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Old 2008-07-22, 00:46   Link #241
getfresh
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I honestly think that all these "fansub" quality comparison sites are becoming pretty pointless as they are not "fansub" quality comparisons when everyone is only focus'd on "encoding" conparisons.

Comparing an edit or translation with 5-6 images doesn't really compare much of anything and prettyy much kills the whole point of a "fansub" comparison. All that is being compared with these images is opening karaoke styles and effects, title effects, dialogue styling, ending karaoke styling and effects, the eyecatch styles and effects, and a random sign.

this is all typesetting and encoding stuff.

As a typesetter I can say without a doubt that typesetting is one of the least important tasks in fansubbing as far as what is REALLY required to sub. I cannot speak for encoding with such absolution as I am not an encoder and do not feel like inviting an argument from them since they are experts and I am not. But I would chance to believe that it is not the big of a deal with the quality of raws present today compared to in the past where a raw needed to be "faxed" just so it was watchable.

I for one hope that his trend will change direction and more focus will be added to translation and editing.
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Old 2008-07-22, 02:29   Link #242
ras80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by getfresh View Post
I honestly think that all these "fansub" quality comparison sites are becoming pretty pointless as they are not "fansub" quality comparisons when everyone is only focus'd on "encoding" conparisons.

Comparing an edit or translation with 5-6 images doesn't really compare much of anything and prettyy much kills the whole point of a "fansub" comparison. All that is being compared with these images is opening karaoke styles and effects, title effects, dialogue styling, ending karaoke styling and effects, the eyecatch styles and effects, and a random sign.

this is all typesetting and encoding stuff.

As a typesetter I can say without a doubt that typesetting is one of the least important tasks in fansubbing as far as what is REALLY required to sub. I cannot speak for encoding with such absolution as I am not an encoder and do not feel like inviting an argument from them since they are experts and I am not. But I would chance to believe that it is not the big of a deal with the quality of raws present today compared to in the past where a raw needed to be "faxed" just so it was watchable.

I for one hope that his trend will change direction and more focus will be added to translation and editing.
Well they might be pointless but at least a starting point to select a good release worth to download. In my cycle I check anidb comments first (if any) then check some screen shots..Without these information what's the alternative other than downloading all releases, and actually seeing them with your own eyes? I wish there was a MASTERANIMEGURU who would answer my best release question every time, patiently..
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Old 2008-07-22, 05:34   Link #243
getfresh
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I wasn't speaking of your site in specific but of all of them in general. Pretty much every compare site compares some screen caps. There use to be sites with translation compares, and one crops up from time to time. But to call something a "fansub comparison" and not have all elements adequately represented isn't right imo. Yet all the new sites coming up one after another do just this.
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Old 2008-07-22, 06:49   Link #244
dj_tjerk
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You can say what you want, but the elements that most leechers consider important are covered in those screencaps. I wonder if it's because of those screencaps people started to only care about visual stuff, or if it's the other way around. Also, an adequate comparison for you may very likely not be an adequate comparison for me.

Also, as has been said many times already (Tofu, NoSanninWa, asunder, ...), not all fansubbers (I prolly won't either) like criticism. If you are going to compare translation/editing/timing, then prepare to endure some childish acts like DDoS's from angry/irritated fansubbers. Translation is not always simply "correct or wrong", neither is any other aspect of a fansub. Tastes differ, and people aren't always that understanding of another one's taste/preference; especially NOT on the internet.

A quick summary:
Literal translation vs. more "free"/localized translation.
Comma abuse (grammatical correctness) or easily readable. Slang or correct english.
Leadin/Leadout/Scenetiming/"lunar-style" timing.
Hardsub/softsub/only notes/AFX/Every Sign/Only useful ones/...
Overfiltered/HD Only/no xvid/too big/too blurry/...

As this and many other threads have proven, one can go on about those for hours, but is one style necessarily better than another (leaving out personal preferences)?
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Old 2008-07-22, 07:13   Link #245
getfresh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dj_tjerk View Post
You can say what you want, but the elements that most leechers consider important are covered in those screencaps. I wonder if it's because of those screencaps people started to only care about visual stuff, or if it's the other way around. Also, an adequate comparison for you may very likely not be an adequate comparison for me.

Also, as has been said many times already (Tofu, NoSanninWa, asunder, ...), not all fansubbers (I prolly won't either) like criticism. If you are going to compare translation/editing/timing, then prepare to endure some childish acts like DDoS's from angry/irritated fansubbers. Translation is not always simply "correct or wrong", neither is any other aspect of a fansub. Tastes differ, and people aren't always that understanding of another one's taste/preference; especially NOT on the internet.

A quick summary:
Literal translation vs. more "free"/localized translation.
Comma abuse (grammatical correctness) or easily readable. Slang or correct english.
Leadin/Leadout/Scenetiming/"lunar-style" timing.
Hardsub/softsub/only notes/AFX/Every Sign/Only useful ones/...
Overfiltered/HD Only/no xvid/too big/too blurry/...

As this and many other threads have proven, one can go on about those for hours, but is one style necessarily better than another (leaving out personal preferences)?
All I am talking about is comparing for absolute mistakes or incorrect work. Like a translation being 100% wrong in many places, numerous editing errors like mispellings, or lines timed to the wrong things, or not timed at all.

The majority of leechers dl whatever is first or whatever group they remember leeching lots from. The people who most commonly go to compare sites are fansubbers. If you don't like the comparisons, don't read them. Some people however learn from them and can take them objectively.
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Old 2008-07-22, 07:40   Link #246
pichu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by getfresh View Post
All I am talking about is comparing for absolute mistakes or incorrect work. Like a translation being 100% wrong in many places, numerous editing errors like mispellings, or lines timed to the wrong things, or not timed at all.
If you want only that, then compare/diff the scripts. Since most of the releases are softsubbed nowadays, it's not impossible to diff the scripts and put them on the site... and the users can know the difference between them.

Screenshots only depict:

Encode/Video Quality
Typesetting Quality (logo, credits, signs, karaoke, and styles)
Some obvious timing errors (bleeds)

Some English mistakes
Some Translation mistakes (if not obvious)
Some Derogatory stuff (like overuse of the word, "fuck")



Screenshots do not show the latter three that well and clearly... The best way, however, is to compare the scripts. Perhaps, have the audio put as a supplementary data.
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Old 2008-07-22, 08:05   Link #247
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The thing I don't like about fansub comparison sites is that it doesn't show what I'm most interested in - the timing. It can show TL comparisons (If there are more than 2 groups), encode quality, typesetting, editing, and pretty much everything other than the timing comparisons. Maybe having animate .gif images of scenes where one group decided to bleed and another decided to snap would help? I don't know. XD
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Old 2008-07-22, 09:25   Link #248
pichu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristen View Post
The thing I don't like about fansub comparison sites is that it doesn't show what I'm most interested in - the timing. It can show TL comparisons (If there are more than 2 groups), encode quality, typesetting, editing, and pretty much everything other than the timing comparisons. Maybe having animate .gif images of scenes where one group decided to bleed and another decided to snap would help? I don't know. XD
True... even on the typesetting I do, the SS can't show how much time is put into them... (i.e. exact movements). Oh please... animated gif... Try .flv's hehe

As for TL's, it only shows a little... It's best to have the audio too for translation checks.

The only things that screenshots emphasize are: fansub typesettings/graphics and encode/video qualities. That's all.
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Old 2008-07-22, 10:31   Link #249
getfresh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pichu View Post
True... even on the typesetting I do, the SS can't show how much time is put into them... (i.e. exact movements). Oh please... animated gif... Try .flv's hehe

As for TL's, it only shows a little... It's best to have the audio too for translation checks.

The only things that screenshots emphasize are: fansub typesettings/graphics and encode/video qualities. That's all.
And even then it can only show static typesetting which is more the styling" end of it. It doesn't show how well the typesetters code actually works.
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Old 2009-11-11, 02:19   Link #250
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"accurate translation"?
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Old 2009-11-11, 18:05   Link #251
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koutakurugi88 View Post
I've decided I am going to start a fansub comparison site starting winter season, i will post flash video embedded for typesetting and find a qualified translator to give an accurate translation for the screenshots taken and will post it like that so people can actually compare everything. I think that would be a better way of comparing. I may even have full comparison of all op/ed songs with an accurate TL underneath, we'll see how it goes ^_^ wish me luck! I am even gonna add a function to vote on the releases so people can see that as well. I think it will be awesome when finished!
So it's AniDB? Apparently everyone there is an accurate translator, and it has a voting system, just no flash. Really most fansubbing things are subjective, besides encoding, some people like more ts, others less, 99% are blind to good sub styling and grammar is a question of preferance. As for voting, if anyone even cares, it'll be fansubbers bashing other groups.

E~
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Old 2009-11-12, 06:05   Link #252
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in other words, a blog among millions of other blogs nobody cares about
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17:43:13 <~deculture> Also, TheFluff, you are so fucking slowpoke.jpg that people think we dropped the DVD's.
17:43:16 <~deculture> nice job, fag!

01:04:41 < Plorkyeran> it was annoying to typeset so it should be annoying to read
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Old 2009-11-12, 06:57   Link #253
Slice of Life
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If somebody could direct me to a few blogs nobody cares about that compare fan translations in particular I'd be grateful.
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Old 2009-11-12, 06:58   Link #254
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Oh my, a fansub comparison effort by coreym.

CLEARLY NOTHING CAN GO WRONG WITH THIS
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Old 2009-11-12, 07:28   Link #255
Emess
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When you change the ending of something to katta what does that mean?

Oh yeah, I see this site's translation validation going smoothly, very very smoothly >.>

E~
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Old 2009-11-15, 09:48   Link #256
guest0815
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Originally Posted by ras80 View Post
...what's the alternative other than downloading all releases, and actually seeing them with your own eyes?
That's what I do. Works great.
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Old 2011-01-16, 23:40   Link #257
IronWarrior
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So is there any decent fansubs that offer full Japanese Audio/English Subs at 1080p that don't cut the OP's and ED's out?
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Old 2011-01-17, 00:01   Link #258
Heibi
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Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by IronWarrior View Post
So is there any decent fansubs that offer full Japanese Audio/English Subs at 1080p that don't cut the OP's and ED's out?
Broad question - but it depends on the show in particular.
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Old 2011-01-17, 01:42   Link #259
Zalis
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With some rare exceptions, 1080p fansubs Blu-Ray remuxes and rips using a pre-existing translation don't "cut the OPs and EDs" out. They often use ordered chapters, which means the OP/ED get played normally if you use a player like MPC that supports that feature.
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Old 2011-01-17, 12:09   Link #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IronWarrior View Post
So is there any decent fansubs that offer full Japanese Audio/English Subs at 1080p that don't cut the OP's and ED's out?
1. Yeah... you're going to have to give a little more detail then that.
2. Nobody cuts the OP/ED, they use Ordered Chapters. Look that up.
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