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Old 2010-06-27, 16:01   Link #11841
Judoh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Can't, unless he is capable of sending it about a year back in time. That's the whole problem with Natsuhi's extra baby really -- timing issues.
There is nothing saying Battler wasn't born 19 years ago either you know. That's why the person himself can make a theory saying that he was that person. As long he's born on the same day anyway the year doesn't really matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by delita-umw- View Post
Question though, have we ever found out who is older between Jessica and Battler? I just checked a umineko wiki and it says Battler is a year older, but I don't trust it and from my vague novel knowledge I know they're roughly the same age but if Battler is older then I can think of one way timing issues wouldn't be so bad. What if: we can trust Natsuhi's narrative but only to a certain extent. For example, she really did receive a child from Rudolph but not in the timing that she describes. Furthermore the real reason she killed the child was because she found out she was pregnant with Jessica. Other Battler problem solved?
They changed the age on the wiki to fit with the theory that Battler is the 19 year old master of the island. He's stated to be the same age as Jessica though.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:02   Link #11842
Oliver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delita-umw- View Post
Question though, have we ever found out who is older between Jessica and Battler?
No, we didn't. It is possible that Battler is older, it is just as possible that he is a bit younger.

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Originally Posted by delita-umw- View Post
What if: we can trust Natsuhi's narrative but only to a certain extent. For example, she really did receive a child from Rudolph but not in the timing that she describes. Furthermore the real reason she killed the child was because she found out she was pregnant with Jessica. Other Battler problem solved?
Battler and Jessica are both 18 years old. The baby is supposedly from "19" years ago. So is Rosa's story about Beatrice-2. For Natsuhi's baby to be completely factual and the Other Battler to be that baby, Our Battler has to be almost a year older than his stated age, because of all people, his birthday is precisely known. It is sort of possible for Natsuhi to become pregnant with Jessica at the time.

It all looks similar but still doesn't correctly fit together.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:05   Link #11843
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Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
There is nothing saying Battler wasn't born 19 years ago either you know. That's why the person himself can make a theory saying that he was that person. As long he's born on the same day anyway the year doesn't really matter.
There is a statement that Battler is 18 years old that he does not correct or contradict, if my memory serves me right.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:12   Link #11844
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Wait, we know exactly when Battler's birthday is?
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:14   Link #11845
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Originally Posted by delita-umw- View Post
Wait, we know exactly when Battler's birthday is?
He's the only one who's birthday is ever given exactly. 15th of July. See 07151129 and related discussion in the text.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:17   Link #11846
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Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
They changed the age on the wiki to fit with the theory that Battler is the 19 year old master of the island. He's stated to be the same age as Jessica though.
I changed it back. It is absolutely not a fact that Battler is 19 years old. In fact there's a big chance that Kanon and Shannon were talking about Beatrice and not Battler.

Until we have a clear confirmation, Battler's age in the wiki must remain 18
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:18   Link #11847
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Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
There is a statement that Battler is 18 years old that he does not correct or contradict, if my memory serves me right.
Piece Battler can say he's 18 and not know he's really 19 as long as he's not told otherwise. Just like he can say 'Rosa keeps her promises' when she really doesn't.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:21   Link #11848
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That'd work if there was noone else in the family. For what reason would Rosa or any other Ushiromiya acknowledge that somehow Battler is 18 when he was born a year before?
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:23   Link #11849
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Yeah, Jessica and Battler were born under the "same unlucky star." So Battler's age should be 18, but the popular opinion is that he's the counterpart to Natsuhi's adopted baby, who is 19.

The child that Natsuhi had may not even be the second Battler, if he or she does indeed live.

Do note that Natsuhi's story about the adopted child is very odd in many ways. It contradicts Rosa's account(and while Rosa may not be the most trustworthy of all people, Beato made it a point to show Battler Rosa's account), in addition to have been perhaps tempered by grief.


Although, I propose the following: Simply put, if the child that Natsuhi adopted is anyone of importance, it would be Piece Beatrice. After all, the master of the island is stated to be 19.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:24   Link #11850
Oliver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
Piece Battler can say he's 18 and not know he's really 19 as long as he's not told otherwise. Just like he can say 'Rosa keeps her promises' when she really doesn't.
Well, he can, but then Jessica is a year younger and can't be the Other Battler, unless her age is fake too.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:26   Link #11851
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Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Well, he can, but then Jessica is a year younger and can't be the Other Battler, unless her age is fake too.
We also have theories that Kanon is 19 which would make Jessica 21. So that's kind of trivial anyway. We can add on more or less on different people depending on how you go about making the theories.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:29   Link #11852
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What is this, Final Fantasy 8? I don't quite think Battler and Jessica would be in the dark about one year of their lives, let alone 4!

Kanon, Shannon, now their age can be dubious because of their wacky nature as furniture, which is zany. But I think we can be sure on Battler and Jessica's age. I at least hope we can be sure on that...
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:29   Link #11853
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Apparently in addition to closets, Ushiromiyas have a genetic predisposition to never look at birth certificates or the family register.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:29   Link #11854
Oliver
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Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
We also have theories that Kanon is 19 which would make Jessica 21.
21, in high school?... That would inevitably get noticed.
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:45   Link #11855
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Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
I changed it back. It is absolutely not a fact that Battler is 19 years old. In fact there's a big chance that Kanon and Shannon were talking about Beatrice and not Battler.

Until we have a clear confirmation, Battler's age in the wiki must remain 18
It still says 19 for me. Are you sure you changed it? I wanted to do that too for the same reason, but I can't figure out how to edit that part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
21, in high school?... That would inevitably get noticed.
You never know she could be NEET.

It's not a popular theory anyway. I thought you said you could see her being a little older though because of some issues with George's age in your timeline or something?
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Old 2010-06-27, 16:54   Link #11856
Oliver
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Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
It's not a popular theory anyway. I thought you said you could see her being a little older though because of some issues with George's age in your timeline or something?
Sort of. I forgot why exactly I wrote that, though.

Mind you, Natsuhi's story, if my memory serves me right (meh, Umineko is starting to exceed my cache size) says that she got pregnant with Jessica after the baby incident pretty clearly.
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Old 2010-06-27, 17:01   Link #11857
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Battler is secretly a transexual, and is therefore Asumu's daughter!

Oh, wait.
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Old 2010-06-27, 17:04   Link #11858
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Well now we've moved from And Then There Were None to Rocky Horror Picture Show.

Funny thing, the phone didn't work there either...
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Old 2010-06-27, 17:06   Link #11859
Oliver
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Originally Posted by Renall View Post
Well now we've moved from And Then There Were None to Rocky Horror Picture Show.

Funny thing, the phone didn't work there either...
I think we've been there all the way since Nanjotrice and Nanjo-Gaap were proposed.
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Old 2010-06-27, 17:08   Link #11860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
It still says 19 for me. Are you sure you changed it? I wanted to do that too for the same reason, but I can't figure out how to edit that part.
Really? It works okay for me... try looking at the history you should see that I did some changes...

I'm actually doing a lot of clean up since I'm at it... it's incredible how many no-lifers find amusing to insert their pet theories into a wiki article. Luckily most of those are removed by other people.

I came across with some dubious statements... like this one:

Quote:
Voyagers are said to become Creators at the ends of their journeys, which they fear for unknown reasons.
I have absolutely no knowledge of this... does it come from some extra TIP?
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