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View Poll Results: Kami nomi/TWGOK - Episode 7 Rating
Perfect 10 34 40.48%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 21 25.00%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 14 16.67%
7 out of 10 : Good 10 11.90%
6 out of 10 : Average 4 4.76%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 1.19%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 84. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2010-11-18, 05:28   Link #41
fukarming
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Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
I think Keima's character's a bit tricky to adapt in anime form... I mean I also feel he's cooler in the manga, all detached and in-control and all, but on the other hand, he must appear pretty sincere to the girls.

With a still, silent image in a manga the reader can at the same time understand that he just wants to get the job done and isn't really embarrassed, but is still acting convincing to the girl. In the anime however, if he didn't act convincing, the viewer would wonder how all the girls are falling in love with someone who seems so cold (especially considering the premise-- gal gamer tackles real girls with great success-- is pretty far out to begin with).

I do prefer his manga portrayal but I think the anime staff had a tough character to work with. :\


Oh yeah. This episode. Concert was a bit long, but cool. I liked Kanon's first song. Also I had the same reaction as LeaD36 at that one scene with Kanon...
I reread the manga and Kanon and Keima's confession scene is almost a frame to frame adaptation. Keima did blush when Kanon get close to him.

But then I also agree that Keima gives out an impression to be much cooler in the manga than his anime counterpart. My theory, is that Keima is shown alot more calculating in the manga, so its blushing scene is "cancel out". In the manga it is obvious that Keima is expecting Kanon to "have one last event", it is not as obvious in the anime.

While I understand the producer want to sell CD, I think they go overboard with this episode.
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Old 2010-11-18, 06:18   Link #42
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- That orchestral piece playing when everyone was searching for Kanon was f***ing epic. Felt like I was playing an RPG in a critical plot point dungeon.

- Overall, loved the addition of Citron's back story, the best part is when she sang their song at the very end. That was such a nice ending.

- That weird "Kanon! Kanon!" chanting totally ruined the mood for at that time they were doing it.
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Old 2010-11-18, 07:05   Link #43
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The scene itself is anime filler. However, it's anime filler that makes sense and actually flows very well with the manga. I can tell you this. Your questions do have definite answers. Just that they won't be answered in this season. Or for quite a while after actually looking back on it.
I hated that flashback. At this point of the story, it doesn't make sense at all.
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Old 2010-11-18, 08:17   Link #44
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Originally Posted by quigonkenny View Post
You're never going to catch the references in the series if you can't even catch the answer to your question in a previous post...


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Originally Posted by Divini View Post
- That weird "Kanon! Kanon!" chanting totally ruined the mood for at that time they were doing it.
Yeah, that sounded awfully odd. I wonder if they mixed it.
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Old 2010-11-18, 08:50   Link #45
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Excellent episode. I thoroughly enjoyed it. 9/10

This was a very slick and well-done production. I believe somebody else mentioned one of the pieces of background music, and I agree that the background music in this episode really made everything feel epic, with a considerable gravitas. The anime did a good job of properly conveying the scale of the events of this episode.

This was more than one girl's heart or one lost soul on the line (which is important in and of itself, of course); this was a major concert, with thousands standing to be very disappointed (and a few standing to possibly lose their jobs) if Keima doesn't save the day. Thankfully, he did.


I'm surprised that this episode isn't more well-received. I can understand initial dislike at Kanon's character, but her backstory and psyche is so well-developed and fleshed out, I'm surprised that more people weren't eventually won over by her.

Also, it's nice to see Keima's more tender side come out. I also think that helps to show that there's a tragic and very sympathetic element to his character, one which might be of later importance thematically. He goes through the process of helping all these different girls, and basically entering into short romances with them, and yet he has to say goodbye to all of them. I don't care how cold or cool a person is; that has to start wearing away at you emotionally, over time.
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Old 2010-11-18, 08:57   Link #46
risingstar3110
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Why Keima so far is not as cool in the anime as in manga??? I guess because his phrase line "I can already see the ending" does not give a strong impact ...yet...

And there is still plenty of time to fresh out his character. I mean, i didn't like Keima as a character until that arc with that cute cat (the one with the ribbon). Back when i read up to Kanon arc, i actually enjoy following Elsie only. But now, Keima's my most favourite male character

That's why i'm a bit impatient about the slow development in this arc . Because I afraid S2 will not process well if the good stuffs in later episodes are not aired soon. Even when the anime put up near prefect adaptation so far+ use well original screens. That final 1 minute of her singing Citron's song to keep up her promise, for example. Brilliant!! Some sides of Kanon's character (her view on Citron for example) were not explored well in the manga comparing to this

Anyway, didn't recognise the "Ghost In The Shell" reference until someone mention it. And it was in the manga as well... i'm failed at that xD
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Old 2010-11-18, 09:56   Link #47
MartianMage
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I just finished watching this episode and I must say that I enjoyed this arc a lot more than I did with the manga. The flow of the episode is nice with the additional scenes. It also left a better impression of Kanon for me.

I'm giving this a 9/10. I'm not bashing the animation but I just wish it was better. Would be 10/10 for me if that was the case.

edit: I love the ending pic :P

Last edited by MartianMage; 2010-11-18 at 10:31.
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Old 2010-11-18, 10:01   Link #48
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I personally liked the build up made the ending more heart warming... Keima's getting more into reality too.
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Old 2010-11-18, 10:13   Link #49
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
This was a very slick and well-done production. I believe somebody else mentioned one of the pieces of background music, and I agree that the background music in this episode really made everything feel epic, with a considerable gravitas. The anime did a good job of properly conveying the scale of the events of this episode.

...

I'm surprised that this episode isn't more well-received. I can understand initial dislike at Kanon's character, but her backstory and psyche is so well-developed and fleshed out, I'm surprised that more people weren't eventually won over by her.

Also, it's nice to see Keima's more tender side come out. I also think that helps to show that there's a tragic and very sympathetic element to his character, one which might be of later importance thematically. He goes through the process of helping all these different girls, and basically entering into short romances with them, and yet he has to say goodbye to all of them. I don't care how cold or cool a person is; that has to start wearing away at you emotionally, over time.
I do agree with that this was a very well made episode. I thought that this was the first time the background music truly shined in the anime, and I've liked how many of the scenes harmonized with the music.

And that's really all what I liked about this arc. The music and visuals in this episode. I felt that this story didn't need this long to convey, and it could've been told in 2 episodes had they cut down on trying to showcase her songs. Also, while she certainly received a great deal of time to develop, the amount of padding in between those moments made it very tedious.

Personally, I'm apathetic towards Kanon herself, but at the same time I disliked this arc. I wasn't sure why when I was reading it, but the anime made it clear for me. It's really a journey into a pop idol mind and I found it to be a very bland one. To me her story was about her ''not getting enough attention'' until Kemia pointed out for her all the fans who care about her and that she'll be disappointing them if she doesn't get a grip. It made her look very self-centered and for lack of a better word atm, bratty.

Kemia involvement was also something that bothered me. We noticed how he is showing more and more of an attachment with the girls he makes these brief romances with and is undergoing small bits of development to become a more empathetic person, but in this arc, his connection with the target is almost nonpresent. Kanon only noticed Kemia because he was ignoring her, and after she got what she wanted, it didn't matter to her if the two couldn't be together.
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Old 2010-11-18, 10:31   Link #50
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Personally, I'm apathetic towards Kanon herself, but at the same time I disliked this arc. I wasn't sure why when I was reading it, but the anime made it clear for me. It's really a journey into a pop idol mind and I found it to be a very bland one. To me her story was about her ''not getting enough attention'' until Kemia pointed out for her all the fans who care about her and that she'll be disappointing them if she doesn't get a grip. It made her look very self-centered and for lack of a better word atm, bratty.
I know what you mean. Usually an idol needs to reminded there are people who care about her for who she really is. But that wasn't the point of her problem. She didn't think she could do anything on her own. That is the focal point and that is what Keima had to fix. That's why Citron was shown in the beginning of the episode.

Quote:
Keima involvement was also something that bothered me. We noticed how he is showing more and more of an attachment with the girls he makes these brief romances with and is undergoing small bits of development to become a more empathetic person, but in this arc, his connection with the target is almost nonpresent. Kanon only noticed Kemia because he was ignoring her, and after she got what she wanted, it didn't matter to her if the two couldn't be together.
I think we are supposed to see how unconnected he is with the girls right now. Part of his character growth will be opening up to them - he's a male tsundere.

Also, Keima could have released the soul sooner but he didn't. I guess he went for the true end instant of the good.
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Old 2010-11-18, 10:47   Link #51
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Originally Posted by Arabesque View Post
I do agree with that this was a very well made episode. I thought that this was the first time the background music truly shined in the anime, and I've liked how many of the scenes harmonized with the music.

And that's really all what I liked about this arc. The music and visuals in this episode. I felt that this story didn't need this long to convey, and it could've been told in 2 episodes had they cut down on trying to showcase her songs. Also, while she certainly received a great deal of time to develop, the amount of padding in between those moments made it very tedious.
Personally, I felt that the showcasing of Kanon's songs were one of the highlights of this arc; that they made it stand out (in a good way) from other arcs.

I'm surprised that this many anime fans seem to not like jpop. To me, getting to listen to pretty catchy (and with comprehensible lyrics!) jpop songs during a few episodes was a real treat.

I guess that there's no accounting for taste, of course, but I'm pretty sure that the makers of this anime included all the jpop songs in part because they felt that most anime fans would naturally like them (why else are the overwhelming majority of anime OPs done to jpop music?).


Quote:
Personally, I'm apathetic towards Kanon herself, but at the same time I disliked this arc. I wasn't sure why when I was reading it, but the anime made it clear for me. It's really a journey into a pop idol mind and I found it to be a very bland one. To me her story was about her ''not getting enough attention'' until Kemia pointed out for her all the fans who care about her and that she'll be disappointing them if she doesn't get a grip. It made her look very self-centered and for lack of a better word atm, bratty.
I don't see how she's different from most teenagers in this respect. Most teenagers crave attention and validation from others. Also, the flashbacks made it clear that there was a time in her life that she was very lonely and unnoticed, and she understandably does not want to go back there. Keima wisely pointed out to her that she's already a star, and basically that her old lonely life is forever gone. Instead of self-centered, I see her as someone incredibly humble, as she actually doesn't grasp just how popular she has become, and how a lot of that popularity has come from her own hard work and talent. That's what I found intriguing about her character. That here you have someone who's the center of attention; who literally has the spotlight on her; and she's the one who fears becoming invisible. Honestly, I found it an interesting character study, due in large part to its irony.

As an aside, if you're looking for a more unusual journey into a pop idol mind, I'd highly recommend the anime movie Perfect Blue to you.


Quote:

Kemia involvement was also something that bothered me. We noticed how he is showing more and more of an attachment with the girls he makes these brief romances with and is undergoing small bits of development to become a more empathetic person, but in this arc, his connection with the target is almost nonpresent. Kanon only noticed Kemia because he was ignoring her, and after she got what she wanted, it didn't matter to her if the two couldn't be together.
Well, maybe she took Keima's words to mean that he wasn't interested in a long-term relationship with her (i.e. him arguing how she doesn't need him). I'll admit that their final scene together felt a bit off to me as well. That part probably could have been done better, yeah.
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Old 2010-11-18, 10:57   Link #52
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[mod edit: answer to other question split off into its own thread]

As for my thoughts on the episode:

I'm of two minds.

Personally I prefer other arcs to Kanon. And there was a lot of extra that didn't really need to be there to tell Kanon's story. I really want the first season to get to a certain point because it would make a good ending point and hook for the next season. With the expansion of the Kanon arc that is still possible, but not as certain as I once thought.

However, trying to look at it from a non-manga viewer- this was probably a good decision. The extra additions, while not necessary, are also beneficial to telling Kanon's story and making it more about her and less about Keima. (One thought I had was that it seemed more like shoujo for some of her scenes- maybe it's intended to increase the appeal to female viewers too?). It was a well done expansion of the story.

Additionally, there are the financial considerations. Kanon is easily the most marketable of the first season girls. As the money maker if she provides the financial stability needed to continue production into a 3rd season when all the really good stuff will be, then I can hardly complain about her getting a little more treatment here. Plus it will actually improve the 3rd season plot wise as well, so it really is a no-brainer.

So my verdict is that as long as well get to the good stopping point with the first season, then I am not going to complain Kanon.

PS: As for Keima being passive this arc- well of course. That's how you have to play Yandere characters like Kanon. Keima went the correct Yandere route:

Ignore her until you force her to the edge of sanity, then surrender to her. Be a passive support for her during her possessive and inane listing of worries and insecurities. Wait for the real crisis to come. She comes to you for comfort. Reject the easy route of making yourself her reason for living, and instead convince her that she has self-worth of her own, regardless of what you or anyone else thinks.

It's really pretty basic. Keima knew what he was doing- avoiding the bad ends on a Yandere route is very important. Remember what he said last episode about dodging the situation if it seems to good to be true- because it's probably a trap.
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Last edited by relentlessflame; 2010-11-19 at 21:46.
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Old 2010-11-18, 11:12   Link #53
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A pretty generic ending but livened up with Keima actually being affected by his work, an impressive animated closing and the show generally doing what I feared it might try spoiling.

Blog post... tomorrow cause I'm sleepy heh.
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Old 2010-11-18, 11:37   Link #54
satomianzaki
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nice episode...good thing that kanon's arc has been resolved...

and elsie...so so cute...i can't really get enough of her...now really excited for the next episode...really really...
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Old 2010-11-18, 11:40   Link #55
thunder123456
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I vote this 'average'. The songs are just so-so, or maybe I have been expecting more than that. And the last thing I want to say is, even if I do not want to compare between manga & anime (since some of you may still not read it yet), they have been downgraded Keima so much. "We can use the loose soul sensor, Kami-sama!" What the hell is that! Wasn't that Keima's line >____< and what's up with the "I'll look everywhere!" >____< seriously man >____< Keima has been downgraded to an idiot... oh wait he really has the same VA with Yoshii-kun, hasn't he?
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Old 2010-11-18, 12:08   Link #56
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I vote this 'average'. The songs are just so-so, or maybe I have been expecting more than that. And the last thing I want to say is, even if I do not want to compare between manga & anime (since some of you may still not read it yet), they have been downgraded Keima so much. "We can use the loose soul sensor, Kami-sama!" What the hell is that! Wasn't that Keima's line >____< and what's up with the "I'll look everywhere!" >____< seriously man >____< Keima has been downgraded to an idiot... oh wait he really has the same VA with Yoshii-kun, hasn't he?
Well, it can't be helped if J-Pop isn't to your tastes.
Even if you say that, I don't see how Keima is downgraded.
About the idea of using the sensor, the fact that whoever of those two said that line is insignificant at this rate.
And it would only be noticed by manga readers (not like I remember)... which in fact wasn't yet. That said, the expressions didn't really change except for the blushing topic which in my opinion is also insignificant at this point.
Either way, his intelligence is surely uneffected by those minor differences which have been brought up so far.
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Old 2010-11-18, 12:12   Link #57
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the first song at the concert was nice. Happy Crescent gets old real quick.
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Old 2010-11-18, 12:13   Link #58
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The songs are nice and I love it. I gave it a 10. Though in this episode they pretty much said Kanon remembers Kami -_-
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Old 2010-11-18, 13:01   Link #59
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The songs are nice and I love it. I gave it a 10. Though in this episode they pretty much said Kanon remembers Kami -_-
I thought of that too but you know even in the manga I don't think it was established at all when the memory mod happens. AFAIK someone from hell needs to do it and it doesn't happen by itself.
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Old 2010-11-18, 13:41   Link #60
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I know what you mean. Usually an idol needs to reminded there are people who care about her for who she really is. But that wasn't the point of her problem. She didn't think she could do anything on her own. That is the focal point and that is what Keima had to fix. That's why Citron was shown in the beginning of the episode.
Which is silly because she's like Justin Timberlake after leaving 'N Sync, how can she think that she can't do anything on her own when she's the only member left from the trio and is a nation wide sensation? It really doesn't make sense. The flashbacks where people seemed to not notice her seemed more of a reason for her insecurities than this.

As Kemia having to solve things, well he didn't do much during these episodes. He only needed to ignore her long enough and then point out the obvious to her.
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Also, Keima could have released the soul sooner but he didn't. I guess he went for the true end instant of the good.
I hate how they'd try and be perfectionist in those Let's Play videos >_> some times the good ending is better than the true one.
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Personally, I felt that the showcasing of Kanon's songs were one of the highlights of this arc; that they made it stand out (in a good way) from other arcs.

I'm surprised that this many anime fans seem to not like jpop. To me, getting to listen to pretty catchy (and with comprehensible lyrics!) jpop songs during a few episodes was a real treat.
I do like a good number of Jpop songs, however I felt that they were plugging in too many songs in here and some of them I just didn't like. They did help make Kanon stand out, but an idol could stand out by singing one song an episode (see Sheryl Nome from Macross Frontier) But like I mentioned, this episode made the OST shine unlike the previous episodes where they were not that noticeable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I guess that there's no accounting for taste, of course, but I'm pretty sure that the makers of this anime included all the jpop songs in part because they felt that most anime fans would naturally like them (why else are the overwhelming majority of anime OPs done to jpop music?).
My gut is telling me it had more to do with a business strategy to target fans of character songs to buy single albums (what Sackett said about marketability) but I'm sure relentlessflame will show up and explain it to us more throughly on a chalkboard :P
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
I don't see how she's different from most teenagers in this respect. Most teenagers crave attention and validation from others. Also, the flashbacks made it clear that there was a time in her life that she was very lonely and unnoticed, and she understandably does not want to go back there. Keima wisely pointed out to her that she's already a star, and basically that her old lonely life is forever gone. Instead of self-centered, I see her as someone incredibly humble, as she actually doesn't grasp just how popular she has become, and how a lot of that popularity has come from her own hard work and talent. That's what I found intriguing about her character. That here you have someone who's the center of attention; who literally has the spotlight on her; and she's the one who fears becoming invisible. Honestly, I found it an interesting character study, due in large part to its irony.
That's an interesting interruption, though I don't agree with it fully. True, teenagers do seek acknowledgement from others (generally that's the case with all humans) however while you find Kanon as incredibly humble, I find it absurdly naive of her not to notice the legions of fans who worship her as a goddess, the fact that she's the only member left of her group who had such level of success and coverage. If she's not seeing it because she's such an airhead that she can't notice her surroundings or doesn't notice all of the fans that adore her, then that makes it worse than being self centered.

Granted, the irony does add an interesting undertone to the arc, though it doesn't make Kanon any more likable for myself (she's someone who has everything she needs right next to her, but is unable to see them despite how obvious it is)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
As an aside, if you're looking for a more unusual journey into a pop idol mind, I'd highly recommend the anime movie Perfect Blue to you.
I actually think I tried to see that movie a long time ago. Thanks for reminding me, I'm already in the mood to watch older anime so I might give it a view.
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Originally Posted by Triple_R View Post
Well, maybe she took Keima's words to mean that he wasn't interested in a long-term relationship with her (i.e. him arguing how she doesn't need him). I'll admit that their final scene together felt a bit off to me as well. That part probably could have been done better, yeah.
I would've like it more had Kanon came to the conclusion that she has many fans and people who adore her by herself, rather than make her look fickle. It made question what exactly was Kemia was to her and made their time together look very shallow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sackett View Post
PS: As for Keima being passive this arc- well of course. That's how you have to play Yandere characters like Kanon. Keima went the correct Yandere route:

Ignore her until you force her to the edge of sanity, then surrender to her. Be a passive support for her during her possessive and inane listing of worries and insecurities. Wait for the real crisis to come. She comes to you for comfort. Reject the easy route of making yourself her reason for living, and instead convince her that she has self-worth of her own, regardless of what you or anyone else thinks.

It's really pretty basic. Keima knew what he was doing- avoiding the bad ends on a Yandere route is very important. Remember what he said last episode about dodging the situation if it seems to good to be true- because it's probably a trap.
I ... don't think Kanon is a Yandere. She strike me as being incredible needy and/or either self centered (or if you go by Triple R's explanation, very humble or naive) who has tendencies to electrocute people who ignore her. She hasn't attempted to brutally murder anyone throughout her arc (unless you count the PFP).

===================================

Overall, I'd rate this episode 8/10 just for the OST and some of the clever scenes but the whole arc 5/10, i.e below average. I'm neutral towards Kanon herself, I think her problems are really shallow, and I didn't like many of the directions of this arc took (the ending and how she seemed so gung ho about shocking Kemia)
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