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Old 2011-01-03, 04:44   Link #2041
Goty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by henwy View Post
Take Megumi for instance. I doubt her fan base would be nearly as large right now if her character design had been Gonk (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Gonk) rather than goth lolita. Change absolutely nothing else about her actions and motivations and I doubt we'd even be having the argument whether she was a nasty bit of work who deserved everything she got. There was absolutely no redemption to her character whatsoever.
I fully agree.
Then there is Masao. Shiki Megumi was way more of an asshole than him. And his life was shittier, for all we know: he was treated like crap by his family (heck, he died and no one cared), while Megumi seemed to hate her parents for no justifiable reason at all.
I don't see people feeling sorry or defending his actions though..

Anyway, i didn't hate/love any character enough to get really pissed off about their fates, maybe that's why i'm pleased with the ending.

Last edited by Goty; 2011-01-03 at 11:26. Reason: ugh. typo.
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Old 2011-01-03, 09:49   Link #2042
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I am almost entirely satisfied with this ending. I would have liked a bit more closure about the many characters who we never saw anymore. Also somethiing about the life of the villlagers after the incident. Hopefully both of this matters will be covered in the 2 dvd specials.
I do find it a bit too convenient that Seishin turned into a werewolf. It would have been better if he survived as a human being and became the new Seishirou, e.g. a human who accepts Sunako for what she is. At the very least I want to believe that Sunako learned her lesson and she won't try to form a Shiki community elsewhere.

The author went to great lenghts to show us that both sides were at fault. While it's true that the Shiki attacked first, the humans never tried to reason with them. I am sure that Ritchan, Tohru and even Masao wouldn't want to attack anyone if they weren't threatened. They could have found a way of coexistence.

This is the main fault of this otherwise beautiful story. It isn't necessary for the Shiki to kill in order to survive. They could survive on blood packs or just drink some blood here and there without killing their victim. Intelligent beings should always try to avoid killing each other at all costs. Maybe if Sunako tried to explain her situation to Toshio, he would have helped her by providing blood packs or blood donations from all the villagers.
I understand that the author tried to pose a moral dilemma for us but IMHO she failed on this aspect. Now, if the Shiki could only survive by killing their victims, their behaviour would be much more justified and coexistence with humans would be next to impossible.
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Old 2011-01-03, 10:55   Link #2043
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gohan78 View Post
This is the main fault of this otherwise beautiful story. It isn't necessary for the Shiki to kill in order to survive. They could survive on blood packs or just drink some blood here and there without killing their victim. Intelligent beings should always try to avoid killing each other at all costs. Maybe if Sunako tried to explain her situation to Toshio, he would have helped her by providing blood packs or blood donations from all the villagers.

I understand that the author tried to pose a moral dilemma for us but IMHO she failed on this aspect. Now, if the Shiki could only survive by killing their victims, their behaviour would be much more justified and coexistence with humans would be next to impossible.
I have to disagree with the bolded statements. I'd argue that Ono-sensei succeeded in posing the moral dilemma, because there are so many of us who realise that yes, humans and Shiki COULD HAVE coexisted if both sides had been willing to work out a solution. The trouble is that you need enough individuals on BOTH sides to cooperate to do it. Unfortunately for the characters in Shiki, the very first contact between humans and vampires - i.e. when Sunako was first turned - was absolutely disastrous for the possibility of coexistence. It's also arguable whether it could actually work on such a huge scale - this kind of ending is far more realistic.
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Old 2011-01-03, 11:47   Link #2044
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Loved the ending. Loved how Masao was killed by his sister. Loved "let's kill her for her sake", though really Id have loved to have seen her reaction to Natsuno still being alive. Ritchan and Tohru....man, not fair. Natsuno staring down at both of them was nice.

This by far one of the best anime Ive ever seen, definitely in my top 3. Ending was unfair in so many ways but I never wanted an typical ending to this. The ED scenes made it possible that some of the villagers will be ok but really the town itself is gone.

And really who didnt know right away that Seishin was driving that car
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Old 2011-01-03, 12:16   Link #2045
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Originally Posted by White Manju Bun View Post
And really who didnt know right away that Seishin was driving that car
plus who is in that box...

thinking of starting on the manga
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Old 2011-01-03, 14:19   Link #2046
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Originally Posted by klare View Post
plus who is in that box...

thinking of starting on the manga
Exactly. And manga is now top on my need to read list. Im really glad I held out til the anime was over.
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Old 2011-01-03, 17:03   Link #2047
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Originally Posted by White Manju Bun View Post
Exactly. And manga is now top on my need to read list. Im really glad I held out til the anime was over.
Yeah i'll start reading it soon, or might just wait until it finishes.
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Old 2011-01-03, 19:33   Link #2048
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gohan78
I am sure that Ritchan, Tohru and even Masao wouldn't want to attack anyone if they weren't threatened. They could have found a way of coexistence.
Remember Natsuno's and Tohru's conversation?
Not just there but few more times it was made clear that coexistence is impossible or very hard (and with so many humans murdered it is impossible to expect for humans to like the idea of forgiving them), mainly due to vampires not just being hungry, but also for feeling great attraction to killing their prey (besides few like Masao and Ritchan).
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Old 2011-01-04, 04:52   Link #2049
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Originally Posted by achirist View Post
I'm of a similar mind as Lestat, not Van Helsing, as far as fictional characters in the wider vampire theme go. People who have different standards and aesthetic ideas than you do are not trolls. Grow up, and indeed, widen the boundaries of your imagination.
You're closer to Malloy.

While we're at it, Tatsumi is Lestat. Natsuno is Louis.

Even this is a loose parallel. Lestat didn't just turn every human he met. He had his own code and would not hesitate to kill vampires that went against his interests. Lestat WOULD kill Sunako.
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Old 2011-01-04, 17:53   Link #2050
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I am not satisfied with the ending. too much left up to the audience, not enough closure on a lot of things. Someone said something about dvd only episodes?

Fantastic series though. Starts out sort of boring and creepy and ramps up into some hardcore shit. The villagers went hard, maybe a bit too hard, and became monsters themselves (some of them).

And I don't know how to feel about the megumi situation. I feel even if she was ugly I'd still have some sympathy for her. She just wanted to get out of the damn village, and the only guy she liked treated her like she didn't exist. I can see how she wouldn't have sympathy towards any of the villagers when she turned. I won't say she didn't get what was coming to her, though you have to admit that was a hardcore way to go out, no sympathy on the villagers part.
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Old 2011-01-04, 19:34   Link #2051
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Originally Posted by Soconfused View Post
I am not satisfied with the ending. too much left up to the audience, not enough closure on a lot of things. Someone said something about dvd only episodes?
Yeah the last 2 DVDs will contain 20.5 and 21.5. I like that a lot was left, we never find out who bit Sunako, never found out who the 4th Jinrou was (assumed it may have been the guy in the glasses in that photo), nice open-ending, really this series was never meant to have closure imho.
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Old 2011-01-04, 21:20   Link #2052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by White Manju Bun View Post
Yeah the last 2 DVDs will contain 20.5 and 21.5. I like that a lot was left, we never find out who bit Sunako, never found out who the 4th Jinrou was (assumed it may have been the guy in the glasses in that photo), nice open-ending, really this series was never meant to have closure imho.
For Sunako it's pretty heavily hinted that the visitor to her family's mansion bit her (since her last human memories are helping him pack) and he may have been the last jinrou Tatsumi was referring to since her was wandering around in the daylight. I don't think it was the glasses doctor since the clinic didn't open until the evening, meaning that it had a vampire staff, plus I think he would've been shown when Tatsumi thought of the other Kirishiki servant, purple pigtails girl, who was a jinrou.
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Old 2011-01-05, 02:09   Link #2053
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speaking of that, what the hell did mr Kirishiki mean when he said he was "waiting for a jinrou to pass by" and shot purple pig tails girl? they never seemed to go back to that, and it kind of makes no sense, as he couldn't have killed her, seeing as super jinrou whats his face was eating bullets left and right from all the other villagers. Thats one of the biggest things bothering me.

sorry if thats been answered, I just skimmed the last few pages and didn't see anything about it.
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Old 2011-01-05, 06:40   Link #2054
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wandering-dreamer
never found out who the 4th Jinrou was (assumed it may have been the guy in the glasses in that photo)
Tatsumi said he knows about (or has met) four other Jinrou. He did not say that all of them are in the village. Do not forget that Sunako and her bunch are just some of the many vampires in the world. Sunako is not some Queen of all vampires in the world but leader of a small bunch of them.
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Old 2011-01-05, 08:12   Link #2055
zero7090
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You broke the rule: "The young shouldnt die before the old". Hence you shall be punished. Heck here in singapore, they hang you for 3g of heroin less not manslaughter, murder or genocide.

For all the environmentalist, you see shiki and human are the same then their punishment for their crime should be the same.
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Old 2011-01-05, 09:54   Link #2056
wandering-dreamer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soconfused View Post
speaking of that, what the hell did mr Kirishiki mean when he said he was "waiting for a jinrou to pass by" and shot purple pig tails girl? they never seemed to go back to that, and it kind of makes no sense, as he couldn't have killed her, seeing as super jinrou whats his face was eating bullets left and right from all the other villagers. Thats one of the biggest things bothering me.
sorry if thats been answered, I just skimmed the last few pages and didn't see anything
about it.
I think part of it was that Mr. Kirishiki was under Natsuno's influence (I thought I saw a bite mark on him) and Natsuno might not have known how hard it was to kill a jinrou. Otherwise I'm sure Natsuno would've told him to fill her full of holes to make sure she stays dead.
Spoiler for and a manga spoiler:
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Old 2011-01-05, 20:17   Link #2057
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wandering-dreamer View Post
I think part of it was that Mr. Kirishiki was under Natsuno's influence (I thought I saw a bite mark on him) and Natsuno might not have known how hard it was to kill a jinrou. Otherwise I'm sure Natsuno would've told him to fill her full of holes to make sure she stays dead.
Spoiler for and a manga spoiler:
So during that stalemate between Natsuno and Mr.Kirshiki, Natsuno bit him and made sure to get him to shoot someone or atleast fill them full of holes. That would explain alot of things.
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Old 2011-01-05, 22:59   Link #2058
White Manju Bun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wandering-dreamer View Post
I think part of it was that Mr. Kirishiki was under Natsuno's influence (I thought I saw a bite mark on him) and Natsuno might not have known how hard it was to kill a jinrou. Otherwise I'm sure Natsuno would've told him to fill her full of holes to make sure she stays dead.
Spoiler for and a manga spoiler:
I hope that interaction is shown in the DVD epis. I didn't even notice the bite marks.
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Old 2011-01-06, 11:45   Link #2059
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Originally Posted by wandering-dreamer View Post
I think part of it was that Mr. Kirishiki was under Natsuno's influence (I thought I saw a bite mark on him) and Natsuno might not have known how hard it was to kill a jinrou. Otherwise I'm sure Natsuno would've told him to fill her full of holes to make sure she stays dead.
Spoiler for and a manga spoiler:
Yeah she lives but maybe if the manga ends before the specials arrive they include some of that ending in it and we see what really happens with Yoshie.
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Old 2011-01-06, 12:42   Link #2060
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because i have already deleted the final eps from my laptop
please somebody comfirm it :
does mr kirishiki have shiki eyes at the end? ( when he back to his castle )
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