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Old 2010-10-12, 17:51   Link #101
Decagon
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If it was that popular this topic would probably be seeing a lot more traffic. Since Animesuki is more or less the western portal for anime discussion in this format I think it should be a good metric for the anime community at least. I think the amount of fanfiction you see for it would also be a good indicator for where it is in western fandom as with a lot of underdeveloped characters and open relations, it's really easy to jump into especially for self inserts.
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Old 2010-10-12, 22:51   Link #102
Leo_Otaku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe4evr View Post
Probably the people who first heard of the Bad Apple!! video on the Cirno News Network.
LOL truly!

Well like seriously over here people's knowledge on things are pretty much =0. It would be cool if it actually produced some cool fans rather than people cosplaying it to be cool/in. They just waste their money on bootleg shit that pops out all over this city. It is really hard to find real merchandise in stores because it is mostly knock-offs. Their ignorance doesn't help either.

So what I mean is I don't want to go and see Touhou along with Hastune Miku and see it everywhere here. I bet you anything none of them have ever used a Vocaloid software before(which is fine) or have knowledge about it. They or just cosplay it because it is cute/ seen youtube videos. Now there is so much bootleg Miku merchandise everywhere (in my city). I never imagined it to be around here.

People were requesting the Alstroemeria "Bad Apple" version for their "dance" at the convention this year. But they simply requested it just "Bad Apple I hardly think they even know that it is the name of the stage theme.

I used to go to the convention but I can't stand it anymore. It is full of second rate fans. I also know the video will probably not reach them but I just fear it from happening.

I bet I sound like some mean bitch now

Last edited by Leo_Otaku; 2010-10-13 at 01:02.
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Old 2010-10-12, 22:53   Link #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decagon View Post
If it was that popular this topic would probably be seeing a lot more traffic. Since Animesuki is more or less the western portal for anime discussion in this format I think it should be a good metric for the anime community at least. I think the amount of fanfiction you see for it would also be a good indicator for where it is in western fandom as with a lot of underdeveloped characters and open relations, it's really easy to jump into especially for self inserts.
This thread has now 6 pages of comments and this was announced some weeks ago. All we have is one PV (camrip!) with a handful of animation and a tiny bit of information.

Compare it to Kuragehime, for instance, which has been announced for months, has a craploads of promotional material out there and information avaible for people to discuss.

There are few threads here in the Upcoming board which managed to hit 6 pages before the show actually started, let alone only two weeks or so after the announcement. I think it's a clear indicative that Touhou is well-known enough as is, and it's not some short OVA (which is what it seems it'll be) that will make a whole lot of new "retards" show up.

Then again, my two cents. But I can't help but think that, for something with so little information about it and such an uncertain release format (shown at some con, no confirmation of a DVD release or whatsoever), this has gotten more attention than pretty much anything else around here lately.

That said, I do understand how people feel about this, but I don't agree with the concept of a "second-rate" fan. Liking something because it's cute is as good a reason as just about any other you could give. I like the games myself, but I have some friends who can't get into it because of the shmup genre, so they just enjoy the fandom side of things. Am I a better fan than them because I like the games? I don't know. I don't think so, but that may change depending on other people's point of view. All in all, though, this whole talk would lead into more and more off-topic, so maybe we should stop here.
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Old 2010-10-12, 23:44   Link #104
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There is a whole lot more involving the definition of second rate fan quality of things. I failed to mention most of which would be very OT indeed. It is really just a different discussion in general and it is also hard to explain in a forum. It is really the knowledge that is lacking really.... I could only compare to what it would be like over here if Touhou in general reached a degree of fandom.

Any rate >.>
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Old 2010-10-13, 22:36   Link #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue-kun View Post
This thread has now 6 pages of comments and this was announced some weeks ago. All we have is one PV (camrip!) with a handful of animation and a tiny bit of information.
Implying 6 pages after 2+ weeks translates to being popular
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Old 2010-10-13, 23:06   Link #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue-kun View Post
Yes, because Touhou is completely unknown by now and most of the people into anime and such never heard of it before and are only going to take notice of it because ufotable is now producing some short animation with its characters.

Well, no. Everyone knows Touhou nowadays. It won't change a thing. It's not like when EoSD was released, when few people in the west even cared about the games enough.

As for the trailer itself, looking great. I just hope we actually GET to watch this. Weren't they going to air it at some con or whatever? It doesn't seem like it's the sort of stuff that's guaranteed to get a DVD release.
Unknown to casual anime fans, yes. I, e.g., knew of something called Touhou for years, but had no idea it was a game until about six months ago. Not that I'm everybody, but I'm just saying, there's at least one person who didn't always know that Touhou is only officially a game.

There's also a strange tendency for some anime fans to auto assume that every cartoon in Japan is based on a source manga, or maybe is original. Maybe because video game-based cartoons are few, and because a lot of them suck.
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Old 2010-10-13, 23:14   Link #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komari View Post
Unknown to casual anime fans, yes. I, e.g., knew of something called Touhou for years, but had no idea it was a game until about six months ago. Not that I'm everybody, but I'm just saying, there's at least one person who didn't always know that Touhou is only officially a game.

There's also a strange tendency for some anime fans to auto assume that every cartoon in Japan is based on a source manga, or maybe is original. Maybe because video game-based cartoons are few, and because a lot of them suck.
Oh, alright. That may very well be true, regarding the 'casual anime fan'. I wasn't exactly taking those into consideration. On the other hand, I never pictured those as the kind of people which Leo_Otaku seemed to have a problem with, seeing as I don't see them voice very strong opinions about much of... anything. At least that's my view of things around here where I live!

Still, I was trying to generalize the whole thing, but it's a fact that Touhou is such a hit nowadays that it's very rare for you to run into a person who hasn't even heard about it. Popping up at CNN, being constantly used for doujin stuff that's released on Comiket -- it's alarming, actually, every passing year it seems like there are more and more Touhou inspired thing -, along with other things make Touhou something very well-known to the more 'hardcore' anime fan, at least. Especially since those usually don't stop at anime, and end up getting in touch with games and manga and whatever else shares some sort of relationship to the anime industry.
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Old 2010-10-14, 07:45   Link #108
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On casual anime fans & Touhou: Yes there are anime fans who only heard of Touhou but never bothered to check about it and would not even know it was a shooter series to begin with.

On "secondaries": What a "secondary" is depends on the Touhou fan you ask. It could be someone who discovered Touhou through videos like "Bad Apple" or "Marisa Stole the Precious Thing", someone who discovered through doujins (I know a irl nanoha fan who got converted to Touhou after reading a few touhou yuri doujins, go figure), someone who stumbled upon one of the MANY remixes of the soundtrack, someone who started through the fighting games spin-offs (I got called a secondary after having told that I discovered Touhou through Immaterial And Missing Power and flat out said that I am horrible at the shooters), etc...

It's NOT bad to discover Touhou through these ways, one fan just cannot drag a casual to the computer and force him to play the danmaku game at gunpoint. What's embittering the fans about the "secondaries" are their blatant refusal to learn more about Touhou and their characters, and how they are characterized, with the help of official materials such as the games themselves (matter being tricky due to ZUN putting his foot down regarding people posting the endings of the games, as in no spoilers please), and taking any fan interpretations of the characters and their relationship as official. This result in the clash between fan interpretations and ZUN's words regarding characters like Koakuma (seen as the Patchouli's moe servant or a lustful succubus by the fans and just a mischievous nameless devil according to ZUN), or Momiji being long seen as a helpless moeblob exploited by Aya until ZUN made official in Double Spoiler that Momiji and Aya often gets into fights. Then there is the whole thing about Alice being a tsundere or a friendless asocial freak running about in fandom, or Hong Meiling being utterly incompetent, sleeping all the day through and miserably treated by the rest of the mansion. While Touhou is pretty malleable itself, fans (those who hold a scornful opinion of 'secondaries' and memetic mutations) generally don't like when ZUN's characters are grossly deformed, in characterization, beyond all recognition.

I think that it IS what fans are lamenting about, regarding the state of the fandom. It have grown, dawrfing stuff like Nanoha or Haruhi or Rozen Maiden, yes that is awesome, but to the point that some of the newer fans are churning out works that grossly misinterpret characters. This is not to say that some of those OOC acts are not enjoyable (I for one like Colonel Aki's work and laugh once in a while over Sogetsu's (sp?) "Oneesamaaaaaaaa" Youmu) but some of them are just as bad and disheartening as the xxxxxxxnth NanoaFate doujin or fanfic.
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Old 2010-10-14, 08:08   Link #109
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@Sheba So it's just a case of fans that didn't do the proper reading, prancing around as if they know everything about Touhou?
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Old 2010-10-14, 18:53   Link #110
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That is my real annoyance with the fans here for anything. I wouldn't even call some of them fans because of their lack of knowledge that leads to incompetence. That is what I really was trying to get at. I can go on with specifics but will be off topic again ^-^" I don't ever think Touhou will reach a large audience like say Hatsune Miku over here, unless a full length anime series or movie was created.
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Old 2010-10-14, 22:33   Link #111
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I don't hate people that are lacking of knowledge. I only hate people who think they know everything and keep on blabbering without even bother to double check what they are saying. It's fun to see how the fan interpret characters' personality, but when they tell you "you are wrong" just because you have different view, it gets annoying fast, and I know thing will get worse if there is official anime of Touhou.
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Old 2010-10-15, 00:13   Link #112
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Their incompetence is exactly just that and more, with their lack of knowledge of the point they are debating goes nowhere. Many factors, many factors.

On another topic which characters do you think they will show other than we have seen? I would think Remilia at some point would make the most sense and we can't have her without Sakuya.
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Old 2010-10-15, 00:51   Link #113
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Actually, how many of us knew about Touhou before this? Reading back on the posts in this thread it seems like all of us who posted knew of Touhou, barring the odd ambiguously worded posts. Considering how many Touhou MADs and remixes are sprinkled around the net youtube, an anime might not make that much of a splash with new fans unless it really plays to a genre. Maybe if they try their hardest to not make the characters moe, the fanbase won't even shift .
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Old 2010-10-15, 01:15   Link #114
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I'm just worrying about the word "official", actually, but maybe we should stop it here.

On topic, even though I really want to see Remilia, for some reasons I don't think she will make an appearance here. Maybe Yukari is fooling around again, and Flandre just happens to be part of it and goes rampart in Tokyo while Sakuya is looking for her. Still....can't make a connection between them and Anime Tenchou .
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Old 2010-10-15, 02:41   Link #115
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Still....can't make a connection between them and Anime Tenchou .
Yup, this makes sense, in any angle I can't see even the tiniest bit of details connecting those 2
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Old 2010-10-15, 03:46   Link #116
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In the video when Tenchou's in the classroom, the blackboard has scribbles of places in Gensokyo. Kinda like a rough map made from bubbles. I could only make out Tenkai, the human village, and the Sanzu river--rest of the stuff is too blurry.
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Old 2010-10-15, 03:55   Link #117
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Animate trying to expand their market into Gensokyo?
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Old 2010-10-15, 04:18   Link #118
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Animate trying to expand their market into Gensokyo?
ZUN is the last boss?
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Old 2010-10-15, 05:51   Link #119
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ZUN is the last boss?
Only if he can shoot beer cans and bottles danmaku.
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Old 2010-10-15, 06:19   Link #120
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ZUN is the last boss?
Try to fight Gensoukyou's creator god with danmaku and you'll just end up in a beer bottle ready to go down his throat....
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