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Old 2004-10-30, 20:09   Link #201
Onizuka-GTO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stormy001_M1A2
Not enough blood for me. But I am damn happy when I see a Monster MK 2 MAC deployed. Those artillery mechas is beautiful.

Storywise, Zero lacks a lot of development, especially the Russian group. The superlative animation is a good compensation.

Oh god. That scene was one of my favourite!

I mean when you see it in Macross, they seem quite unsurprising and overlooked compared to the larger Macross gunship and the surrounding Zentradi ships.

But Macross Zero scene really shows how big these mechs were, i mean the VF-x II showed them off, but that was the Flying versions, and were slightly smaller compared to the originals.

I want to see more of them in action scenes...
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Old 2004-11-02, 18:01   Link #202
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Worst Macross show ever, what's with the whole "magic" and "greenpeace" crap suddenly? Kawamori should lay off the enviromentalist propaganda, its been screwing up his anime ever since Arjuna.
Macross has always been about airplanes, dogfights, aliens, hot-shot pilots and pop-idols, none of this greenpeace magic kadun mumbo jumbo.

And graphically its a disaster too, for its "high budget" it sure has the worst showing of any other Macross series, simply becuase they obviously didnt use the tools available at optimum level.
Like having 3D airplanes, and then 2D explosions over them...and in one ep some mech goes from 3D->2D just before it blows up in 2D...and when they do that "zoom in cockpit" thing...you totally see the character as a 2D object against a 3D backround....and when people are walking infront of 3D object...its so bad...i wasn't even this annoyed when i watched SDF Macross! and that was made by a bunch of amatuers compared to this!
Oh, and also, the character animation is terrible in most places, nasty distortions, and bad movement...i'm amazed this is a ova, it seems like some TV-anime with a slightly high 3D budget. >_>

As an animator this series is appalling, as a Macross fan its even worse. >_>

Well, this ranks lowest on my Macross list...number one being Do You Remember Love, and number two being Macross Plus.

Kawamori should have stopped with Macross after Plus.
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Old 2004-11-02, 20:51   Link #203
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The ending was rushed and a tad predictable but I still liked the series overall. Every now and then you need a little mindless fluff and Mac 0 provided that.

PS: Isnt they carrier supposed to be called Asuka, like the Japanese carrier in WW2? Why did the subbers change the name?
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Old 2004-11-03, 00:38   Link #204
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How does this Bird man origin fit into the Macross story? Is the birdman some machine left over by the "Creators?" Why is there even a link with the blood to the mayans o.O
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Old 2004-11-03, 02:06   Link #205
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Wait, are there more than 5 episodes? Because I've seen up to episode 5 and there's no magic, and no greenpeace environmentalism anywhere. The themes that conflict can be ended peacfully has been in Macross since the beginning, as the Bodol fleet would have wiped out Earth and gone on it's merry way had Britai and his fleet not teamed up with the Macross. This theme was repeated in both DYRL? and Macross 7, Macross Plus being the odd series out. Even there, Isamu and Guld were able to settle their differences, wich turned out to be rather different than what had been portrayed at the beginning.

As for how the Bird Human and the blood link, the Bird Human (AFOS) is actually a machine left behind by the Protoculture (fleshed out even more in SDF Macross, DYRL?, and Macross 7) to make sure that humanity was not another warlike race by the time it had grown beyond it's terrestrial cradle. The Protoculture had already created the Zentradi, the Meltrandi, and the eVil series wich became inhabited by the Protodevlin. The subsequent wars had decimated even the Protoculture's once galaxy spanning society. The Nome family, specifically, was a decended line genetically designed to pilot AFOS, and either inform the machine that humanity had evolved beyond the needless conflict of an agressive species, or activate AFOS's program to destroy humanity and start again from scratch.
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Old 2004-11-03, 02:38   Link #206
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I agree with zepher about the environmentalist stuff in Arjuna and Macross Zero. I am actually pro-environmentalism in reality, but Arjuna made me hate the environmentalism messages in it. And environmentalism in a Macross series is the worst possible thing ever. what's the point of protecting the nature when
Spoiler:
environmentalism in a Macross universe doesn't make any sense IMO...
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Old 2004-11-03, 12:14   Link #207
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To be honest, i don't see anything about protecting the enviroment in this series.

Maybe im just abit stupid.



But Macross Zero was great.

I loved it, it had some of the element themes of love, and peace thing going, but it also had some other messages of that not all things are black and white, and one of those things was the mention of U.N troops that affected Nora, and the ironic actions she does that repeats the same violent cycle.
But the most surprising part, was the very Japanese Ending, loved it!
It was sad, but had a element of hope.

Too bad it didn't show more Mecha though. can't go wrong with that!

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Old 2004-11-03, 19:38   Link #208
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Protoculture - Enlightened Creator Race or Brutal Galatic Empire

Quote:
As for how the Bird Human and the blood link, the Bird Human (AFOS) is actually a machine left behind by the Protoculture (fleshed out even more in SDF Macross, DYRL?, and Macross 7) to make sure that humanity was not another warlike race by the time it had grown beyond it's terrestrial cradle. The Protoculture had already created the Zentradi, the Meltrandi, and the eVil series wich became inhabited by the Protodevlin. The subsequent wars had decimated even the Protoculture's once galaxy spanning society. The Nome family, specifically, was a decended line genetically designed to pilot AFOS, and either inform the machine that humanity had evolved beyond the needless conflict of an agressive species, or activate AFOS's program to destroy humanity and start again from scratch.
Maybe it's just my love of irony, but I'm not too sure that the Protoculture is all that benevolent and peaceful. To put things another way, they leave fantastically powerful weapon lying around by developing cultures. If they don't like the way the "lesser race" developes, they nuke it. There's no moral directive in this behavior. They already had a star spanning empire and didn't want their creations rocking the boat. Comparing the weapon technology, it's like the US nuking another country because they're developing gunpowder weapons.

Not to mention that the presence of the bird human itself affected the human conflict. Without AFOS, the conflict between the UN and anti-united forces would have progressed a bit differently. Given the chance to control a super weapon that would essentially result in an automatic win, how could each side not go for it? The bird human is an escalating factor in the conflict, like a 3rd player who keeps raising the other 2 in a card game. It's not some aloof judge, it's a major factor in the human conflict simply through it's existence; like the uncertainty principle on a global level.

Additionally, AFOS is toasting more than just humans. Good job with the whole killing all humans with energy beams, when at that level of tech (where technology = magic for most intents and purposes), it could use more selective antihuman weapons (tailored germs or chemicals, nanites, etc).

Finally, the Bird-Human takes the idea of dehumanizing one's enemies to the next level. Do you really think Sara would be blithely be selecting human fighters and ships for destruction if she was aiming at people? An unwilling (or only semi-willing) pilot would kind of put a damper on the kill all humans plan. Good thing that interface only shows her inhuman monsters that play upon her religious background. Deceptive much? Furthermore, it seems a bit underhanded to play off a girl's fear, anger and gried.

To borrow the Mayan term, the Bird Human is kadun.
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Old 2004-11-03, 20:22   Link #209
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I heard that after Kawamori's father died, he converted to some religious cult and that he tries to put themes from that cult into his anime ever since then (starting with Arjuna). It would explain the mess this anime falls apart into. In the end, I only liked this show for the mecha scenes and Kamiya Akira reprising his role as Roy Fokker.

I was really hoping that the Mayan island would be hinted to being the disguised form of the protoculture city that appears in the Macross movie...at least that would have made more sense.

It would be nice to see a Macross series appear again that captures the feel of the classic series and movie. Sigh.
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Old 2004-11-04, 00:48   Link #210
dreamless
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actually I don't think the Protoculture had considered that much about moral issues when they started the project to create humanity. the comparison to US nuking other country doesn't not really hold since US is not the creator of any other country nor are US people any superior lifeform than people of other countries. The Protoculture, Birdman and human situation is more like human scientists, failsafe security and lab created experimental bioweapons.

I guess Protoculture itself is definitely not some "enlightened race". They have their own republic and anti-republic forces at all out war, that's why they keep developing more and more powerful living weapons. That's why the science ship which created humanity got destroyed by enemy forces after leaving Earth.
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Old 2004-11-14, 20:02   Link #211
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having a problem playing 4 and 5... i get video but no audio and a very helpful (NOT) windows message pops up saying my pin cannot play the file... search didn't help me much in this case, can someone point me in the right direction? i'm using WM10 with the most recent codec i could find. sorry if this is the wrong forum.. i got kinda lost and this is the onyl one that said macross zero on it
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Old 2004-11-14, 20:18   Link #212
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sorry bout that.. did the search wrong ... i'll go look in the Macross Help thread =P
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Old 2004-11-15, 10:24   Link #213
Radd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ayu-ayu
I heard that after Kawamori's father died, he converted to some religious cult and that he tries to put themes from that cult into his anime ever since then (starting with Arjuna). It would explain the mess this anime falls apart into. In the end, I only liked this show for the mecha scenes and Kamiya Akira reprising his role as Roy Fokker.

I was really hoping that the Mayan island would be hinted to being the disguised form of the protoculture city that appears in the Macross movie...at least that would have made more sense.

It would be nice to see a Macross series appear again that captures the feel of the classic series and movie. Sigh.

Mess? Really the only problems I had with the last episode is that it seemed rushed and that they had crammed 2 episodes worth of content into a single episode.

As for the Mayan island being hinted as the Protoculture city...

Spoiler:


As for all the Macross titles since SDF and DYRL? Well, I'm actually fairly happy that Macross didn't turn into another Gundam, with a new sequel every year that just rehashed the same old elements. I really enjoyed Macross Plus, and find myself watching my Macross 7 DVDs far more than my SDF or DYRL? DVDs. While I think Zero falls short of both Plus and 7 in all respects except for some of the animation, I can't say I'm terribly dissapointed. I enjoyed the ride and look forward to more whenver Kawamori gets around to another Macross project.
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Old 2004-11-18, 15:32   Link #214
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Macross Zero with 5.1?

With the current Macross Zero fansubs available on Animesuki, which have AC3/surround sound audio? I know the ANBU & AonE & F-B 5 episode bundle has it for the last two, but what about the the first three?
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Old 2004-11-19, 15:49   Link #215
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Anyone? I don't want to re-download episodes until I can get them in AC3. Earlier in the thread there was mention of files that are either not seeded, or not listed anymore.
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Old 2004-11-19, 17:06   Link #216
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what happens three years after this story???

Spoiler:
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Old 2004-11-19, 20:17   Link #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f00l
what happens three years after this story???

Spoiler:

The what?



It was the Zentradi during the Macross Gunship Auguaration on completion of it's reconstruction.

SW 1 starts off, which you see in the original Macross Series.

I dunno what your talking about, perhaps your talking about another anime?

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Old 2004-11-19, 22:04   Link #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f00l
what happens three years after this story???

Spoiler:
That'd be too funny. Nah, the Invid attack happened in ROBOTECH. Macross was a part of ROBOTECH (the first half) two other animes (Southern Cross and MOSEPEDA) were edited and added to the ROBOTECH storyline, but those 3 shows have no correlations to eachother, just only in ROBOTECH. Macross Zero happens a few years prior to Macross. And if edited could fit into the ROBOTECH universe too.

I think the Inivid attack happened right after the Second ROBOTECH War with the Masters. (Sorry just had to throw that in)
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Old 2004-12-08, 07:08   Link #219
JoeBlack
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Thumbs down

I am so disappointed with Macross Zero.

Macross Plus was splendid with its characters, plot and theme. I thought Kawamori Shoji has the potential to be the best director in anime genre. I was high on expectation when I knew that Macross Zero will be released soon. However, after seeing entire 5 episodes, I am utterly disappointed. Instead of a crafty well developed story or characters, I got much ripped off from other people's work. Unoriginality comes to my mind when I was watching the series.

Shin Kudou - a friendly somebody
Sara Nome - native princess with psychic power
Mao Nome - typical mischievous sister in many series
Aries Turner - Ritsuko Akagi comes back alive!!!
Dr. Hasford - looks evil, smell evil, he is your typical evil scientist
Nora Polyansky - I am sure I have seen her somewhere in Gundam.

The plot is so predictable that it is laughable. Sara has been reaffirming that the bird human is going to awake and sing the song of death. Oh well, guess what, the bird human does awake after a couple meaningless battle scenes between valkyries. The bird human wake up and become 18th Angel. Well, it needs a pilot. Sara somehow gets sucked in and is able to synchronize herself to the bird human without any plug suit!!!! (No, the blood type is blue!!! ba ba ba ba) Then, insert a love story. Why must there be a love story???? It has been done before, so let us just recycle it. Eventually, Sara and its beloved eva,,,woops,,,I mean,,,,bird human are then drift in space. The theme, we all know war is bad, so let's have bird human destroy everything.

The animation of the series is amazing, but it is a waste to be used for such a bad script.
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Old 2004-12-10, 19:25   Link #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamless
I agree with zepher about the environmentalist stuff in Arjuna and Macross Zero. I am actually pro-environmentalism in reality, but Arjuna made me hate the environmentalism messages in it. And environmentalism in a Macross series is the worst possible thing ever. what's the point of protecting the nature when
Spoiler:
environmentalism in a Macross universe doesn't make any sense IMO...
As Radd said on the previous page, we have to think about Macross Zero in context just as I'm sure the production team did while they were making the series. If you think about what happens to the earth a short while later, then it takes on a whole different meaning. It's not that Kawamori decided to tell his 'stupid Greenpeace story' and slap the 'Macross' name onto it in a shameless attempt to trick people into listening to his ebil propaganda. Any feeling of peace has to be balanced out by what we know of destruction, just as what we know of destruction has to be balanced out by what we know of peace. Humanity is "saved" in Macross Zero. And then much of it is destroyed in SDF Macross. No difference anyone makes will ever be permanent. That's what makes multi-installment series like Macross so interesting: the possibility for a dialogue between the different installments and constantly building upon the original idea. Environmentalism in the real world doesn't 'make any sense' either. The world might be scorched by March 2005 for all we know. Needlessly destroying nature to benefit ourselves doesn't 'make any sense' either: We might be history by March 2005. Why bother to feed yourself when you'll only die eventually anyway? Why not massacre a whole race of people? After all, nobody will care or remember that they ever existed 100 years from now. While I understand the logic behind saying that something is stupid because it is futile, it's also possible to say that anything is futile. So why not err on the side of preservation instead of destruction?

Although perhaps an ending reference to the SDF Macross series would have been in order if that continuity was actually the point.
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