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Old 2011-06-24, 20:37   Link #1041
Bri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
Yes, but the last episode was the first time the writing team actually showed that they themselves had an understanding as to what money *means* in an economic sense . Even if it was triggered by some supernatural event, the currency exchange was explained in a way that required at least some undergraduate understanding of economics. Quite surprising given the very simplistic level shown thusfar. I was enjoying the anime sofar simply for the characters and sillyness, so the change was unexpected.
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Old 2011-06-24, 23:01   Link #1042
~Yami~
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yeah! I enjoy the economic theme in this anime.... maybe it's the first anime for me that represents the modern economy world

I don't see any problems with the kiss... Even though Msyu will be his daughter... Msyu always his asset... there is no incest there.... lol
maybe the writer leaves the opinion about Msyu's true identity for us... we have right to decide whether Msyu is Kimimaro's daughter or Kimimaro's wife..... I prefer wife.... lol
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Old 2011-06-25, 00:07   Link #1043
Peanutbutter
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I like to think that since the FD will still be there, if Kimimaro goes back there, he'll get Msyu again.

After all, he recovered the future, including his own.
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Old 2011-06-25, 04:07   Link #1044
Kanon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
It probably wasn't subbed because there are several ways to romanise the name - Nagata / Osada / Ozada etc etc...

The professor's name was Ehara (江原) though, IIRC...

(And that was Hanabi's house before Kimimaro 'reclaimed' this particular 'future')
Oh, so that was Hanabi's house. All of a sudden, my theory that the "peaceful" disappearance of the FD erased all kind of influence it ever had on Japan, and therefore that reality was altered to the point current persons (like Kimimaro and Hanabi) disappeared, and others like the kids appeared, seems more plausible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hamstar View Post
This confirms my theory that what Kimi saw at the end was a dream of the future to come. Either that or Kimi is physically transported to future Japan. Where else did that kid come from? The toddler must of been 5 years old, this shows that considerable time has passed by since 'C' passed through Japan. Hanabi probably moved out after college and is living independently now (or maybe still in the same room living as a depressed NEET lol).
In my opinion, what happened at the end was a reverse C. Instead of disappearing, Japan was fixed by the pretty sparkly bubbles. Reality was basically changed to a reality where Midas Money never screwed up the economy and the FD never took away anybody's future (because Kimimaro bought them back), which obviously greatly altered everything. Where did the kids come from? Probably from the place where all the people hit by C disappeared to. In short, the past was changed and it was pretty much a lol reset ending.
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Old 2011-06-25, 04:52   Link #1045
TheEroKing
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nothing to do now but wait for Kimimaro x Msyu doujins
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Old 2011-06-25, 06:51   Link #1046
sapphire-pyro
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The final episode was... really not what I expected.

Still trying to gather my thoughts on what I think of this overall. But it's nice to see that there's still a lot of positive views on this series
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Old 2011-06-25, 08:26   Link #1047
orion
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I thought the pre-school teacher at the end sounded a little like Msyu. What do you guys think?
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Old 2011-06-25, 09:08   Link #1048
ahelo
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C REVIEW

A very likable series that wasn't my thing. Mixed-bag all in all.

"Has strengths to be called 'Good'; Has faults limiting it to be called 'Awesome'."
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Old 2011-06-25, 10:14   Link #1049
TheEroKing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
I thought the pre-school teacher at the end sounded a little like Msyu. What do you guys think?
Yea I said that too a while ago. What C actually stood for = Confusion.
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Old 2011-06-25, 11:10   Link #1050
physics223
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It was a great run. The series is definitely not a masterpiece, but it was certainly great for me.

I wrote up on the final set of symbols from the show, as well as my explication on the philosophy of hope here. The ending was all right for me.
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Old 2011-06-25, 13:47   Link #1051
RedWing
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Isn't Hyperinflation a BAD thing?! The show makes it seem like you just switch currency and everything will be OK. Badass final battle was badass though. Fighting in a suit = boss.
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Old 2011-06-25, 15:32   Link #1052
Reckoner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
It's weird...I still feel like I'm one of the only ones that saw this kind of ending coming a mile away. In any case I definitely don't feel the kind of disappointment a lot of others seem to feel because I didn't really have any expectations at all and haven't since about the time the whole financial collapse plotline just sort of...happened out of the blue.

The show had been hovering between a 2/10 and 3/10 on my ol' anime list for the past 5 episodes I would say and never managed to exceed 6/10 at even the series highest point (which I will argue were the individual story lines that showed how losing duels affected people around Yoga) so this episode is just what I'd call keeping with an already set standard. It was really a wholly appropriate way to end the show if you ask me.
To me it wasn't so much that I couldn't tell things were going badly, the signs were there very early on that the editing was haphazard and that the plot was so large it was hard to imagine how'd they keep in only 11 episodes. But rather, it pisses me off to see an intriguing idea and setting go to hell because of factors not really related to the story, but budget, allotted time of episodes, etc. They basically got really low marks on every front that is objective, things that one can actually have complete control of. And that is essentially what dragged down the entire show.

I just don't like to see good ideas go to waste.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace View Post
I thought it was a good read too, but I'm not sure I'd say it was comically bad. More like so bad it's good? Definitely B-grade, but some of the best stuff ever made is, and absolutely a cult classic imo (yeah yeah...I'm sure someone will complain it can't be a cult classic right after ending).
Perhaps I came off wrong with the way I wrote that post, but I definitely understood .

This show is definitely something you got to sit back and enjoy and not take too seriously, otherwise you're just hit a million and one roadblocks.
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Old 2011-06-25, 15:44   Link #1053
Deconstructor
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C - The Money and Soul of Possibility Control

[C] is my second favorite anime this season and for good reason (rhymes!). The writers realized most viewers aren't interested in the particular nuances of how an economy works. Personally I am more concerned with how the economy impacts the everyday lives of ordinary people, otherwise known as econoethics. Should we save up our money for the future or spend what we have to survive? Indeed both sides of the argument have strong points in their favor. Some people only have enough money to survive in the present; there is no choice for the poor but to make the bare minimum. And yet for affluent investors up on top of the economic pyramid, the responsibility truly falls upon them to give the impoverished many a future.

The final episode represents the final clash of these two ideals, and future wins. However, the penultimate scene has a higher power stating both sides were correct. According to the higher power, each person presents their own philosophy, and the world is better off because of the diversity in ideas. I disagree as many people think in ways I could never respect. Just look at all the tyrants, dictators, and slaughterers that have stood atop mankind's societies, and you'll see who I mean. The world did get better because of their existence, but only because justice prevailed in the end. If Mikuni succeeded, then Japan would have died.

I will admit the animation in episode 11 was top notch. Mikuni and Kimimaro slashed at each other rapidfire while Mashu and Q blasted each other with their flations. The one scene when Mashu fired off Scorched Earth is particularly impressive; I could see the laser beams homing in on Q. Indeed if the whole series were animated as diligently and magnificently, then people wouldn't be complaining about the shallow economic ideas. Some episodes didn't even have a deal to show off the special effects, while some deals were cut short and sometimes even omitted (Kimimaro vs. Sennoza). I believe the great animation is the show's strongest point, but there's simply not enough of it.

Ultimately, however, I am very pleased at [C]. Among many ethical questions, I find myself still engaged in how rich people, the most powerful people in our world, should be acting to protect the world's future. I hope [C] inspires other animation companies to venture into philosophical debates in other fields of study, and perhaps some day people will realize anime can have moral significance. Despite the surface approach to economic theory, I found myself quite fulfilled by how every character brought their personal ideals to the fray.

Also, Mashu is awesome.

Episode 11 Rating: 9/10
Cumulative Average Rating: 8.77/10 (B+)
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Old 2011-06-25, 16:03   Link #1054
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deconstructor View Post
C - The Money and Soul of Possibility Control

[C] is my second favorite anime this season and for good reason (rhymes!). The writers realized most viewers aren't interested in the particular nuances of how an economy works. Personally I am more concerned with how the economy impacts the everyday lives of ordinary people, otherwise known as econoethics. Should we save up our money for the future or spend what we have to survive? Indeed both sides of the argument have strong points in their favor. Some people only have enough money to survive in the present; there is no choice for the poor but to make the bare minimum. And yet for affluent investors up on top of the economic pyramid, the responsibility truly falls upon them to give the impoverished many a future.

The final episode represents the final clash of these two ideals, and future wins. However, the penultimate scene has a higher power stating both sides were correct. According to the higher power, each person presents their own philosophy, and the world is better off because of the diversity in ideas. I disagree as many people think in ways I could never respect. Just look at all the tyrants, dictators, and slaughterers that have stood atop mankind's societies, and you'll see who I mean. The world did get better because of their existence, but only because justice prevailed in the end. If Mikuni succeeded, then Japan would have died.
And it's all undercut by the fact that it was all complete bullshit. It's not just that it was based on magic to start with. It's not just that it's all retcon based. It's not even that the protagonist got, out of nowhere, the power to do all that.

It's that it was never really about ethics: it was either Mikuni and his immediate ruin of all Japan (where's your present, bitch?), or Kimimarou and his sunny "everything is fine, somehow. Except for the yen, but who cares about that? Not the Japanese, apparently."

How is that a tough choice? How is that competing ethics?

If, say, Mikuni's course had doomed Japan to a slow but certain death, with few outward symptoms in the present, while Kimimaro's got half the population killed, but at the same time gave the remaining half the opportunity to pick themselves up by the bootstratps and come back stronger, then yeah, I could see it. But as it is? The hell?
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Old 2011-06-25, 16:34   Link #1055
Deconstructor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
It's that it was never really about ethics: it was either Mikuni and his immediate ruin of all Japan (where's your present, bitch?), or Kimimarou and his sunny "everything is fine, somehow. Except for the yen, but who cares about that? Not the Japanese, apparently."
If you just overlook Mikuni's actions in favor of his ideas, then there's a good argument to be made in favor of the present. While the way Mr. Mikuni goes about achieving his own ideals (super-hyper-duper-uber-inflation) is crazy, the writers probably did so to make him seem more of a villain.

I know accepting the idea as valid is very difficult if the proponent is insane, but Mikuni wasn't always eye-twitchingly absurd. Before the final episode there were very intriguing back and forth discussions between Kimimaro, Mikuni, Jennifer, and Sennoza. Mikuni seemed more levelheaded back then. I know you despise the ending, but are you going to say the previous 10 episodes of conflicting econoethics were equally deplorable?
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Old 2011-06-25, 16:57   Link #1056
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
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I'd say they ended up being inconsequential.

They weren't all that understandable to start with. And in the end, we're left without... consequences. That's what lacking. If their ethics don't guide their actions, which then have logical consequences, then they're just shooting the breeze. We don't need anime characters to do that, unless they're cute high school girls or something.
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Old 2011-06-25, 17:23   Link #1057
Deconstructor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
They weren't all that understandable to start with.
What part of the show wasn't understandable? I seem to remember people stating the show is too simplistic, but they all understood the underlying contrast between present and future. I'm just saying the ideas are rather direct and straightforward; if you don't understand them, then you'll have to elaborate further as to which parts you don't comprehend.

Quote:
And in the end, we're left without... consequences. That's what lacking. If their ethics don't guide their actions, which then have logical consequences, then they're just shooting the breeze.
I'd say there were tons and tons of consequences in episode 10. You know, people disappearing, countries disappearing, three babies born in one week. The usual side effects of printing black money to save the present.

Even Kimimaro's actions have consequences. In the final scene when he sits on a park bench and looks around, he sees the effect of his own existence reflected in the futures of Japanese people. You can complain about a cop-out, saccharine ending all you want, but a lot of anime do exactly that. I think you're putting down the show without even giving the story a fighting chance.

Quote:
We don't need anime characters to do that, unless they're cute high school girls or something.
Really? Because cute high school girls make watching anime less painful for you? Kind of makes me wonder why you even decided to watch this show to the very end.
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Old 2011-06-25, 17:39   Link #1058
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deconstructor View Post
What part of the show wasn't understandable? I seem to remember people stating the show is too simplistic, but they all understood the underlying contrast between present and future. I'm just saying the ideas are rather direct and straightforward; if you don't understand them, then you'll have to elaborate further as to which parts you don't comprehend.
I'm not talking about the mechanics of economy. But what does it mean to prefer the future to the present, in the context of this show?

Quote:
I'd say there were tons and tons of consequences in episode 10. You know, people disappearing, countries disappearing, three babies born in one week. The usual side effects of printing black money to save the present.

Even Kimimaro's actions have consequences. In the final scene when he sits on a park bench and looks around, he sees the effect of his own existence reflected in the futures of Japanese people. You can complain about a cop-out, saccharine ending all you want, but a lot of anime do exactly that. I think you're putting down the show without even giving the story a fighting chance.
But the consequences aren't particularly believable, and don't reflect the "ethics" of the characters. The former is always a danger in a magic heavy show, but what we have is a relative newcomer buying back a country's worth of "future". The latter one is more important: Mikuni's action didn't save the present at all. And while I suppose Kimimaro's action did save the future, it did so by buying back a brand new present.

It ended up not being a fight of (believable) ethics. It was a fight between a nihilistic villain bent on world country destruction, even if he covered it up with some saintly words, and a messiah who dies for our sins.

Quote:
Really? Because cute high school girls make watching anime less painful for you? Kind of makes me wonder why you even decided to watch this show to the very end.
Well, yes, I'll forgive a slice of life show featuring cute girls for being a slice of life show featuring cute girls. C wasn't that, so I hold it to different standards.
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Old 2011-06-25, 21:04   Link #1059
Master_Yoma
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Anther rushed series it just seems that they missed out on a lot. The final fight was just so great cant wait got the dubs come out

8/10
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Old 2011-06-25, 21:39   Link #1060
Dawnstorm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
It ended up not being a fight of (believable) ethics. It was a fight between a nihilistic villain bent on world country destruction, even if he covered it up with some saintly words, and a messiah who dies for our sins.
I had a big problem with the "deal = fight" metaphor to begin with. In an ideal deal, both parties benefit. In an ideal fight, only one party profits. Now if you were to apply that metaphor to the stock market, where money gets divorced from what it's supposed to buy, you may have point. But then you have a royal rumble, not a one-on-one fight. But if you have a "winner", i.e. all the money in one hand, money's become worthless, because you can't do anything with it. (Everyone else is too ruined to produce anything.)

They might have tried just that, but it didn't really work for me. I mean Kimimaro started out as a character who's afraid to spend money, lest he has too little in the future, but this ended up counting for little more than "a guy treasuring his asset".

Typical fighting show, different flavour. Occasionally interesting. 6/10
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