AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Retired > Umineko

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-08-16, 04:40   Link #81
zRyuu
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
So I have read that we get more information about Nanjo's past and how he met Kinzo and Beatrice-1. Do we get anything new about Kumasawa's past and her relationship with Beatrice-1?
zRyuu is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 06:52   Link #82
immblueversion
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Where you're not.
So the answers have been revealed, but this isn't the final chapter, is it? Happy ending or not, would there be a resolution episode, if not an omake? I mean, they sure as hell set us up for one, what with Battler and all at the end.
__________________
I'm not the boss.

I just know what you should be doing.
immblueversion is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 07:00   Link #83
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Where I can learn to be lonely.
Age: 29
I think many of those who have finished the game said that no true answers have been revealed yet.
MeoTwister5 is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 07:07   Link #84
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Answers have been offered, that is definitely so.

Whether any of them have actually been true is very much in question.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
— Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 07:11   Link #85
ArcticHelm
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
I think any answers in this one are like the inside of an onion-we're probably not going to get much from the outside layer(s).
ArcticHelm is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 07:32   Link #86
Digdri
Uu~ Let's solve a riddle
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Answers have been offered, that is definitely so.

Whether any of them have actually been true is very much in question.
I think a see a pattern here for the core arcs.

EP5 had vast amounts of red but most of them didn't really add much genuinely revealing new facts to the tale but seemed more focused on cutting done the vast pool of possibilities of the setting or channeling the right ones.

Then in EP6 we got a very very specific interpretation of the character and their motives to show some answer but in a really cryptic and unintuitive way.

Now were are back to this tossing around of possibilities and by showing one "consistent" version of the story he is also implicitly cutting some theories and channels others. But by intentionally cutting down on the red we also once again have very reliable facts to work an and we have to question Berns motives.

EP8 also makes sense to go back to EP6s style but with most of / all the noise removed.
Digdri is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 07:47   Link #87
TheForsaken
Winter is coming
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renall View Post
For that matter, why were they freaking strapped to the gills with firearms while going to solve the epitaph? Did they think Kinzo was gonna have the place guarded? Were they worried Maria was going to find the guns and hurt herself? Did they just think they looked totally cool walking around with loaded guns?
They didn't bring the guns with them.
Beatrice and the guns were inside the room that has the gold. She said if they failed to solve the epitaph she would use the guns to kill them.

And there are only four guns, but the ammo seems unlimited
__________________
TheForsaken is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:14   Link #88
immblueversion
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Where you're not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
I think many of those who have finished the game said that no true answers have been revealed yet.
Just so long as it isn't the end, because it hardly seems like a way for a story with so much development to end.
__________________
I'm not the boss.

I just know what you should be doing.
immblueversion is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:19   Link #89
Almazluverdis3
Shall we do it?
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: In the Golden toilet.
Send a message via MSN to Almazluverdis3
EP7... Umineko is closing on us so fast. I wonder who Claire is.

EDIT: I wonder if Beatrice C. is the human Beatrice who keeps coming.

EDITEDIT: Wait, THERE'S A YOUNG KINZO SPRITE? Hnnnggggg. The new servants... I think someone said they were the stakes. I'm confused.
__________________

Last edited by Almazluverdis3; 2010-08-16 at 08:33.
Almazluverdis3 is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:32   Link #90
immblueversion
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Where you're not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Almazluverdis3 View Post
EP7... Umineko is closing on us so fast. I wonder who Claire is.
From what I know (ALL I know, in fact), she is a piece Bernkastel uses. And there was something about being a portrait painter.

I know her name in Japanese is クレル・ヴォーブ・ベルナルドゥス (Kureru Vōbu Berunarudusu). I also wonder why people call her Claire when that name is transliterated into クレア (Kurea). I think it should be more along the lines of "Cler".

Sorry, I gave you more than what was asked and now I may sound like some kind of ass.
__________________
I'm not the boss.

I just know what you should be doing.
immblueversion is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:37   Link #91
Renall
BUY MY BOOK!!!
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
Isn't this exactly what makes them such a terrible family, though?
I don't know. I'm very morally opposed to killing or even doing harm to anyone, but I'm not sure it could fairly be said that I would never do anything bad in such a fashion that it could be said I "couldn't" commit such an act.

If, on a game board, that means that the mere possibility I could commit murder allows my "piece" to be moved in such a fashion as to actually be the murderer, then any piece may as well be acting wildly out of character, because under any reasonable and normal circumstances, it wouldn't be possible for me to act that way.

So basically, let's take it at face value and say Kyrie is capable of killing and of saying she doesn't love her children under certain circumstances. Just how close to accurate under ordinary circumstances do they have to be for her piece to be able to move in that manner?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheForsaken View Post
They didn't bring the guns with them.
Beatrice and the guns were inside the room that has the gold. She said if they failed to solve the epitaph she would use the guns to kill them.

And there are only four guns, but the ammo seems unlimited
Why did she need four guns to kill seven people? That doesn't even begin to make sense. Let alone keeping them there. "Oh hey, here's the guns I was going to use to murder you if you didn't solve the epitaph, but you did. Good work! Have a free gun. Don't do anything baaaad with iiiiiit!"

It's like that was put there as an excuse to give everyone guns in the first place. C'mon, Bern, can't you do better than that?
__________________
Redaction of the Golden Witch
I submit that a murder was committed in 1996.
This murder was a "copycat" crime inspired by our tales of 1986.
This story is a redacted confession.

Blog (VN DL) - YouTube Playlists
Battler Solves The Logic Error
Renall is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:37   Link #92
Almazluverdis3
Shall we do it?
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: In the Golden toilet.
Send a message via MSN to Almazluverdis3
Quote:
Originally Posted by immblueversion View Post
From what I know (ALL I know, in fact), she is a piece Bernkastel uses. And there was something about being a portrait painter.

I know her name in Japanese is クレル・ヴォーブ・ベルナルドゥス (Kureru Vōbu Berunarudusu). I also wonder why people call her Claire when that name is transliterated into クレア (Kurea). I think it should be more along the lines of "Cler".

Berunarudusu. Yeah. Found that a little suspicious.
Thanks for giving some info!
__________________
Almazluverdis3 is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:41   Link #93
Digdri
Uu~ Let's solve a riddle
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheForsaken View Post
They didn't bring the guns with them.
Beatrice and the guns were inside the room that has the gold. She said if they failed to solve the epitaph she would use the guns to kill them.

And there are only four guns, but the ammo seems unlimited
Still strange how the story went from one gun with seemed reasonable to multiply multiple guns "out of nowhere" starting with EP3. But you could always the mindfuck backup option of declaring thats just Featherinnes embellishing the stories after seeing how the one gun in the bottle stories had resulted in so much tension and drama among the adults. (And Bern just adding them in in the same kind of "illogical" way just to replicate the resulting drama of earlier stories)

After all the stories always keep us guessing which types of weapons where really used for murder. From staking to fake staking to all this inconsistent Siesta magic attacks to later on totally different ways of murder like choking and slit the throats and symbolisms or suggestions of all kinds of vaguely defined melee weapons, pistols, drugs/poison, death by fire etc.
Digdri is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:43   Link #94
Klashikari
Swords•Maidens Maniac
*Graphic Designer
*Moderator
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Belgium, Brussels
Age: 28
Send a message via Skype™ to Klashikari
Quote:
Originally Posted by immblueversion View Post
From what I know (ALL I know, in fact), she is a piece Bernkastel uses. And there was something about being a portrait painter.

I know her name in Japanese is クレル・ヴォーブ・ベルナルドゥス (Kureru Vōbu Berunarudusu). I also wonder why people call her Claire when that name is transliterated into クレア (Kurea). I think it should be more along the lines of "Cler".

Sorry, I gave you more than what was asked and now I may sound like some kind of ass.
Then please just stop answering things that you barely know from external source instead of the game.

Also, Claire is the only "logical" name people can bring up. It may not be the correct name, but at least it is convenient and it is fairly accepted as the one we should use.

We will ask Ryukishi about the romaji of some characters (though Will is a no brainer), but as far as it goes, Claire, Lion and so forth are correct in their practical sense.
Klashikari is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:46   Link #95
Almazluverdis3
Shall we do it?
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: In the Golden toilet.
Send a message via MSN to Almazluverdis3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digdri View Post
Still strange how the story went from one gun with seemed reasonable to multiply multiple guns "out of nowhere" starting with EP3. But you could always the mindfuck backup option of declaring thats just Featherinnes embellishing the stories after seeing how the one gun in the bottle stories had resulted in so much tension and drama among the adults.

After all the stories always keep us guessing which types of weapons where really used for murder. From staking to fake staking to all this inconsistent Siesta magic attacks to later on totally different ways of murder like choking and slit the throats and symbolisms or suggestions of all kinds of vaguely defined melee weapons, pistols, drugs/poison, death by fire etc.

I strongly think the victims of the so-called Seista sisters (I'm Anti-Fantasy, so yeah) must have knocked them out by clubbing (Would have been poison, but Knox rule forbid use of unknown poisons. ) Then stabbed and messed around to make it look like something that wasn't human did it.
__________________
Almazluverdis3 is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 08:47   Link #96
TheForsaken
Winter is coming
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renall View Post
Why did she need four guns to kill seven people? That doesn't even begin to make sense. Let alone keeping them there. "Oh hey, here's the guns I was going to use to murder you if you didn't solve the epitaph, but you did. Good work! Have a free gun. Don't do anything baaaad with iiiiiit!"

It's like that was put there as an excuse to give everyone guns in the first place. C'mon, Bern, can't you do better than that?
Everything Beatrice said in that scene doesn't make any sense.

Basically she said: "Congratulation for solving the epitaph. Here is the mountain of gold, take it. Here are the guns, take it. Here is the account with one billion yen within, take it. Here is the switch that triggers 900 tons of explosive, take it."

I agree with what Eve said. "I found her creepy."
__________________
TheForsaken is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 09:01   Link #97
Digdri
Uu~ Let's solve a riddle
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by Almazluverdis3 View Post
I strongly think the victims of the so-called Seista sisters (I'm Anti-Fantasy, so yeah) must have knocked them out by clubbing (Would have been poison, but Knox rule forbid use of unknown poisons. ) Then stabbed and messed around to make it look like something that wasn't human did it.
The problem is how ambiguous those Siesta action are presented how much noise they add to their metaphoric value. At first we get this ridiculous high-presicion sniping stuff but later we have lasso or rope like dragging around (most more reminiscent of of the choking and hanging ideas presented) and last but not least we have this golden threads stuff from Kyrie and the idea of blasting half faces away in EP4s 1st murder.
Non of this makes you think of the same types of weapons and most of them don't even make sense with the initial metaphor of Kinzos oldschool shotguns.
EP6 even associates the (other) Siestas with massive rapid fire weapons.

So I guess their is no ONE weapon the Siestas are meant to mystify but their are just a generic catch all term for all those times of weapons used in specific contexts of murder and the details are just the noise of the witch illusion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheForsaken View Post
Everything Beatrice said in that scene doesn't make any sense.

Basically she said: "Congratulation for solving the epitaph. Here is the mountain of gold, take it. Here are the guns, take it. Here is the account with one billion yen within, take it. Here is the switch that triggers 900 tons of explosive, take it."

I agree with what Eve said. "I found her creepy."
If its just such a simple role she is playing here that sound almost like a note left at the treasure place saying "Grats....this is all yours now".
If they are really reaching some place with was a former part of the "military part" of the island it would even make sense that besides the stored gold and account infos and even the bomb their could be weapons down there.
Digdri is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 09:11   Link #98
Almazluverdis3
Shall we do it?
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: In the Golden toilet.
Send a message via MSN to Almazluverdis3
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digdri View Post
The problem is how ambiguous those Siesta action are presented how much noise they add to their metaphoric value. At first we get this ridiculous high-presicion sniping stuff but later we have lasso or rope like dragging around (most more reminiscent of of the choking and hanging ideas presented) and last but not least we have this golden threads stuff from Kyrie and the idea of blasting half faces away in EP4s 1st murder.
Non of this makes you think of the same types of weapons and most of them don't even make sense with the initial metaphor of Kinzos oldschool shotguns.
EP6 even associates the (other) Siestas with massive rapid fire weapons.

So I guess their is no ONE weapon the Siestas are meant to mystify but their are just a generic catch all term for all those times of weapons used in specific contexts of murder and the details are just the noise of the witch illusion.
You drive a hard bargain. The problem is, looking at an Anti-Fantasy perspective, there is no "Golden Lasso" or whatever But the fire power, can be a massive fire thrower.
__________________
Almazluverdis3 is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 09:30   Link #99
Digdri
Uu~ Let's solve a riddle
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Germany
Quote:
Originally Posted by Almazluverdis3 View Post
You drive a hard bargain. The problem is, looking at an Anti-Fantasy perspective, there is no "Golden Lasso" or whatever But the fire power, can be a massive fire thrower.
I'm not try to justify any Fantasy perspective or whatever but just meant to address how the metaphoric implication from all thats attributed to Siestas killing is hardly consistent at all and most of it doesn't suggest shotguns were used in EP3 or at least not in the way the tales wants us to believe their murder were commited.

There IS another interpretation that at least fits to EP3 I thought of once but its a bit far fetched:
Siestas are just meant to contrast to the Stakes and how the murderers behave.

Siestas are calculating, efficient and professional even someway "emotionless" in their work.
Stakes take everything very personal with her connections to sins, are sometimes really amateurish or clumsy and not nearly as powerful. Besides they can get in danger and killed and fight some duels while Siestas are always overpowering enemies or fleeing really fast.

But as this is really not the topic of EP7, my overarching idea was if those multiple guns and the simultaneously introduced Siestas are just misinterpreted noise of the witch illusion it is most likely that Bern is just committing a follow-up error by also fitting this idea in her story. If EP7 is really meant to show us fan theories this makes even more sense.
Digdri is offline  
Old 2010-08-16, 09:34   Link #100
TheForsaken
Winter is coming
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digdri View Post
If its just such a simple role she is playing here that sound almost like a note left at the treasure place saying "Grats....this is all yours now".
If they are really reaching some place with was a former part of the "military part" of the island it would even make sense that besides the stored gold and account infos and even the bomb their could be weapons down there.
Yeah, she was just there and explained everything we need to know. She did nothing when the adults killed each other and when Kyrie tried to kill her.
And it's funny, the controller of the bomb that can destroy half of the island is pretty simple, just ON and OFF (Heck, it doesn't even have the label to let people know which is on which is off)
It's just like the self-destruction button in many cliche stories.
__________________
TheForsaken is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:52.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.