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View Poll Results: Hanasaku Iroha - Episode 14 Rating
Perfect 10 12 19.35%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 20 32.26%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 18 29.03%
7 out of 10 : Good 10 16.13%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 1.61%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 1.61%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 62. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-07-04, 13:53   Link #81
Archon_Wing
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Originally Posted by Ghostfriendly View Post
All the characters, but especially the men, have some way to develop in this show; Ko and Tooru have good qualities, but they largely seem to be hidden by their shyness or insensitivity. Changing their characters into convincing love interests wouldn't take so much development as some guys seem to be demanding, just a realisation.
Which is what I feel the show should be slowly working on soon. We still have quite a few episodes left, so we can realize that potential. It's just that my thoughts atm are not so great.

What I don't want, is a sudden jump into melodrama when it's half baked. That wrecks many an anime.
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Old 2011-07-04, 13:55   Link #82
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I find Ko very cool and composed. He never forces the issue on Ohana and knows to push all the right buttons. He is a smooth operator and he doesn't "put the pussy on the pedestal". He even got a girl to confess to him only two months after Ohana left. You realize how cool Ko is when you compare him Ohana's male classmates who fawn and drool over Minko and Yuina. Same with the guy who was confessing to Minko a second time; he couldn't get a hint that Minko didn't want to talk and he didn't read the situation so well.
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Old 2011-07-04, 13:56   Link #83
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Lol, I'm not sure if the classmates are a good standard by any means, but sure, they are much less pathetic than those losers.
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Old 2011-07-04, 14:02   Link #84
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I don't know, the classmates are portrayed as the your typical hormone-driven awkward teenagers. So they are sort of the standard of adolescence. Ko shown to much more mature then them and knows his way around girls and work. He is contemplative and introspective.

Also, another thing that dawned to me is that this show in from the POV of the "popular clique". Ohana, Minko and Yuina are fairly popular students in their school. I like the contrast when they are at work that they aren't perfect like their classmates see them.
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Old 2011-07-04, 14:24   Link #85
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Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
I'll admit I AM a bit curious as to what particular factors present in Okada's other work is being referred to here. I've heard this particular line of thought brought up many times during discussion in these threads but I've not quite grasped what the comparisons being made are.
I'll second this Enzo because she's done plenty of adaptations (though true she sometimes takes a few liberties) but this is original work.

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Though I guess there isn't much to talk about this episode which is why this thread discussion is being derailed with Ko and Ohana's romance
It has nothing to do with nothing much happening.

Grandma could die next episode and the discussion on the thread would be "how does this event impact the odds of OhanaXKo?"
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Old 2011-07-04, 14:28   Link #86
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I find Ko very cool and composed. He never forces the issue on Ohana and knows to push all the right buttons. He is a smooth operator and he doesn't "put the pussy on the pedestal". He even got a girl to confess to him only two months after Ohana left.
...Ko ran away immediately after confessing to a girl he knew was moving away and didn't even see her off the next day. And we don't exactly know much about glasses girls and Ko's relationship beyond she approached him and was a bit persistent since she felt his answer wasn't strong enough.

I'm not sure by what standard we're going by that this...


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Originally Posted by deadite View Post
You realize how cool Ko is when you compare him Ohana's male classmates who fawn and drool over Minko and Yuina. Same with the guy who was confessing to Minko a second time; he couldn't get a hint that Minko didn't want to talk and he didn't read the situation so well.
...you know that's a pretty low standard of comparison.

That's like declaring that someone is an elite special forces soldier because he's more disciplined than your average liberian Militiaman.
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Old 2011-07-04, 14:34   Link #87
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That's because Ko panicked that she was leaving town and he was caught off guard with her sudden departure. He then apologized to Ohana afterwards. After that I haven't seen Ko do anything bad. He's a great guy and really knows how to handle the situation. It's not good to force her to give him an answer. He just nudged Ohana into realizing that she hasn't given him an answer. I don't know about you but Ko isn't your typical shy male lead.

It's not a low standard because MOST teenagers act like what you saw in the beach episode. Ko seems to be above such childish fawning. He is mature, has a job and pretty girls with glasses are attracted to him.
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Old 2011-07-04, 14:54   Link #88
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Yeah, I don't quite get the Ko hate/disliking either.

He's handled things as well as can be expected I think. Dude has more self-respect than to confess twice to the same girl (unlike a certain hardcore Minchi fan ), and I personally respect that.

Short of confessing twice, he's left the door open for Ohana as much as possible.

If Ko/Ohana never happens, it'll be because of Ohana, not Ko, imo.
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Old 2011-07-04, 15:05   Link #89
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That's because Ko panicked that she was leaving town and he was caught off guard with her sudden departure. He then apologized to Ohana afterwards. After that I haven't seen Ko do anything bad. He's a great guy and really knows how to handle the situation.
A trait of genuinely composed/cool operators is that they tend to NOT panic and get caught off guard easily. That's the antithesis of being cool/composed.

Oh. And I'm not sure the attempted visit to Kissiou was an example of a Smooth operator at work.
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He's a great guy and really knows how to handle the situation. It's not good to force her to give him an answer. He just nudged Ohana into realizing that she hasn't given him an answer. I don't know about you but Ko isn't your typical shy male lead.
This has also resulted in a massive miscommunication where Ohana thinks that Ko has dumped her. I'm quite hard pressed to see how this is him having the situation in hand at all.

Plus, waiting until a girl you like figures out that you like her seems to be a pretty shy move from my perspective.

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It's not a low standard because MOST teenagers act like what you saw in the beach episode. Ko seems to be above such childish fawning.
And most people in general are extremely bad at fighting. That doesn't mean that just because you can punch straight without hurting yourself that you're the next Mike Tyson. Similarly, Ko being more composed than the bumpkins in Ohana's class doesn't make him gods gift to women.


Ko's SNAFU's with Ohana are understandable because he's a teenage boy. But they're hardly in line with someone I'd think of as a smooth operator.
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He is mature, has a job and pretty girls with glasses are attracted to him.
First point is debatable. 2nd point is commendable that Ko is employed, but it hardly makes him some super cool dude. And if we go by that last points logic, Ohana and Minchi are super suave and mature because a bunch of guys like them.

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Yeah, I don't quite get the Ko hate/disliking either.

He's handled things as well as can be expected I think. Dude has more self-respect than to confess twice to the same girl (unlike a certain hardcore Minchi fan ), and I personally respect that.

Short of confessing twice, he's left the door open for Ohana as much as possible.

If Ko/Ohana never happens, it'll be because of Ohana, not Ko, imo.
I don't dislike/hate Ko. And while I might seem to sadistically glee at the prospect of everyone in this series ending up alone, I don't necessarily view him as a pathetic figure.

But It REALLY seems disingenuous to describe him as some kind of playboy. He's not. He's a confused kid.

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If Ko/Ohana never happens, it'll be because of Ohana, not Ko, imo.
Absolutely. Especially considering how every hint we've had is that Ohana is going to become a Sui/Satsuki style super powered dragon lady when she grows up.
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Old 2011-07-04, 15:29   Link #90
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I think my main reason for backing Kou x Ohana is that they're a matching pair. Both are a bit insecure under the surface, both are underdogs in a way. They go well together.

(It's a bit like how I shipped the older brother and the miko in Wagaya no Oinari-sama - they both seem clueless about the opposite sex, so it would be cute.)

Tohru does have his appeals - the way he acts like a ten year old with a crush despite being being cool on the surface is kind of cute - the problem is it also makes him come across as a bit of a prick.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo
Absolutely. Especially considering how every hint we've had is that Ohana is going to become a Sui/Satsuki style super powered dragon lady when she grows up.
I could see Kou becoming the brains behind her brawn.
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Old 2011-07-04, 16:15   Link #91
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Maybe I'm incorrect but I don't think a lot of people actually hate Ko, we just hate what he does to the show.

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It's not a low standard because MOST teenagers act like what you saw in the beach episode. Ko seems to be above such childish fawning. He is mature, has a job and pretty girls with glasses are attracted to him.
He confessed to her because he had to, since she was leaving. He said himself, he was just hanging around hoping she'd notice he liked her. That's pretty darn immature.

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After that I haven't seen Ko do anything bad. He's a great guy and really knows how to handle the situation. It's not good to force her to give him an answer. He just nudged Ohana into realizing that she hasn't given him an answer. I don't know about you but Ko isn't your typical shy male lead.
After that we haven't seen Ko do much of ANYTHING productive. Maybe it's not good to force an answer, but it's also not good to do nothing at all. It was basically a surprise, unplanned confession, followed by nothing meaningful to back up the fact that he loves her.

1. Their only communication for quite a while after Ohana left was a single text.

2. He backed out on a visit to her after he already took the train there because he saw she was busy. I'm really amazed on how terrible they make the communication between Ko and Ohana. Also yes, the inn was full but from how big they were making out Yuina's inn to be he could have easily found somewhere else to stay.

3. Ohana runs off in the rain and gets discovered by Minko and Tohru, instead of him dashing after her, which I was really hoping would happen as some sort of character redemption.

4. He pretty much just accepts it without a fight when Ohana tells him her tearful goodbye on the phone.

EDIT: I love how in my previous post, the one quick line about Ko got responded to, but I don't think my whole paragraph about Yuina/Yosuke did. And here I am writing another entire post about Ko/Ohana. At the very least Ko strikes up a ton of conversation, although I'm not sure that's a good thing.
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Old 2011-07-04, 16:38   Link #92
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I don't understand people gushing over how "nice" Ko is. Minchi isn't "nice", Tohru isn't "nice", Sui isn't "nice", yet all three of them have done a lot more to prove that they love and care for Ohana and are generally way more interesting, rounded out characters. Didn't the first episode make that point? The grandma that gives out candy gives instant gratification and is easy, but Sui as a grandma may have been harsh, but she gave Ohana far more deep and valuable things.

Plus, Ko isn't really a smooth ladies man for reasons other people have detailed before. He's really an awkrawd dork, like virtually every other male on this show, he just happens to express in ways that are considered "nice" and inoffensive because we live in a culture that gives men tons of credit for being "nice guys". (perhaps a little too much) Hell, maybe Glasses Girl likes him BECAUSE she finds his awkrawd dorkiness endearing.
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Old 2011-07-04, 16:49   Link #93
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I don't understand people slobbering over how "nice" Ko is. Minchi isn't "nice", Tohru isn't "nice", Sui isn't "nice", yet all three of them have done a lot more to prove that they love and care for Ohana
... When? Seriously, when have they ever shown that they love and care for Ohana?

Oh, sure, there have been a few nice gestures here and there, like when she was sick. Or, I suppose, when they went to fetch her in Tokyo. But none of those were particularly impressive or showed overwhelming concern for her.

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and are generally way more interesting, rounded out characters. Didn't the first episode make that point? The grandma that gives out candy gives instant gratification and is easy, but Sui as a grandma may have been harsh, but she gave Ohana far more deep and valuable things.
I suppose. But it's because she's treated Ohana like an employee. Sure, learning about the workplace, finding a career path, and getting paid are all precious things. Way more precious than the casual kindness of a stranger. But that doesn't make Sui a saint, and it doesn't make her the best grandmother ever. It just makes her Ohana's first boss.
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Old 2011-07-04, 16:57   Link #94
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... When? Seriously, when have they ever shown that they love and care for Ohana?

Oh, sure, there have been a few nice gestures here and there, like when she was sick. Or, I suppose, when they went to fetch her in Tokyo. But none of those were particularly impressive or showed overwhelming concern for her.

I suppose. But it's because she's treated Ohana like an employee. Sure, learning about the workplace, finding a career path, and getting paid are all precious things. Way more precious than the casual kindness of a stranger. But that doesn't make Sui a saint, and it doesn't make her the best grandmother ever. It just makes her Ohana's first boss.
Seriously? The "sick" episode is insanely heartwarming because it reaffirms their concern for her. Just look at how Tohru acts and the things Minchi says to her. And don't tell me you weren't really happy when they got Ohana during her meltdown in the rain in Tokyo. So what if they're not heroic or impressive? That's just what people who care each other do. Love is what you do for other people. Just look at how Minko's acts and what she says when Ohana's sick. You just tell from the look in her eyes and the sound of her voice that she really cares for Ohana. This is nonverbal communication 101, people.

And seriously, Sui loves Ohana and Satsuki, and just because she's not sweet or affectionate doesn't make it not true. I never said she was a saint or a perfect grandma, (because she's pretty obviously a troubled person) but Ohana's relationship with her made her a way better person.

To be brutally honest, this is the first post I've ever read on this forum that's ever made me somewhat angry. You cannot seriously downplay how important Ohana is to a lot of characters aside from Ko. If you take out Ohana's developing friendships and how much she means to them, YOU HAVE NO STORY. THERE'S NO MEAT IN IT.
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Old 2011-07-04, 17:27   Link #95
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I hope we get to see more of Nako and her love of swimming in future episodes. It looks like her "bad-ass" mode switch goes of while in the water; really compliments her normally meek and shy disposition (which I also adore ).
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Old 2011-07-04, 17:36   Link #96
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I hope we get to see more of Nako and her love of swimming in future episodes. It looks like her "bad-ass" mode switch goes of while in the water; really compliments her normally meek and shy disposition (which I also adore ).
Hellz to the yes this needs to happen. I lovez me some Nako. (in the straightest way possible )
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Old 2011-07-04, 17:41   Link #97
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Seriously? The "sick" episode is insanely heartwarming because it reaffirms their concern for her. Just look at how Tohru acts and the things Minchi says to her. And don't tell me you weren't really happy when they got Ohana during her meltdown in the rain in Tokyo. So what if they're not heroic or impressive? That's just what people who care each other do. Love is what you do for other people. Just look at how Minko's acts and what she says when Ohana's sick. You just tell from the look in her eyes and the sound of her voice that she really cares for Ohana. This is nonverbal communication 101, people.
Great, so they didn't smother her in her sleep while she was sick. Big deal. I mean, yes, it was heartwarming, and yes, they actually like her. But my point is, none of that is doing "a lot more" than what Ko's done. (And what he's done must add to lot of offscreen friendship, considering how much he's in Ohana's thoughts.)

Actually, I've got another point: you say her sick day was heartwarming, but why? Those were all small gestures that you'd normally do for a colleague you don't hate and who is right there. The reason it looks so great is that up to that point, Ohana was in a semi-hostile environment. It's not quite at the level of a battered wife claiming her husband is a big softie who really likes her for remembering her birthday (in between two sessions of kicking the crap out of her), but the principle's the same.

I'll also note: most of things you claim show their love for Ohana are, well, private things. Thoughts. In which case, Ko's got them all beat out by pining for her for months.

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And seriously, Sui loves Ohana and Satsuki, and just because she's not sweet or affectionate doesn't make it not true. I never said she was a saint or a perfect grandma, (because she's pretty obviously a troubled person) but Ohana's relationship with her made her a way better person.
And she has to be drunk to show her love. But the question isn't whether she loves Ohana or not. It how she's "done a lot more than Ko to prove it". She hasn't.

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To be brutally honest, this is the first post I've ever read on this forum that's ever made me somewhat angry.
I don't care about that. Go and be angry all you like.

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You cannot seriously downplay how important Ohana is to a lot of characters aside from Ko. If you take out Ohana's developing friendships and how much she means to them,
I'm not doing any of that. What I'm disagreeing with isn't that they like Ohana, but a very specific statement of yours:
"yet all three of them have done a lot more to prove that they love and care for Ohana".

Especially when you go and consider "blushes" and "looks" - those depend a lot on circumstances and screentime, where Ko is obviously handicapped. It doesn't mean his feelings will lose to theirs.
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YOU HAVE NO STORY. THERE'S NO MEAT IN IT.
That's no reason to blow things out of proportion, or belittle what went on in her old life.
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Old 2011-07-04, 18:04   Link #98
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Great, so they didn't smother her in her sleep while she was sick. Big deal. I mean, yes, it was heartwarming, and yes, they actually like her. But my point is, none of that is doing "a lot more" than what Ko's done. (And what he's done must add to lot of offscreen friendship, considering how much he's in Ohana's thoughts.)

Actually, I've got another point: you say her sick day was heartwarming, but why? Those were all small gestures that you'd normally do for a colleague you don't hate and who is right there. The reason it looks so great is that up to that point, Ohana was in a semi-hostile environment. It's not quite at the level of a battered wife claiming her husband is a big softie who really likes her for remembering her birthday (in between two sessions of kicking the crap out of her), but the principle's the same.
Maybe I just care for it more because I like the friendship more than the romance in this show, I don't know. I just don't like how it seems you're acting as though the friendship on this show isn't the forefront of the main action/isn't important. Maybe I chose my words poorly. It just might be that even though Ohana's present relationships had more conflict, they come off as stronger to me because it works on the "show, not tell" principle. Ko pining for Ohana for several months just seems...really weak to me. Way too little communication there.

(and no, not really mad, not trying to blow anything out of proportion. It's the internet. Miscommunication happens)
Let's take the manga One Piece. Luffy's crew mates regularly deride his stupid decisions and behavior, even sometimes resorting to comical beatings. "Hostile environment" right? Whereas you have Boa Hancock, whose got serious unrequited love for Luffy, and who during their time together would constantly dote on and spoil him. Guess which of the two Luffy is way closer to? Or heck, even the Mitsuru Adachi manga Touch: two twins, both love a childhood friend, it turns out she was always in love with the one she had more fights with. Or virtually every relationship in Fullmetal Alchemist, such as the brother's relationship with their teacher Izumi, who during their month of pre-training with her she sent them on an island in the wilderness only being supervised by her assistant disguised as a masked dude trying to kick their asses. While they were children. Or shoot, if you want to get even more basic, you have Snow White and Seven Dwarves where Grumpy is easily the most hostile to her throughout the movie, but the animators explicitly stated he had the deepest feelings for her. The thing is, people being closer to those they fight with is a really common trope in both eastern and western fiction, and maybe I sorta take that for granted.
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Old 2011-07-04, 19:07   Link #99
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Ko pining for Ohana for several months just seems...really weak to me. Way too little communication there.
This never felt that unnatural to me, actually. The whole thing felt reminiscent of the early parts of my relationship with my (then very shy) girlfriend. She freaked out when I confessed to her because she didn't know how to respond, and let me tell you, there was a pretty strong urge to just give her some breathing room and not push the issue. I never succumbed to the urge the way Ko did, but I can understand why he acted the way he did.


Quote:
Let's take the manga One Piece. Luffy's crew mates regularly deride his stupid decisions and behavior, even sometimes resorting to comical beatings. "Hostile environment" right? Whereas you have Boa Hancock, whose got serious unrequited love for Luffy, and who during their time together would constantly dote on and spoil him. Guess which of the two Luffy is way closer to?
Closeness and love are not really the same thing though. Even though I've know her about two years now, I still feel closer to some of my friends than my girlfriend. She's certainly the one I feel the most affectionate towards though.

I will admit Ohana is pretty close to her coworkers (Minko, Nako) and Yuina, also probably her grandmother/boss. Tohru... eh, I haven't seen much indication that she thinks of him as anything beyond Minko's crush (another case of poor communication) and that guy who occasionally bullies her.
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Old 2011-07-04, 19:41   Link #100
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Yuina and Minchi were so cute in their swimsuits. Lol Nako swimming at night and Ohana thinking it was a kappa. Even better these 2 can't get out of their daily routines of working at the inn.

Yuina was great this ep, i think she's the most interesting character. Pretty clear since the beginning when we first met her that she wouldn't want to work at an in. At least she made t vocal to everyone.

Sucks for Yosuke lost his workers ad fiance at the same time. Think he deserved it.
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