky Cat Chinese Restaurant. He knew all about the history of the proxy-proxy war, too...
I was thinking the same thing, I think it's safe to assume he's related to the Lucky Cat Chinese restaurant, though I'm not so sure about him being the big boss. And thanks for posting about the symbols, I was wondering what the other five represented.

Spoiler for episode 9:
__________________
Rize and Kaneki
Kanon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 08:34   Link #222
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Ah yes the "money buys everything" episode. Slightly cliched but entirely real, considering as well the economic developments of the past few years puts into perspective just how money itself isn't limitless but ironically very limiting. Something Watashi learns the hard way by virtue of a well-deserved bitch slap from Akashi. As the Kanon has said, it's a rather shocking episode to see the huge deviation in character Watashi has regressed(?) in the episode.

To me there are still things to be said about Ozu's intentions. Impure methods for pure goals? If the end justifies the means then one would assume it would work for Watashi too but clearly it doesn't, which I guess fuels the jealous rage in Watashi, asking himself why a person of questionable character and questionable goals like Ozu could find love when guys like him can't.

Perhaps nice guys do finish last eh? I guess I should no this more than anyone.

Master Higuchi hits nail on head by pretty much putting Watashi's entire struggle into perspective. Anyone who's been through college knows the rose colored life does not exist and it never will. It's just another Utopian dream that Watashi clings on to, hoping beyond hope that the rose colored life will be that which defines him and finally give him what he so desperately searches for.

And this itself is what separates Watashi from both Ozu and Higuchi. Sure Higuchi may be a super senior with a laid back attitude and late book returns. Sure Ozu may be something of a deviant with questionable motives for clear cut goals. Both of them were directionless in a sense, but in the end however they both did and had something Watashi never realized even in the end:

Ozu and Higuchi enjoyed the ride rather than worry about the end.

This entire time Watashi was so focused and so worried about his clear-cut goal that he pretty much sacrificed every damn thing just to get it, exploring every road and every method on the belief that the end will justify everything he has done. In the process he was always miserable, always pushed around and simply always unhappy. In the end he gets nothing, having pushed aside everything (Akashi!) for a goal that does not exist.

On the other hand Ozu and Higuchi simply lived the present for what it's worth. In the process of enjoying, at times working hard and at times bumming around one can say they both found satisfaction. Higuchi felt contentment to leave and travel the world while Ozu found a girl he was willing to bend the rules for. They both got these, the things they wanted, by simply living life. They got it in the process of living rather than at the end of a journey. A sharp contrast to Watashi.

For me I guess that's something Watashi really needs to realize. Ozu and Higuchi got their substitutes for the rose colored life by simply taking each day at a time rather than spending every waking moment suffering for it like Watashi does.

As the cliche goes, sometimes the only way to find what you want is to not look for it. Watashi spent so much of his life looking for a goal that does not exist that a goal of equal value may have been, or should I say is (Akashi!), already there.

I guess the next episode will be Watashi in NEET mode. Well that would be depressing, then again given the ending it's more or less an expected stage of his despair. I'm sure everyone here who's gone through what he has had their own shut-in stage in life, which means it's all going to be about how he gets out of his rut (Akashi!)
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 08:37   Link #223
physics223
In the Tatami Galaxy ↓
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Episode Nine Analysis and Reflections

I seriously had a horrible day before I watched the episode. I took care of dinner, prepared myself, and watched the episode. I'm extremely glad I did. The episode was one of the best episodes of any anime series I have seen. There is so much pathos and yet so much revelation about the characteristics of its players.

I loved Higuchi's turn as adviser to Watashi: he already got the 'rose-colored life' he was thinking of, and yet he was still not satisfied. Higuchi's reply was scintillating. In my link I tried to explain the philosophy behind Higuchi's reply, because it was just so awesome.

Last edited by physics223; 2010-06-18 at 08:52.
physics223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 08:54   Link #224
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by physics223 View Post
Episode Nine Analysis and Reflections

I seriously had a horrible day before I watched the episode. I took care of dinner, prepared myself, and watched the episode. I'm extremely glad I did. The episode was one of the best episodes of any anime series I have seen. There is so much pathos and yet so much revelation about the characteristics of its players.

I loved Higuchi's turn as adviser to Watashi: he already got the 'rose-colored life' he was thinking of, and yet he was still not satisfied. Higuchi's reply was scintillating. In my link I tried to explain the philosophy behind Higuchi's reply, because it was just so awesome.
Still not as awesome as 3 specific Cross Game episodes but close.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 08:58   Link #225
physics223
In the Tatami Galaxy ↓
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Still not as awesome as 3 specific Cross Game episodes but close.
Without any offense to you, I love Cross Game but it was never as intellectual as Tatami Galaxy. It was smart, affecting, and pathos-invoking, and it was an excellent series, but it was not intellectual. If an episode reminds me of the things I learned in some philosophy classes, it's really good for me.
physics223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 09:07   Link #226
physics223
In the Tatami Galaxy ↓
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
Intellectual series like this are a dime a dozen and personally I prefer for them to stay that way aside from the potential abuse for intellectual douchebaggery. Too many intellectual series leads to neuron fatigue and neuron fatigue leads to me failing out of medical school, but that's off topic.

Anyway I just realized that Akashi's existence in relation to Watashi and what I expect to be the conclusion is eerily similar to a paper I wrote in Ph103. If I find it I might actually post it at the conclusion.
Intellectual series are a dime a dozen ... what? There are more shows about baseball than intellectual series like this. None of them can really compare with Adachi's writing, but to say series like this are a dime a dozen is (no offense) ignorant. Frankly, I hope Despera comes out earlier to tide the onrush of moe shows.

Were you perhaps talking about moe series like K-On and Sora no Woto?
physics223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 09:19   Link #227
Quarkboy
Anime Translator
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Age: 35
Send a message via AIM to Quarkboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by physics223 View Post
Intellectual series are a dime a dozen ... what?
I'm pretty sure he misused the expression and meant to say "intellectual series are pretty rare"

Just for reference "A dime a dozen" means "quite common"... i.e. for only a dime you can buy a dozen of them.

The phrase originates, I believe, from trading cards in the earlier 1900s. The most common ones you could buy for "a dime a dozen."
__________________
Yomiuri Television Enterprise
International Media Strategy Chief
Sam Pinansky
Quarkboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 09:22   Link #228
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Yes I misused the expression sorry.

Anyway my point was, intellectual series are comparatively rare when you consider the rest of a single season's releases.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 09:29   Link #229
physics223
In the Tatami Galaxy ↓
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Ah, that makes me feel better. I was really surprised and agitated with that claim.
physics223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 09:57   Link #230
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
BTW I was wondering how exactly did Akashi know that Watashi was there to steal the human-powered plane?

Also I realized the subs mention Ozu referencing that he and Watashi are tied by a "black thread." Was that really what Ozu said or was that the translator's prerogative at using an appropriate symbolism?
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 10:00   Link #231
Quarkboy
Anime Translator
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Age: 35
Send a message via AIM to Quarkboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
BTW I was wondering how exactly did Akashi know that Watashi was there to steal the human-powered plane?

Also I realized the subs mention Ozu referencing that he and Watashi are tied by a "black thread." Was that really what Ozu said or was that the translator's prerogative at using an appropriate symbolism?
It's what was said. The red-thread of fate vs. the black thread of fate is a deep connecting metaphor in the show. Black represents mutual destruction while red represents love...

Watashi is connected to Akashi by the red and Ozu by the black, at least I think that's the idea.

At the very end of this episode you see Ozu however cutting his black thread to Watashi, escaping from their mutual self-destruction and leaving Watashi all by himself... The red thread had long since been cut when he willfully turned away from Akashi in this episode.
__________________
Yomiuri Television Enterprise
International Media Strategy Chief
Sam Pinansky
Quarkboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 10:20   Link #232
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Well I wouldn't call it severing their ties to mutual destruction considering the eventual fate of the airship but I see what you mean.

This of course begs the question regarding Akashi: while the blame for severing their red string of fate is essentially solely on Watashi's shoulders, can it be said that by slapping the jeebus out of him, Akashi also acknowledges cutting ties with Watashi on her end?

Good God I hope not.

Considering that we've all agreed long before in this thread that the ties that bind them are a strong theme in the series, these ties is something almost consistent in every episode despite variations. Previous episodes have already suggested how Ozu seems to be slowly becoming less and less a defining factor in Watashi's life's direction, and in this episode alongside the severing of ties practically all the shit that hit the fan was his fault.

This makes me wonder if perhaps going into the conclusion, the ties that once bound Watashi to Ozu will likewise be consistently be severed, such that Ozu is now a bit player in Watashi's story?

If such is possible, that a severed thread will likewise be consistently severed from now on, it puts Watashi's relationship with Akashi is probable state of jeopardy. Holy shit.

God this is a depressing thought. I have no idea how I managed to reach to reach such a idea. I need a beer.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 10:51   Link #233
SageGaiGar
You are Next
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: NE USA
Well guess we'll be getting Hikikomori Watashi in the next episode. Hopefully he'll get his damn act together in the next couple episodes. The denouncement of the 'rose-colored life' was simply awesome, Ch'aan - tastic.
__________________
sig courtesy of Haak and Natsuki Hyuga
Friends don't let friends CB
SageGaiGar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-18, 22:16   Link #234
physics223
In the Tatami Galaxy ↓
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
I'll just say that I'm grateful for Quarkboy for being a 'close viewer' of the series he translates. He proposes a wonderful interpretation of the series's timeline that differs a little from my interpretation: I think that the previous arc is divergent from the main timeline, but he thinks everything is interconnected. I personally think that his is a more comprehensive timeline (his analyses of the episodes is impressive!) but I also have some questions (nothing altogether major) as regards the timeline he proposes that I think can be better answered with my interpretation.

Here is the analysis: I say it was comprehensive, because what Quarkboy wrote really was. It tied everything together.
physics223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-19, 12:15   Link #235
Raiza Sunozaki
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
I was really impressed by this episode. Last episode gave us a definite confirmation of Watashi's determination, but as it is in the Tatami Galaxy, the episode that follows another is as much a contradiction of the previous as it is a continuation. I found this was stressed more so in this episode, as Watashi's determination definitely carries on, but his determination is misled by temptation and corruption that he ends up backtracking farther than he got in three episodes of advancing.
Throughout the three women arc, he slowly and steadily was given increasingly obvious hints that his happiness, if not his beloved rose-coloured life, was always there in front of him, waiting for him to grasp it. As several people have said before, for Watashi, happiness does not lie in his goal, his "rose-coloured campus life." In fact, there is never any happiness to be found at the end of a trek. That is satisfaction. Happiness is found along the way, something that must be looked for, not received. And if you have been successful in looking for happiness, once you reach your satisfaction, happiness will be there for you, but not because you finished.
As physics has mentioned, Higuchi's line on the rose-coloured campus life (or the lack of it) was brilliant and shows the man's carefree ingenuity. But I found the scene showed more of Watashi's inability to accept reality over his rose-coloured reality. While he was abducted shortly after, it felt like he was only along for the ride, not doing anything, not trying to do anything, just watching. He couldn't accept that this was reality, so he rejected it and did nothing.
And in the end, he shut himself away in his own tatami galaxy.

On a side note, I'm hoping this series will have a happy end, but looking at Watashi's cowardly and incompetent personality, I'm starting to have my doubts.
Raiza Sunozaki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-19, 22:51   Link #236
Theowne
耳をすませば
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Toronto, Canada
Age: 25
Send a message via Skype™ to Theowne
Tatami Galaxy truly just keeps getting better and better. I echo all the sentiments about the speeches and monologue towards the end. And I also really loved how they tied the 3-women arc back to Akashi. I hope so much that the ending will be as wonderful as it deserves to be....my anticipation and expectation is high. I think we have a new benchmark for underappreciated gems...

Also lets leave the comparisons away....Cross Game and Tatami Galaxy are both great series for different reasons....
__________________

My Site - Reviews collection, Sheet music, and etc.
Anime reviews/blog, piano arrangements, Studio Ghibli..
Theowne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-19, 23:11   Link #237
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiza Sunozaki View Post
I was really impressed by this episode. Last episode gave us a definite confirmation of Watashi's determination, but as it is in the Tatami Galaxy, the episode that follows another is as much a contradiction of the previous as it is a continuation. I found this was stressed more so in this episode, as Watashi's determination definitely carries on, but his determination is misled by temptation and corruption that he ends up backtracking farther than he got in three episodes of advancing.
Throughout the three women arc, he slowly and steadily was given increasingly obvious hints that his happiness, if not his beloved rose-coloured life, was always there in front of him, waiting for him to grasp it. As several people have said before, for Watashi, happiness does not lie in his goal, his "rose-coloured campus life." In fact, there is never any happiness to be found at the end of a trek. That is satisfaction. Happiness is found along the way, something that must be looked for, not received. And if you have been successful in looking for happiness, once you reach your satisfaction, happiness will be there for you, but not because you finished.
As physics has mentioned, Higuchi's line on the rose-coloured campus life (or the lack of it) was brilliant and shows the man's carefree ingenuity. But I found the scene showed more of Watashi's inability to accept reality over his rose-coloured reality. While he was abducted shortly after, it felt like he was only along for the ride, not doing anything, not trying to do anything, just watching. He couldn't accept that this was reality, so he rejected it and did nothing.
And in the end, he shut himself away in his own tatami galaxy.

On a side note, I'm hoping this series will have a happy end, but looking at Watashi's cowardly and incompetent personality, I'm starting to have my doubts.
I really doubt that cowardice and incompetence is really his core personality. If his actions have shown anything, often skewed and misdirected as they are, it's that when it comes down to a getting his rose-colored utopia he will do what it takes and not back down even if he has to resort to devious ends. If he really was an incompetent coward then he would have fucked up his life at the start and wallowed into despair for the rest of every episode. It's really only in episode 9 that his despair at his condition really manifested into something concrete that all of us can see.

In fact the very nature of his passionate drive to achieve a non-existent dream shows that he is very fully capable of achieving what he wants in life, it just so happens that his goal is unattainable. If he finally accepts the reality of the rose-colored life, abandon it for something more realistic and attainable, then I think he is fully capable of getting it.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-19, 23:17   Link #238
Quarkboy
Anime Translator
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Age: 35
Send a message via AIM to Quarkboy
I'm not sure this is the moral of the story, but as far as I'm concerned I'd rather live a life that was all kinds of colors mixed up than one that was monochromatic pink
__________________
Yomiuri Television Enterprise
International Media Strategy Chief
Sam Pinansky
Quarkboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-20, 00:41   Link #239
WanderingKnight
Gregory House
*IT Support
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Age: 25
Send a message via MSN to WanderingKnight
Quote:
I'm not sure this is the moral of the story, but as far as I'm concerned I'd rather live a life that was all kinds of colors mixed up than one that was monochromatic pink
Plus you might get accused of being gay! I'd rather it be manly blue (jk)

This was an excellent episode. Watashi had finally given up on finding his utopian happiness (and thus, as the show tries to tell us, on life itself -- since as someone said earlier next episode will probably be a hikikomori phase) and decided to be like Ozu instead of distancing from him--or at least, his own image of Ozu. When he realizes Ozu is not really who he thought he was, the whole point of his existence is destroyed.

Quote:
To me there are still things to be said about Ozu's intentions. Impure methods for pure goals?
It was more like Watashi was following his own image of Ozu as someone with no true purpose in life, which is pretty much the way he was depicted in the whole series up until this episode. Ozu's intentions, whether "pure" or "good" or whatever, don't matter, as long as he has a purpose -- which is what Watashi has given up on in this episode. However, this idea of purpose differs from goal, at least in the way Watashi understood it in the earlier episodes.

Quote:
This of course begs the question regarding Akashi: while the blame for severing their red string of fate is essentially solely on Watashi's shoulders, can it be said that by slapping the jeebus out of him, Akashi also acknowledges cutting ties with Watashi on her end?
It was pretty much Watashi who cut the ties, what with his giving up on love and his earlier ideal of "rose-colored campus life".
__________________


Place them in a box until a quieter time | Lights down, you up and die.
WanderingKnight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-06-20, 01:30   Link #240
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingKnight View Post
Plus you might get accused of being gay! I'd rather it be manly blue (jk)

This was an excellent episode. Watashi had finally given up on finding his utopian happiness (and thus, as the show tries to tell us, on life itself -- since as someone said earlier next episode will probably be a hikikomori phase) and decided to be like Ozu instead of distancing from him--or at least, his own image of Ozu. When he realizes Ozu is not really who he thought he was, the whole point of his existence is destroyed.



It was more like Watashi was following his own image of Ozu as someone with no true purpose in life, which is pretty much the way he was depicted in the whole series up until this episode. Ozu's intentions, whether "pure" or "good" or whatever, don't matter, as long as he has a purpose -- which is what Watashi has given up on in this episode. However, this idea of purpose differs from goal, at least in the way Watashi understood it in the earlier episodes.



It was pretty much Watashi who cut the ties, what with his giving up on love and his earlier ideal of "rose-colored campus life".
Yeah but in a way, while by himself becoming the douchebag he so passionately hated, Akashi likewise was so disgusted with Watashi's actions that it gives the impression that she herself wants nothing more to do with him. What concerns me is that while Watashi has no one but himself to blame, it might have gone so bad that Akashi herself might want to keep this thread permanently severed, and thus Watashi only succeeded in completely alienating himself from her.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
funimation, noitamina

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 22:06.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.