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Old 2010-08-05, 09:24   Link #141
Baru
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Eh, actually Vic and Travis are good friends...

Well anyway, point is, the dub workers do put effort into their projects, and they do hire professionals.

But either way, whether you prefer subs or dubs is up to the viewer. It's fine for Kaijo to like the subs better. But it's good to be respectful of the English dub staff too, because they do work really hard and try their best.
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Old 2010-08-05, 09:29   Link #142
Kaijo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baru View Post
No, this isn't true... typically voice actors in anime are trained stage actors, or professional voice-over workers... they don't produce these as cheaply as you make it sound...
There is competition in US dubbing too. There are auditions, and people get casted in roles if the directors find them suitable.
You misunderstand. In Japan, anime is more accepted, and it's a big business. Not many in US high school would say, "I want to be a Voice actor when I grow up" while in Japan, it's more than acceptable to say, "I want to be a seiyu." Their are many schools that train seiyu in Japan, whereas such schools in the US are nearly nonexistant; if anything, it's a course or two attached to a broader curriculum. It's also not as stigmatized as VA work is in Western Society. It's like anime in general, which is big in Japan, and yet not quite mainstream in the US.

Go ahead, enter a new social circle and say you like watching anime and playing video games. There is still that stigma of... immaturity to it.

In Japan, it's not as bad to say that, and since anime is a big business, a LOT more people train to be VA's then they do in the US. Over here, it's not as often you get a "professional" VA, but as you said, a stage actor looking for some cash between gigs or something. And yes, there can be auditions, but I think you're underestimating just what corners a company will cut to get cheaper labor.

Anime dubbing companies in Japan also want cheaper labor, but they get it because there are TONS more VA's there then in the US; with so much supply and competition, hiring prices go down.

I work for a company that hires VA's for some of it's work, adding voices to educational software. It's not that big of a business, and there are very few people who actively specialize in it. Normally it's just something attached as a side skill, and not sought as a lifelong career. And I've been in those recording booths and done some recording myself; it does take training and practice to modulate your voice enough to get emotions through so they end up sounding right. You can't just talk normally; you really have to push your tonations and inflections just right, almost overemphasizing them, otherwise you end up sounding wooden and emotionless.

Note: A company *can* hire good dub actors, and a lot of cases they do, even if the dub actors aren't professional full time VA's. I've already mentioned a few series where I liked the English voices. And most western animation do seek out better dub actors; but a company dubbing something like anime, usually just want to add an English track and push it out the door, so there's not as much emphasis.

Also, as a last note: superior is down to taste. Just because one way sounds better to me, doesn't mean someone else can't find a different sound better.
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Old 2010-08-05, 14:52   Link #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
You misunderstand. In Japan, anime is more accepted, and it's a big business. Not many in US high school would say, "I want to be a Voice actor when I grow up" while in Japan, it's more than acceptable to say, "I want to be a seiyu." Their are many schools that train seiyu in Japan, whereas such schools in the US are nearly nonexistant; if anything, it's a course or two attached to a broader curriculum. It's also not as stigmatized as VA work is in Western Society. It's like anime in general, which is big in Japan, and yet not quite mainstream in the US.

Go ahead, enter a new social circle and say you like watching anime and playing video games. There is still that stigma of... immaturity to it.

In Japan, it's not as bad to say that, and since anime is a big business, a LOT more people train to be VA's then they do in the US. Over here, it's not as often you get a "professional" VA, but as you said, a stage actor looking for some cash between gigs or something. And yes, there can be auditions, but I think you're underestimating just what corners a company will cut to get cheaper labor.

Anime dubbing companies in Japan also want cheaper labor, but they get it because there are TONS more VA's there then in the US; with so much supply and competition, hiring prices go down.

I work for a company that hires VA's for some of it's work, adding voices to educational software. It's not that big of a business, and there are very few people who actively specialize in it. Normally it's just something attached as a side skill, and not sought as a lifelong career. And I've been in those recording booths and done some recording myself; it does take training and practice to modulate your voice enough to get emotions through so they end up sounding right. You can't just talk normally; you really have to push your tonations and inflections just right, almost overemphasizing them, otherwise you end up sounding wooden and emotionless.

Note: A company *can* hire good dub actors, and a lot of cases they do, even if the dub actors aren't professional full time VA's. I've already mentioned a few series where I liked the English voices. And most western animation do seek out better dub actors; but a company dubbing something like anime, usually just want to add an English track and push it out the door, so there's not as much emphasis.

Also, as a last note: superior is down to taste. Just because one way sounds better to me, doesn't mean someone else can't find a different sound better.
Well that's something that we both agree together, it doesn't matter what superior people can do good or bad jobs in whatever roles they do. It just that it takes time to prepare it. Superior doesn't mean a thing but we all messed accordingly.

To Baru:

I think they are all rivalry but for Vic and Travis, they do have speaking terms against each other. Some one told me that Travis said about disclosing some stuff about Vic and being with him overall. But that's their private lives overall. I do still believe there is rivalries between VA's or possibly dubbing studios as well.
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Old 2010-08-05, 22:49   Link #144
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Originally Posted by Highman View Post
Yeah you are right eventually because everyone bitched alot when they chose Shizuru accent instead figuring out on learning Kyoto accent they just give an Southern Belle or Texan voice and anime fans went crazy over that issue. I would not trust Bluewater (Ocean Group) to do it nor Bandai Entertainment to take that kind of licensing for the Mai-franchise. If they do Sifr, possibly? Then I would buy but not hear the dubs. Even the dialogue and writing was so bad that I can't even comprehend and confusing at the least. But I found good VA's but and possibly Golden Gems that could be so awesome.
That's kind of a dumb comment considering that "learning" a Kyoto accent won't help anything. The reason Kyoto accents are translated as Southern ones is because accents in Japan work differently than in English speaking countries. There's no way of translating that exactly, so the Southern accent is used to show the difference. Another example is Ami Mizuno from Sailor Moon. In Japanese, she spoke with an Osakan accent, but in the dub, she was given a British accent.
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Old 2010-08-05, 23:02   Link #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Same_Shark View Post
That's kind of a dumb comment considering that "learning" a Kyoto accent won't help anything. The reason Kyoto accents are translated as Southern ones is because accents in Japan work differently than in English speaking countries. There's no way of translating that exactly, so the Southern accent is used to show the difference. Another example is Ami Mizuno from Sailor Moon. In Japanese, she spoke with an Osakan accent, but in the dub, she was given a British accent.
How can you say it's dumb when VA's want to learn accent's that crap was totally out of line. It's just takes practices and it may grow into. Dubbers would learn what the Japanese even If they did it for homework. Yet, I blown out of this Shizuru Southern accent thing out of proportion. I hope they could get a better VA's Una Shamrock (previous headmaster) because they would use her voice as Southern accent as well. *rolls eyes*!
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Old 2010-08-05, 23:04   Link #146
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To be honest, having a Kyoto accent translated as a British one works better for me. A southern accent is just too strange for me. Especially for people like Ami and Shizuru; I would have loved it if they gave Shizuru a slight British accent. She just seems so proper and composed, that a southern accent doesn't work for her.
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Old 2010-08-05, 23:12   Link #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
To be honest, having a Kyoto accent translated as a British one works better for me. A southern accent is just too strange for me. Especially for people like Ami and Shizuru; I would have loved it if they gave Shizuru a slight British accent. She just seems so proper and composed, that a southern accent doesn't work for her.
True, but it's okay to try hard though on practicing Kyoto accent, can it be?
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Old 2010-08-06, 01:10   Link #148
Same_Shark
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Originally Posted by Highman View Post
True, but it's okay to try hard though on practicing Kyoto accent, can it be?
Japanese accents don't work the same as accents from England & America! To keep a Kyoto accent, the dub would have to be in Japanese! That's the point I'm making!
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Old 2010-08-08, 19:27   Link #149
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Originally Posted by Same_Shark View Post
Japanese accents don't work the same as accents from England & America! To keep a Kyoto accent, the dub would have to be in Japanese! That's the point I'm making!
That's kind of crock right there man, If you watched alot of dubs in your life, probably you heard an English VA done a Kyoto accent but stay off from closer to a Texan one. Bluewater did it wrong, Dubbing should take form every time this happens, I'm sure dubbers would learn once and just look back to think I may have pulled it off but deep down you need to do it better. Effort makes talent and practice makes perfect. That's what it takes to become a better voice and stage actor.
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Old 2010-08-09, 00:00   Link #150
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Originally Posted by Highman View Post
That's kind of crock right there man, If you watched alot of dubs in your life, probably you heard an English VA done a Kyoto accent but stay off from closer to a Texan one. Bluewater did it wrong, Dubbing should take form every time this happens, I'm sure dubbers would learn once and just look back to think I may have pulled it off but deep down you need to do it better. Effort makes talent and practice makes perfect. That's what it takes to become a better voice and stage actor.
Japanese accents are mainly based on pitch, not pronunciation.

And since we're complaining about stuff like that, why is it that the Japanese don't try to make characters from England sound differently from Americans when they use random English in anime?
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Old 2010-08-09, 01:31   Link #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
To be honest, having a Kyoto accent translated as a British one works better for me. A southern accent is just too strange for me. Especially for people like Ami and Shizuru; I would have loved it if they gave Shizuru a slight British accent. She just seems so proper and composed, that a southern accent doesn't work for her.
Though it should be noted that Shizuru's dub accent isn't a traditional Southern accent, it's a variation that follows along the lines of a "Southern Belle"-esque style, which is a more proper and refined type of Southern Accent, formerly used by those of the upper class in the Old South in the past.

Though British probably would've worked as well, I believe they did select this accent with Shizuru's character personality in mind.
I personally think her dub voice came out well...
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Old 2010-08-09, 15:20   Link #152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Same_Shark View Post
Japanese accents are mainly based on pitch, not pronunciation.

And since we're complaining about stuff like that, why is it that the Japanese don't try to make characters from England sound differently from Americans when they use random English in anime?
Great idea, I have no problem with that at all.
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Old 2010-08-11, 19:07   Link #153
supei_02
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Originally Posted by Same_Shark View Post
Japanese accents are mainly based on pitch, not pronunciation.

And since we're complaining about stuff like that, why is it that the Japanese don't try to make characters from England sound differently from Americans when they use random English in anime?
because they can't pronounce british english so well?
my pals start freaking out when they hear british english... probably for the sake of Japanese viewers they keep it to simple engrish? I would love to hear that though.
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Old 2010-08-11, 21:04   Link #154
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Originally Posted by supei_02 View Post
because they can't pronounce british english so well?
my pals start freaking out when they hear british english... probably for the sake of Japanese viewers they keep it to simple engrish? I would love to hear that though.
Here's a protip for dubbing to grown anime fans: British english is better than Kyoto accent but that's was other fans care about the most.
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Old 2010-09-08, 10:46   Link #155
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You know, I watched Sifr again the other day, and I'm more convinced they are planning on making a prequel sequel. There is just too much they introduced, hints, that are left unresolved.

- Lena's mother; both the argument between Lena, and the fact that Lena had a super meister gem

- Lena's HiME-like mark (almost looks like Lena was an experiment to make a real hime)

- The ending lines about Lena's power leading them into another adventure

But there's more than that, I noticed a few other things:

- Young Reito says something about Shiro, hinting that there is something about him

- Why include the Artai guy and his Otome Sakura? They didn't add anything to the plot, and appeared to either know something, and/or have a plot of their own

- And something I just noticed: Sakura's Otome robe looks a LOT like Arika's pink Otome robe. I wondered why the Blue Sky Sapphire gave Arika a pink outfit, and so I'm wondering if something like this happens:

Lena's mother being a scientist that helped "create" Lena. The next story has Lena learning about her powers, something happens to the Blue Sky Sapphire like it gets damaged, and Sakura gives her gem to help repair it or something. Thus, creating the pink mode that Arika later uses.

It would explain why Arika has two materialization modes; because the Blue Sky Sapphire gem has a normal meister gem within it as well.
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Old 2010-09-08, 11:54   Link #156
Highman
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Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
You know, I watched Sifr again the other day, and I'm more convinced they are planning on making a prequel sequel. There is just too much they introduced, hints, that are left unresolved.

- Lena's mother; both the argument between Lena, and the fact that Lena had a super meister gem

- Lena's HiME-like mark (almost looks like Lena was an experiment to make a real hime)

- The ending lines about Lena's power leading them into another adventure

But there's more than that, I noticed a few other things:

- Young Reito says something about Shiro, hinting that there is something about him

- Why include the Artai guy and his Otome Sakura? They didn't add anything to the plot, and appeared to either know something, and/or have a plot of their own

- And something I just noticed: Sakura's Otome robe looks a LOT like Arika's pink Otome robe. I wondered why the Blue Sky Sapphire gave Arika a pink outfit, and so I'm wondering if something like this happens:

Lena's mother being a scientist that helped "create" Lena. The next story has Lena learning about her powers, something happens to the Blue Sky Sapphire like it gets damaged, and Sakura gives her gem to help repair it or something. Thus, creating the pink mode that Arika later uses.

It would explain why Arika has two materialization modes; because the Blue Sky Sapphire gem has a normal meister gem within it as well.
And this is why HiME/Otome connection is so far-fetched. I'm sorry I had to say this but this connection looks confusing and non-existent. But we all know that Sunrise is making kind of journal from Hisayuki-san said. I'm little too worried on how they would execute the story very well, since they put the replica of the Black Mountain on Otome blu-ray special. I'm very convince they'll make a new path instead of connection. I just hope we go through a shonen based generation to generation story with alot of realistic elements.
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Old 2010-09-09, 10:15   Link #157
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And this is why HiME/Otome connection is so far-fetched. I'm sorry I had to say this but this connection looks confusing and non-existent. But we all know that Sunrise is making kind of journal from Hisayuki-san said. I'm little too worried on how they would execute the story very well, since they put the replica of the Black Mountain on Otome blu-ray special. I'm very convince they'll make a new path instead of connection. I just hope we go through a shonen based generation to generation story with alot of realistic elements.
Why are there two different HiME marks shown, then? Mikoto had the normal one, so why did Lena have one that was similar? It looked like a cross from the Sears Orphan symbol and a HiME symbol, implying some artificialness. Also, Artemis was Alyssa's child, and appears to be Lena's child as well. Otome in general seem like an artificial way to create HiME.

Anyway, not saying they are related, just that there are hooks. My main point was that there has to be another prequel at least planned, because the Sifr OAV put in too many hooks that go unexplained.

The Sakura/Artai guy one, for instance. There is no reason to include them, except perhaps to hint that Sakura's pink robe becomes Arika's pink robe mode.

Of course, they have another Sequel after Zwei instead, and have Arika and friends find out things about the past instead.
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Old 2010-09-09, 16:22   Link #158
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Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
Why are there two different HiME marks shown, then? Mikoto had the normal one, so why did Lena have one that was similar? It looked like a cross from the Sears Orphan symbol and a HiME symbol, implying some artificialness. Also, Artemis was Alyssa's child, and appears to be Lena's child as well. Otome in general seem like an artificial way to create HiME.

Anyway, not saying they are related, just that there are hooks. My main point was that there has to be another prequel at least planned, because the Sifr OAV put in too many hooks that go unexplained.

The Sakura/Artai guy one, for instance. There is no reason to include them, except perhaps to hint that Sakura's pink robe becomes Arika's pink robe mode.

Of course, they have another Sequel after Zwei instead, and have Arika and friends find out things about the past instead.
Oh Lordy, like I said it just not even connected enough fact. Between the same Artemis child that Alyssa and Lena formed doesn't mean the same as a real HiME could. Now I'm really interested on Rena's mother that's the one thing I want to know. But still connection is non-existent, Hisayuki-san said that diary project still getting green-lit soon. I want to see a prelude to the upcoming saga or just a frickin one episode OVA.
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Old 2010-09-11, 10:28   Link #159
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Just wanted to say, I think it is already official that Lena and Arika are the direct descendants of Alyssa, the artifically made HiME. sorry if you guys already knew that I really hope they make a sequel for Otome, I'm curious what happens to Lena after Sifr...
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Old 2010-09-11, 12:34   Link #160
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Just wanted to say, I think it is already official that Lena and Arika are the direct descendants of Alyssa, the artifically made HiME. sorry if you guys already knew that I really hope they make a sequel for Otome, I'm curious what happens to Lena after Sifr...
Eh, Well yeah but still HiME and Otome are not connected unless they reveal it soon enough. Also I guess you didn't watch Otome, Zwei (sequel) and Sifr (prequel) in order. We all know that but were disappointed over the outcome. I just Otome never existed and you watched it than yourself would be disappointed too.
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