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View Poll Results: Hanasaku Iroha - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 26 36.11%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 28 38.89%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 9 12.50%
7 out of 10 : Good 8 11.11%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 1.39%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-06-19, 14:55   Link #21
Kanon
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I was hoping the Ko subplot would reach a conclusion this week, but alas, it looks like they're going to drag it out a lot longer. Despite her epiphany, it looks like Ohana still doesn't get it. Glasses girl is right, she needs to let Ko go already. How much longer is the poor dude going to have to wait for her, probably for nothing? Yes, I don't believe Ohana loves Ko, nor that she will come to love him. I interpreted her final lines in a different way: she said she had never even thought about going back to Tokyo, even though Ko is there. She's basically saying she didn't miss him. Sure, she likes him, but only as a friend. Mails are enough when it comes to friendship. If things between the two of them can't go back to how they were... then she doesn't want to go back to Tokyo. Of course, the other big reason she doesn't wish to go back is that she's having the time of life at Kissuiso. Me thinks she found her calling.

Satsuki didn't make me want to slap her this time. It's clear she isn't the mom of the year, but she does care about Ohana. She just doesn't really seem to know how a mom should behave, which might be due to how Sui treated her. In a way, she's not that different from Sui -- they both neglected their daughters to some extent, and I'm sure both of them thought it was for the best.

Minko is starting to grow on me. The girl who just kept urging people she disliked to die seem far away. She's handling the situation very maturely. She was even pretty cute in this episode, like when she started praising Tooru in front of Ohana, and immediately retracted her statement once she realized Ohana might fall for him if she notices how much of nice guy Tooru is
I felt kind of bad for her too. Her "date" with Tooru was horrible. Geez, what kind of guy would force a lady to eat until she pukes? Ohana saw right through him: he doesn't know how to handle women. That said, that date was pretty hilarious. Loved Minchi's face when she found out the kind of sushi Tooru was talking about.

All in all, excellent episode. I just hope we'll move on from the romance drama soon. I'm more interested in Yuina and Nako than Ko's romantic life.

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Originally Posted by deadite View Post
Ohana was the voice of her teen mom wasn't she?
Yup.
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Old 2011-06-19, 14:58   Link #22
hanashi
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Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
...Is it wrong that I'm highly amused by the trollercoaster that's going on this series? Where shit keeps getting piled on character after character?

Trollercoaster! I like that one.

I have my pairing preferences, but I don't consider myself a shipper. I change my mind too often, lol. Kinda shipping Tooru and Satsuki this week. Don't give me that look, you know it'd be loltastic.


Judging from the way Sui slapped Enishi in the preview, I don't think Satsuki v. Sui is going to be the cage match I'd have thought at the beginning of the show. I think it's pretty clear that Sui is fond of both her daughter and her granddaughter. It's also becoming a little more clear why Enishi turned out the way he is if chibi!Satsuki and Sui argued a lot before she left. He didn't inherit Sui's backbone, that's for sure, and the arguing wouldn't have helped. Yes, the previews can be trollerific but we have Enishi looking terrified as Satsuki hugs him and Sui slapping shaking him/slapping the bejeezus out of him so I feel safe in predicting the next episode will air some unresolved issues. Or maybe Satsuki will spend the entire episode drinking and scaring her brother.
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Old 2011-06-19, 14:59   Link #23
Guardian Enzo
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@Kanon - is it a sub-plot, or is it the plot?
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:04   Link #24
tezu
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
All in all, excellent episode. I just hope we'll move on from the romance drama soon. I'm more interested in Yuina and Nako than Ko's romantic life.
I feel the same way, but I heard ep 14 is going to introduce
Spoiler for ep14:

so if we're unlucky, the romance aspect might take up the majority of the series indeed........I hope not, though. Romance already ruined AnoHana for me lol xD
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:05   Link #25
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
@Kanon - is it a sub-plot, or is it the plot?
No, it's really not the plot. Even Minko and Ohana have more character development together.

Just because Ko's a man doesn't mean he's entitled to be considered more important to the main
plot than he really is.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:05   Link #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
...Despite her epiphany, it looks like Ohana still doesn't get it. Glasses girl is right, she needs to let Ko go already. How much longer is the poor dude going to have to wait for her, probably for nothing?

Yes, I don't believe Ohana loves Ko, nor that she will come to love him. I interpreted her final lines in a different way: she said she had never even thought about going back to Tokyo, even though Ko is there. She's basically saying she didn't miss him. Sure, she likes him, but only as a friend. Mails are enough when it comes to friendship. If things between the two of them can't go back to how they were... then she doesn't want to go back to Tokyo.

Of course, the other big reason she doesn't wish to go back is that she's having the time of life at Kissuiso. Me thinks she found her calling.
Hmm ... I dunno if the series is moving towards the specific ending of Ohana realizing she does not love Kou. But it definitely seems that sorting that whole pile of emotions out regarding him will be a big key to Ohana's growth somehow. Maybe even a watershed? And in this sense I absolutely agree that Ohana does need to "let go" of Kou in the sense of end the state of "up-in-the-air'nitude" between them so they both can move on. Whether it is to a relationship with Kou or not is another question.

Personally I would like a relationship with Kou to take place, but not "now" - maybe some years down the line. But then I am one of those gooey romantic story type sorts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Satsuki didn't make me want to slap her this time. It's clear she isn't the mom of the year, but she does care about Ohana. She just doesn't really seem to know how a mom should behave, which might be due to how Sui treated her. In a way, she's not that different from Sui -- they both neglected their daughters to some extent, and I'm sure both of them thought it was for the best.
VERY well said imo! I felt very similar.... And I lol'd at the above bolded statements.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:07   Link #27
Kaoru Chujo
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Originally Posted by deadite View Post
Ohana was the voice of her teen mom wasn't she?
It certainly sounded like it, but there's no indication of that in the end-credits, which just say that Satsuki is played by Honda Takako. So I'm not sure.

@tezu -- Romance can't ruin anything. I don't understand how people can give up the vast pleasure that enjoying romance stories can provide. It's all about choosing a life partner and perhaps the parent of your children. Nothing important, lol.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:09   Link #28
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Great episode. The only thing I didn't like was how young Satsuki is voiced by Ohana's VA. That was kinda lame. =/
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:12   Link #29
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
Another very strong episode.

Ohana's epiphany that she is the villain of her own love story hit really hard. I felt so awful for her, but she needed this moment of clarity; sometimes you can act completely without malice, but still hurt others.
I'm having trouble casting her as a villain. Shouldn't she be more uncaring of other people's feelings? I don't deny she's hurt Ko, and that he deserved better. But still, a villain?

Quote:
Tooru continues to shift annoyingly between being my favorite character, and coming off as an icky pervert. Mostly, he was awesome this episode. More of this Tooru, less creepy drooling at 16 year old girls in china dresses, please.
You're going to be disappointed. He's gone from drooling after Ohana to drooling after her mom. The logical progression is that he's going to drool after the grandma very soon.

Quote:
Maybe I'm crazy, but his comedic abuse of poor Minchi's stomach looked to me like a sign of approval and acceptance of her potential as a chef. I bet he's the tough love type when it comes to instructing.
Sort of, but why did he insist she eat everything, instead of a more rational "taste everything, and pace yourself, there's a lot to go through"? Eating till you vomit is unhealthy, and isn't doing the food justice.

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Originally Posted by serenade_beta View Post
I guess the last part tried to prove Ohana's mom isn't a terrible person or something, but her past actions are just too astounding to be covered up by a few "motherly" actions.
Well, she's more thoughtful than I thought. Granted, that's not saying much, but it's something.

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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Not the magnum opus last week was, but a very solid effort nonetheless. I was ready to strangle Ohana by the end of her "interview" with Bookstore Girl, but at least she redeemed herself by admitting what a selfish person she'd been.
I think she's a tad too hard with herself. I also think that, rather than saying she loves Kou as a "living creature", she should just have said that if she could easily tell how she loved him, she'd have answered him six months ago.

Quote:
Honestly, I think anyone who sees her ending up with someone other than Kou is kidding themselves. Okada is making it pretty inescapable at this point that their fates are hopelessly entangled.
I agree that it's Kou or no one, but it really could be no one. Hasn't he just let her go? Didn't she accept that? So frustrating, when she said accepting him as a boyfriend was the correct decision. Goddammit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hanashi View Post
It's also becoming a little more clear why Enishi turned out the way he is if chibi!Satsuki and Sui argued a lot before she left. He didn't inherit Sui's backbone, that's for sure, and the arguing wouldn't have helped.
That scene did make it look like he's always been pathetic, didn't it? Though he was pretty young then, so it doesn't mean much.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:16   Link #30
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Tohru is Ohana's new step dad, this would be very interesting
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:29   Link #31
tezu
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Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
@tezu -- Romance can't ruin anything. I don't understand how people can give up the vast pleasure that enjoying romance stories can provide. It's all about choosing a life partner and perhaps the parent of your children. Nothing important, lol.
It really depends on how the romance plot is executed. I'm generally not a fan of A likes B but B likes C and C likes etc. etc. plots. I find it hard to watch series that base too much drama on romance alone, e.g. when the entire main cast of a series forms an impenetrable web of unrequited love, crushes and jealousy (Ano Hana). On the other hand, the current romance ratio in Hanasaku Iroha is okay. I'm not bothered by Ohana and Kou, but Minchi for instance is being a total doormat for Tooru and in this case, yes, romance does ruin her character. There should be more things that define Minko's character, however her crush on Tooru overshadows everything else. And if they decide to add male love interests for every one of the girls and turn it into a major plot it'll make me wonder why every girl has to be focused on a guy in order to make their character developments enjoyable. Romance can be good in the right doses, but sometimes I just want to see other aspects, too
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:34   Link #32
ThereminVox
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I'm having trouble casting her as a villain. Shouldn't she be more uncaring of other people's feelings? I don't deny she's hurt Ko, and that he deserved better. But still, a villain?
Perhaps I misspoke. I don't think she's a villain at all. I use the word deliberately because of how harshly she judges her own actions when seeing them from a new perspective. If she really were antagonistic, I don't think she'd be so distraught at seeing the unthoughtful side of herself. She's basing her judgement off of the TV dramas she's watched, and finding parallels between her own situation and the fictional antagonists.

Obviously we know full well there's nothing rotten about her, but she is her own harshest critic.

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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
but why did he insist she eat everything, instead of a more rational "taste everything, and pace yourself, there's a lot to go through"? Eating till you vomit is unhealthy, and isn't doing the food justice.
Tooru's mind works in "mysterious" ways. Seeing the look on his face watching a feverish and semi-conscious Ohana putting a strawberry to her lips was enough to teach me that.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:42   Link #33
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Great episode, a contender for best episode thus far.

To me, the point of Hana-Saku Iroha is (slowly) learning about Ohana and the people surrounding her through watching them grapple with difficult circumstances, getting some good laughs along the way. And boy, did this episode deliver. Ohana's big problems - the ones she can't solve through sheer effort and brute force - really came to a head this week, and we got to see how she reacts to that pressure. But the episode wasn't just about her, with Satsuki and Tohru taking on important roles in moving the plot forward.

And damn, Tohru was hilarious this week. Not just at the crane game, but his expressions during the conversation with Ohana at the beginning. He was always a decent foil, but I think this is the first week I'd count him as a character I like.

I haven't weight in on the poll previous weeks because I always have so much trouble deciding what number would be appropriate, but this week is easy - 10/10.
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Old 2011-06-19, 15:42   Link #34
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by ThereminVox View Post
Tooru's mind works in "mysterious" ways. Seeing the look on his face watching a feverish and semi-conscious Ohana putting a strawberry to her lips was enough to teach me that.
Perhaps he has all kinds of food-related fetishes. Including one for vomiting.
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Old 2011-06-19, 16:01   Link #35
Triple_R
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Ohana isn't a villain, but she's either indecisive or severely lacking courage (in romance) or both, and it does mean that her overall impact on a few other people in the romance department is mostly negative (i.e. antagonistic ).

It really is time for her to give Ko a proper answer, and yet again she doesn't really do so, even when the plot and other characters keep pushing her towards that. As much as I like Ohana, I have to admit that I'm a bit tired of how anime has so many female character types that are very strong and confident, except when it comes to romance. I'm not saying it's unrealistic, because many people in real life are like that, but it would be nice for a change to see more female characters that are strong in relationship matters as well (a good example here is Hitagi Senjogahara from Bakemonogatari).


That being said, this was another fantastic episode, and it was good to see Ohana start to seriously reflect on how her actions can effect others in unexpected negative ways. I think that Ohana's shounen-esque personality may soon be refined somewhat, as she continues to "come of age" through this anime's narrative.


Ko and Tooru both came across very well in this episode, I felt. So did the girl with a crush on Ko. All three of them took a mature and reasonable approach to the obvious romantic conflicts of this anime, as Ko was profoundly understanding of Ohana's words to him, while Tooru and the girl with a crush on Ko both did what they could to force Ohana to properly resolve her situation with Ko. However, the fact that all three of them are handling the situation in a forthright and mature manner makes Ohana look a bit worse by contrast.


I have to admit that this episode downright surprised me with how it handled Satsuki. It was probably a safe bet that her character would be softened a bit over time, but I didn't expect it to happen this quickly, and so pronouncedly. My sense is that Satsuki was genuinely moved by Ohana's actions in Episode 11, particularly as they reminded her of what she was like at Ohana's age.

I also echo Kanon's take on Minchi. She now seems far removed from the girl that practically made catchphrases out of "Die!" and "Balut!". Minchi's passivity towards Tooru's crush on Ohana is truly startling, and it suggests that there's a softer and more insecure side to Minchi. I actually find myself starting to care about Minchi, which was almost unthinkable to me back around Episode 4 or 5.


The plot of this anime is admirably unpredictable, yet firmly rooted in realism far more often than not. This is great for viewer immersion, as well as for keeping the viewer on the edge of his or her seat.

In Hanasaku Iroha, much as she did in True Tears, Okada pulls the viewer along as though on a roller coaster ride of family and romantic conflict where each twist and turn makes sense in retrospect, but also often seems thrilling and unexpected when you first come upon it.


10/10 for a finely crafted Episode 12. Hanasaku is starting to seriously challenge Steins;Gate for top spot amongst Spring 2011 anime for me.
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Old 2011-06-19, 16:22   Link #36
Kaoru Chujo
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I think Ohana's main problem is her complete honesty. She could tell Kou she loved him and it wouldn't exactly be a lie, but it would be somewhat wishful thinking. So she can't say it until she really understands what it means and knows that's what she's feeling. I don't think she's indecisive or lacking courage, just honest. She can certainly show courage and decision in other areas, but romance is somewhat beyond her, at this point.

Good comments by tezu. Romance shouldn't eliminate all other aspects of character, nor should it be an "impenetrable web" of nothing but insecurities, crushes and jealousies. It can also be painfully slow to gain expression, as in Kimi ni Todoke.
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Old 2011-06-19, 17:03   Link #37
Blaat
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I want the megane girl to work at the inn, she's way more interesting than... let's say the consultant or the perverted writer.
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Old 2011-06-19, 17:16   Link #38
ChairmanMeow
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It just seems to me that everyone in Ohana's family seems to have trouble understanding or dealing with other people's feelings. Sui and Satsuki, definitely, considering both were given the "having to hold back" speech. Ohana, although somewhat more considerate, is pretty much the same.

Thinking about it, she knows how Kou feels, yeah, but not really the meaning behind it. She needs both the bookstore girl (Igarashi, I guess?) and Tohru to force her to confront that he likes her enough to do so much and have her rely on him, and she realizes she just takes it for granted. As sad as it is (for me, since I was rooting for Kou), their chat really made me think Kou is considering moving on, and Ohana is on the brink of still sorting our her feelings, which seem to be leaning to friendzone.

Satsuki was every bit as awesome a character as I thought she would turn out to be. Minko as well, althought she does need to be less of a doormat. Looking to more development on her part. Tohru was a bit insensitive, with the way he basically treated Minko horribly the entire time, and even weirder how he seemed to be hitting on Satsuki at the end.

Igarashi was kind of mean, but understandable. In one sense, she's selfish because even if Kou is perfectly willing to wait for an answer from his confession, she doesn't want to wait for an answer from her confession (which she technically got). On the other hand, she doesn't want Kou to be strung along any longer, which is kind of what Ohana is doing.

Whatever, this was a great episode, but it doesn't look like Kou will be appearing again for a while (or as long as it takes for Ohana to ask for his help again?).
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Old 2011-06-19, 17:27   Link #39
Roger Rambo
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Originally Posted by hanashi View Post
Trollercoaster! I like that one.
Somehow I kind of get off to all the misgivings and suffering the characters are forced to go through. It's like the show creators KNOW how much people try to emphasize/project into the characters.

Spoiler for The Shows creators:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Satsuki didn't make me want to slap her this time. It's clear she isn't the mom of the year, but she does care about Ohana. She just doesn't really seem to know how a mom should behave, which might be due to how Sui treated her. In a way, she's not that different from Sui -- they both neglected their daughters to some extent, and I'm sure both of them thought it was for the best.
Although Satsuki is acting all composed here, you do get a sense that she to is going to get victimized by *forever alone* syndrome by the end of this series

Although she doesn't get massively upset over it, she DOES note that her daughter never really contacted her during the months she was at the inn. Nor did she ever really consider going back to Tokyo. It was infact Satsuki who was considering getting back into contact with Ohana and requesting going back home...except by now she's figured Ohana doesn't really possess any actual interest for that.
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
I felt kind of bad for her too. Her "date" with Tooru was horrible. Geez, what kind of guy would force a lady to eat until she pukes? Ohana saw right through him: he doesn't know how to handle women. That said, that date was pretty hilarious. Loved Minchi's face when she found out the kind of sushi Tooru was talking about.
Well they ARE chefs. They got to go and sample lots of different kinds of food when they're out on this sort of outing. Tohru seems to have pretty solidly *apprentice zoned* Minko here and bassically is treating her like how he'd treat any other person in a similar circumstance.
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Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
All in all, excellent episode. I just hope we'll move on from the romance drama soon. I'm more interested in Yuina and Nako than Ko's romantic life.
I was actually pretty surprised that we saw Ko this soon after the fever episode. I doubt we'll be seeing him for awhile.

And honestly, another series of episodes that show what kind of awkwardness/distance currently exists between Ohana and Kou further cements my belief in that we are proudly marching towards a *ForeverAlone.jpg* ending
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Originally Posted by sikvod00 View Post
Great episode. The only thing I didn't like was how young Satsuki is voiced by Ohana's VA. That was kinda lame. =/
No it wasn't. It was to emphasize that Sui, Satsuki and Ohana are CLONES!

It's possible that they're some kind of bizzaro alien species that creates hyper powerful Bene Gesserit female clone offspring, while spawning pitiful and weak men.
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Old 2011-06-19, 17:47   Link #40
ars89
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Lol at Ohana's plan to kidnap her mom. Even better Tohru wanted to meet his competition and kidnap Ko. Minchi really has to voice her feelings or she'll be left behind.

Ohana got owned by the girl who likes Ko. After Ohana's conversation with Ko i think he's out of the picture. Still don't like her and Tohru pairing though. Like how she called him out on his bad traits.

Nice gifts for the folks back at the end. What luck that her mom agreed to come. So Ohana is a lot like how she was when she was younger. Was it me or did it sound like she missed her home and mom? Soundedl ike she felt bad for fighting her since she figured out she was wrong and her mother was right.
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