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Old 2010-12-29, 22:50   Link #20581
AuraTwilight
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As far as making choices in the ending goes, I'm rather under the impression that Ryukishi meant that if one were to put themselves in Battler's shoes, they see that he has a choice: he can tell Ange what happened as it actually did (gruesome details and all), or he can sugarcoat the truth as one should for a six year old. Really, I don't think Ryukishi meant that the choices were ours to make, but rather Battler's. Thus, we're all probably going to see the same exact game.
I like this idea.

Also Lion/Will forever. There is no other person for Lion to pair up with, since he doesn't have the excuse of NOT knowing it's incest until already involved with them.
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Old 2010-12-29, 23:04   Link #20582
Judoh
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Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
For the same reasons saying that Genji or Hideyoshi are the culprits unless I missed something would be really come out of the blue, because I can't see any element that would let the readers understand that they must be the culprits rather than someone else.


I don't mean to say that the hints must make it blatantly clear, but the solution must stick out as substantially more probable than any other theory once you see all the elements that support it.
For the Epitaph it was so.

It's not like I want this to be true because I've worked very hard at finding hints.

Just a thought. That could be the "dirty trick" you're always talking about. That the culprit isn't solved with what's fair play according to Knox's 8th and Dine's 1st or whatever.
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Old 2010-12-30, 01:18   Link #20583
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Honestly I would cheer for Hideyoshi culprit just for the sheer shock value, even if there'd never been any evidence whatsoever.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:11   Link #20584
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Originally Posted by Renall View Post
Honestly I would cheer for Hideyoshi culprit just for the sheer shock value, even if there'd never been any evidence whatsoever.
He's fat anyways. A Hideyoshi culprit just has to happen as a joke end.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:15   Link #20585
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Honestly I would cheer for Hideyoshi culprit just for the sheer shock value, even if there'd never been any evidence whatsoever.
Yeah it would be a huge twist, but it wouldn't be fair to the readers.

If I were the writer and I really wanted to shock the readers I'd rather introduce a twist that no one even suspected about. I mean not a revelation related to something they've been speculated and were supposed to solve. If you do that they'll feel betrayed because they've spent a lot of time trying to reason about something that couldn't be foreseen in any way.

Then it's better to add a twist about something they never speculated about and whom they were never enticed to reason about, something that they just took for granted and has no real relevance to what they were supposed to solve but it still has a deep impact on the plot.

That's what I would do...
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:18   Link #20586
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I think that's basically where George has been left at this point. Really shady, yet never shown by any particularly strong evidence to have ever done anything. If he were put forth as somehow important, we couldn't really say we had no way of seeing it coming (as indeed many people have seen it coming), but neither could we say there's a lot of evidence that makes you think "Aha, this is what he did and this is how and why he did it, and this part here proves that it could only have been him."
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:18   Link #20587
Keriaku
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Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
Yeah it would be a huge twist, but it wouldn't be fair to the readers.

If I were the writer and I really wanted to shock the readers I'd rather introduce a twist that no one even suspected about. I mean not a revelation related to something they've been speculated and were supposed to solve. If you do that they'll feel betrayed because they've spent a lot of time trying to reason about something that couldn't be foreseen in any way.

Then it's better to add a twist about something they never speculated about and whom they were never enticed to reason about, something that they just took for granted and has no real relevance to what they were supposed to solve but it still has a deep impact on the plot.

That's what I would do...
This would be kind of similar to Amakusa being Battler. It has no relevance to anything else (expect the 'mystery' of Ange dying in 1998, I guess). Though it would be nice if there was something else, maybe bigger.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:22   Link #20588
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Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
Yeah it would be a huge twist, but it wouldn't be fair to the readers.

If I were the writer and I really wanted to shock the readers I'd rather introduce a twist that no one even suspected about. I mean not a revelation related to something they've been speculated and were supposed to solve. If you do that they'll feel betrayed because they've spent a lot of time trying to reason about something that couldn't be foreseen in any way.

Then it's better to add a twist about something they never speculated about and whom they were never enticed to reason about, something that they just took for granted and has no real relevance to what they were supposed to solve but it still has a deep impact on the plot.

That's what I would do...
Just imagine the Hideyoshi sprite in a Beatrice dress.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:28   Link #20589
AuraTwilight
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Hell fucking no.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:36   Link #20590
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I seriously wouldn't mind a joke ending in EP8 though. Comedy is something Ryukishi07 does well anyways.

But putting that aside, an ending like that would be very dissatisfying for people who've expected more.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:36   Link #20591
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Originally Posted by Mirrored View Post
Strongly disagree. Natsuhi threw her off a cliff. The family has raised her as a servant. She's been denied her inheritance as a child of Kinzo, or even the consideration that comes with that. She was constantly berated. She is with George in a body incapable of love. He tells her that he wants kids. She can't have them. Battler returns. This is true whether Yasu is the child of Beatrice and Kinzo or whether Yasu is the child of Rudolf and Asumu.

If you believe what was presented, Kinzo apologized for his incest, etc. If you don't believe that, the possibilities there also get darker.
Either way, those motivations don't lend well to her plotting to kill everyone, they lend themselves to her snapping and killing herself out of horrible levels of depression.

Besides, it'd be a pretty horrid ending if it was "Oh, I just killed everyone because my life sucks and I decided to take it out on everyone I know, whether they have anything to do with it or not."
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:48   Link #20592
Kylon99
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You know, the only one whom we've haven't really been told about yet, but received absolutely no hints, motives, or even *capability*, who would be a total and utter shock if it were revealed he was the culprit behind all of this, despite all the illogicalness and inconsistency would be...

Magical Gouda Chef.

I swear, if Ryukishi is putting in troll endings for the people who guess wrong (and it's about finding the culprit or something), he's *gotta* put in Gouda as the end to the super bad end; the one where you make all the wrong choices.
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Old 2010-12-30, 02:59   Link #20593
Jan-Poo
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Originally Posted by Renall View Post
I think that's basically where George has been left at this point. Really shady, yet never shown by any particularly strong evidence to have ever done anything. If he were put forth as somehow important, we couldn't really say we had no way of seeing it coming (as indeed many people have seen it coming), but neither could we say there's a lot of evidence that makes you think "Aha, this is what he did and this is how and why he did it, and this part here proves that it could only have been him."
Well at least George has some faint hints that would make you think he's the culprit. You'll be able to see them all over the place since EP1 if you are actively looking for them.

However Hideyoshi would really come out of the blue. People that have proposed him as the culprit only did that as part of a "the one that you suspect the least must be the culprit" reasoning.


Quote:
This would be kind of similar to Amakusa being Battler
Yeah that's the kind of non foreshadowed twist people wouldn't be angry about.
Not like no one thought about that before to be honest... so it can't really be said that that would be a shocking revelation.


Quote:
You know, the only one whom we've haven't really been told about yet, but received absolutely no hints, motives, or even *capability*, who would be a total and utter shock if it were revealed he was the culprit behind all of this, despite all the illogicalness and inconsistency would be...

Magical Gouda Chef.
Actually back when I first read EP1 he was the first on my suspect list. However yeah... I really can't see any hint pointing at him as the culprit.
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Old 2010-12-30, 03:04   Link #20594
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Hell fucking no.
Hell fucking yes.
Spoiler for Eye Burning:
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Old 2010-12-30, 03:05   Link #20595
Judoh
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Originally Posted by Renall View Post
I think that's basically where George has been left at this point. Really shady, yet never shown by any particularly strong evidence to have ever done anything. If he were put forth as somehow important, we couldn't really say we had no way of seeing it coming (as indeed many people have seen it coming), but neither could we say there's a lot of evidence that makes you think "Aha, this is what he did and this is how and why he did it, and this part here proves that it could only have been him."
There's also the troll the fans option.

Hey guys, guess what, George gets some back story finally. *shock*.

And he's totally innocent. *shock*

And it turns out he wasn't really an ass after all. He was just misunderstood (or an idiot) who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. *shock*

I'm mentally preparing for this scenario to play out so I'm also gonna call it just in case...
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Old 2010-12-30, 03:34   Link #20596
SonozakiUshiromiya
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Originally Posted by Golden Dream View Post
Hell fucking yes.
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More like 'Eye Melting'! AAHHHH!

I call a Krauss culprit troll ending.
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Old 2010-12-30, 08:33   Link #20597
neutrino
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Originally Posted by Kylon99 View Post
You know, the only one whom we've haven't really been told about yet, but received absolutely no hints, motives, or even *capability*, who would be a total and utter shock if it were revealed he was the culprit behind all of this, despite all the illogicalness and inconsistency would be...

Magical Gouda Chef.

I swear, if Ryukishi is putting in troll endings for the people who guess wrong (and it's about finding the culprit or something), he's *gotta* put in Gouda as the end to the super bad end; the one where you make all the wrong choices.
Gouda actually got his own Extra TIP (this will be in Tsubasa) explaining his back ground: Notes from a Certain Cook. He looks more like the victim of the mastermind than one himself.
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Old 2010-12-30, 08:40   Link #20598
MeoTwister5
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So I'm now putting down 20 virtual dollars that my initial theory more than a year ago, modified excessively, is correct, with barely 24 hours left before the truth sets us free.

Who else will put money on the virtual pot?
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Old 2010-12-30, 08:48   Link #20599
witchfan
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Originally Posted by Kylon99 View Post
That's why I was wondering. Last time before EP7 came out I posted a little bit about getting Translation Aggregator to work. But I made a more comprehensive post this time in the Translations thread.

Here: http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...postcount=5825

It's helpful if you already know a bit of Japanese grammar but just need help with vocabulary. I wouldn't recommend using it for the automatic translations... except for purely entertainment; i.e. since it consistently screws up, sometimes the "translations" are awesome.

I'm going to keep that post in my signature too.
Hey, thanks. I'll give it a try. Getting it to work sounds like a hassle, though.
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Old 2010-12-30, 09:12   Link #20600
rogerpepitone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Renall View Post
I think that's basically where George has been left at this point. Really shady, yet never shown by any particularly strong evidence to have ever done anything. If he were put forth as somehow important, we couldn't really say we had no way of seeing it coming (as indeed many people have seen it coming), but neither could we say there's a lot of evidence that makes you think "Aha, this is what he did and this is how and why he did it, and this part here proves that it could only have been him."
Reread the parts of Ep 1 around when cousins + Shannon go to the beach. George and Shannon control that conversation. In particular, reread the part when Rosa smacks Maria around in the garden. George convinces Battler and Jessica to leave Maria and Rosa alone. Maria has to be alone when she gets the letter, and George plays a key role in that.

Also, very few deaths occur after George is confirmed dead. (Nanjo in Episode 3, Beatrice in Episode 4)
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