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Old 2011-03-02, 12:19   Link #61
Echoes
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I don't think you should spoil recent episodes of ongoing series for people who might not have watched them yet in unrelated threads such as this.

One cliche that I really think needs to go is the "comic relief male friend" in every harem/school-based comedy. These characters usually don't contribute anything to the show expect to act as a counterweight to the mysteriously sexually disinterested lead. They're annoying, unnecessary, usually not even remotely funny, and overused doesn't even come close to describing their prevalence.

Notable exception: Clannad. Sunohara is an amazingly funny and cool character.

Why is it popular? No idea. I guess it might just be a difference in culture. I'm willing to concede that it might just be me "not getting" it.
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Old 2011-03-02, 13:13   Link #62
Sheba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
I don't think you should spoil recent episodes of ongoing series for people who might not have watched them yet in unrelated threads such as this.

One cliche that I really think needs to go is the "comic relief male friend" in every harem/school-based comedy. These characters usually don't contribute anything to the show expect to act as a counterweight to the mysteriously sexually disinterested lead. They're annoying, unnecessary, usually not even remotely funny, and overused doesn't even come close to describing their prevalence.

Notable exception: Clannad. Sunohara is an amazingly funny and cool character.

Why is it popular? No idea. I guess it might just be a difference in culture. I'm willing to concede that it might just be me "not getting" it.
I am not getting it either. I am also of the opinion that the stereotype, or rather a character that is modelled after this stereotype must offer something other being the clown of the class who will always end ALONE in the end of the show.. Which is why I found Junpei Iori in Persona 3 so endearing, I know it is a video game, but he is the more interesting take on the stereotype if not the most. He actually have issues, doubts and a love interest! He is the best thing to have ever happened to that character type.
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Old 2011-03-02, 13:39   Link #63
Haak
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What is it?: Girls calling the male lead perverted even when he's done nothing to warrant it.

Worst offenders: Most harems, but Infinite Stratos is a recent example.

Variants: Korewa Zombie Desuka? Ayumu is actually unexpectedly perverted so it's kinda funny.

Notable exceptions: None, unless you count those that avert this trope.

What makes it popular: I have absolutely no idea. Is it a cutural thing or do writers think the otaku males like to be mistaken for perverts?

Reason that I hate it: It's annoying as hell because it reinforces the stereotype that All Men Are Perverts in the most eniterly unjustifiable way..

Is the hate really worth it?: Comedy is such a subjective issue. What's funny for some may not be funny for others. If people really think it's funny then I suppose I can deal with that. Otherwise I'm going to hate it until the writers finally wise up.
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Old 2011-03-02, 16:34   Link #64
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What is it?: Just in time to the rescue. The good guy (or often the bad as well) is about the get shot or slashed with a sword, but not to worry. Someone literally appears out of nowhere in between to stop the attack.

Worst offenders: All battle shounen use this trick. Especially One Piece has taken this to all new heights lately. Many other genres as well.

Notable exceptions: I'm afraid to list them as there's always going to be one.

What makes it popular: Suspense, I guess. Or comebacks.

Reason that I hate it: It's usually a very cheap way to ruin battle coreography and ruins shows that want their plots taken seriously.

Is the hate really worth it?: It depends much on the situation and the type of show. There should at least be a hint that the person is nearby and doesn't appear out of thin air. It doesn't hurt so much if it's more of a tongue-in-cheek show.
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Old 2011-03-02, 17:09   Link #65
Kyero Fox
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my cliche hates are

1. accadent yuri/yaoi - when two girls/boys kiss because of a misshap.

2. young protags - seriously... why? why do so many animes have to star children now? oh.. wait.. its japan.. nevermind

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
I don't think you should spoil recent episodes of ongoing series for people who might not have watched them yet in unrelated threads such as this.

One cliche that I really think needs to go is the "comic relief male friend" in every harem/school-based comedy. These characters usually don't contribute anything to the show expect to act as a counterweight to the mysteriously sexually disinterested lead. They're annoying, unnecessary, usually not even remotely funny, and overused doesn't even come close to describing their prevalence.

Notable exception: Clannad. Sunohara is an amazingly funny and cool character.

Why is it popular? No idea. I guess it might just be a difference in culture. I'm willing to concede that it might just be me "not getting" it.
this can also be female ones too... like the annoying loli whos purely in it for NO REASON BUT FANSERVICE

but yes... Suohara was DEFINALY the becon of hope for his kind.
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Old 2011-03-02, 19:29   Link #66
DasDingus
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I'm gonna steal from Genten here and post a rant on tsunderes because they frustrate me as well.

What is it?: Tsunderes. I want to be specific here in that I'm referring only to characters that are attracted to a male character and know that they feel that way but refuse to let it show and instead are hostile to the point of being violent. I don't count characters that are initially hostile because they have other emotional issues and later warm up to a character, nor am I referring to characters that are cool or indifferent, the kuudere. Tsunderes in my mind run hot and are violent despite their attraction to somebody.

Worst Offenders: Louise of Zero no Tsukaima always sticks out to me as the most un-redeemable example but Houki of Infinite Stratos has been getting on my nerves lately and I was not a fan of Taiga of Toradora!

Variants: Characters like the kuudere that are cool or indifferent to somebody they actually like I personally find endearing. It's the openly hostile characters that get on my nerves.

Why is it Popular?: If I understood this maybe it wouldn't annoy me so much. I do know that some people find a girl who can't be honest with herself cute. They like it when a guy can push a girl's buttons. I also have a suspicion that some people like the idea that girls who are hostile to them secretly have a crush on them.

Reasons why I hate it: How much time do we have? A lot of what turns me off to the tsundere is what I see as the origin of their hostility. They like a guy, they know they like a guy, but they refuse to show it. It often feels like this stems from a feeling that the guy they like is inferior. "How the heck could I like that loser?" The tsundere either personally considers the guy inferior, or her friends do. If it's the former then why are you attracted to him? Maybe he's not as inferior as you thought. If it's the latter then why are you hanging out with people like that? I just find a character that displays such an attitude to be completely unsympathetic.

The other major issue with tsunderes is that once they make the transformation from tsun to dere all is forgiven. If I was in such a position I would not forgive somebody so easily. I would be thinking "You treated me like crap for months (even years) and now you expect me to return your feelings? Fat chance." But for some reason as soon as the tsundere shows her soft side it's all rainbows and unicorns and nobody ever calls her out for the BS she put everybody through leading up to this. I can't stand to see characters like that get a free pass because some people think they're cute.

Notable Exceptions: Fujibayashi Kyou of CLANNAD is the only tsundere character I've encountered that I could really get behind. (not like that you pervert) Her tsun side was not particularly violent (towards Tomoya anyway). She beat the crap out of Sunohara regularly but she didn't like him and he usually deserved it. She didn't lash out to hide her feelings but instead was only hostile when she was trying to protect Ryou or Botan, which made her tsun side feel much more realistic and legitimate than the typical tsundere.

Spoiler for Clannad Kyou OVA/VN spoilers:
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Old 2011-03-02, 22:58   Link #67
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What is it?: Kill 'Em All ending

Worst offenders: Any Gundam, mechs shows and depressing shows

Notable exceptions: Legend of Galactic Heroes

What makes it popular: It is cliche to show how bleak something is by killing faceless mooks.

Reason that I hate it: I hate the fact that they only display kill 'em all at the ending but they don't kill the main characters or characters

Is the hate really worth it?: Yes, if you are going kill off everybody then do so and make sure they stay that way.


What is it?: Super Sharp characters
Worst offenders: Characters from those type of shows
Notable exceptions: Except cases where it is justified

What makes it popular: Any character who is sharp and know their stuff is immediatly praised.

Reason that I hate it: Nobody is that sharp or at least as shaarp as they are.

Is the hate really worth it?: Well to me it is, I hate those characters.
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Old 2011-03-03, 09:07   Link #68
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Lol, Dasdingus, you beat me to that rant. While I don't hate that archtype completely , the really bad ones truly suck... and not in the hentai way, unless it's a bad fanfiction. Usually the more tsun heavy ones tend to be very bad. And they frequently have annoying voices... The Rie Kugimiya screechy kind is frequently ear rape.*

*No not all of her characters, just that's the first thing that comes to mind. It's mostly just Louise.

Anyhow let me find something to rant about. Umm...

Panty shots!

Worst Offender: Stuff like Ikkitousen, or just watch any Gonzo anime, like FMP season 1.

Exceptions: Anything with this

Variants: Saki, because it doesn't seem like they even are wearing them. Also, any pervert camera angled shots follow the same concept.

What makes it popular: People like fanservice.

Reason that I hated it: It's almost always out of place most of the time. Usually I don't mind fanservice that expresses how sexy the characters are too much but panty shots always give me the vibe of a pervert and many cases pedo cameraperson because they always come from stupid angles. And in many cases, it's not even sexy. I don't really care about the color of their underwear. And by the way they draw boobs, I really don't care for their naughty bits.

Occasional jokes about it are funny. Blatant and extremely pointless ones that distract from the actual plot is very grating.

Tl;DR Gratuitous and it's not even exciting.
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Last edited by Archon_Wing; 2011-03-03 at 09:27. Reason: added rant
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Old 2011-03-03, 12:11   Link #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
Exceptions: Anything with this

Occasional jokes about it are funny. Blatant and extremely pointless ones that distract from the actual plot is very grating.

Tl;DR Gratuitous and it's not even exciting.
So by that link you're probably not as annoyed with it in something like Railgun, where it's done for a joke, but isn't even shown?
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Old 2011-03-03, 15:50   Link #70
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I always thought Mikoto wore shorts underneath to deal with that crap.
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Old 2011-03-03, 15:53   Link #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
I always thought Mikoto wore shorts underneath to deal with that crap.
She does , but I meant Saten's teasing of Uihara XD.
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Old 2011-03-03, 16:26   Link #72
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I suppose it could hurt. I did not like the first half of Railgun at all, as I felt there was too much fluff and fanservice, but I'm just not a huge fan of the Index series . I don't think these things really show up with alarming frequency so it doesn't get my hate.

But imagine my dismay when people told me there were panty shots in Nanoha. (Oh nos call the FBI) I didn't notice them at first, and well... was not pleased. If they're not noticeable, then it can't bother me.

So it's either frequency (pretty much any ecchi anime out there) or extreme inappropriateness. The 1st season of Full Metal Panic would give us panty shots at the worst moments. Shana doesn't really have that many, but the few that are kinda disruptive because they happen during fights. But at least that makes more sense with all that jumping around.

I also admit to be instantly turned off with that one scene in Bakemongatari's start.
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Old 2011-03-03, 16:54   Link #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
I suppose it could hurt. I did not like the first half of Railgun at all, as I felt there was too much fluff and fanservice, but I'm just not a huge fan of the Index series . I don't think these things really show up with alarming frequency so it doesn't get my hate.

But imagine my dismay when people told me there were panty shots in Nanoha. (Oh nos call the FBI) I didn't notice them at first, and well... was not pleased. If they're not noticeable, then it can't bother me.
Wait Nanoha had panty shots? I don't remember seeing any really unless you're counting the transformation scenes <_<.
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Old 2011-03-03, 16:59   Link #74
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Wait Nanoha had panty shots? I don't remember seeing any really unless you're counting the transformation scenes <_<.
Exactly. Neither of us noticed them because we weren't looking for them. And I don't want to go back to find out.

Unless Tvtropes has been lying to us. Which is entirely possible.
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Old 2011-03-03, 22:35   Link #75
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Originally Posted by Konakaga View Post
Wait Nanoha had panty shots? I don't remember seeing any really unless you're counting the transformation scenes <_<.
They're there. Anytime Nanoha or Fate (well, I guess Fate doesn't technically wear panties) flip in the air you catch a small glimpse of them...But unless you're looking for something to complain about, it's hardly noticeable.

In other news, about the whole kuudere/tsundere debate --

You got a cute little "hurt puppy" loli with a hardened exterior on one side, and a bitch on the other. I'm not sure how some people rationalize and choose the latter, but it happens.
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Old 2011-03-03, 23:40   Link #76
DangoMochi
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Originally Posted by Echoes View Post
One cliche that I really think needs to go is the "comic relief male friend" in every harem/school-based comedy. These characters usually don't contribute anything to the show expect to act as a counterweight to the mysteriously sexually disinterested lead. They're annoying, unnecessary, usually not even remotely funny, and overused doesn't even come close to describing their prevalence.

Notable exception: Clannad. Sunohara is an amazingly funny and cool character.
I agree with you on this, especially about Sunohara

I'm able to withstand other cliches, but this is the only one that gets on my nerves
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Old 2011-03-05, 09:24   Link #77
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Adding to the Tsundere rant, I find it extremely annoying when they have a second love interest that actually deserves them more. You know, Girl A kicks the hell out of him, Girl B bakes him a cake. Girl A only just noticed he exists, Girl B has loved him since childhood. Girl A: "Fine, I guess I'll let you carry my stuff." Girl B:"I'm happy just being by your side."
And somehow Girl A is supposed to be sympathetic. I think the worst of these is when the tsun is the main character, so she wins completely by default, like in Familiar of Zero (where pretty much anyone is better than Louise) and B Gata H Kei (where Yamada is, well, Yamada).

In the interest of adding something new, though, I'll say I hate onsens. Yes, I hate bath scenes. Now don't get me wrong, partial nudity is usually great, but damn if there isn't a bath scene in every anime. Even when it makes no sense, even when the series is dark as hell, somehow, if there is a female character in the show, she will, at some point, enter a bath house. Some series will even produce entire episodes just for this.
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Old 2011-03-05, 14:36   Link #78
Chiibi
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Originally Posted by Blank-Mage View Post
Now don't get me wrong, partial nudity is usually great, but damn if there isn't a bath scene in every anime. Even when it makes no sense, even when the series is dark as hell, somehow, if there is a female character in the show, she will, at some point, enter a bath house. Some series will even produce entire episodes just for this.
There are a few shoujo anime that do not have onsen scenes.

A few....

Oh, come to think of it, I don't think any of the Key series had them? The only Key series I've completed is Angel Beats but I know that didn't have one.
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Old 2011-03-05, 15:04   Link #79
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Well I can't deny the fact that they partially, or possibly fully dedicate 1 entire episode to extreme fanservice for the sake of reasons I don't know myself but there are some animes that don't have an onsen episode. Like Chiibi said, Angel Beats doesn't have one, Clannad doesn't, I don't know about the other Key series myself but I think they don't have one. But you are also accurate by pointing out that "alot" of animes have this.
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Old 2011-03-05, 17:05   Link #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kameruka View Post
Okay, enough with cooking. Finally I came with better but more controversial idea...

What it is?: Anti-feminist shoujo heroines/shows/mangas

Spoiler for space:
Don't bash, but being so popular among girls should tell you something about at least modern feminists.
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