AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Current Series > Fate/ Series

Notices

View Poll Results: Your favorite character tied with discussion
Tohsaka Rin 104 24.47%
Matou Sakura 20 4.71%
Emiya Shirou 18 4.24%
Ilyasviel "Ilya" von Einzbern 36 8.47%
Saber 153 36.00%
Rider 23 5.41%
Lancer 4 0.94%
Archer 53 12.47%
Caster 11 2.59%
Berserker 3 0.71%
Voters: 425. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-07-19, 22:11   Link #341
Arbitres
Disabled By Request
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Quote:
What? When the hell was Ilya ever badass? Sakura was far more badass than Ilya, albeit only in her dark form....
Is she could control Berserker, she was badass.

Quote:
I can never get how people can say "oh, they made Sakura too sympathetic". It's just plain ridiculous to say that. Also, Sakura never did bad things, Zouken did. Sakura was just the 'tool' he used to do them.
She never did bad things, no. I don't think Keroko ever said that, actually. What of Sakura's character isn't sad? Even her love for Shirou can be pretty depressing.
Arbitres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-19, 22:30   Link #342
Cherry_Lover
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arbitres View Post
Is she could control Berserker, she was badass.
No, that just makes her a very good magus. Rin or Sakura could control him just as well.

Quote:
She never did bad things, no. I don't think Keroko ever said that, actually.
He said "Ilya and Sakura both did bad things".

Quote:
What of Sakura's character isn't sad? Even her love for Shirou can be pretty depressing.
Her love for him isn't, but how much she depends on him (entirely reasonably, really, given her situation) can be, particularly when you consider that, in four out of the five endings, she doesn't get him.
Cherry_Lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 01:39   Link #343
Flinch
Onii-chan~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Einzbern Castle
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Flinch Send a message via MSN to Flinch Send a message via Skype™ to Flinch
To control a Beserker is one thing, to control them completely while they are insane is another. Take Kariya for instance, a poor magus, on scale with... hmmm, lets say Sakura (who wasn't a skilled magus in comparison to all the others who fought; Shiro would compare with Uuryu), and he couldn't control Beserker at all when he was insane. Heracles had a higher level of Mad Enhancement, making him even more difficult to control as a Beserker; Sakura would've faulted instantly, and I doubt anyone BUT an Einsbern could've controlled such a Beserker whilst insane.

Additionally, I would've preferred the Ilya path
Oh look, Saber, Rin, and Sakura are all dead... time for Shiro to mentally break down.
__________________
Flinch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 03:47   Link #344
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
What? When the hell was Ilya ever badass?
Every single time she controlled berserker? Seeing that tiny loli with that huge monster behind her calmly going 'kill them all.' oh yes, that was badass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Sakura was far more badass than Ilya, albeit only in her dark form....
Hence why dark Sakura was awesome, regular Sakura wasn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Oh, so because Sakura had such a bad life, you don't like her? Anyway, that still doesn't justify blaming Sakura for deaths she had no responsibility for whilst not blaming Ilya for the people she killed intentionally.

I can never get how people can say "oh, they made Sakura too sympathetic". It's just plain ridiculous to say that. Also, Sakura never did bad things, Zouken did. Sakura was just the 'tool' he used to do them.
It's hardly ridiculous, it's simply overdoing things. When you try to hard you can actually miss the purpose you are trying to achieve. Random examples from the top of my head: Jar Jar from Star Wars was intended to be a comedic character, but they tried so hard he stopped being funny. Louise from Zero no Tsukaima is supposed to be the funny tsundere, but they tried so hard the tsundere shtick became more annoying than amusing. Shinji from Evangelion was supposed to be a character you sympathize with (sort of like Sakura) but they tried so hard many people were shouting "Get a spine you wimp!" instead.

With Sakura this is exactly what happened. They tried too hard. I'm not a stone-hearted person, in fact it's quite easy to get me feel for characters and to have me cry for them. I cried at the end of Utawarerumono, I cried several times during Clannad, I cried during One Piece (over a friggin ship no less) but there comes a point where you can simply be trying too hard to get me to pity a character.

Sakura was one of these. "Here's a poor girl, she's being mistreated by her brother. Sad, huh? But that's not all! She's also being controlled by a worm implanted by her grandfather! Oh, and that worm makes her a crazed sex-slave too! What, still not enough? Okay then, she was raped for most of her life! By worms! Oh, and she's Rin's sister, taken away from her when she was very young, are you having pity for her yet? Oh, and that brother we mentioned? He rapes her too! Are you pitying her yet? Well here's some more! All she really wants is to be loved by the guy she admired when she was young! And she can't! And now the one she loves is trying to save her, while she doesn't want him to risk his life! No pity yet? In that case, she was also manipulated by Zouken to unconsciously kill people! And she feels really, really bad about it! Are you pitying her her yet? Are you? Do I have to spell it out for you? SAD CHARACTER! THIS IS A SAD CHARACTER! PITY HER!"

And that's all I can remember. I'm sure I even missed a few things I've forgotten since. This is what we'd call 'forced drama.' Yeah, Sakura has lead the most sucky life out of the entire cast, so statistically speaking we should feel sorry for her. But you know what? They tried too hard. Beating me to death with reasons to pity someone works counterproductive for me. For me, if you make your drama more subtle, I find it coming across much stronger.

That's why I don't like Sakura that much. Her entire route was tossing more and more 'pity poor Sakura' cards on the pile. Sakura was a character created purely to feel sorry for, and like most characters of her kind, she missed the point by trying too hard.
__________________

Last edited by Keroko; 2010-07-20 at 06:08.
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 04:15   Link #345
Flinch
Onii-chan~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Einzbern Castle
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Flinch Send a message via MSN to Flinch Send a message via Skype™ to Flinch
Keroko, you have put into words what I could not. For that, I salute you, and you get a cookie.
__________________
Flinch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 11:48   Link #346
Cherry_Lover
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Every single time she controlled berserker? Seeing that tiny loli with that huge monster behind her calmly going 'kill them all.' oh yes, that was badass.
It's easy to be 'badass' when you have a big gun. And, she didn't seem quite so 'badass' when she was looking up at Shirou in despair once Berserker was gone, did she....

Quote:
With Sakura this is exactly what happened. They tried too hard. I'm not a stone-hearted person, in fact it's quite easy to get me feel for characters and to have me cry for them. I cried at the end of Utawarerumono, I cried several times during Clannad, I cried during One Piece (over a friggin ship no less) but there comes a point where you can simply be trying too hard to get me to pity a character.
Well, that may be your opinion, but it certainly didn't come across that way to me. And the way you're talking about Sakura certainly makes you seem stone-hearted from my viewpoint, even if you don't agree. Perhaps it's because you find it easier to pity a character that when one comes along who is deserving of true pity your mind can't cope with it. Sakura's situation is indeed extreme (beyond anything that could happen in real life), so I suppose it's possible that your mind just couldn't copy with how awful it is and failed to sympathise with her as a result.

Quote:
And that's all I can remember. I'm sure I even missed a few things I've forgotten since. This is what we'd call 'forced drama.' Yeah, Sakura has lead the most sucky life out of the entire cast, so statistically speaking we should feel sorry for her. But you know what? They tried too hard. Beating me to death with reasons to pity someone works counterproductive for me. For me, if you make your drama more subtle, I find it coming across much stronger.
Well, I guess you're different to me, then. I don't have some point where I go "oh, well, her suffering is too much now, so I don't care about her any more". And she's not just there to be pitied, although caring about her is undoubtedly necessary for the route to work.

But this whole attitude still astounds me. That you can not like a character because her life sucked too much, even though that's not her fault. You've certainly not made me any fonder of Ilya, in any case. Just because her suffering isn't outlined explicitly on screen, that doesn't make her a 'better' or 'more rounded' character.

Quote:
That's why I don't like Sakura that much. Her entire route was tossing more and more 'pity poor Sakura' cards on the pile. Sakura was a character created purely to feel sorry for, and like most characters of her kind, she missed the point by trying too hard.
Rubbish. Whilst you're undeniably supposed to pity Sakura, you're also supposed to respect her for her strength. She isn't created solely to be felt sorry for, she has a role in the story and her own personality that makes her endearing and makes you want to care for her.
Cherry_Lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 12:28   Link #347
Flinch
Onii-chan~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Einzbern Castle
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Flinch Send a message via MSN to Flinch Send a message via Skype™ to Flinch
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
It's easy to be 'badass' when you have a big gun. And, she didn't seem quite so 'badass' when she was looking up at Shirou in despair once Berserker was gone, did she...
Ilya loved Berserker because for the past few months, he was always there for her and would do anything to protect her. Even without his sanity, the one thing he wanted to do was protect her, because she reminded him of his first family. They became dependent on each other, and the bigger person gets killed. Now how do you act? Everything you've wanted for the past ten years was within your grasp, and you lost it, you lost someone who would always protect you, and now, your life is in the hands of the person you hate more than anyone. How could an 18 year old girl NOT break down.
__________________
Flinch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 13:21   Link #348
Cherry_Lover
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Age: 30
You know, when you're trying to argue against a Sakura fan, pulling the "but she's sympathetic" card isn't going to work, because Sakura had it ten times worse, and yet is still remarkably strong.
Cherry_Lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 13:48   Link #349
GDB
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, that may be your opinion, but it certainly didn't come across that way to me. And the way you're talking about Sakura certainly makes you seem stone-hearted from my viewpoint, even if you don't agree. Perhaps it's because you find it easier to pity a character that when one comes along who is deserving of true pity your mind can't cope with it. Sakura's situation is indeed extreme (beyond anything that could happen in real life), so I suppose it's possible that your mind just couldn't copy with how awful it is and failed to sympathise with her as a result.
Just because someone doesn't agree with your opinion about a character is no reason to get all holier than thou on them.

Quote:
Rubbish. Whilst you're undeniably supposed to pity Sakura, you're also supposed to respect her for her strength. She isn't created solely to be felt sorry for, she has a role in the story and her own personality that makes her endearing and makes you want to care for her.
You, perhaps, but not everyone feels the same way. That's why there's things like popularity polls, because people feel differently about the same characters.
GDB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 16:29   Link #350
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
It's easy to be 'badass' when you have a big gun. And, she didn't seem quite so 'badass' when she was looking up at Shirou in despair once Berserker was gone, did she....
Nope, but she was damn badass when she was. Hell, she has several of the best 'kill Shirou' moments to boot. And even without berserker she could at least act as a tiny little overlord to the rest of the group.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, that may be your opinion, but it certainly didn't come across that way to me. And the way you're talking about Sakura certainly makes you seem stone-hearted from my viewpoint, even if you don't agree. Perhaps it's because you find it easier to pity a character that when one comes along who is deserving of true pity your mind can't cope with it. Sakura's situation is indeed extreme (beyond anything that could happen in real life), so I suppose it's possible that your mind just couldn't copy with how awful it is and failed to sympathise with her as a result.
Oh, my mind can cope. It's just that at the point where it starts beating me around with more reasons to pity a character than you really should put in a plot to begin with that my mind starts wondering if maybe the chocolate paste isn't spread too thick. Bread with chocolate paste is delicious, bread which taste is drowned out by the chocolate paste not so much, and messy to eat to boot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, I guess you're different to me, then. I don't have some point where I go "oh, well, her suffering is too much now, so I don't care about her any more". And she's not just there to be pitied, although caring about her is undoubtedly necessary for the route to work.
Really? I must have missed that somewhere along the unending torrent of dialog that constantly talks about what a poor girl Sakura is. Hell, even when she turns evil she's still being painted as someone we should pity and rescue. I haven't seen a single moment in her route where I wasn't supposed to be pitying Sakura. Granted, dark Sakura was a constant stream of awesome that started way too late and ended way too soon, but then that wasn't really Sakura, but Angra Manyu manipulating her so she doesn't get any points for that.

I don't dislike Sakura because 'her life sucked too much' I don't like Sakura because the game keeps beating me on the head with the 'bag-o-suffering' every other paragraph. Like I said, it's a case of trying too hard. Bad writing. Yeah, sure, from an outside perspective if you compared Sakura's life to Ilya's and asked someone who they pitied the most, they'd say Sakura, no doubt. But then when you play the game you get those reasons stuffed down your throat again and again and again to the point where you're going "Allright! I get it! I have to pity this girl! Can we please get on with the story now?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Rubbish. Whilst you're undeniably supposed to pity Sakura, you're also supposed to respect her for her strength. She isn't created solely to be felt sorry for, she has a role in the story and her own personality that makes her endearing and makes you want to care for her.
What strengths? The ones that were vaguely alluded to and I had to carefully pry in between the times she was either sickly, crying or batshit crazy? See, that's another problem with Sakura, I'm supposed to respect her for her strengths, but I have no clue what those strengths are. The game never makes that clear, it just focuses on what a poor frail girl Sakura is and how much you need to rescue her. Which makes sense when you think about it since her entire story is a damsel in distress story, and you can't really have the damsel take care of the problems herself, but then that's the very part about Sakura I don't like.
__________________

Last edited by Keroko; 2010-07-20 at 17:03.
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 16:36   Link #351
Flinch
Onii-chan~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Einzbern Castle
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Flinch Send a message via MSN to Flinch Send a message via Skype™ to Flinch
Other tid-bit on Ilya, she was the greatest magus in the 5th Heaven's Feel in terms of capabilities, not to mention a nearly inexhaustible mana supply.

Keroko, I now need to get you a box of cookies.
__________________
Flinch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 17:22   Link #352
Cherry_Lover
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Oh, my mind can cope. It's just that at the point where it starts beating me around with more reasons to pity a character than you really should put in a plot to begin with that my mind starts wondering if maybe the chocolate paste isn't spread too thick. Bread with chocolate paste is delicious, bread which taste is drowned out by the chocolate paste not so much, and messy to eat to boot.
Well, I never saw it that way at all. But I'm clearly not going to convince you, and you're clearly going to keep hating Sakura regardless, so this is pointless.

Quote:
I don't dislike Sakura because 'her life sucked too much' I don't like Sakura because the game keeps beating me on the head with the 'bag-o-suffering' every other paragraph. Like I said, it's a case of trying too hard. Bad writing. Yeah, sure, from an outside perspective if you compared Sakura's life to Ilya's and asked someone who they pitied the most, they'd say Sakura, no doubt. But then when you play the game you get those reasons stuffed down your throat again and again and again to the point where you're going "Allright! I get it! I have to pity this girl! Can we please get on with the story now?"
Well, it worked perfectly fine to me. Maybe because I wasn't so focussed on seeing how annoyed I could make myself at the fact that Sakura's suffering was 'shoved down my throat' that I missed everything else in the route....

Quote:
What strengths? The ones that were vaguely alluded to and I had to carefully pry in between the times she was either sickly, crying or batshit crazy? See, that's another problem with Sakura, I'm supposed to respect her for her strengths, but I have no clue what those strengths are. The game never makes that clear, it just focuses on what a poor frail girl Sakura is and how much you need to rescue her.
Well, you obviously missed all the bits where she was desperately struggling to keep her mind as the Grail corrupted her (which, incidentally, is something Ilya also had to do), and all the emotional scenes as she tore herself apart over the fact that her wish to be with Shirou was seemingly in conflict with her wish for him to be happy and safe. And you obviously missed the bits where she stood up for him in order to protect him (like when Rin threatened him). And you also missed the character development she got in the middle of the route, when she was living with Rin and Shirou.

Quote:
Which makes sense when you think about it since her entire story is a damsel in distress story, and you can't really have the damsel take care of the problems herself, but then that's the very part about Sakura I don't like.
Not really. Whilst Sakura is indeed in distress, it's not in any way her fault, and she tries very hard to take care of her own problems. It's just that she can't, because of what Zouken did to her. But, she's more than just a "distressed damsel", she's a very well-written character with a huge amount of mental strength who just happens to be stuck in a situation where she can't do all that much. But she certainly tries to help, and how many distressed damsels end up being the final boss, whose mental strength is extremely important in the last few days to prevent her falling entirely. True, Sakura never directly did anything to save herself, but if it wasn't for her insane mental strength, determination and kindness the route would have gone very differently.
Cherry_Lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 17:45   Link #353
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, I never saw it that way at all. But I'm clearly not going to convince you, and you're clearly going to keep hating Sakura regardless, so this is pointless.
Easy, grasshopper. Stop jumping to conclusions. I never said I hated Sakura (in fact, I distinctly remember saying I don't hate her) I just don't like her as much as I do other characters.

Which, you know, is an opinion. Hence why you saw it differently: because you have a different opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, it worked perfectly fine to me. Maybe because I wasn't so focussed on seeing how annoyed I could make myself at the fact that Sakura's suffering was 'shoved down my throat' that I missed everything else in the route....

Well, you obviously missed all the bits where she was desperately struggling to keep her mind as the Grail corrupted her (which, incidentally, is something Ilya also had to do), and all the emotional scenes as she tore herself apart over the fact that her wish to be with Shirou was seemingly in conflict with her wish for him to be happy and safe.
When I was reading I was hardly 'foccussed on seeing how annoyed I could make myself' I really wish you would stop making those baseless accusations. Anyway, those are just more cards being tossed on the 'pity poor Sakura' pile -some of which I already pointed out earlier- and really weren't working well to counter the whole pity thing for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
And you obviously missed the bits where she stood up for him in order to protect him (like when Rin threatened him). And you also missed the character development she got in the middle of the route, when she was living with Rin and Shirou.
Remind me again when that standing up to Rin part happened? I need to re-read that to jog my memory. It's been a year after all. And the living together wasn't much at all, it quickly regressed to become even more food to pity Sakura. Even the sex scenes were written in such a way that they attempted to invoke pity for Sakura.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Not really. Whilst Sakura is indeed in distress, it's not in any way her fault, and she tries very hard to take care of her own problems. It's just that she can't, because of what Zouken did to her. But, she's more than just a "distressed damsel",
Whatever the damsel in distress is suffering never has to be the damsel's fault. It's not the fault of the princess the dragon captures her, but it certainly makes her a damsel in distress. The fact that you, as the hero, constantly have to rescue Sakura and Sakura herself contributes zero in this makes her a textbook damsel in distress.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
she's a very well-written character with a huge amount of mental strength who just happens to be stuck in a situation where she can't do all that much. But she certainly tries to help, and how many distressed damsels end up being the final boss, whose mental strength is extremely important in the last few days to prevent her falling entirely. True, Sakura never directly did anything to save herself, but if it wasn't for her insane mental strength, determination and kindness the route would have gone very differently.
A fact that is only alluded to by a few random bits of dialog. It's rather ironic, while they keep blowing her weaknesses out of proportion, we never get to see her strengths. Even her mental strength, the greatest strength she has, is only shown when it is constantly failing.

And Sakura isn't the final boss, Angra Manyu manipulating her is. After all, as you have so fervently been pointing out so far, Sakura never did anything bad, she was always being manipulated. What was the final battle is the regular 'damsel in distress needs to be saved from the claws of evil (Angra Manyu) by the hero.'
__________________

Last edited by Keroko; 2010-07-21 at 03:58.
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 18:07   Link #354
Flinch
Onii-chan~
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Einzbern Castle
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Flinch Send a message via MSN to Flinch Send a message via Skype™ to Flinch
Having big boobs does not make you a well-written character, nor does it inherently give you a personality.
__________________
Flinch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-20, 18:14   Link #355
Cherry_Lover
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Age: 30
No, but having big boobs or being sympathetic also doesn't make you a poorly-written character, or one lacking in a personality....

Anyway, we're clearly not going to agree here, because your opinion of Sakura is totally different from mine, so let's just drop it, shall we...?
Cherry_Lover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-21, 03:57   Link #356
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Huh.. how did that happen? Guess something went wrong with that last edit. Ah well, that's why we have delete buttons.

Anyway, I'm quite ready to agree to disagree, that's why I constantly keep saying that all of this was my opinion and that the points I raised were just my reasons for not liking Sakura.
__________________

Last edited by Keroko; 2010-07-21 at 05:33.
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-07-28, 02:35   Link #357
Altima of the Gates
Casting a spell on you...
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Where there are no mallets or tentacles.... and the female cast of Tenjou Tenge is mine, all mine!
Age: 30
Send a message via AIM to Altima of the Gates Send a message via MSN to Altima of the Gates Send a message via Yahoo to Altima of the Gates
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flinch View Post
Having big boobs does not make you a well-written character, nor does it inherently give you a personality.
Now, now. That's uncalled for.

Now Keroko, I think you might be mistaken about Nasu putting it on too thick with Sakura's backstory, you've already said that you dislike Sakura (and before you say anything about that, I'll say it verrrry slowly, you don't hate Sakura, but you don't like her either.), and through that you are unable to empathize(something different than sympathy or pity) with her. Her story is more than just a story of pity, she endured, and endured without hating the world or hating her abuser. That's real strength to me. In this story we have her facing many different things at once that is:

1.) The state of her body
2.) Being possessed by Angra Mainyu
3.) Having her personality altered and twisted as a lesser Grail
4.) Her past, and trying to pick up a bit of what she lost so long ago.
5.) A love she had almost given hope on

And all within the span of less than two weeks.Sure it was a lot to swallow, but this was her story. Saber and Rin both had an allegiance to duty and honor, Ilya had her lonliness and regret. Shirou had his heroism. These themes were all over the VN, and Nasu pointed them out over and over. But I hear too often that people felt like Sakura's story made them pity her. Like it was a chore. But really you can't make someone do anything, they either like the character or they don't, they can either feel for them or they cannot. You see a starving kitten mewing for food, and let's say you feed it. It was you who decided to feed it, it was you who thought about its well being. Its fine if one doesn't like a character, but it doesn't mean that the character did something wrong, you just merely didn't resonate with it. People like Kotomine, however reprehensible he may be, because they found something sympathetic and decided, "hey this guy ain't so bad." Hell, the same is said for Gil and Shinji, even Zouken. Rather paradoxical isn't it?

So I wanted to go over a few things I think about her and comb through the route with a bit of analysis, maybe we all might learn something.

I think that saying Dark Sakura could ever been seen as just strong is wrong. There is no strength there. There is none of the quiet strength that endured there. Sure you can like her for being powerful, but that 'strength' she had was empty. That power perverted who she was, and almost cost her a great deal. It wasn't worth it. But we can be thankful for the regeneration that took care of the mother worm, that was pretty much the only good thing about it.

What quite a good of people fail utterly to realize was that Sakura is in no way a yandere. Nasu very blatantly would show her 'yandere side' and right after that you would see the tell tale signs of shame, regret and frustration at a self emerging that she was disgusted with. She had no information with which to combat it and since AM was eating away at her sanity, along with every Servant absorbed, the human being known as "Sakura" was eroded down. This was akin to the way Shirou was breaking down with Archer's arm, where she lost memories, and had trouble figuring out where she was, who people were,and what day it was, and it got worse and worse as the route went on. Hell, after that gold bastard skewered her, she had to hold together herself with magical energy to even move, Rin even said that surviving such an ordeal would cause her to go insane. But even as her mind was breaking apart, and she went through unimaginable pain, she would show Shirou a smile. When he tried to kill her the second time, I doubt anyone can fathom what she was thinking that night, under those covers. But what we saw was that, no matter how guiltless she was of the situation, the only thing on her mind was, "Someone like me broke the pure boy that ran under the setting sun and fought for a dream." That isn't a selfish person. The selfish people would be the ones who orchestrated this war, the selfish people are the ones who experiment on children and hurt innocents in the name of power and ambition, the selfish people would be the magi who know that there are people who are willing to use that great power for a disastrous end and yet allow such a ritual to continue.

Now as to her real strengths, look at the scene "Distant Twilight" where you could see that Sakura may not have liked the way she was raised, but she didn't complain about it. She told Shirou the nature of the magics that were engraved upon her, but she never asked for pity. As she spoke, he noticed that Sakura had the same level of level-headedness and sharpness of mind that Rin had, just she wasn't as blunt. It was amusing how she teased him but gave him tips at the same time. Doesn't this sound like someone to you? Shirou was telling us of her strength all along, and it is a strength that goes unseen in the limelight of tsundere magic slingers and blonde swordswomen, and that was the strength of her heart.

In summation, when you think of Sakura and her story, I'd say, look between the lines and see that she was a worthwhile and strong person, in her own way. I may like Sakura the most, but I won't say anything in detriment to Saber and Rin, because I found things to like about them too. Look beyond pity, and try to understand, even a little of what Nasu was trying to say about her in this story. It wasn't about pity. It is yet another tale of the cruelty and callousness of magi and their road to ambition.

Oh and here are a few fanfiction I wish to endorse for just this topic:

http://nrvnqsr.proboards.com/index.c...ay&thread=5842
http://nrvnqsr.proboards.com/index.c...ay&thread=5856
http://nrvnqsr.proboards.com/index.c...ay&thread=6043

Ironically enough, this was written by a forum member who openly admitted to disliking Sakura.
__________________


Thanks to kira_lacusXX for this great sig!
Altima of the Gates is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-08-05, 15:01   Link #358
DragoZERO
Spoilaphobic
*IT Support
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Age: 28
I voted for Sakura this time around.
DragoZERO is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:10.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.