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View Poll Results: To Aru Majutsu no Index II - Episode 5 Rating
Perfect 10 50 47.17%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 24 22.64%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 15 14.15%
7 out of 10 : Good 11 10.38%
6 out of 10 : Average 3 2.83%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.94%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.94%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 0.94%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 106. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2010-11-07, 21:12   Link #121
Marcus H.
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You don't understand how powerful The Book of the Law is. It is thousands or millions of times more powerful than any nuclear weapon on Earth. Plus, they have no intentions of using the power, just telling Agnese to "back off, we have a very powerful weapon, and we're not afraid to use it".
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Old 2010-11-07, 21:20   Link #122
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Still its suprising that I get to see Kaori fall in love with Touma so soon, Iv read about it that she does fall in love with him in the novel, wikipedia and from forums.

But to see it and believe it is another thing, it really was adorable to see her blush like that to Touma.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:22   Link #123
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Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
You don't understand how powerful The Book of the Law is. It is thousands or millions of times more powerful than any nuclear weapon on Earth. Plus, they have no intentions of using the power, just telling Agnese to "back off, we have a very powerful weapon, and we're not afraid to use it".
Then they didn't need to properly decode it, just bluff.

Sorry, this arc just had too many logic holes for me.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:26   Link #124
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While I am the biggest moe-nut I know, this direction for Kaori's character may not be the best idea:

Making her vulnerable, indecisive and "cute" has the same effect of what happened when the same was applied to Kanu Unchou of the Ikkitousen franchise:

Damage of character integrity.

Both warrior women are defined by the fact that they are (legally) adults who are the sole voice of reason, maturity and dignity amongst the women of the cast.

For crying out loud, we are already more than satisfied with a cast of adorable 14 to 16 year old Tsunderes, nuns, busty glasses clad shy cuties, mikos and psycho twin tailed lesbians. Yay, I'm taking Kuroko-chan AND Index-chan home with me!!

There is NO need to lower a dignified and honorable Lady Warrior, a noble Dragon Amongst Men, to the level of a helpless and vulnerable child to further pander to the indiscriminant need for cuteness.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:32   Link #125
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There is NO need to lower a dignified and honorable Lady Warrior, a noble Dragon Amongst Men, to the level of a helpless and vulnerable child to further pander to the indiscriminant need for cuteness.
Well, I like it. But- this is exactly what happened in the light novels, so I can't really complain. But Kanzaki can still kick rear no matter what- but honestly, couldn't you see this coming? I certainly did from the Angel Fall arc.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:42   Link #126
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Originally Posted by Yui Is My Wife View Post
While I am the biggest moe-nut I know, this direction for Kaori's character may not be the best idea:

Making her vulnerable, indecisive and "cute" has the same effect of what happened when the same was applied to Kanu Unchou of the Ikkitousen franchise:

Damage of character integrity.

Both warrior women are defined by the fact that they are (legally) adults who are the sole voice of reason, maturity and dignity amongst the women of the cast.

For crying out loud, we are already more than satisfied with a cast of adorable 14 to 16 year old Tsunderes, nuns, busty glasses clad shy cuties, mikos and psycho twin tailed lesbians. Yay, I'm taking Kuroko-chan AND Index-chan home with me!!

There is NO need to lower a dignified and honorable Lady Warrior, a noble Dragon Amongst Men, to the level of a helpless and vulnerable child to further pander to the indiscriminant need for cuteness.
Well...

It might not help that she... uh, wasn't that "dignified" and have that cold(-ish) persona to begin with. Her coldness stemmed from her being unable to save Index from losing her (Index) memories of her (Kaori) and the aftermath of it.
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Last edited by Master Assassin; 2010-11-07 at 22:59.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:53   Link #127
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Then they didn't need to properly decode it, just bluff.

Sorry, this arc just had too many logic holes for me.
Ding ding ding. If it's that dangerous, why in god's name would you have anyone even touch the damn thing. It should have been buried in some vault underwater where nobody has access to it instead of trying to decode it. Did they mention if you can burn or destroy the book or not? This arc was a mess.
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Old 2010-11-07, 22:59   Link #128
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Ding ding ding. If it's that dangerous, why in god's name would you have anyone even touch the damn thing. It should have been buried in some vault underwater where nobody has access to it instead of trying to decode it. Did they mention if you can burn or destroy the book or not? This arc was a mess.
Index mentioned before this episode that they don't burn.

Touma did ask "If it's that dangerous, why don't you just burn it?"

Index: "Magic books don't burn."
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Old 2010-11-07, 23:07   Link #129
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They tried nukes before using it(on Japan) in a controlled environment. I mean you're about to kill someone off and you're not even sure if it works. I mean Index tried the exact same method so someone knew it didn't work.

Rome Catholic and Angelican don't share information too often, Index isn't going to tell which method works or not, she does all the decoding in her head.

And you're not getting my point, they do not want the book decoded at all. No they're not going to take that chance, no they don't need that power at all. and yes they would resort to killing her if they deem so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sackett View Post
Then they didn't need to properly decode it, just bluff.

Sorry, this arc just had too many logic holes for me.
lol and if the bluff doesn't work?


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Originally Posted by Jarmel View Post
Ding ding ding. If it's that dangerous, why in god's name would you have anyone even touch the damn thing. It should have been buried in some vault underwater where nobody has access to it instead of trying to decode it. Did they mention if you can burn or destroy the book or not? This arc was a mess.
Maybe you should try paying attention to the previous episodes instead of blindly yelling out plotholes?

No, you cannot destroy magic books, that's the problem in the first place. The second best thing they could do is to seal it. However that means that people would still find reasons to fight for them.

Orsula was trying to decode the book because she figure by understanding how the book is written, she might be able to find a way to destroy them. That is why she wanted to decode the books, and this is obviously against the wishes of the Church cause despite all their talk, those who control the grimoire control a very powerful weapon and they wouldn't want it destroyed.
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Old 2010-11-07, 23:34   Link #130
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destroy the book
The only way to destroy any original grimoire without resorting to Imagine Breaker is to decode it first. And do you even remember what happens when you even try to read and understand the text of an original grimoire? Learn to pay attention.
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Old 2010-11-07, 23:54   Link #131
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Destroy magic books? Index pointed that out already that the reason why they are sealed instead of destroyed is because they can't be done so.

Decode? Look back to episode 1, one of the possible consequences of trying to understand a grimoire. A normal magician reduced to the level where cats can injure them.
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Old 2010-11-08, 05:38   Link #132
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Orsula was trying to decode the book because she figure by understanding how the book is written, she might be able to find a way to destroy them. That is why she wanted to decode the books, and this is obviously against the wishes of the Church cause despite all their talk, those who control the grimoire control a very powerful weapon and they wouldn't want it destroyed.
I think they very much want the book destroyed. After all, the grimoire's power is specifically to destroy all of Christianity. The Catholic Church doesn't get a lot of use out of that, I imagine. Can't really tell heretics, "Stop blaspheming or we'll destroy ourselves!" Deicide is very, very bad for a religion. But as has been said, destroying the tome is impossible, so they keep the book sealed away.

I'm curious how Orsula was able to decode the book--albeit unsuccessfully--if she didn't have access to the Vatican's secret library. Apparently they put digital copies of religion-ending magic tomes on their library computers so students at Seminary can write their dissertations?
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Old 2010-11-08, 06:20   Link #133
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I think they very much want the book destroyed. After all, the grimoire's power is specifically to destroy all of Christianity. The Catholic Church doesn't get a lot of use out of that, I imagine. Can't really tell heretics, "Stop blaspheming or we'll destroy ourselves!" Deicide is very, very bad for a religion. But as has been said, destroying the tome is impossible, so they keep the book sealed away.
I suppose it's both? They want to get rid of this heretic book, but they cannot risk someone gaining it's power.

Look at it this way, even if Orsula doesn't intend to use the Book of the Law, what happens if someone were to kidnap her and coerce her into revealing it? The Book is nothing without a decoder, and since you can't destroy the book, you kill the decoder.

You know, they never did explain why the Book is considered so dangerous, aside from the whole 'end the age of Christianity' thingy. It was said that the original author of the Book of the Law, 'Edward Alexander', was able to summon an 'Angel'.

Angels in Toaruverse are beings that beyond powerful, they have spells that can affect the planet on a global scale as well as control other celestial bodies like the Sun and stars.

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Originally Posted by Kamonichan View Post
I'm curious how Orsula was able to decode the book--albeit unsuccessfully--if she didn't have access to the Vatican's secret library. Apparently they put digital copies of religion-ending magic tomes on their library computers so students at Seminary can write their dissertations?
I don't recall all the details, but I do remember that they had replicas of the Book for display purposes. She might not need the entire book, just a few pages to study the code.

Or maybe she had access to the real Book, but nobody thought she could actual do it?

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Old 2010-11-08, 07:25   Link #134
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I suppose it's both? They want to get rid of this heretic book, but they cannot risk someone gaining it's power.

Look at it this way, even if Orsula doesn't intend to use the Book of the Law, what happens if someone were to kidnap her and coerce her into revealing it? The Book is nothing without a decoder, and since you can't destroy the book, you kill the decoder.

You know, they never did explain why the Book is considered so dangerous, aside from the whole 'end the age of Christianity' thingy. It was said that the original author of the Book of the Law, 'Edward Alexander', was able to summon an 'Angel'.

Angels in Toaruverse are beings that beyond powerful, they have spells that can affect the planet on a global scale as well as control other celestial bodies like the Sun and stars.

I don't recall all the details, but I do remember that they had replicas of the Book for display purposes. She might not need the entire book, just a few pages to study the code.

Or maybe she had access to the real Book, but nobody thought she could actual do it?
Yeah, I got that much. A lot like how in war, they have a soldier escort radiomen who know military codes. "Don't let it fall into enemy hands," and all that. It makes sense, but I'm still sad that, once again, the Roman Catholics are the "conniving bad guys" in this arc. Touma declaring that there's "no rule saying they have to be the enemy next time" made me happy, though.

By the way, why was it that Kanzaki was just an observer? I couldn't really understand her role in this arc. I mean, I got that the Amakusa are trying to make up for apparently getting slaughtered in previous battles and want to follow "a righteous path" because Kanzaki felt guilty for their deaths, but really, I didn't get why Kanzaki was there at all. Her role seems kind of forced and contrived in this arc. I'd rewatch it, but the parts where she's on screen seemed mostly throw-away.
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Old 2010-11-08, 07:30   Link #135
Marcus H.
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She was the main reason why the Amakusa were fighting for their beliefs. However, she has decided that she wants them to learn to fight without her presence, so that they can develop on their own. One can call Kaori's care for Amakusa as somewhat motherly, don't you think?
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Old 2010-11-08, 07:34   Link #136
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I think they very much want the book destroyed. After all, the grimoire's power is specifically to destroy all of Christianity. The Catholic Church doesn't get a lot of use out of that, I imagine. Can't really tell heretics, "Stop blaspheming or we'll destroy ourselves!" Deicide is very, very bad for a religion. But as has been said, destroying the tome is impossible, so they keep the book sealed away.

I'm curious how Orsula was able to decode the book--albeit unsuccessfully--if she didn't have access to the Vatican's secret library. Apparently they put digital copies of religion-ending magic tomes on their library computers so students at Seminary can write their dissertations?
Okay I tried to stay away as on this kind of topic but I can't anymore I even ignored the previews episode but since it's the end of the arc....

first and foremost how the heck does the book of law was send to the japan to begin with. Well the Roman Catholics use it for making their religion bigger. They plan to display it on a museum now look at that why would they display a grimoire on a museum just for ordinary japanese to look at it and be evangelize to become a catholic. But like an ordinary citizen can even understand such thing. Well for an ordinary citizen a grimoire is just a book. Look at index she doesn't have mana that's why she's the store or library of books.

Theirs a borderline of magicians and espers. One who doesn't release an Aim is not an esper and can become a magicians. Now they are displaying it to see a possible recruit. Look at Agnese background story. She's in dumps. The anime skips the part where she even eats garbage and cockroach to survive. But the Roman Catholics found her and find potential on her and recruit her.

They use the book and their gospel to find recruits and make their over 2 billion member more bigger. Now back to the grimoire of why even show it to the public. Well a magician would be toasted if he/she reads it but an ordinary citizen without magic training or any kind of training in manipulating mana would probably take less damage but their would be a reaction. And if their is a reaction their is potential.

Now the troublesome part is here. If you had potential it's either join or be abandon or worst be killed by the Roman Catholics. Remember the Roman Catholics of toaruverse are the same when the Roman Catholics are still not known around the world. They go to your country conquer you and spread their words. Dark Times.

Now back to the book of LAW. The book of law is known for "MAGICIANS" that it would lead to Christianities end but it's not like a normal citizen would understand such thing because for them it's just a book. For a magcian a grimoire is poison. Look at episode 1. They purposely show it so you would understand on what would happen when a lowly magician tries to "PEAK" a "BIT ONLY" on the grimoire. Ouma from episode 1. Still didn't fully acquire the book he need. His still beginning to read it but the damage is that fatal already. Now if a magician tries to decode that book of law. Imagine what would happen. Many tried to decode but many was sacrifice too and all that sacrifice are in vain to begin with. Because all lead to "wrong" answer. It's not the answer that they expect it would lead them too.

To destroy a grimoire one needs to know it's content because hidden on it is the way to destroy it. Grimoire are protected with the magic knowledge embedded on it. The knowledge itself is the poison that would rot your brain.

Now onto the book of law again. Why was it in japan? for advertisement or gospel or channelization or just for the sake of "ordinary people" to know christianity. To become wildly known. But when the news of the "book of law" is being sent to japan for displaying of course magicians would be interested on it and not just ordinary people. Magicians that want to destroy the reign of Roman Catholics. It works as a way to spread Roman Catholics and also a trap to lure on who wants to end it. That's why I said it's either join, abandon or be killed law.

The roman catholics sealed the original book of law inside the deepest vault of vatican library which is protected by vatican. Now if you want to go agains the roman catholics headquarters then you need to at least bring down an arch angel level to go against them.

Their are lots of copies of book of law. But that's useless for magicians because it doesn't had the knowledge they need but can be used as a reference for grimoire decoders like Orsola. Orsola evangelize and spread the word of god and with it she also studies grimoire and ways to destroy it. And the book of law being the most dangerous she wants to destroy it the most.

Roman catholics doesn't had a single reason on wanting it to be decode even if it would lead to destroying it because the even if at first you want to destroy it. The knowledge might poison your mind or you would ended up drunk by power and ended up going against them.
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Old 2010-11-08, 07:39   Link #137
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By the way, why was it that Kanzaki was just an observer? I couldn't really understand her role in this arc. I mean, I got that the Amakusa are trying to make up for apparently getting slaughtered in previous battles and want to follow "a righteous path" because Kanzaki felt guilty for their deaths, but really, I didn't get why Kanzaki was there at all. Her role seems kind of forced and contrived in this arc. I'd rewatch it, but the parts where she's on screen seemed mostly throw-away.
Actually, I agree with this statement, I don't see why Kanzaki needed to appear in this arc except as a reason for Necessarius to get involve. Originally this was an internal matter for the RCC there's no need for Stiyl or Index to help them. But because Necessarius fears the political backlash should Kaori side with the Amakusa, they sent Stiyl, Index and Touma to assist.

As for Kanzaki's motive, she just wanted to see if the Amakusa have strayed from their path, and whether they could carry on without her or would they just fall apart.
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Old 2010-11-08, 09:36   Link #138
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lol and if the bluff doesn't work?

Because if they don't really intend to use the magic book, but just threaten that they will then it's a bluff anyways!

They are already planning to bluff. They don't plan on actually using such destructive power. So why do they need to actually decode it? Just bluff that they decoded it as well.

Look- it didn't even need to change the plot. Someone could point out that a bluff is dangerous and commits them to a high risk of being called on it. Then they decide to go with Touma's plan- which is fine by me, that would make sense.

But instead they made it seem like the problem was that the decoding wasn't correct, which made the bluff impossible.

You all got your fanboy blinders on. I like A Certain Magical Index, but this arc just sucked. There is some potential there in the story, but the execution was terrible.
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Old 2010-11-08, 09:52   Link #139
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Well, again, we'll let the text provide some insight.

Spoiler for Volume 7, the planning part:
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Old 2010-11-08, 10:00   Link #140
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End result Touma is back in the hospital Again lol and we got to see Kaori blushing like mad and looking cute as hell i heard this was going to happen didnt think i would see it so soon but im looking forward to more
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