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Old 2010-11-04, 05:29   Link #221
Rhythm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
I checked, and the original text is this:

Spoiler for kanji:
The term in question doesn't mean "cheating", it means "conning", that is to swindle.

Araragi: "It's not like I'm doing something bad, and I'm not conning you[...]"
[...]
Senjougahara: "You are not doing something bad, huh [...] However, you might be conning me"

Senjougahara had met several swindlers before, so she was wary of supposed saviors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by omimon View Post
She thinks that your forehead is something that you need to protect more than your panties.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
This is explained in the novel, but not in the anime. In the novel Sengoku has the hair covering her eyes, so much that Araragi even doubts she can actually see well. So he tries to touch her hair to test it, but for Sengoku the hair is the "place to guard", so she dodges Araragi's hand with surprisingly quick movements. Then Araragi tries the opposite side, and grabs her skirt. No reaction at all from Sengoku, because she only cares about her hair. Araragi though understands flipping up her skirt is not very manly, so he desists.

EDIT: to be exact, it's the forelocks that she cares the most.
Oh wow I see, thanks for clearing all that up. That's pretty interesting actually, do we know the reason why she's so protective of her hair?
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Old 2010-11-04, 05:59   Link #222
Shikijin
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Originally Posted by Rhythm View Post
Oh wow I see, thanks for clearing all that up. That's pretty interesting actually, do we know the reason why she's so protective of her hair?
The title of her next story gives a clue:
Spoiler for otorimonogatari:
Also in Nisemonogatari
Spoiler for nise:
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Old 2010-11-04, 06:37   Link #223
omimon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
The title of her next story gives a clue:
Spoiler for otorimonogatari:
Also in Nisemonogatari
Spoiler for nise:
Yea, there's been a lot of talk lately about even thought Nisio said Nise 2 was the last book at the time that he actually planned everything out.
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Old 2010-11-10, 17:23   Link #224
Buddy Waters
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
I checked, and the original text is this:

Spoiler for kanji:
The term in question doesn't mean "cheating", it means "conning", that is to swindle.

Araragi: "It's not like I'm doing something bad, and I'm not conning you[...]"
[...]
Senjougahara: "You are not doing something bad, huh [...] However, you might be conning me"

Senjougahara had met several swindlers before, so she was wary of supposed saviors.
I think you've got the subject wrong here; Senjogahara is the one not doing anything wrong, and not being "zurui" (a word that needs to be translated in a lot of ways depending on the context.
He's recommending she be more "rakutenteki" -- the word I translated as carefree, and the subtitles originally referenced translated as optimistic.
This is why she doesn't seem to understand how she's being bold/confident; that line doesn't work if Araragi is the subject.

I think I specifically took zurui to refer to her testing him by parading around naked; that the confidence he was praising was actually part of that test, and therefore "zurui."

Last edited by CrowKenobi; 2010-11-11 at 21:20. Reason: The "EDIT" button is your friend...
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Old 2010-11-11, 05:34   Link #225
Shikijin
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Spoiler for the dialogue before:
I have only read what was before so far, anyway Senjougahara was talking about all the chances involved in her being saved by Araragi, revealing a certain skepticism. There is a brief derailment and then they are back to the subject of "optimistic" (which is optimistically specifically about Araragi ending up having helped her). The way I saw it Araragi was trying to win Senjougahara's diffidence about his own actions.

Thinking better though, your translation could be the correct one. Japanese doesn't require a subject for verbs, so who does what is a bit confusing at the times. In addition, the verb connected to optimistic, "omoeru" can also be used in impersonal sentences (thus the dictionary translates it with "appear" or "seem likely"), so there may have not been any subject in the first place.

"Zurui" simply implies the use of cunningness, so the proper translation may vary according to the interpretation (in fact not even rendering it with cheating is per se wrong). However I am inclined to believe they are talking about Araragi's actions, whoever is the zurui one.

Another thing: you translated 器のでかさ with "amazing performance". I don't know if this was what you implied, but I think it's a variant of
器の大きい (adj-i) tolerant (e.g. to others misbehaviour)

In this context, Hitagi was letting Araragi see her half-naked, so there is a degree of tolerance involved (which seems to fluctuate as Hitagi sometimes lashed out at Araragi even for lesser reasons).
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Old 2010-11-11, 13:13   Link #226
Buddy Waters
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
Another thing: you translated 器のでかさ with "amazing performance". I don't know if this was what you implied, but I think it's a variant of
器の大きい (adj-i) tolerant (e.g. to others misbehaviour)

In this context, Hitagi was letting Araragi see her half-naked, so there is a degree of tolerance involved (which seems to fluctuate as Hitagi sometimes lashed out at Araragi even for lesser reasons).
Utsuwa no ookii means a hell of a lot more than "tolerant"; in fact, most of the time it refers to someone's potential for greatness. I took it to mean Araragi viewed what she was doing as something no one ordinary would ever have managed. I'm less confident on that interpretation than I am on the subject issue, though.
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Old 2010-11-11, 14:44   Link #227
Shikijin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buddy Waters View Post
Utsuwa no ookii means a hell of a lot more than "tolerant"; in fact, most of the time it refers to someone's potential for greatness. I took it to mean Araragi viewed what she was doing as something no one ordinary would ever have managed. I'm less confident on that interpretation than I am on the subject issue, though.
I see, indeed most of the times it's "a person of high caliber". Only EDICT seems to use "tolerant". Probably it has that meaning only when used for sweet talk, in the sense of "closing one eye".

Well, I give up. I can't come up with anything without having read the whole thing, and even then I may be wrong. I apologize for having created more confusion than enlightenment.

EDIT: I think in the end the 器のでかさ was some kind of sarcasm related to the fact that in that occasion (今みたいに) Hitagi was half-naked. The key is the adjective 堂々. Looking among the possibile meanings, there was this on kotobank:
2 なんの隠しだてもないさま。こそこそしないさま。「正面切って―と戦う」「白昼―」
No secrecy, no stealthiness (a form of confidence after all). In other words Hitagi half-naked. 器のでかさ referred not to Hitagi in her entirety, but only to her quality of being 堂々, the extent of which she was unaware. Well, this is probably what you meant in the first place.

Last edited by Shikijin; 2010-11-11 at 16:48.
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Old 2010-11-12, 14:32   Link #228
Buddy Waters
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shikijin View Post
EDIT: I think in the end the 器のでかさ was some kind of sarcasm related to the fact that in that occasion (今みたいに) Hitagi was half-naked. The key is the adjective 堂々. Looking among the possibile meanings, there was this on kotobank:
2 なんの隠しだてもないさま。こそこそしないさま。「正面切って―と戦う」「白昼―」
No secrecy, no stealthiness (a form of confidence after all). In other words Hitagi half-naked. 器のでかさ referred not to Hitagi in her entirety, but only to her quality of being 堂々, the extent of which she was unaware. Well, this is probably what you meant in the first place.
Yeah. I definitely agree with everything here.
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Old 2010-11-15, 07:12   Link #229
Rhythm
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Wow...I'm just envious of just how much you guys understand Japanese.
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Old 2010-11-15, 14:50   Link #230
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Can somebody tell me what the timeline is for the novels, or at least the individual story arcs?
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Old 2010-11-15, 15:35   Link #231
Shikijin
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Originally Posted by Shadow5YA View Post
Can somebody tell me what the timeline is for the novels, or at least the individual story arcs?
This is a repost of stuff posted here by someone, slightly modified.
Spoiler for timeline of bake:
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Old 2010-11-21, 10:15   Link #232
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btw... when the whole forelocks things happened between nadeko and koyomi. when hanekawa arrived, why did nadeko suddenly run away?
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Old 2010-11-21, 10:34   Link #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wigwams View Post
btw... when the whole forelocks things happened between nadeko and koyomi. when hanekawa arrived, why did nadeko suddenly run away?
Same here. I think someone explained it before, but I forget now.
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Old 2010-11-21, 11:05   Link #234
omimon
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Originally Posted by Wigwams View Post
btw... when the whole forelocks things happened between nadeko and koyomi. when hanekawa arrived, why did nadeko suddenly run away?
She's not good with people she don't know I think.
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Old 2010-11-21, 22:37   Link #235
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hmm. but she was OK with kanbaru?
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Old 2010-11-22, 05:33   Link #236
omimon
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hmm. but she was OK with kanbaru?
Well Kanbaru is REALLY good with little girls if you know what I mean. Also we didn't the scene where they first met so we don't know.
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Old 2010-12-01, 20:11   Link #237
pampz21
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New here and I don't know where to read the novel so im just gonna ask this?
Araragi wasn't attack by the vampire but let her suck his blood?
and that Araragi likes Senjougahara but likes to preserve his friendship with everyone? so meaning he has feelings for everyone of them!

BTW I wanted ShinobuXKoyomi
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Old 2010-12-01, 23:31   Link #238
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Originally Posted by pampz21 View Post
New here and I don't know where to read the novel so im just gonna ask this?
Araragi wasn't attack by the vampire but let her suck his blood?
and that Araragi likes Senjougahara but likes to preserve his friendship with everyone? so meaning he has feelings for everyone of them!

BTW I wanted ShinobuXKoyomi
I want ShinobuxKoyomi too and it will happen just not now. Yes, he let her suck his blood in order to save her life. As for why he plays with other girls......hes a pervert, there really isn't a better answer than that.
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Old 2011-03-07, 03:53   Link #239
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Will there be a Season 2??? what is being released in septemeber 2011??? (i read it on wikipedia and was curious if it is an OVA)
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Old 2011-03-07, 05:59   Link #240
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Will there be a Season 2??? what is being released in septemeber 2011??? (i read it on wikipedia and was curious if it is an OVA)
Kizumonogatari the prequel story has be announced to be animated[see thread below this], though it's rumored to be a movie, the format nor date are confirmed currently.
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