AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Nanoha

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2011-03-25, 06:29   Link #3021
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
Augusto, the Wolfram's main weapon.
That's one. But the claim was "magic-powered weaponry isn't exactly less common than sand", so backing that up would require more example
__________________
Tiresias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 06:50   Link #3022
Arcc
Knight who says D'ni
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: -0,-0,-0,-0: The Brink of Time
Age: 27
Well, I suppose there are surprisingly few examples of weapons on inspection. Not a lot of vehicle-mounted weapons or artillery, though we don't see an awful lot of vehicles, period. Most mages use their own power via a device when it comes to personal combat. But consider what we do see: Precia's robots and the target drones on the training course do use magic attacks. And practically everything that's worth defending to somebody has a barrier. Heck, all of the tech in this era is magic-powered, and they don't have mages running on hamster wheels for that. You could go the distopian, Matrixesque route of saying they having mages hooked up in series inside their generators, but I ain't reading that fic.

So why not let drones shoot magic lasers? Frankly, there's no accounting for Spagghetti's demented tastes, so it could be either sort of weapon, but the drones are magical. They kinda need to be to generate AMF, which is just another type of magic barrier. (StrikerS manga chapter 2, page 10)
__________________
The more that you resist the tide
The more it pulls you in
The more you hang on for your life~

Arcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 07:34   Link #3023
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
I don't think AMF is illegal per se.



Those are banned outright. I think Fate explains that in a StrikerS episode, though I don't remember which one. However, physical weapons were only part of Type IV and, possibly, Type II (the air-to-air missiles).



Only as long as they are actual Lost Logia. Those are to be turned over to the Bureau (see first seasons). I think only Type III were powered by them, however.



I don't think those are illegal per se, either...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
How about their lasers?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
I am not sure those are not magical...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcc View Post
Well, I suppose there are surprisingly few examples of weapons on inspection. Not a lot of vehicle-mounted weapons or artillery, though we don't see an awful lot of vehicles, period. Most mages use their own power via a device when it comes to personal combat. But consider what we do see: Precia's robots and the target drones on the training course do use magic attacks. And practically everything that's worth defending to somebody has a barrier. Heck, all of the tech in this era is magic-powered, and they don't have mages running on hamster wheels for that. You could go the distopian, Matrixesque route of saying they having mages hooked up in series inside their generators, but I ain't reading that fic.

So why not let drones shoot magic lasers? Frankly, there's no accounting for Spagghetti's demented tastes, so it could be either sort of weapon, but the drones are magical. They kinda need to be to generate AMF, which is just another type of magic barrier. (StrikerS manga chapter 2, page 10)
Let me explain the purpose of my main question: Why were Gadget Drones illegal?
__________________
Tiresias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 07:56   Link #3024
al103
Grumpy Russian bear
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk
Age: 33
Send a message via ICQ to al103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
Let me explain the purpose of my main question: Why were Gadget Drones illegal?
Answer - we don't know. It's possible (though not likely) that they were legal, just Jail actions with them were not.
__________________
Proud Nanoha/Yuno/Fate, Caro/Elio/Lutecia, Alto/Sheril/Ranka and Honor/Hamish/Emily shipper. Last one even canon.

PS. Also Nanoha/job, Honor/job and Rein/Agito.
PPS. Proud Athrun/Cagalli/Meyrin shipper.
al103 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 08:58   Link #3025
Arcc
Knight who says D'ni
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: -0,-0,-0,-0: The Brink of Time
Age: 27
That is a good question. I can't remember where I saw it, but I thought I remembered them saying somewhere that the gadgets were reverse-engineered from lost logia. So in other words, they weren't lost logia themselves, but they used illegal tech in their construction and/or components?

Also, the jewel seed on that one unit was one of the same ones collected by Nanoha and Fate in the first season. Considering there are only 12 of those that didn't fall through the rift with Precia, there's no way that all Type IIIs were equipped with such things. Remember that Scags was taunting RF6 (and probably Fate in particular) directly by stamping his name right next to the Seed; it may not even have had a purpose in the drone other than to draw attention and say "neener neener remember this?"

Edit: Just pulled up that scene from episode 6. Immediately after identifying the jewel seed and Spaghetti's handiwork, Fate states that lost logia was used to manufacture the gadgets.
__________________
The more that you resist the tide
The more it pulls you in
The more you hang on for your life~

Arcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 14:09   Link #3026
Koveras Alvane
Mastermind Rational
*Author
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
Age: 27
Send a message via ICQ to Koveras Alvane Send a message via MSN to Koveras Alvane
Well, on the topic of magical weaponry... If you recall, the whole training grounds for the trainees in StrikerS were made out of magical solid light and they also had pretty realistic simulations of Gadget Drones which shot lasers that were definitely magical yet did dish quite some pain.

Also, think back to Precia's robots in TOS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al103 View Post
Answer - we don't know. It's possible (though not likely) that they were legal, just Jail actions with them were not.
Gadgets per se weren't illegal IIRC, it's the fact that they were used to search and capture Relics that was. In fact, I am not really sure that the Gadgets used in Teana and Subaru's mage rank exam weren't simply reprogrammed Scaglietti's drones.
__________________
Koveras Alvane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 14:16   Link #3027
Arcc
Knight who says D'ni
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: -0,-0,-0,-0: The Brink of Time
Age: 27
Another thing about the gadgets, besides the LL connection: They were semi-autonomous drones that Scaglietti just sent out to look for the relics (and kill anything that gets in the way). Once they are unleashed on their single-minded purpose, they are effectively UXOs. . . and the TSAB is the kind of progressive good-guy government that wouldn't tolerate use of that sort of weapon by itself or others (think landmines).
__________________
The more that you resist the tide
The more it pulls you in
The more you hang on for your life~

Arcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 19:30   Link #3028
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
Well, on the topic of magical weaponry... If you recall, the whole training grounds for the trainees in StrikerS were made out of magical solid light and they also had pretty realistic simulations of Gadget Drones which shot lasers that were definitely magical yet did dish quite some pain.

Also, think back to Precia's robots in TOS.



Gadgets per se weren't illegal IIRC, it's the fact that they were used to search and capture Relics that was. In fact, I am not really sure that the Gadgets used in Teana and Subaru's mage rank exam weren't simply reprogrammed Scaglietti's drones.
This raises another question: If it's not illegal, why don't we ever see the TSAB uses them, even unarmed civilian versions? Because it looks like not everyone has powerful enough magic for doing things and they usually compensates with technology (cars, helicopters, etc) ? And if there's TSAB owned Gadget Drones why weren't they utilized during the JS Incident?
__________________
Tiresias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 19:56   Link #3029
al103
Grumpy Russian bear
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Russia, Krasnoyarsk
Age: 33
Send a message via ICQ to al103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcc View Post
That is a good question. I can't remember where I saw it, but I thought I remembered them saying somewhere that the gadgets were reverse-engineered from lost logia.
If something is reverse-engineered than it's not lost logia. It's simple as that. Doesn't mean that it's legal though.
__________________
Proud Nanoha/Yuno/Fate, Caro/Elio/Lutecia, Alto/Sheril/Ranka and Honor/Hamish/Emily shipper. Last one even canon.

PS. Also Nanoha/job, Honor/job and Rein/Agito.
PPS. Proud Athrun/Cagalli/Meyrin shipper.
al103 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-25, 20:04   Link #3030
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
Made more illegal afterwards?
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-26, 09:42   Link #3031
Koveras Alvane
Mastermind Rational
*Author
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
Age: 27
Send a message via ICQ to Koveras Alvane Send a message via MSN to Koveras Alvane
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
This raises another question: If it's not illegal, why don't we ever see the TSAB uses them, even unarmed civilian versions? Because it looks like not everyone has powerful enough magic for doing things and they usually compensates with technology (cars, helicopters, etc) ? And if there's TSAB owned Gadget Drones why weren't they utilized during the JS Incident?
I don't know. ^^ Maybe it's an ideological thing, just like with mass weaponry, since the Belkans were quite eager to use robots in their wars...
__________________
Koveras Alvane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-26, 12:56   Link #3032
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
This raises another question: If it's not illegal, why don't we ever see the TSAB uses them, even unarmed civilian versions? Because it looks like not everyone has powerful enough magic for doing things and they usually compensates with technology (cars, helicopters, etc) ? And if there's TSAB owned Gadget Drones why weren't they utilized during the JS Incident?
The answer remains the same: We don't know.
__________________
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-26, 13:02   Link #3033
Arcc
Knight who says D'ni
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: -0,-0,-0,-0: The Brink of Time
Age: 27
Well, I did put my theory up there. It IS a very good reason the TSAB wouldn't implement or condone the use of gadget drones. But it is still just a theory.
__________________
The more that you resist the tide
The more it pulls you in
The more you hang on for your life~

Arcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-26, 22:24   Link #3034
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcc View Post
Well, I did put my theory up there. It IS a very good reason the TSAB wouldn't implement or condone the use of gadget drones. But it is still just a theory.
A nice theory, if not for the fact that militaries actually increases their use of combat drones to minimize human casualties (on their side).
__________________
Tiresias is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 04:19   Link #3035
Arcc
Knight who says D'ni
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: -0,-0,-0,-0: The Brink of Time
Age: 27
Well, my point is that the gadgets aren't remote-operated; they are basically terminators given instructions and set out, and at that point they are just collateral damage waiting to happen. UXOs = unexploded ordinance, if you're not familiar with the term.

I'm sure the TSAB has no problem with remotes who are controlled from afar, or fully-intelligent machines who can make judgement calls and would have to be treated like citizens rather than devices (case in point: the Wolkies and unison devices). Heck, I'm sure remote controlled stuffs see frequent use in both private and military sectors for all kinds of purposes, just like in the real world.
__________________
The more that you resist the tide
The more it pulls you in
The more you hang on for your life~

Arcc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 11:59   Link #3036
Akiyoshi
The Flame Crussader
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcc View Post
Well, my point is that the gadgets aren't remote-operated; they are basically terminators given instructions and set out, and at that point they are just collateral damage waiting to happen. UXOs = unexploded ordinance, if you're not familiar with the term.
True. I'm rewatching StrikerS and Scaglietti mentions at some point that once the Gadget Drones are settled into "relic Search" mode he stops being in full control of them because they're only following their own protocols in order to find and secure the relic.
__________________
May 29 2010-2014

...4 yeargo, the day after never would be the same

~The ASFB~
Akiyoshi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 12:32   Link #3037
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
Which is an outright lie, considering Quattro can still control them just fine.
__________________
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 13:06   Link #3038
Akiyoshi
The Flame Crussader
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Which is an outright lie, considering Quattro can still control them just fine.
Apparently the Gadgets can be switched between auto-search and controled mode, remember how Lutecia suddenly make them fully operable by controlling them with her bugs during the battle at Hotel Augusta.
__________________
May 29 2010-2014

...4 yeargo, the day after never would be the same

~The ASFB~
Akiyoshi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 15:02   Link #3039
Yasanagi
A Drifter...
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Brampton
Send a message via AIM to Yasanagi
Are there any specific details on how exactly Olivie's sacrifice stopped the Saint King Unification War? Like what actions she took and how did she perish in the end?
__________________

Thanks to 00-Raiser for hooking me up with the sig!
Yasanagi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2011-03-27, 16:00   Link #3040
Keroko
Adeptus Animus
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Age: 26
She took the Cradle. Beyond that, none whatsoever.
__________________
Keroko is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:45.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.