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Old 2010-08-05, 16:21   Link #41
Keroko
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Normally yes. Fortunately your father is a Major and you're in good relations with a Colonel. Yes, I'm implying nepotism, it's not that unusual in Japanese culture (yes, I know Mid-Childa isn't Japanese, but the social norm the writers are familiar with is)
That'd explain it, yeah. Not a good implication, but unless we see people totally unrelated to the bureau with ID's, not something we can exclude.

Speaking of which, Einhart doesn't use a device, does she?

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I'm starting to buy the "Yuuno found RH in one of his digs" theory. Why else would he got something not compatible with him?
It's not all that unlikely either, I mean compared to ultra-rare Lost Logia, digging up an ID or two has got to be a common find when combing out sites of war.

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PS: What's a unison accident?
A Unison accident is when the Unison device takes over the mage, operating using the mage's power, but without the mage's consent. Yami no Sho's taking over Hayate is an example of this. Though with a tad more extreme repercussions.
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:24   Link #42
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Yeah, I imagine most other Unison Accidents don't result in the complete annihilation of a world...
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:27   Link #43
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Well, unless said mage just happened to be standing next to the End of the World button...
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:44   Link #44
Tiresias
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Speaking of which, Einhart doesn't use a device, does she?
Now that you mention it, yeah that has always bugs me. She can turn into adult mode without a device?
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:46   Link #45
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We can attest this to transformation magic being decidedly easy to accomplish. Yuuno uses transformation magic without a Device as well, after all.
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:50   Link #46
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We can attest this to transformation magic being decidedly easy to accomplish. Yuuno uses transformation magic without a Device as well, after all.
But why would she need adult form for? Longer reach? More muscles? I don't think a small body is not such a problem for mages, just ask Vita.
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:53   Link #47
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But why would she need adult form for? Longer reach? More muscles? I don't think a small body is not such a problem for mages, just ask Vita.
Vita's not exactly a regular mage, though, is she?

Other than the out-of-story explanation of giving her something to match her with Vivio, a look at Einhart's character would show that an adult form allows her to engage against opponents without them holding back against her due to her status as a child. It allows her opponent to not feel guilty about going all out, and thus allows Einhart to utilize her Kaiser Arts freely so she can validate them. She wouldn't be able to do that if she felt her opponent was holding back on her.
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:56   Link #48
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Depends on who you look at. Einhart used the mode mostly as a cover, Vivio used the mode mostly so she could spar with Nove. What actual bonuses the adult modes give have -to my knowledge- never been revealed.

Looking at it out-of-universe though, reach and muscle would indeed be examples.
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Old 2010-08-05, 16:56   Link #49
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Could be in her genes.

maybe all battle-oriented Belkan rulers can turn into adults when they go to battle when they're only four years old and turn back to normal when they're at home?

Plus, Saint Kaiser Vivio was at least as powerful as the S+ Nanoha, most likely stronger, just lacking experiences when they fought.

Loli!Vivio in StrikerS doesn't really rate on the scale, remember Schach telling (Signum or Nanoha, I forget who exactly) that her body was normal and her magic wasn't any stronger than it should have been for her age.

Vivid!Vivio is A-rank (according to the test paper) in magic, but as an Adult, it's safe to assume she's closer to AAA or even S rank, since people clear the way for her and Nove to spar.
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:04   Link #50
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The real interesting questions of transformation magic and adult modes lie elsewhere. Namely, can adult mode Vivio get pregnant? Can a female use transformation magic to turn into a man and impregnate someone?

Of course, if you really follow this line of questioning, you'll end up needing brain bleach. =)
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:05   Link #51
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When we consider the fact that girls Vivio's age already have the potential to become pregnant, I think we already know the answer to that first question...
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:11   Link #52
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Depends on who you look at. Einhart used the mode mostly as a cover, Vivio used the mode mostly so she could spar with Nove. What actual bonuses the adult modes give have -to my knowledge- never been revealed.

Looking at it out-of-universe though, reach and muscle would indeed be examples.
I actually quote the whole reach thing from Negima

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Plus, Saint Kaiser Vivio was at least as powerful as the S+ Nanoha, most likely stronger, just lacking experiences when they fought.
A Jewel Seed-enhanced Vivio, mind you...

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The real interesting questions of transformation magic and adult modes lie elsewhere. Namely, can adult mode Vivio get pregnant? Can a female use transformation magic to turn into a man and impregnate someone?

Of course, if you really follow this line of questioning, you'll end up needing brain bleach. =)
By God!

...this reminds me back to StrikerS, when Jail confessed to having impregnated the NumberS(without actual sex, I think). I reached the brain bleach when I realized this includes Cinque!
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:14   Link #53
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Relic-enhanced and Cradle-connected Vivio, you mean. Jewel Seeds were used in the larger Gadget Drones, not on Vivio.
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:16   Link #54
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The real interesting questions of transformation magic and adult modes lie elsewhere. Namely, can adult mode Vivio get pregnant? Can a female use transformation magic to turn into a man and impregnate someone?

Of course, if you really follow this line of questioning, you'll end up needing brain bleach. =)
Hmm, possibly. It depends on how much DNA altering transformation magic does, and it being 'transformation' and not 'illusion' I'd say it would. That'd mean that a girl who transforms the proper tools would be able to get another girl pregnant.

Now for the real brain-killer: What would happen if a man got himself pregnant while transformed, and transforms back?
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:16   Link #55
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Relic enhanced, not jewel seed enhanced.

ViVid went and said that Vivio's adult mode isn't the same as the Saint Kaiser transformation.

As for the pregnancies, yeah, I think we should just bleach that out. I can see Uno, Tre and Quattro having that done to them, but not the rest. Plus, it's Jail, do you really trust everything he says?

@Keroko - Mode Lock to prevent transforming back.
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Old 2010-08-05, 17:22   Link #56
Tiresias
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Relic-enhanced and Cradle-connected Vivio, you mean. Jewel Seeds were used in the larger Gadget Drones, not on Vivio.
I never catch the difference between relic and jewel seed. Well the point is that back then Vivio has extra power supply than normal

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Hmm, possibly. It depends on how much DNA altering transformation magic does, and it being 'transformation' and not 'illusion' I'd say it would. That'd mean that a girl who transforms the proper tools would be able to get another girl pregnant.

Now for the real brain-killer: What would happen if a man got himself pregnant while transformed, and transforms back?
To paraphrase Takahasi Rumiko on being asked whether female Ranma can get pregnant: "I don't think about it and neither should you." Ergh, let them H doujin-ka think about that; I'd rather not be reminded of an Arnold Schawrzenegger comedy...

Just as a reminder on how squicky this topic can be: remember that they can transform to other creatures, not just a different gender...
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Old 2010-08-05, 18:09   Link #57
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One argument against why this might not be possible, is that we haven't seen anyone with two mommies or two daddies, that wasn't adopted. Transformation magic may give the outward appearance of something, but the form would be sterile, but who knows how far someone could take it if they were skilled enough? Obviously, the creators never thought down this path, but human nature being what it is (Rule 34), odds are some people in Mid-Childa experiment with it, even if only for a kink.

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Just as a reminder on how squicky this topic can be: remember that they can transform to other creatures, not just a different gender...
That's why I said not to follow it too much. :P

Although, won't someone please think of the furries!?
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Old 2010-08-05, 18:57   Link #58
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Normally yes. Fortunately your father is a Major and you're in good relations with a Colonel. Yes, I'm implying nepotism, it's not that unusual in Japanese culture (yes, I know Mid-Childa isn't Japanese, but the social norm the writers are familiar with is)
Hayate seems to be more important there. Ginga didn't get an ID until RF6 supplied it.

Touma might be a lead to Huckbein, Nove's one of Vivio's unofficial bodyguards and the Alpines are running RF6's secret mountain training camp.

I'd note Chrono prefers storage devices though, since I think there is little doubt he could lay his hands on an ID if he wanted it.

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What's a unison accident?
When Your device decides to make you it's puppet. As seen from the first Reinforce and Mach Calibre.
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Old 2010-08-05, 20:15   Link #59
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Although, won't someone please think of the furries!?
That's what Familiars are for. Arf is worth any social stigma I can think of.
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Old 2010-08-05, 20:21   Link #60
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That's what Familiars are for. Arf is worth any social stigma I can think of.
Heh, which version of Arf tho?

Besides, I want one of the Numbers. ;3p
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