Hayate no Gotoku manga (raw discussion only)

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Used Can

I think things are heading the way I've thought they would for quite some time. Nagi seems to be outgrowing the need to be constantly guarded by Hayate. It seems this is her very first step on independence. Of course, she's got a long way to go before she becomes actually independent and Hayate will be watching over her while she gives her first steps.

This is good development, I believe. I want to see more of Luca, though, and what that Yozora girl is up to.

soon she won't need hayate at all and Athena will step in and repay his debt and take him away

[Bastion_Arcion]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

soon she won't need hayate at all and Athena will step in and repay his debt and take him away

He'll still have his loyalty of protection to Nagi, even Athena won't be able to take that away.
Unless Nagi orders him away (like Athena did), he'll never leave Nagi willingly.

[mitsuganae]

Turning momentarily to the real world, I find it interesting that the current arc is unfolding amidst an anime season with shows that are about being an otaku (Bakapacuman, The World Dog Only Knows, Orekillmoe, etc.). Must be something in the air.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion

He'll still have his loyalty of protection to Nagi, even Athena won't be able to take that away.
Unless Nagi orders him away (like Athena did), he'll never leave Nagi willingly.

or when Hayate realize that what Nagi needs eventually to stand on her own is without Maria or him hoovering in the background.

[Wolfnagi]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

or when Hayate realize that what Nagi needs eventually to stand on her own is without Maria or him hoovering in the background.

But then again,
She still needs them to at LEAST survive (well, every kids need their guardian right?????)

@mitsuL The World Dog Only Knows.....
lol xD

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

or when Hayate realize that what Nagi needs eventually to stand on her own is without Maria or him hoovering in the background.

I doubt he'll ever do that. His attitude toward Nagi is the same of a father. A father never thinks his daughter is old enough.

However, I think Nagi becoming independent, little by little, is a good thing on many different levels. To begin with, it is really good for her character development. It also makes the manga more interesting, and it's good to take it from the slump it was in. It also adds the possibility that, since Nagi may reach a point in which she becomes independent enough, she decides to let Hayate go (i.e. assuming he hasn't fallen for her, and/or that Nagi learned that he's not in love with her and about what actually happened back when they first met), so that he can starts a relationship with one of the other girls. That, or since Nagi may have been developed enough, she may actually start a relationship with Hayate.

Originally Posted by Wolfnagi

But then again,
She still needs them to at LEAST survive (well, every kids need their guardian right?????)

Listen to this man.

[Xellos-_^]

Originally Posted by Used Can

I doubt he'll ever do that. His attitude toward Nagi is the same of a father. A father never thinks his daughter is old enough.

However, I think Nagi becoming independent, little by little, is a good thing on many different levels. To begin with, it is really good for her character development. It also makes the manga more interesting, and it's good to take it from the slump it was in. It also adds the possibility that, since Nagi may reach a point in which she becomes independent enough, she decides to let Hayate go (i.e. assuming he hasn't fallen for her, and/or that Nagi learned that he's not in love with her and about what actually happened back when they first met), so that he can starts a relationship with one of the other girls. That, or since Nagi may have been developed enough, she may actually start a relationship with Hayate.

not gonna happen

Listen to this man.

i didn't say he needs to leave immediately, just when his leaving will do the most good.

[madmac]

I doubt he'll ever do that. His attitude toward Nagi is the same of a father. A father never thinks his daughter is old enough.

However, I think Nagi becoming independent, little by little, is a good thing on many different levels. To begin with, it is really good for her character development. It also makes the manga more interesting, and it's good to take it from the slump it was in. It also adds the possibility that, since Nagi may reach a point in which she becomes independent enough, she decides to let Hayate go (i.e. assuming he hasn't fallen for her, and/or that Nagi learned that he's not in love with her and about what actually happened back when they first met), so that he can starts a relationship with one of the other girls. That, or since Nagi may have been developed enough, she may actually start a relationship with Hayate.

Exactly this. No matter how it ends, Nagi growing up is the key that breaks the stalemate and allows the manga to move forward towards an (eventual) conclusion. It's no wonder Hata has been emphasizing how important this arc is.

[Wolfnagi]

Originally Posted by madmac

Exactly this. No matter how it ends, Nagi growing up is the key that breaks the stalemate and allows the manga to move forward towards an (eventual) conclusion. It's no wonder Hata has been emphasizing how important this arc is.

And you guys HAD to realized that now......
Its actually rather simple,
Nagi's Arc = Plot-wise Arc,
Anybody else except Hayate, A-tan and Maria = Fillers, and yes, its also include Hina

[Used Can]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

not gonna happen

Can you prove that? Mind you, I do not think the manga has been developed in a way that Hayate and Nagi will end up together. I've said that plenty of times in this thread. But that's all I can do. I have no idea what Hata plans to do with this manga.

Just be careful when you take things for granted. The world goes round, and it sometimes brings something back to slap you in the face. This is just a friendly piece of advice.

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

i didn't say he needs to leave immediately, just when his leaving will do the most good.

I think there are higher chances of him and Nagi ending up together, than him leaving Nagi's side on his own accord. If Hayate ever leaves Nagi's side, in my opinion, it will be because he's got strong feelings for another girl AND because Nagi let him go. The latter being the most important condition for him to even consider leaving her side.

Originally Posted by Wolfnagi

Anybody else except Hayate, A-tan and Maria = Fillers, and yes, its also include Hina

I wouldn't call them fillers. Hina is basically the heroine of the story, since she's always helping pretty much everyone. Even if she's not really connected to the core of the plot, she's been engrained so much to the story, that she's become an almost integral part of it. Ayumu is also following those steps, since she's pretty much becoming someone who can tie all the characters. Not to mention she's becoming very important for Nagi and Hina, because they rely on her for advise, since Ayumu is, emotionally, much more mature than them.

They may be support characters, but they are so relevant to the story, that referring to the moments in which they receive focus as fillers, in my opinion, is just wrong.

[mitsuganae]

Jeez, it seems that things always fall back to the ground that is shipping. When all is said and done, shipping is only a single aspect of character use/development. Which reminds me -- I wish Hata would give something that distinguishes Risa a bit more. Miki has her Hinagiku crush and Izumi has her meeting with Hayate from waaay back, but Risa is just . . . there, as a chorus member. Even minor characters need something distinguishing.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by mitsuganae

but Risa is just . . . there, as chorus member.

She's a miko.

[mitsuganae]

Originally Posted by GDB

She's a miko.

Yeah, but IMHO that's not terribly distinguishing. Unless of course it starts to play a larger role in the plot.

[madmac]

Jeez, it seems that things always fall back to the ground that is shipping. When all is said and done, shipping is only a single aspect of character use/development

It's the single biggest obstacle to keeping a conversation going, yes. (Not that I can claim complete innocence.)

Sometimes it seems the only thing you can do is avoid talking about any of the "main" (Nagi, Athena, Hina) girls too much. Anyone who doesn't have a huge shipping base is easier to discuss without getting sidetracked by shipping wars.

Risa is just . . . there, as a chorus member. Even minor characters need something distinguishing.

Risa does feel different to me then the other two, but it's hard to put it into words...She's like the brash, aggressive one, I guess. She's also simultaneously the dumbest and most self confident member of the group. I'd also say she has the simplest motivations--Miki is sneaky, but Risa just straight up enjoys messing with people.

It's true though that she has virtually no background or character development and what is there (Miko) is almost entirely unused.

Still, I think she works well enough. Not every support character needs to be well-rounded and three dimensional.

[mitsuganae]

It's always a great pleasure to know your thoughts, madmac. I suppose my desire to have Risa a bit more fleshed out exists because it seems that almost all the other characters surpass her in terms of development/background. I mean, her fellow chorusmates, Yukiji, and even Tama are more fleshed out. To me, the only character that is less fleshed out is Shiranui. It all seems a little unfair for poor Risa. But as you said, she works well enough.

[Bastion_Arcion]

Originally Posted by madmac

Risa is just . . . there, as a chorus member. Even minor characters need something distinguishing.
Risa does feel different to me then the other two, but it's hard to put it into words...She's like the brash, aggressive one, I guess. She's also simultaneously the dumbest and most self confident member of the group. I'd also say she has the simplest motivations--Miki is sneaky, but Risa just straight up enjoys messing with people.

It's true though that she has virtually no background or character development and what is there (Miko) is almost entirely unused.

Still, I think she works well enough. Not every support character needs to be well-rounded and three dimensional.

While I agree that Risa needs more development, there are hints being dropped that Hata does have a deeper character for her than simply a trouble-making Miko.
During her travel with the other two, she did hint that she had kissed a guy, which might indicate she's a Hero Of Another Story just waiting to be told. Maybe she'll get an arc later on, when the story's back where Hata is happy with the way things are going/working/flowing/whatever again.
And maybe she'll get to shot another reptile, and explain why she carries a tranq gun.

About him leaving Nagi eventually, it's not going to happen. He has his promise of eternal protection over her (at the same time he thinks of his promise of eternal love for Athena), though I don't think that'll extend to romance.
That's not to say he, possibly, won't fall in love with Nagi, he's just going to protect her beyond the space of romance.
Even if she orders him to leave her side, he'll still find a way to protect her because of that promise.

[Mentar]

To give other character's shippers a chance to participate in the next Popularity Contest, too:

There's an online version which normal people can use, too. Doughnut Gunso wrote a small Howto on his blog here:

http://doughnutgunsoshayatereport.wo...how-do-i-vote/

And to help with the names a bit for those not proficient with moonrunes, here the most important ones translated:

o Hayate                             o Nagi                          o Maria
o Athena                             o Hinagiku                      o Ayumu
o Chiharu                            o Sakuya                        o Isumi
o Wataru                             o Saki                          o Izumi
o Miki                               o Risa                          o Tama

[Arabesque]

Ooh, thanks! I might just participate tomorrow when I have some free time, though I'm split on which character to vote for (Athena, Hina, Nagi, Isumi and hell even Hayate all had amazing moments this past year, so I need to think about it for a while)

For favorite chapter, that's a bit easier for me. It's down to Athena Vs. Isumi, Nagi breaking the King Jewle, or Athena farewell. I'll need to find out what's the correct volume numbering for them though ...

[Used Can]

Spoiler for Latest chapter:

This was an, all in all, good chapter, in my opinion.

1. Hayate coslaying.
2. Athena hentai-dōjinshi poster.
3. Luca disguising herself as what seemed like some 2ch meme.
4. Whatshisname... Ayumu's little brother showed up again, and bought a dōjin from Nagi, making her realise the pleasure of a successful commercial transa... I mean, the pleasure having your dōjinshi sold, and thus, she started to slowly gain back her determination, and she also gave Luca some (indirect) encouragement when she defended her dōjinshi.
5. Yozora apparently can use magic as well.

Originally Posted by Arabesque

I'll need to find out what's the correct volume numbering for them though ...

Wikipedia is your friend.

[Rah]

If you went on MFox you'd know about the Athena doujin n' Yozora's magic show already. Anywayz, Hayata is MOE!