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Old 2010-12-22, 19:15   Link #7441
madmac
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The only ones in the story that have seen the two interact, significantly (Athena may not realize it yet) and aren't convinced that they are head-over-heels in love with each other are the two themselves
Eh...not particularly. Nearly every comment anyone has made about the two of them is along the lines of "Hina is super mega popular so obviously anyone would want to be with her." It's the idea of competing with miss perfect that worries other girls (Nagi especially) more then the reality of the situation.

By the same token, Ayumu is the only one who really understands what Hina is going through. Miki might have her suspicions, but not much more then that.
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Old 2010-12-22, 19:55   Link #7442
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Originally Posted by madmac View Post
Eh...not particularly. Nearly every comment anyone has made about the two of them is along the lines of "Hina is super mega popular so obviously anyone would want to be with her." It's the idea of competing with miss perfect that worries other girls (Nagi especially) more then the reality of the situation.
Actually, Nagi's worried about Hayate's side of the argument and remains unconvinced about everyone's attempts to convince her that Hinagiku wouldn't fall for Hayate.
None of the other contenders are at all worried about Hina-tan being part of the harem.
Athena would actually have a bonus over that, since she apparently had the same level of popularity when she was going through school.

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Originally Posted by madmac View Post
By the same token, Ayumu is the only one who really understands what Hina is going through. Miki might have her suspicions, but not much more then that.
Ayumu is the one who's actually said that she knows, on the ferris wheel. Miki has made it clear that she knows, using the same method Aika did to show it, sending the two of them on a date. Maria actually foresaw that they would fall for each other before they had even met.
Just reading the expressions of the other characters when Hayate and Hina-tan try to deny it tells you that everyone knows.
The only one who's been shown to be interested in dating Hinagiku has been Koutarou, the rest just fawn over her.
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Old 2010-12-23, 04:55   Link #7443
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Well, this certainly was one of the better chapters in the recent weeks ^_^;

We get a transition into a new setting, and I'd say Love Hina is just around the corner. Let's have Ayumu move in aswell, and we're shacked up.

So what do we learn? Athena needs the power of the Shirosakura to "regain her power", possibly the power of royalty (would need the japanese raw to find out, I only found chinese raws and a translation). She heard "by rumors" that now Hinagiku is the bearer of Shirosakura, and seeing her threaten Hayate with it confirms the fact.

It should be noted that this feels like a minor plot hole. Hayate has seen the masked hero (Hina) fight with Shirosakura, yet he doesn't connect the dots, and neither did A-tan. Then again, those were hectic times, so I guess one can argue that they didn't notice.

So, with the help of Aika they make up a crazy story about a "Princess in training", and Hayate plays along when Mini-A-tan hands him the ring Hayate once gave to Athena. Yet, while he's willing to house and butler her, Hina is embarrassed to the bone playing house with Hayate as daddy, refuses and rushes off. Mini-A-tan sends Hayate off to retrieve her. And a clueless Nagi just wakes up.

Okay, so just as expected, it's all about A-tan seeking her "power" - probably the "power of royalty". She needs Hina's help for it, yet she doesn't ask her openly about it, but has Aika come up with this hare-brained "Princess in training" scheme. Then again, she doesn't tell Hayate the truth either.

Under how much compulsion she is remains to be seen. In the previous chapter she seemed very much in distress - in this chapter her eyes are pretty commanding and cold when she tells Hinagiku to tag along and Hayate to go get her back. There's one scene where she shows Aika a gadget which looks like a battery life indicator which looks almost depleted.

Anyway, I'm curious how this is gonna play out. Having to wait 2 more weeks feels nasty ^_^;
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Old 2010-12-23, 10:50   Link #7444
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I think this arc will be a good way to tie Hina in to the meat of the series while still allowing for some whacky hijinks along the way. She's just too popular to keep on the outskirts of what's going on, so using the sword is a nice way to do it. (Also explains why Athena was looking for Hayate's bro.)

While Love Hina-esque gags aren't really my thing, I'm looking forward to how Nagi reacts to all this.
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Old 2010-12-23, 10:58   Link #7445
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Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
It should be noted that this feels like a minor plot hole. Hayate has seen the masked hero (Hina) fight with Shirosakura, yet he doesn't connect the dots, and neither did A-tan. Then again, those were hectic times, so I guess one can argue that they didn't notice.
To be fair, Hayate's an idiot when it comes to connecting any dots.
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Old 2010-12-23, 11:31   Link #7446
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Originally Posted by musouka View Post
I think this arc will be a good way to tie Hina in to the meat of the series while still allowing for some whacky hijinks along the way. She's just too popular to keep on the outskirts of what's going on, so using the sword is a nice way to do it. (Also explains why Athena was looking for Hayate's bro.)
Can you pls refresh my memory what the connection is here? I think I forgot...
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Old 2010-12-23, 12:45   Link #7447
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Still feeling that we're going to 'end' the mini-arc with Hayate waking up and it all being his dream. His mind is connecting the dots of your plot hole and trying to be subtle about it XD Or maybe he just didn't consciously recognize that the sword Silver Red wielded was the same one Hina-tan pulled out.
Amused at the fact that the affection levels are clearly weighted towards Hinagiku and not Athena, despite his earlier confession that he loves Athena (though that might just be his 'I'm not a lolicon' complex).
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The world is winning.. by leaps and bounds.

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Old 2010-12-23, 12:54   Link #7448
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I think we can chalk Athene up another another chessmaster point. I like how she drops the cute act once she has all her pawns lined up. :/
I doubt it's 'just a dream', since it;s forming a coherent plot that seems to relate to past events, but that doesn't mean it's not filler.

By the way, some fridge logic (this side of fourth wall): To those of you who thought the events after EotW were 'uninteresting' or whatever.... how exactly did you make it though the ~200 chapters before that arc started? EotW was the outlier in terms of mood and events, and while I don't mind if you're only hanging around for the serious arcs at least don't complain about the rest of it, since that's what the series has been since the beginning. (I'm pretty sure Hata has said he doesn't even like doing serious story arcs, but don't quote me on that.)
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Old 2010-12-23, 13:13   Link #7449
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
Still feeling that we're going to 'end' the mini-arc with Hayate waking up and it all being his dream. His mind is connecting the dots of your plot hole and trying to be subtle about it XD Or maybe he just didn't consciously recognize that the sword Silver Red wielded was the same one Hina-tan pulled out.
i doubt it will be a dream kinda arc

Quote:
Amused at the fact that the affection levels are clearly weighted towards Hinagiku and not Athena, despite his earlier confession that he loves Athena (though that might just be his 'I'm not a lolicon' complex).
i didn't any of that in the chapter at all.
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Old 2010-12-23, 13:31   Link #7450
zodanhko
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I like how she drops the cute act once she has all her pawns lined up. :/

how exactly did you make it though the ~200 chapters before that arc started?
Pawns? I don't hate the sound of that. Hopefully, there's an opponent that she can play against with her pawns.

I either skimmed through the chapters or just skipped them entirely, at least to the ones I thought were boring.
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Old 2010-12-23, 13:32   Link #7451
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
i doubt it will be a dream kinda arc.
Sublimating his affections for the Athena of the past (and thus chibi-fying her), while focusing on his affections for the girl in his present that he does have affection for? Supposedly having had a kid with the girl he likes doesn't hit you with a sense of misplaced affections?
Several times now, he's shown to be attracted to Hina-tan, Ayumu even went so far as to say that she was perfect for him, maybe his mind finally got fed up with him denying that he actually does care for her.

Even though there are connections, they aren't connections that the characters have made, they're ones that the fans have made. The fourth wall may have been pounded into dust, but the wind hasn't blown it away yet.
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Arcion's is open for business. How would you like your hare-brained scheme?

Would people quit throwing my faith in humanity being intelligent a shovel?
... Apparently there are now people in existence who are unable to use a shovel.

Programming today is a race between programmers trying to create better idiot-proof programs, and the world creating better idiots.
The world is winning.. by leaps and bounds.

Body Language and Intonation can convey large amounts of information with a single word.
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Old 2010-12-23, 13:41   Link #7452
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
Sublimating his affections for the Athena of the past (and thus chibi-fying her), while focusing on his affections for the girl in his present that he does have affection for? Supposedly having had a kid with the girl he likes doesn't hit you with a sense of misplaced affections?
Several times now, he's shown to be attracted to Hina-tan, Ayumu even went so far as to say that she was perfect for him, maybe his mind finally got fed up with him denying that he actually does care for her.
hmmm..... you might want to give a few example or else Hayate is just nice to everyone or is trying his hardest to help A-tan? hahaha on second thought I rather not get involve but I don't see Hayate acting any different to any other girl beside A-tan.
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Old 2010-12-23, 14:03   Link #7453
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
Sublimating his affections for the Athena of the past (and thus chibi-fying her), while focusing on his affections for the girl in his present that he does have affection for? Supposedly having had a kid with the girl he likes doesn't hit you with a sense of misplaced affections?
Several times now, he's shown to be attracted to Hina-tan, Ayumu even went so far as to say that she was perfect for him, maybe his mind finally got fed up with him denying that he actually does care for her.

Even though there are connections, they aren't connections that the characters have made, they're ones that the fans have made. The fourth wall may have been pounded into dust, but the wind hasn't blown it away yet.
have you read the chapter yet? if this was Hayates dream, why is Aika part of it. And the interchange between Aika and A-tan, something Hayate does not know.
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Old 2010-12-23, 14:10   Link #7454
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
have you read the chapter yet? if this was Hayates dream, why is Aika part of it. And the interchange between Aika and A-tan, something Hayate does not know.
Even if it's only subliminally, he knows that Aika is a chessmaster, as is Athena. And he knows that Aika was in Athens, and hadn't returned yet, it's entirely plausible that his mind threw them together.
I haven't read the chapter (in English) yet, but I did read through the scans before they were translated. I'm not commenting on anything in the spoken language though, it's all body language, which is universal.

If it's filler, why would they not write it off as a dream, they've already done so with the second character poll in the anime being written off as a bad dream by Isumi.
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Arcion's is open for business. How would you like your hare-brained scheme?

Would people quit throwing my faith in humanity being intelligent a shovel?
... Apparently there are now people in existence who are unable to use a shovel.

Programming today is a race between programmers trying to create better idiot-proof programs, and the world creating better idiots.
The world is winning.. by leaps and bounds.

Body Language and Intonation can convey large amounts of information with a single word.
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Old 2010-12-23, 14:45   Link #7455
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
Even if it's only subliminally, he knows that Aika is a chessmaster, as is Athena. And he knows that Aika was in Athens, and hadn't returned yet, it's entirely plausible that his mind threw them together.
I haven't read the chapter (in English) yet, but I did read through the scans before they were translated. I'm not commenting on anything in the spoken language though, it's all body language, which is universal.

If it's filler, why would they not write it off as a dream, they've already done so with the second character poll in the anime being written off as a bad dream by Isumi.
I would suggest you try reading it first then comment on it, especially since the english is already out.
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Old 2010-12-23, 15:03   Link #7456
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
I'm not commenting on anything in the spoken language though, it's all body language, which is universal.
Whenever I read the raw version of anything, all I can do is relying on the bodily movements and expressions of the characters to get a sense of the situation. I know when the characters get embarrassed, when they got nervous, and the likes, but I'm uncertain of knowing why they behave that way since I can't understand a word they said. In other words, all I can do is making assumptions on what's happening (or what they are thinking) if I only rely on the body language without understanding the texts.

However, I have a much larger grasp on the situation (almost perfectly) if I can understand the texts even without any arts/drawing/body language (but the art does provide me a clearer visual atmosphere). The texts are much more helpful and important than the arts in given light to the events and the character's thoughts. Ignoring them is no different from ignoring the author's words and making your own assumptions of what's going.

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I would suggest you try reading it first then comment on it, especially since the english is already out.
Precisely.
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Old 2010-12-23, 15:31   Link #7457
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Originally Posted by Xellos-_^ View Post
I would suggest you try reading it first then comment on it, especially since the english is already out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zodanhko View Post
Whenever I read the raw version of anything, all I can do is relying on the bodily movements and expressions of the characters to get a sense of the situation. I know when the characters get embarrassed, when they got nervous, and the likes, but I'm uncertain of knowing why they behave that way since I can't understand a word they said. In other words, all I can do is making assumptions on what's happening (or what they are thinking) if I only rely on the body language without understanding the texts.

However, I have a much larger grasp on the situation (almost perfectly) if I can understand the texts even without any arts/drawing/body language (but the art does provide me a clearer visual atmosphere). The texts are much more helpful and important than the arts in given light to the events and the character's thoughts. Ignoring them is no different from ignoring the author's words and making your own assumptions of what's going.
I'm finding it amusing that you're telling me to read the chapter, but none of what you're discussing about this chapter has anything to do with the actual dialogue.

Sometimes it's not the words themselves that are important, it's the emotions displayed physically that depict what is being said.
Sometimes you can get more out of a situation by knowing what is being said, such is not the case for this chapter.
(It's usually also a clue for when your mind is trying to tell you something.)

Hayate's mouth confessed that he loves Athena when he says it to Hinagiku, and later to Athena herself. His body language when they interact after defeating Midas, however, says differently (which is what I was trying to get across to you in our debate).
The body language is what's important.
Such is just one instance of what Nagi means when she says earlier that 'words are imprecise'.

BTW: just read the chapter in English, and got nothing new out of it except a few points of humor that have nothing to do with the story, and absolutely nothing to change where my stances lie.
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Arcion's is open for business. How would you like your hare-brained scheme?

Would people quit throwing my faith in humanity being intelligent a shovel?
... Apparently there are now people in existence who are unable to use a shovel.

Programming today is a race between programmers trying to create better idiot-proof programs, and the world creating better idiots.
The world is winning.. by leaps and bounds.

Body Language and Intonation can convey large amounts of information with a single word.

Last edited by Bastion_Arcion; 2010-12-23 at 16:03.
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Old 2010-12-23, 15:35   Link #7458
musouka
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Can you pls refresh my memory what the connection is here? I think I forgot...
It's similar to the sword in the Royal Garden that Ikusa wielded against King Midas. I'm pretty sure they even have similar names?
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Old 2010-12-23, 15:45   Link #7459
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It's similar to the sword in the Royal Garden that Ikusa wielded against King Midas. I'm pretty sure they even have similar names?
More then that, it's the same sword. Hata changed the name of the sword between the magazine and volume editions of the EoTW arc, IIRC.

It's also the sword that Ginka pulled out of Machina, which may have something to do with his absence currently.

Now that I think about it, Athena has had the Shirozakura with her ever since she left the Royal Garden. It's not too farfetched that it's connected to her power in some way even though she (apparently) can't wield it herself.
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Old 2010-12-23, 15:51   Link #7460
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Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
I'm finding it amusing that you're telling me to read the chapter, but none of what you're discussing about this chapter has anything to do with the actual dialogue.
What I meant was read every chapter first to understand what's going on, what thecharacter's are saying, what the chapter's about, and not using the knowledge comparable to a raw reader for debate (I.E. Through Using Body Language).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bastion_Arcion View Post
Sometimes it's not the words themselves that are important, it's the emotions displayed physically that depict what is being said.
Sometimes you can get more out of a situation by knowing what is being said, such is not the case for this chapter.
(It's usually also a clue for when your mind is trying to tell you something.)

Hayate's mouth confessed that he loves Athena when he says it to Hinagiku, and later to Athena herself. His body language when they interact after defeating Midas, however, says differently (which is what I was trying to get across to you in our debate).
The body language is what's important.
Such is just one instance of what Nagi means when she says earlier that 'words
Words are important if you want to understand a novel, a story, or manga written by an author in their words and if you want to understand their intentions. If you only using the bodily movements of the characters, all you are doing is just making your own assumptions on the author's art (without knowing his intention through his words).

Isn't that obvious that he was confession to Athena, not toward Hina (even without the art)? Uggghh....Don't tell me you think he confessed that to Hina...

Did you not see the way Hayate embraced Athena after Midas' defeated. Like this: http://www.mangareader.net/203-47294...apter-260.html

What is this "differently" behavior you are speaking of?

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Now that I think about it, Athena has had the Shirozakura with her ever since she left the Royal Garden. It's not too farfetched that it's connected to her power in some way even though she (apparently) can't wield it herself.
She wielded the sword before 10 years ago, and she's most likely the person who put the sword in Machina.
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