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View Poll Results: Macross Frontier: Sayonara no Tsubasa Movie Rating
Perfect 10 40 42.11%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 33 34.74%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 12 12.63%
7 out of 10 : Good 5 5.26%
6 out of 10 : Average 3 3.16%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 2.11%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 95. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2010-10-02, 14:54   Link #161
moncikoma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reelyanoob View Post
I haven't seen the first movie, but it covers episodes 1 - 7 with some changes in plot.
Movie 2 *should* cover eps 8 - 25, though I think many minor events will be left out.

All "macross" feature movies since DYRL have only recapped series, not extended.

I wouldn't be surprise if there were 3 Frontier movies though, 18 eps worth seems a lot to get through, and I just saw the tralier, looked more like the middle of the series than anything right at the end.

It might well end with Michel's death? That'd give them some breathing space to do a better ending.

Or have they ruled this out, anyone?
damn...i thought..in movie 1 everything is OVER...grace is dead! so she's still alive afterall? and the BIG BOS is her again in 2nd movie?

BORING! so boring...

i just hope this statement is true
"Macross Frontier The Movie: The Wings of Goodbye

The official website of the Macross Frontier anime series has confirmed that there will be two theatrical Macross Frontier films. While the first film will re-edit the story of the television series with new footage, the second film, which will be based also on the Macross Frontier TV series, will act as a sequel to the 2009 film, including a new story and new music.[19] In the Macross Frontier Girasama Festival, the movie's release date is confirmed to be on February 26, 2011."

i hope it will be tottaly different...in story, and ending..!
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Old 2010-10-02, 14:56   Link #162
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This image is the same they used in Ep7 to explain cybernetics and implants, copare them:

So i think that person is no one in particular (or maybe Grace)

Kawamori said that this will be anew story so I expect some changes but not a whole different story, based on the trailer I think some story elements from the series will be in the movie like Sheryl being sick, the battle for the Vajra planet and of course Ranka becoming popular.

About the scenes on the beach, i think that will be a complete different situation and they won't do the "Macross Zero movie" again because it will be a waste of time (unless they only show some parts quickly).

And yeah too much Ranka/Alto scenes but it was to be expected since the movie will focus more on her, Sheryl got the lake scene with Alto last time so now Ranka will have a Beach scene with him.

Oh and count me in the pessimist Sheryl fans too, not because it's a Ranka centered movie but because now that in this story Ranka is Alto's friend/childhood friend, and I have the impression they will go with the cliche about chilhood friends
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Old 2010-10-02, 15:01   Link #163
justavisitor
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If the hero goes to the new girl, then we call it the "cliche" about the new girl

If the hero falls for the childhood friend, then we call it the "cliche" about the childhood friends

Relex ppl, if we can see through the ending from the trailer, then the movie itself isn't necessary anymore, isn't it??

I am a Ranka fan and I don't see anything too special in the trailer lol, so don't worry too much
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Old 2010-10-02, 15:58   Link #164
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About the kimono scene... Hopefully... It will be upgraded + uncensored X3 ......
As long that scene exsist... Sheryl fan can be @ ease

Still... I have a bad feeling..that scene will be skipped.... Because kawamori want to make it more different... So maybe alto will be with ranka more often and they would spend the night @ that beach... That beach somehow is the like the main event... continuation, conffesion or maybe rejection? Climax??

... Dammit... Februari is damn too long...eitherway... I am sure the ending will bring out my manly tears

Last edited by moncikoma; 2010-10-02 at 16:20.
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Old 2010-10-02, 16:06   Link #165
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Oh jeez... You guys overreact way too much.
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Old 2010-10-02, 16:59   Link #166
moncikoma
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Can't wait to watch the 2nd trailer... Or
The full trailer..

I hope there will be a full trailer which included in the hybrid BD package itsuwari uta hime.
So we can excpect the full trailer to come out around a week..
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Old 2010-10-02, 17:10   Link #167
magnuskn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reelyanoob View Post
I can't believe some people on here are still like, "oh Kawamori is SURE going to give me the ending I wan't - THIS TIME" after how the series ended.

btw If a writer is NOT trolling you, he's not doing his job.
Yes, a show about a triangle romance... how dare they bring resolution to it! That's so clichť, romance shows should always end with an open ending, so that merchandise revenues can be maximised. Who cares about storytelling integrity but old-fashioned people?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dash_Hunter View Post
This image is the same they used in Ep7 to explain cybernetics and implants, copare them:
So i think that person is no one in particular (or maybe Grace)
Yeah, that looks even more similar to another than the one with a young Sheryl getting treated for ( or getting infected with ) the V-Type infection. But why then blur out the face? ^^

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dash_Hunter View Post
Oh and count me in the pessimist Sheryl fans too, not because it's a Ranka centered movie but because now that in this story Ranka is Alto's friend/childhood friend, and I have the impression they will go with the cliche about chilhood friends
Oh, come on. Macross series are not really known for following clichťs.
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Old 2010-10-02, 18:43   Link #168
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Originally Posted by justavisitor View Post
I was so upbeat when I heard you guys saying there are so many RankaxAlto moments in the trailer...and then I watched the trailer...damn nothing special imo XD


I think the ending will be similar with the TV series....3 ppl living together happily ever after
But Kawamori, please prove me wrong and give me a RankaxAlto ending
You know... I really disliked Ranka's character in TV series... But I think that a Ranka x Alto ending in the 2nd movie , as long it makes sense, will be more bearable than the one presented to us in episode 25: A Harem, cheesy, and heavily focused on fanservice ending.

It may be a bit off-topic but I have to spill it out. I've been watching anime for many years, and one of the things that I realized about the changes in anime industry is that how much the romance aspect is becoming more and more developed and realistic. Generalizing might be a wrong thing to do but what I am noticing nowadays is that the writers/directors are trying to give us proper resolutions instead of an open-ending or "safe" ones, even on series that doesnít have romance as the main focus. Harem endings are getting less and less common, and probably the Harem genre is trying to reformulate itself.
Recently, Ken Amatsu, the creator of Love Hina, a very popular series, gave an interview and then he said that the Harem genre is ending or something along those lines. Well, I think that itís not the case, maybe they are just trying to take a different approach. Maybe people are getting tired of unrealistic characters and/or relationships in fictional works, and want to find more situations that they can relate to, and the creators were probably smart enough to notice this; and then tried to come with new ideas. I found myself very pleased when I was watching some one of those recent harems shows that have a huge amount of fanservice. Surprisingly enough, the creators focused on a particular girl, that was not the main heroine but was clearly the best choice, gave her a decent amount of development, and her relationship with the main guy became the more developed one, by far surpassing the other girlís.

Macross is a series that I've always admired because of its originality. It is a story that tells us about romance, war and music at the same time, all mixed together, and it stills sounds serious, convincing, very dramatic and surprisingly deep. (Letís put Macross 7 aside for nowÖ)
When I watched the last episode of Macross Frontier, two years ago, I got extremely pissed, and itís not just because of the unsolved love triangle, it was the whole presentation of the episode that really hurt me. It sounded like a huge musical videoÖ it was rushed, colorful, and they gave us a horrible remix of most songs like they are trying to tell us: "Hey, listen how good these songs are!!!". So, everything was covered in a happy and "love-and-peace" aura that destroyed all the previous drama build-up in the past 24 episodes to me.

On SDF Macross, Minmay was singing horrible pop music like "My boyfriend is a pilot" in the middle of a war for humanity survival. But the mood was totally different than the last Macross F battle. It felt like everyone was in a bloody battle, fighting for the lives; people are dying, suffering, getting desperate as their loved ones are dying in front of themÖ So, while doing this, they at least gave us a decent portrayal of a war. It was still sad, painful, even with all of those pop songs in the background. Then here comes the point, in SDF Macross, those songs were used as a tool to end the war, they are not the main focus, but part of the war itself. While in the end of Macross Frontier, theyíve become the first priority, and so on the war became like a big scenario to present an overload of songs. Itís seemed that they put the fanservice in first place. Furthermore, they wanted to please everyone, and gave us an unsolved conclusion of the romance part. Thus, the balance between war, romance, and music was broken.

The last episode of MF, through my eyes, got the same weird vibes that Iíve found in some of Kawamori's works like Macross 7, Sousei no Aquarion and most recently Basquash! Itís like they try too hard to present us everything as colorful and cheesy as possible, with a shounen-like touch. Itís a bit difficult to explain, but series like these sometimes are a bit too "commercial" and unrealistic to me. Because they often only focus in some elements that can easily please the audience; like brainless action, gorgeous presentation, fanservice, and "effective but plain" dialogues, and almost always forget to give us some serious character development and storytelling.

I am not saying that this is a "wrong" thing to do, and while MF episode 25 definitely had some of those elements, the whole series is still far from being a totally commercial show.
I'm not against fanservice or a more commercial approach in Macross series. It was product after all; and created to be profitable in the first place. I just hope that the movies does not forgot of what makes Macross so special to fans like myself, and give us a more "balanced" ending.
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Old 2010-10-02, 20:03   Link #169
justavisitor
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@Elazul
That's a pretty good post....and I think I have a few things I want to say

First of all, pop songs aren't always bad (I am pretty sure you didn't imply that, but let me just continue)...in the movie DYRL, the title song was originally a pop song from the alien culture, so it's no surprise that Macross Frontier just picks up this tradition and uses pop songs at the end. Of course, did the MF staff use those pop songs in the right way in the last episode? That's open to discuss I guess. Personally I think it's ok...and yeah, last battle was kind of like a happy party but I felt fine with it...it was like the show had many frustration (michael's death, Grace and Leon's evil plan, it's either human or vajra, etc...) and at the end everyone comes out, takes the burden off, beats the evil guys, and everyone is happy at the end...I am ok with that, because in MF it was about Grace and Leon took advantages of Vajra and Human, and I really enjoyed the ending when Human and Vajra cleared the misunderstanding, united and finished Grace once and for all...but if you put that kind of ending into other shows, like gundam 00, then perhaps I would feel otherwise...but I think MF is ok to have that kind of the ending...having said that, I fully aware that others may think the ending of MF is unrealistic and they probably have their points...

Talking about realistic, don't you think it would be realistic that Macross should allow polygamy?? Based on the setting, different cultures (living with the aliens) in the same ship, and the need to survive, grow, and prosper when they explore the new planets..etc. Sure, the original macross was still 1 guy and 1 woman but that was the time before the space exploration/colonization...

So, normally I like to watch one guy end up with one girl, but for macross, I have no problem accepting RankaxAltoxSheryl (of course, I am a ranka fan so rankaxAlto would be much better for me )...because I think it could be "realistic" and possible in macross universe...of course, that's just me
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To all old and new Sheryl fans:
I am a Ranka fan and I have significant experience in defending various "crimes" committed by Ranka, from her evil plan to terminate human races, to feeding inapporiate food to unknown lifeforms. If you think you find "new" charges aginst Ranka and you are interested, or you care to see how a particular Ranka fan would respond, please feel free to check my previous comment. There is a good chance that I have answered a similiar issue. And of course, my viewpoints do not necessarily represent other perspectivs from numerous Ranka fans in this planet

Last edited by justavisitor; 2010-10-02 at 20:19.
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Old 2010-10-02, 23:08   Link #170
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Elazul: You should watch older anime. Most of them were NOT open endings. The open ending type shows started becoming popular I'd say, in the mid to late 90's. Probably about the time you started watching anime. When I started watching anime in the mid to late 80's, open endings on romance aspects of the stories were few and far between.
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Old 2010-10-02, 23:50   Link #171
Elazul
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@justavisitor

Polygamy does happen in our society but itís too a very delicate matter that defies various morals values and thus not acceptable in most cultures.
When I wrote about realism, it was meant to be about characters behaviors and situations that most people can relate to. Anime is a fictional work that aims to reach a certain audience. I bet that most people who watch anime donít want to see a story (which takes itself seriously) involving polygamy. It will be pointless, unnecessary polemic and even offensive to many.
Also, polygamy now is less common than it used to be in the past centuries. Youíre simply assuming that in the MFís fictional future polygamy will become more acceptable, when the humanity took the opposite direction. Though Macross is set in on a futuristic universe, it is painfully obvious that the creators used our todayís society as a basis, including our moral values, social institutions, etc. So, there is nothing in the whole Macross series that give us signs that polygamy is an acceptable.
Furthermore, a polygamous ending in MF is totally out of question. If we think about Sheryl, Ranka and Alto and all of their character development, we can easily realize that none of them will accept such a thing in the first place; it would be totally out of character. Second, the whole romance aspect is focused on a love triangle. It was not, by any means, about polygamy.

@ justinstrife

I am already doing this. I watched Kimagure Orange Road and Maison Ikokku in the past year... Both of them are very good with really great endings in my humble opinion.
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Old 2010-10-03, 02:11   Link #172
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Looks like we got to see more of Ranka, which I find a bit disappointing in the sens their concept of making one Movie for Sheryl and one movie for Ranka is a bit too (aka each girl gets her moment of glory)...'expected', 'simplistic', 'cliche'? Sheryl's and Ranka's fans got each what they want though

So it looks like the retelling still goes on, and I have a mixed feeling about it: should we be worried? @__@ While we obviously got many shots of the earrings, I'm not too sure where this is going on, and Ranka definitely got extra points with the beach scene, they really made it look good >//<

I'm also wondering about all the SherylxAlto scene of the end of the series (when he decides to stay by her side, they live together, when she goes to his house etc...): will they crop them all or most? Because if it's Ranka centered, they can't really include so much Sheryl related material ^^;

I guess my point is: they either didn't want to spoil us and showed a bit of both girls on purpose, or...there will be no resolution to the LT and I don't think I could bear with that, after desperately waiting for 2 years for a conclusion to it ;__;
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Old 2010-10-03, 07:05   Link #173
choji
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elazul View Post

I am already doing this. I watched Kimagure Orange Road and Maison Ikokku in the past year... Both of them are very good with really great endings in my humble opinion.
KOR is really epic shit; series are great and the two movies that give the resolution are brilliant. Man, good days.

Anyway, just watched the trailer-teaser, and i am so disappointed so far; needs WAY moar Sheryl. Half the trailer i was contemplating being between OTL and ORZ seeing so much Ranka, ehhhh. But anyway, it is just a teaser, so..

Also, in regards to the epic scene in MF#22, there better not be replaced by some shitty angst scene, where Sheryl is on her own crying and Alto is running away or something with manly tears. DNW, we want sex scene people.
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Old 2010-10-03, 10:03   Link #174
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Originally Posted by Elazul View Post
@justavisitor

Polygamy does happen in our society but itís too a very delicate matter that defies various morals values and thus not acceptable in most cultures.
When I wrote about realism, it was meant to be about characters behaviors and situations that most people can relate to. Anime is a fictional work that aims to reach a certain audience. I bet that most people who watch anime donít want to see a story (which takes itself seriously) involving polygamy. It will be pointless, unnecessary polemic and even offensive to many.
Also, polygamy now is less common than it used to be in the past centuries. Youíre simply assuming that in the MFís fictional future polygamy will become more acceptable, when the humanity took the opposite direction. Though Macross is set in on a futuristic universe, it is painfully obvious that the creators used our todayís society as a basis, including our moral values, social institutions, etc. So, there is nothing in the whole Macross series that give us signs that polygamy is an acceptable.
Furthermore, a polygamous ending in MF is totally out of question. If we think about Sheryl, Ranka and Alto and all of their character development, we can easily realize that none of them will accept such a thing in the first place; it would be totally out of character. Second, the whole romance aspect is focused on a love triangle. It was not, by any means, about polygamy.
Agree many many thing you say here...and got to be honest that I prefer RankaxAlto ending 1.0x10^20 times more than the RankaxAltoxSheryl ending...


I guess it comes down to how the audiences enjoy their animes then..I am the type who likes to put the setting into a more serious consideration...yes, you have your point (the staff using present values in MF, character development etc), but it's just that when I look at the setting of MF, they may have a chance of doing it (polygamy), due to the assumptions I made in my previous post....and when there is a slight possibility that polygamy is okay in this show, then I am ok to accept a harem ending

But if you ask me, do I like a harem ending in other series like A Town where you live, I''s, video girl, Suzuka, Ichigo 100%, etc...my answer would be no because those setting definitely do not allow polygamy XD
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To all old and new Sheryl fans:
I am a Ranka fan and I have significant experience in defending various "crimes" committed by Ranka, from her evil plan to terminate human races, to feeding inapporiate food to unknown lifeforms. If you think you find "new" charges aginst Ranka and you are interested, or you care to see how a particular Ranka fan would respond, please feel free to check my previous comment. There is a good chance that I have answered a similiar issue. And of course, my viewpoints do not necessarily represent other perspectivs from numerous Ranka fans in this planet
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Old 2010-10-03, 10:19   Link #175
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Originally Posted by justavisitor View Post
Agree many many thing you say here...and got to be honest that I prefer RankaxAlto ending 1.0x10^20 times more than the RankaxAltoxSheryl ending...


I guess it comes down to how the audiences enjoy their animes then..I am the type who likes to put the setting into a more serious consideration...yes, you have your point (the staff using present values in MF, character development etc), but it's just that when I look at the setting of MF, they may have a chance of doing it (polygamy), due to the assumptions I made in my previous post....and when there is a slight possibility that polygamy is okay in this show, then I am ok to accept a harem ending
...ok. So serious = polygamy?
Lolol, nice.

I consider polygamy really lulzy in fiction and it would never, EVER fit with Macross or any kind of show that is not actually harem or idk what.

And there better be resolution in the second movie concerning the damn triangle /if that is even considered triangle, cause i never did consider it; i mean, it is not like SDF M, where Hikaru was standing between two sides but ended up leaning ultimately to Misa. In MF, Alto is clearly having a lot of chemistry with Sheryl, yet we get this shoved-ass trolling ending, which basically says 'oh, yeah Alto's actions might show this and that, but we gonna end it like this because we can. and we shall troll hur dur/ because it gets to the point where it is annoying; inevitably one side is gonna end up 'hurt' but that is how shipping works dahlings.
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Old 2010-10-03, 10:57   Link #176
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lol, I am pretty sure I didn't mean "serious=polygamy", I just meant I like to explore the setting more...

Hope I clarify that part XD

And I think Alto has a lot of chemistry with Ranka also...but of course, I fully understand this where is where our difference lays, so I will just stop here

and I don't think we got a troll ending
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Come and join Ranka Lee Fanclub !!! Join our club and you will see
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To all old and new Sheryl fans:
I am a Ranka fan and I have significant experience in defending various "crimes" committed by Ranka, from her evil plan to terminate human races, to feeding inapporiate food to unknown lifeforms. If you think you find "new" charges aginst Ranka and you are interested, or you care to see how a particular Ranka fan would respond, please feel free to check my previous comment. There is a good chance that I have answered a similiar issue. And of course, my viewpoints do not necessarily represent other perspectivs from numerous Ranka fans in this planet
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Old 2010-10-03, 10:58   Link #177
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And there better be resolution in the second movie concerning the damn triangle /if that is even considered triangle, cause i never did consider it; i mean, it is not like SDF M, where Hikaru was standing between two sides but ended up leaning ultimately to Misa. In MF, Alto is clearly having a lot of chemistry with Sheryl, yet we get this shoved-ass trolling ending, which basically says 'oh, yeah Alto's actions might show this and that, but we gonna end it like this because we can. and we shall troll hur dur/ because it gets to the point where it is annoying; inevitably one side is gonna end up 'hurt' but that is how shipping works dahlings.
Sounds to me like one side already IS 'hurt.'
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Old 2010-10-03, 11:03   Link #178
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Sounds to me like one side already IS 'hurt.'
Well, we got all on our side but the actual ending. And that only by non-resolution. It kinda sucks when an excellent show like Frontier ends so weakly. That generates resentments.
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Old 2010-10-03, 11:06   Link #179
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Well, we got all on our side but the actual ending. And that only by non-resolution. It kinda sucks when an excellent show like Frontier ends so weakly. That generates resentments.
Really? I didn't think the ending was weak at all.
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Old 2010-10-03, 11:08   Link #180
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Your prerogative if you want to overlook the structural weaknesses for flashy space combat. Not that the space combat was bad.
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