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Old 2011-06-06, 16:27   Link #1041
hoarfrost
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonta Kun View Post
In that case should he really be on some holiday, when he should be training to gain proper control of that power.

They are after all fighting a war for mankind's survival.

Like I've said before they are completely lax about discipline with pardoras.
Always bothered me. In any reasonably well written world, he would be locked in a facility 500 ft below ground undergoing 24 hour rigorous conditioning. But Genetics basically says "lol lets just let him walk around doing nothing". What's worse is that he goes on these inner monologues about how he wants to use his power For Great Justice, but himself doesn't seem to ever petition anyone about teaching him anything about anything. What's his face from Kuragehime at least played around and meditated until a plot device happened he acquired his ability.

I wouldn't actually be surprised if Limiters all honed their abilities through just yelling "Freezing!" and straining real hard until something useful happens.
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Old 2011-06-06, 23:22   Link #1042
Darknemo2000
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Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
For everyone who is calling Kazuya weak i think you need to take a step back and throw out what crazy self deluded notions of what being a man is.

Kazuya character is not meant to be the strong arm type thats not him it never was and to all of sudden turn him into some hand to hand combat specialist is ridiculous. Louis obviously coming from a very rich family was probably trained in martial arts his whole life. Its no surprise that he could physically beat down Kazuya. Yes Aoi lost his temper and charged at Louis but anyone would have if they saw the person they love abused in a such a way.

Aoi's character is meant to possess the strength of heart and understanding. He is the emotional support while Stella is the muscle its been that way since they met. Louis lacks the emotional fortitude of Aoi he has never had it and does not truly understand what it means to care for a person as a person not as an object. He seems Stella as his property and he sees Holly as his property as well. The racial slurs only amplify his ignorance and shows just how shallow of a person he really is.

No matter how many times Aoi was knocked down, no matter how many times he was kicked, punched or insulted he never lost faith in Stella or what they have built together. He supported her even while getting his ass kicked he took the insults and stood back up time and time again. Only a person who truly believes in what they doing or what they are defending can do that. So he may have been beaten physically but his emotional support never wavered not even once, how many of you have the stones to keep getting back up to shouting to the heavens what you truly believe while getting your fucking face caved in or kick in the head? He didnt use his Freezing power SO WHAT!!!. Louis didnt use his either you dont need special powers to settle a fight and i would have thought less of him if he did use it. Also, the reason why the girls are now involved is because Louis told Holy to chop up Aoi. Im sorry all fucking bets are off when you try to dismember someone because you have a damn sister complex so server i cold make millions off writing a self help book based of his experiences. If i was Aoi i would have tried to settle this with my fist and not my powers as well man to man but Louis broke that when he involved Holly.

So again being a man is not about your physical strength its about fortitude and standing strong to your beliefs even when someone threatens physical violence upon you, its about keeping your word and supporting the people you care about no matter what. Aoi has demonstrated qualities of a real man more than most men i know. He may not be Mr muscle, Col kick ass or General GAR but hes got the qualities that really matter.


Im done peace
And i am bored with these qualities that do matter. I want a character to relate not some wuss. Sorry but thats who he is. Talk about strong inner strength and blah blah blah but in reality he is nothing but a helpless weakling.

I much more prefer characters who are not afraid and actually can kick some ass, are not the retarded knights in shining armour who always stay on the 'don't kill, killing is so bad even when you face psychotic guy with an axe". I am just so bored of these guys.

Thats why creations like Kaze No Tsigma with Kazuma in front stands out of the retarded mass of the weakling guys who are strong inside, but frankly I dont like their strong inside when they are kicked around like meat puppets, I simply have zero respect on them and zero connection because they are so inhumanly weak.

Give me one Kazuma over a thousand of Aoi's anyday. He is strong outside, much more inner depth than Aoi could ever muster with his generic 'inner strength' that we have seen so much.

Now, I dont like guys who are all muscle but the guys in the middle rather than two extremes all muscle or all Aoi kind of guys. Give me a normal guy simply.
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Old 2011-06-06, 23:39   Link #1043
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Well Darknemo, I hate to say it but... outside of UxU, you're reading the stuff by the wrong author. Im Dal Young is notorious for this kind of shit (again, UxU is the exception, and I'm hearing people bitch about the qualities you're looking for that are in the male protag. of that series), with well-endowed, kick-ass women (who get extremely abused at one point or another) that are partnered with wimpy guys who on very rare occasion show a badass power

(also, with Kazuma and Kaze no Stigma- would you believe that's actually a shoujo story told in a shounen fashion?)
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Old 2011-06-07, 00:23   Link #1044
madness3_0
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Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
And i am bored with these qualities that do matter. I want a character to relate not some wuss. Sorry but thats who he is. Talk about strong inner strength and blah blah blah but in reality he is nothing but a helpless weakling.

I much more prefer characters who are not afraid and actually can kick some ass, are not the retarded knights in shining armour who always stay on the 'don't kill, killing is so bad even when you face psychotic guy with an axe". I am just so bored of these guys.

Thats why creations like Kaze No Tsigma with Kazuma in front stands out of the retarded mass of the weakling guys who are strong inside, but frankly I dont like their strong inside when they are kicked around like meat puppets, I simply have zero respect on them and zero connection because they are so inhumanly weak.

Give me one Kazuma over a thousand of Aoi's anyday. He is strong outside, much more inner depth than Aoi could ever muster with his generic 'inner strength' that we have seen so much.

Now, I dont like guys who are all muscle but the guys in the middle rather than two extremes all muscle or all Aoi kind of guys. Give me a normal guy simply.
Ok honestly at what point in reading this did you think it would change? does anyone even remember the nova? it is all about girls fighting each other, actually more specifically its about fighting stella. Actually its more about breaking her down and Aoi helping her from going insane or something. If you were really looking for a ...kung fu fight Aoi or something then you are reading the wrong thing.
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Old 2011-06-07, 01:15   Link #1045
Darknemo2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madness3_0 View Post
Ok honestly at what point in reading this did you think it would change? does anyone even remember the nova? it is all about girls fighting each other, actually more specifically its about fighting stella. Actually its more about breaking her down and Aoi helping her from going insane or something. If you were really looking for a ...kung fu fight Aoi or something then you are reading the wrong thing.
I am a normal guy I dont know kung fu and karate but I still can fight. I can land the blows and I can kick the ass. You dont need to be super fighter to be just a normal guy. Aoi is not a normal guy. He is too much of a weakling. The kind of guy who gets his head flushed in the toilet by the bullies. Normal guy is the one who dont bully others but do not get bullied himself. Who doenst throw the punches unnecessarily but still can throw a few when needed.

Thats the normal guy. Aoi is just another one of thos wimp heroes which clog a lot of manga for some reason and I am just kind of tired of such guys who blabber about inner strength and stuff like that but in reality are nothing but a helpless fuck toys and are completely dependent on others to save their asses.

I know pandoras are super and the like but Aoi completely sucks ass even against normal humans.

Hell even Shinji from evangelion could throw a punch when he was angered. Aoi is just utterly and totally helpless.

As for Kaze no Stigma. Yeah I think it had some shoujo elements in it, particularly Kazuma as he was good looking guy (very unusual for shounens to have a handsome guy), but at the same time he wasnt - he smoked like hell and had no claims about killing humans as long as they were unrelated to him. Normally shounen or shoujo guys are still those who fight for humanity and dont want a waste human life and blah blah blah. Kazuma never gave a shit about human life. He avoided unnecessarily death but had no claims to risk his life for complete strangers.

Like you know the shounen situation bad guy takes a stranger from the street as hostige and the good guy has to surrender. Kazuma in such case would not surrender simply because if he would bad guy would kill him and hostige so its better to just let hostige die but stay alive and kill the bad guy.

Its pragmatic kind of view but realistic. Something that you dont see often in the manga and thats why such heroes are a gust of fresh wind in the manga's stuffed with Aoi type of wimps with unrealistic retarded ideals that noone really believes in.

Of course even among the idealists Aoi is kind of extreme because he is such a total weakling. At least they should have given Aoi some strength on his own instead of making him a guy who would have troubles tackling a butterfly because butterfly is simply stronger.
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Old 2011-06-07, 01:38   Link #1046
madness3_0
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Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
I am a normal guy I dont know kung fu and karate but I still can fight. I can land the blows and I can kick the ass. You dont need to be super fighter to be just a normal guy. Aoi is not a normal guy. He is too much of a weakling. The kind of guy who gets his head flushed in the toilet by the bullies. Normal guy is the one who dont bully others but do not get bullied himself. Who doenst throw the punches unnecessarily but still can throw a few when needed.

Thats the normal guy. Aoi is just another one of thos wimp heroes which clog a lot of manga for some reason and I am just kind of tired of such guys who blabber about inner strength and stuff like that but in reality are nothing but a helpless fuck toys and are completely dependent on others to save their asses.

I know pandoras are super and the like but Aoi completely sucks ass even against normal humans.

Hell even Shinji from evangelion could throw a punch when he was angered. Aoi is just utterly and totally helpless.

As for Kaze no Stigma. Yeah I think it had some shoujo elements in it, particularly Kazuma as he was good looking guy (very unusual for shounens to have a handsome guy), but at the same time he wasnt - he smoked like hell and had no claims about killing humans as long as they were unrelated to him. Normally shounen or shoujo guys are still those who fight for humanity and dont want a waste human life and blah blah blah. Kazuma never gave a shit about human life. He avoided unnecessarily death but had no claims to risk his life for complete strangers.

Like you know the shounen situation bad guy takes a stranger from the street as hostige and the good guy has to surrender. Kazuma in such case would not surrender simply because if he would bad guy would kill him and hostige so its better to just let hostige die but stay alive and kill the bad guy.

Its pragmatic kind of view but realistic. Something that you dont see often in the manga and thats why such heroes are a gust of fresh wind in the manga's stuffed with Aoi type of wimps with unrealistic retarded ideals that noone really believes in.

Of course even among the idealists Aoi is kind of extreme because he is such a total weakling. At least they should have given Aoi some strength on his own instead of making him a guy who would have troubles tackling a butterfly because butterfly is simply stronger.
honestly it just seems to be bad writing, i mean there is barely anymention of nova, and it pretty much just girl on girl fighting. Aoi isn't an actual person, not trying to remove the immersion, but he seems very lifeless, im saying though is that this story is based on stella.
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Old 2011-06-07, 02:08   Link #1047
Darknemo2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madness3_0 View Post
honestly it just seems to be bad writing, i mean there is barely anymention of nova, and it pretty much just girl on girl fighting. Aoi isn't an actual person, not trying to remove the immersion, but he seems very lifeless, im saying though is that this story is based on stella.
Yeah I know that. I have no claims that he would be able to beat persona. They are inhuman strong so he has no chance against them, kung fu or not, but agaisnt other humans he shouldnt look this much helpless. For me its kind of disgusting and disturbing looking at him.

Magin, Isnt Aflame Inferno from the same author too? I thought that the MC wasnt really a wimp there. He still needed help once in a while but he certainly could stand his ground on more like one situation rather than being Aoi-like pushover.
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Old 2011-06-07, 02:18   Link #1048
Velsy
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ah since someone brought up the issue

Its what I said to my friend half way thu the anime. These pandoras are too busy bitching over ranks and pride, to realize the reason they are there for. Ranks mean shit all on a battlefield. You need to learn how to operate as a unit/team. But no, here they are, purposely trying to cripple each other (yes confirmed in the manga, 3rd year rank 7 tried putting Saterlizer out of service permanently, same with rank 2,4, 5, and 6 soon aftewards). Just say hey succeeded in destroying Saterlizers stigmas... theres one powerful ally gone. Bam a nova pops out and they are under-strength. All because they clutch to precious ranks like trophies and get butthurt when a 2nd year defeats a low end 3rd year in self defence.

I actually pridicted they would get there a$$ kicked if a Nova appeared during the anime because poorly lacking in team spirit or any unity.

On a side note, I thought alot better of Rolland when she covered/took a hit for Saterlizer, regardless if she was offically ranked higher. Keeping the stronger Satelizer in the battle for a better chance at winning is my assumption for her split second decision. I did actually think she had died, mainly because Arthur didnt make any attempt to stop the bleeding or administer any first aid. But keh, those pandoras are really quite durable don't yous think ? for humans.

Last edited by Velsy; 2011-06-07 at 02:29.
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Old 2011-06-07, 04:06   Link #1049
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lol.... I think that words can be more effective than punches.... A word can pierce someone's heart and leave a deep scar
I respect how Kazuya tried to attack Louis but failed... then he counters it with some sharp words (plus confession)
Kazuya just found a way to defeat Louis in a different way
the next chapter will be a brutal one and hopefully Kazuya can show that he is stronger than Louis as a limiter
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Old 2011-06-07, 04:32   Link #1050
Alhazad2003
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lol.... I think that words can be more effective than punches.... A word can pierce someone's heart and leave a deep scar
I respect how Kazuya tried to attack Louis but failed... then he counters it with some sharp words (plus confession)
Kazuya just found a way to defeat Louis in a different way
the next chapter will be a brutal one and hopefully Kazuya can show that he is stronger than Louis as a limiter
Exactly, all of Louis' punches did nothing to disprove Kazuya. Might does not make right. Louis' mentality is the same as all tyrants throughout history, and they've all been cast down. Louis will be no exception.

Oh yeah, in a pure Limiter battle, Louis has no chance. Kazuya's used his skills against Miyabi, Ingrid, those thugs in the city, and Nova Form Cassie. I doubt Louis has ever used his skills, because he's never been in any real danger. Wealth and status means nothing in a real battle, he'll realize that by the end of this arc, I'm sure.

And on another note...

Spoiler for Chapter 67:

Last edited by Alhazad2003; 2011-06-07 at 05:32.
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Old 2011-06-07, 06:48   Link #1051
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
And i am bored with these qualities that do matter. I want a character to relate not some wuss. Sorry but thats who he is. Talk about strong inner strength and blah blah blah but in reality he is nothing but a helpless weakling.

I much more prefer characters who are not afraid and actually can kick some ass, are not the retarded knights in shining armour who always stay on the 'don't kill, killing is so bad even when you face psychotic guy with an axe". I am just so bored of these guys.

Thats why creations like Kaze No Tsigma with Kazuma in front stands out of the retarded mass of the weakling guys who are strong inside, but frankly I dont like their strong inside when they are kicked around like meat puppets, I simply have zero respect on them and zero connection because they are so inhumanly weak.

Give me one Kazuma over a thousand of Aoi's anyday. He is strong outside, much more inner depth than Aoi could ever muster with his generic 'inner strength' that we have seen so much.

Now, I dont like guys who are all muscle but the guys in the middle rather than two extremes all muscle or all Aoi kind of guys. Give me a normal guy simply.

okay if you are tired of those types of characters why are you reading this manga when Aoi's character was developed from the start. I knew from page one he was not going to be bruiser. I see no reason why Aoi should even know how to fight but whatever. He tried we can bitch all we want but most of us in Aoi's situation probably curled into the fetal position. Everyone thinks their a bad ass till they are really faced with someone who really wants to kick your ass.

You said you are a normal guy that can fight i will bet you a years salary i know at least 7 people you wouldn't be able to land a hit on no matter how much you tried. The difference being you have no training in combat when they do. Like i said being a rich boy Louis probably has taken several forms of self defense his whole life. I know its your personal opinion and your preference. However, what i was referring too mainly in my post was that Aoi acted according to what and who his character is in the manga. Hes not going to change very much except for probably mentally not physically so you will only continue to be disappointed.
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Old 2011-06-07, 07:16   Link #1052
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Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
okay if you are tired of those types of characters why are you reading this manga when Aoi's character was developed from the start. I knew from page one he was not going to be bruiser. I see no reason why Aoi should even know how to fight but whatever. He tried we can bitch all we want but most of us in Aoi's situation probably curled into the fetal position. Everyone thinks their a bad ass till they are really faced with someone who really wants to kick your ass.

You said you are a normal guy that can fight i will bet you a years salary i know at least 7 people you wouldn't be able to land a hit on no matter how much you tried. The difference being you have no training in combat when they do. Like i said being a rich boy Louis probably has taken several forms of self defense his whole life. I know its your personal opinion and your preference. However, what i was referring too mainly in my post was that Aoi acted according to what and who his character is in the manga. Hes not going to change very much except for probably mentally not physically so you will only continue to be disappointed.
Let's not forget, Louis is also used to commiting acts of violence against his fellow human beings and he seems to have a low inhibition threshold towards doing so - I'd assume, being the heir to one of the most powerful families also helps to hush-up any wrongdoing on his part.
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Old 2011-06-07, 10:54   Link #1053
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Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
okay if you are tired of those types of characters why are you reading this manga when Aoi's character was developed from the start. I knew from page one he was not going to be bruiser. I see no reason why Aoi should even know how to fight but whatever. He tried we can bitch all we want but most of us in Aoi's situation probably curled into the fetal position. Everyone thinks their a bad ass till they are really faced with someone who really wants to kick your ass.

You said you are a normal guy that can fight i will bet you a years salary i know at least 7 people you wouldn't be able to land a hit on no matter how much you tried. The difference being you have no training in combat when they do. Like i said being a rich boy Louis probably has taken several forms of self defense his whole life. I know its your personal opinion and your preference. However, what i was referring too mainly in my post was that Aoi acted according to what and who his character is in the manga. Hes not going to change very much except for probably mentally not physically so you will only continue to be disappointed.
Its pretty obvious that I am dropping it now, isnt it? I was hoping that in final Aoi would show something... more than just words but thats all what he is capable off.

And I really dont know if there are person on whom you cannot land a blow. Even professional boxers are not that great actually - they are good at soaking the hits and avoiding hits towards the head and upper corpus but their knees are pretty weak and defense against legs is not great at all. I had a browl with one, got beaten of course (and had a chipped tooth as a present) but I certainly landed a few punches (we both were quite drunk though). But even so they are professional - Louis is not a professional, aristocrat or not he is not a professional boxer or karate guy. Its just that Aoi's pathetically is making him look good. Self defense or not, the way he sends Aoi to the ground without much of effort is just too pathetic to look at.

Last edited by Darknemo2000; 2011-06-07 at 11:05.
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Old 2011-06-07, 14:04   Link #1054
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While I don't share the LEVEL of Darknemo's disguist with these kinds of characters (I for example can deal with Aoi despite his getting his ass handed to him here).

I frankly can see where he is coming from, Shinji is a counterweight to all the redblooded mecha characters, that was deliberate contrast by Anno as his whole show was about tipping the iceberg. Far too often however, especially in these romantic tinged manga, the main males really would not last one day in real life in "charisma battles". I.E. they'd NEVER get chicks at least ones as hot in the manga. Sure nice guy and all, I am a nice guy, but not even the Japanese in real life all act like these Tenchi clones. It's really quite tiresome and lazy from a narrative standpoint.

Now as a moderating opinion, I can deal with Aoi because he's shown just enough backbone to be appealing as a protag, even if he lost a fight (and in the context of this Darknemo it IS just ONE fight, chill bro). Now we all know that unless we have serious condifence issues, most guys would have expected him to make the moves on Satella by now, but what are you gonna do?

Like something, the proprietor of Blog Suki said whilst he was grumbling about same protags, that it's likely self-inserting fantasy for the more otakuy demos who'd be reading this.
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Old 2011-06-14, 08:50   Link #1055
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Spoiler for chapter 67:

Last edited by shaselai; 2011-06-14 at 12:16.
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Old 2011-06-14, 10:04   Link #1056
hoarfrost
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Spoiler for :


That woman's name is Elize too? I got kind of confused given that that makes two of them so far. If they're different people it's kind of lazy to reuse names in a fictional setting.

Last edited by hoarfrost; 2011-06-14 at 10:16.
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Old 2011-06-14, 10:50   Link #1057
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Spoiler for :


That woman's name is Elize too? I got kind of confused given that that makes two of them so far. If they're different people it's kind of lazy to reuse names in a fictional setting.
the doctor's name is Elize no? at least that's the one i found in wiki... E pandoras are small fries though right?
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Old 2011-06-14, 11:44   Link #1058
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the doctor's name is Elize no? at least that's the one i found in wiki... E pandoras are small fries though right?
Elize is the German doc at West Genetics. Apparently, this one's name is Scarlet Ohara (lol).
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Old 2011-06-14, 15:43   Link #1059
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Spoiler for chapter 67:
Spoiler for chapter 67:
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Old 2011-06-15, 08:58   Link #1060
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Spoiler for chapter 67:
Spoiler for 67:
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