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Old 2011-07-20, 03:19   Link #3321
Mareike
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna View Post
He doesn't need to, others are doing it for him already. Seriously, "Princess Aurora"? I bet Zechs is behind it.
*headdesk* Oh, dear.

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It gets better. Noin and Zechs have been around each other for presumably more than 10 years, which means they ought to know each other by heart, yet the most "romantic" scene those two have in the series was that weird sword tapping in episode 4. Or perhaps Zechs not killing Noin when she guarded Peacemillion.
Heero and Relena on the other hand have known each other for hardly a year, yet half their time they spend saying each other's name or rescuing each other. Or leaving birthday gifts on shuttles.
As far as showing affection goes, Heero is leagues ahead of Zechs, which isn't really difficult but anyway. But maybe it's just Relena? After all, she was hugged by Zechs, whereas Noin was only helped out of her MS by him.
IKR? However, even if they've known each other since the Academy, Zechs never really opened up that much to either Treize and Noin who were supposed to be closest to him. Those two had to find out whatever it is that they know about him on their own. Blondie's that closed off. This calls to mind two dialogues:

In Episode 4, 6 tells 9: "Don't get too attached or parting will hurt."
In Episode 5, 9 whispers: "Open up, Zechs. You're hiding far too many secrets."

While it's no doubt that he valued Noin, it could be that he never allowed himself to get so involved nor to be open about how he feels because he had a personal mission to see through. Romance was not a priority. The thing is, though, they still trust each other a hell of a lot.

But you know, 12 years later, I'm still wondering what the eff the saber-tapping scene was all about. Sure, I found it cute back then (still do), but I still couldn't get what it was supposed to be, if it was to recall something in their past or what... ( I read somewhere that it was an invitation to do something...) The novelization didn't even bother explaining it. It just said the clanging was as if to replace Noin's words.

Speaking of the novels, something else got me wondering. There's something there that's always struck me odd about the two:

Spoiler:


Zechs, in her living room. Noin, clad only in her bathrobe. They may have grown up together but, IDK, that much level of comfort is rather suspicious...

Spoiler:


And yet again in her private quarters, just after she's changed clothes.

As for Relena, she's still his baby sister after all. IDK why, though, but that hug didn't strike me as being affectionate of him... Maybe I should watch that scene again.

Last edited by Mareike; 2011-07-20 at 03:27. Reason: Wording
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Old 2011-07-20, 06:09   Link #3322
Leave The Pieces
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Talking I live on the other side of the world so I missed out. Here's a response dump.

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Originally Posted by Mareike View Post
That's because Duo would not stand a chance with her at all. Relena's too independent and reckless for someone like him. Not that Hilde hadn't been reckless, too.
Lol really? I think differently. While I agree that Relena is pretty reckless herself (like Hilde, but in her own way), which is usually soo Duo's type, the reason why I think he'd never be interested in her is because she's... so hiiiiiggghhhh, high above him. Like the song. You know? Lol. Nah seriously, I doubt dating noblewomen is on Duo's list of things to do before he dies. I think he prefers adventurous women, not sheltered and pampered ones like Relena. I remember discussing this with a 2xR fan once who said a number of them 2xR shippers ship the two because they just love the whole idea of a trouble-maker punk/introverted rich girl relationship (ie Aladdin and Jasmine, sorry, lame examples, I know). Anyway, yes, saying it like this, the personalities really do apply to Duo and Relena a lot (respectively, of course, lol). But imo, the combination doesn't work simply because it's a stereotype relationship. It would only work on stereotype characters, which none of the Wing characters are... or were.

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Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
Obviously it's a shounen- series, but somehow girl's skills are mostly presented as inferior, while they have other roles instead (which are equally or even more important though). And this irks me a little every time. Of course there are a few exceptions but they are rare and far in between, and sure there are excellent pilots among the girls, but they rarely get to be in the spotlight.
Quote:
I guess it can't be avoided, as it's a shounen series (and to be fair guys get the same kind of treatment in pretty much every magical girl anime out there), but I'm sure the occasional good pilot with a good suit wouldn't hurt.
I now see that we do agree, but are complaining about two different things. Personally, I am not bothered that there are no main female characters who are pilots. But I sure as heaven would love to see one in my lifetime lol. And I'm with you, the fact that they use the this-is-a-shounen-series excuse is pretty lame.

The thing is, just because a series is shounen, it doesn't mean it's anti-shoujo (I'm using the anti here in the same context as... matter and anti-matter). Holy shiz, here we go... English. Let me walk you through this, what I'm trying to say is that just because the audience of a shoujo series is female in majority, that doesn't mean it's safe to assume that the audience of a shounen series is male in majority. Shoujo is feminine... but shounen isn't masculine, it's UNISEX!! Lol. Sorry, I dunno how else to explain myself lol. But seriously. It's unisex, haha. And I'm pretty sure a lot of producers know this. Heck, why else would they make their male characters so damn hot. They know WE are watching, too.

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Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna View Post
As far as showing affection goes, Heero is leagues ahead of Zechs, which isn't really difficult but anyway. But maybe it's just Relena? After all, she was hugged by Zechs, whereas Noin was only helped out of her MS by him.
It's kinda weird, she has the most number of scenes where affectionate acts were played. She gave daddy a kiss, hugged mum, got her hand held by Quatre (), got hugged by Zechs (like you just said)... and man, even Dorothy. She gets quite 'touchy' around Relena. Sometimes I can't help but think she's bisexual lol. And then there are the most prominent ones such as the helmet scene and second base in Endless Waltz. Lastly, we have Blind Target. I don't think I need to be specific on that one.

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Originally Posted by Nishiio View Post
I agree. I really appreciated how almost all the women in Gundam Wing (except Relena, since she doesn't fight) were able to hold their own in combat and prove to be quite a challenge even to the gundam pilots.
Daz ryt! True shiz, man. You know, even though Relena and Catherine didn't get to show off piloting skills like the other girls, I have no doubt they can still keep up with their corresponding male counterparts in other ways. Relena did snatch a gun off a random colony rebel once. Plus, she was pretty good at handling and firing one. No training whatsoever, unlike Heero. I always thought it was the rose she was aiming for because she didn't show any disappointment when she didn't hit Une. Catherine, on the other hand, went all ninja on Trowa in "Catherine's Tears". Those were some slick moves, how she got up on the Heavyarms' cockpit. Or maybe I was just seeing things lol. She can throw knives, too. Also, she's more experienced in acrobatics than Trowa, I reckon, so I'm pretty sure she can do that body spin on air like he does lol.

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I hate damsel-in-distress characters and was grateful that GW hardly had any of those.
High five, mate. I hate damsels-in-distress too. Unless they're justified. Relena and Catherine are among the too few non-fighter anime chicks that I actually liked. Wing's awesome!

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Don't even get me started on the characters of Gundam SEED, ugh...
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
Even Nina and Louise don't look as bad when compared to the Seed girls.
Prime examples of "good suit, but low skills"
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I'm pretty sure that yes, Gundam writers so far have always had trouble writing girls, and I'm not sure what the cause of that is.

The saddest thing about SEED (and Destiny) is the fact that its writer is a woman, even. Morosawa--darn, what did she smoke? Shame on her. How could she ruin her girls like that. She's the most unprofessional writer I've seen in my life. Lacus and Cagalli, her leading ladies, even, were her biggest offenses. She derailed the latter so that the former (which she happens to be a big fangirl of) could have all the limelight for herself when they're supposed to share (like the two leading men, Kira and Athrun). Seriously, what the heck?! And what's worse? It backfired a hundredfold. For me, at least. Cuz it ruined Lacus instead of using it as THE opportunity to make her shine brighter than Cagalli. I know, it can never make the bastardisation of Cagalli's character acceptable, but at least if it improved Lacus there's a bit of a consolation in it, albeit not enough. But no, it was all in vain. Both chicks got derailed. Talk about killing two birds with one stone. Tragic, really. Same with Shinn. Goodness me, the poor bastard. He was THE new fish. The kid was bound to be hated if 95% of the lines you make him say consists of words carefully picked to bash previously-favourited characters. DUUUHHH. But, okay, fine, what's done is done.
Time for damage control. Okay, so what was the damage control? Ummm... bringing Kira in and making him more infallible than G or Buddha. That's what they called damage control. Remind me again how that helped Shinn? Pfft, not a single antagonist was given the chance to redeem himself/herself. Everything was black and white. Anyone who isn't on Kira and Lacus' side is either dumb or evil.

Okay, off topic. I'll shut up. Sorry, just had to get that off my chest!

PS I bet everyone who engaged in this discussion are chicks. Hahahaha. I see traces of female-pride in every post (not to mention, the length of the posts. We're lucky if a gentleman or two in the thread posted something longer than two lines). Then again, there's always a chance that a Wing fanboy is feminist. *crosses fingers* Nevertheless, well done, ladies. Well done!

Last edited by Leave The Pieces; 2011-07-20 at 07:03. Reason: Grammar and spelling. Asian here -> legit excuse :D
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Old 2011-07-20, 10:24   Link #3323
Elo the Blue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mareike View Post
But you know, 12 years later, I'm still wondering what the eff the saber-tapping scene was all about. Sure, I found it cute back then (still do), but I still couldn't get what it was supposed to be, if it was to recall something in their past or what... ( I read somewhere that it was an invitation to do something...) The novelization didn't even bother explaining it. It just said the clanging was as if to replace Noin's words.

Speaking of the novels, something else got me wondering. There's something there that's always struck me odd about the two:

Spoiler:


Zechs, in her living room. Noin, clad only in her bathrobe. They may have grown up together but, IDK, that much level of comfort is rather suspicious...

Spoiler:


And yet again in her private quarters, just after she's changed clothes.

As for Relena, she's still his baby sister after all. IDK why, though, but that hug didn't strike me as being affectionate of him... Maybe I should watch that scene again.
The scabbard-tapping still puzzles me too. Maybe being so close to Zechs after so long got her excited. An embrace would have been inappropriate on a number of levels, so she just decided to tap her scabbard against his. Still an odd thing to do though...

As for when they were cadets at the academy, I think it was a matter of mutual comfort. Zechs wasn't going to express his personal feelings, and even though Noin probably knew that, she was happy to have him around.

Zechs hugging Relena couldn't be too affectionate. He still had to project the image of a cold-blooded revolutionary leader, and his subordinates were just a few feet away.
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Old 2011-07-20, 17:05   Link #3324
Faerie
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Oh great, this is going to be long. Need to check this thread more often x__x

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Originally Posted by Nishiio View Post
Ah, my bad. I've only really seen Gundam Wing, Gundam SEED, and Gundam 00 for mecha series (and while I'm extremely fond of GW, I'm not fans of the other two, especially not SEED). I guess I was just trying to think of another "pilot" female character, haha.

That would make sense. I'll try to watch Macross sometime. =)
Maybe the writers/director didn't think it would be necessary to develop the females very much? I can understand that it's an action series and you want the focus to be on the wars, the battles, and the gundams...but the guys were written well. Would it hurt to hire a few female writers for perspective?
I only asked, because I think most people preferred Asuka out of the bunch, if anyone. Or Rei. Personally, 10 years ago I preferred Rei, nowadays,more mature, both of them. Still dislike whiny fool Shinji- probably why I never appreciated Shinn-types either.

Judging from this, I'd guess you wouldn't hate female pilots in general, just the examples you've seen weren't so good. 00 had Soma, who was promising, but flopped so bad she went from favourite to meh for me.
Sad thing is Seeds writer was female... Gundam doesn't really have characterization as a true strong point imo, it's better in the action/plot department, imo. (When compared to other shows)
For example, Macross has way better characterization in general, male and female- so give it a watch when you have time =)

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Originally Posted by Kitsoru View Post
This! And the character she was an homage to, Milia from the original Macross, who is 100% badass for sure both before and after she meets her hubby Max. Macross is just kinda awesome for female characters in general.

Also, we need to keep in mind.. Gundam is a shounen series. It's made for boys to sell toys to boys.
AC has already had one female main protagonist pilot, though: Tiel Noembreux.
Totally, what I really enjoy in Macross vs Gundam is that it doesn't make be wonder who's got the better skills/machinery as compared to who.
It managed to sell both characters and plot/story so well, that there isn't really time to care if Alto is an inferior pilot to, say, Klan. (Which he is, I'm sure. She'd kick his butt )

I think the problem isn't so much being a shounen series, many of those have developed strong female leads/ co-leads these days, but being Gundam. as I said above, I think Gundam has different strengths, but it would be nice to have this worked on.
Plus, I think there is a much larger female demographic watching it than we think, especially since Seed specifically aimed to draw in female viewers iirc, but also before. They don't need to throw in a female main lead, but a female co-lead (e.g one of the 5-or whatever main pilots) needs to come about in the next few years. It's time. Curse you, Tieria, for turning out a guy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mareike View Post
Speaking of the novels, something else got me wondering. There's something there that's always struck me odd about the two:
I'm going to say this very honestly, and without beating around the bush, but to me, this just sounds like they're just friends with benefits at this point, which doesn't require massive emotional sharing, while being close and comfy around each other at the same time.

In other words: They were always close, but Zechs wasn't the cuddly, sharing type (which is funny, as he's scandinavian the stereotype is supposedly "sharing everything you think and feel to the point that it becomes annoying" My Scandi friends laugh and complain about this trait frequently).
Imo, her showering and running around in bathrobes when he's around is a pretty obvious sign of what's going on, and considering they got married sometime after EW, I don't think it's a stretch to simply assume they hooked up way before that.
You can do that, deeply care for (and possibly love) someone, even if you're not an official couple for whatever reason, which is why this behavior seems kind of normal to me..

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Originally Posted by Leave The Pieces View Post
I now see that we do agree, but are complaining about two different things. Personally, I am not bothered that there are no main female characters who are pilots. But I sure as heaven would love to see one in my lifetime lol. And I'm with you, the fact that they use the this-is-a-shounen-series excuse is pretty lame.
=) I'm not immediately bothered by it in the context of Wing either, but it would be nice to have one, along with better characterization in Gundam all-around. It's the writers fault. Shounen genre isn't an excuse for either.
I heard Urobuchi or Shinbo (can't remember which) want to do a Gundam series at some point. I really hope they give them one, they would work some serious magic there <3

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that doesn't mean it's safe to assume that the audience of a shounen series is male in majority. Shoujo is feminine... but shounen isn't masculine, it's UNISEX!! Lol. Sorry, I dunno how else to explain myself lol. But seriously. It's unisex, haha.
they do know this. imo this is why Macross has such strong girls, because we wouldn't accept a weak bunch, or more of the standard damsel-in-distress types UNLESS they had a twist to them.
In Gundam, I think they've tried to appeal to the female demographic with attractive males and flashy looking girls, but this won't be enough in the long run imo.
Not if a lot of these characters are really empty. Now, Wing has good, complex characters that interest you for years to come. But the shows after that didn't. They just had pretty boys and singing girls, although 00 had some good people.

And haha, I agree about Dorothy!

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The saddest thing about SEED (and Destiny) is the fact that its writer is a woman, even.
She is a very sad, sad, creepy woman, that one. Why she was allowed to do things like this, I can never understand.
She kind of reminds me of that Twilight woman, who just woke up one day and decided "HEY; let's ruin the advances of feminism today. I have a GREAT idea for a book, about an emo chick, who becomes dependent on a pedophile corpse. Her life goal is to be a wife and teen mom!"
Lacus could have been a great, Relena-style character. Cagalli could have been the revolution of Relena, which would have been more accepted by western fans than Relena ever was (sadly).
Lunamaria could have been that great female pilot. She's a redcoat after all.
I despise incompetent writers. No way I can tolerate what I wouldn't tolerate in a fanfic, just cause they got themselves published

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PS I bet everyone who engaged in this discussion are chicks. Hahahaha.
Hahah, I know!! This is a pretty girly topic, but I also think (some guy please confirm!) that guys would equally not mind/appreciate this. I mean, if I can reference macross again, seeing at how much more loved Sheryl is compared to Ranka, the guys love their strong females nowadays.
It's therefore my guess that they would like to see a kick-ass female pilot appreciated for her skills just as much as the girls do. Which just makes the argument "but it's shounen" weaker, if the viewers wouldn't mind.

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Originally Posted by Elo the Blue View Post
The scabbard-tapping still puzzles me too. Maybe being so close to Zechs after so long got her excited. An embrace would have been inappropriate on a number of levels, so she just decided to tap her scabbard against his. Still an odd thing to do though...
Well, coming from a sport that involves long, metallic objects very much like these, I can possibly answer that
We sometimes do this, out of impatience, or to attract attention, or out of affection while we sit around and do nothing.
I sort of imagine it's the same thing. I do this frequently to either a coach, or to someone I care for, sometimes without really taking notice of it (or without the other person taking much outward notice- be that a friend, a person of interest, or a coach). It's a little like, uhmm.. casually passing a ball if you're a volley/ basket/ tennis person.
I'd say it's simply a request for attention/ sign of affection here.
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Old 2011-07-20, 20:58   Link #3325
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Originally Posted by Mareike View Post
As for Relena, she's still his baby sister after all. IDK why, though, but that hug didn't strike me as being affectionate of him... Maybe I should watch that scene again.
Really? I thought that was the only time he was shown being affectionate, actually. And that was the only time I remember being disappointed in Relena. Uhh, dude, HUG YOUR BROTHER BACK...? It just killed the drama (the good kind) of that scene. Honestly, how couldn't she? They haven't seen each other in... forever. They could share a friggin' hug! She OBVIOUSLY wanted to hug him back, but she didn't. She just forced herself not to cuz she was like, "You've been a bad, bad boy, Milliardo. Bad! No hug for you!" But still. I wish she hugged him back. XD

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Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
I think the problem isn't so much being a shounen series, many of those have developed strong female leads/ co-leads these days, but being Gundam. as I said above, I think Gundam has different strengths, but it would be nice to have this worked on.
This.

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they do know this. imo this is why Macross has such strong girls, because we wouldn't accept a weak bunch, or more of the standard damsel-in-distress types UNLESS they had a twist to them.
In Gundam, I think they've tried to appeal to the female demographic with attractive males and flashy looking girls, but this won't be enough in the long run imo.
Not if a lot of these characters are really empty. Now, Wing has good, complex characters that interest you for years to come. But the shows after that didn't. They just had pretty boys and singing girls, although 00 had some good people.
AND THIS!! Thing is, for fandumb, it's more than enough in the long run. And let's face it, a lot of fandoms nowadays consist mostly of fantards. Majority wins. A lot of producers will still keep on making their shounen/seinen series lead by admirable male characters and... brainless eyecandy female characters who are nothing but the males' sidekicks. Simply because, it's what the majority of the fans want. Now that is just sad.

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Why she was allowed to do things like this, I can never understand.
Here, I'll help you understand... she's the director's wife, that's why.

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She kind of reminds me of that Twilight woman, who just woke up one day and decided "HEY; let's ruin the advances of feminism today...

Lacus could have been... Cagalli could have been... Lunamaria could have been...
I despise incompetent writers. No way I can tolerate what I wouldn't tolerate in a fanfic, just cause they got themselves published
Lacus and Luna were the chicks I was pissed off the most. Their stance on the show was so bloody fixated on the lead males'. They were the Pikachu to Kira/Shinn's Ash Ketchum. "Yeah, let's just go wherever they go, support whatever they do, nod to everything they say." - What the eff. Cagalli's character was bastardised, yes, but even after her breakup with Athrun, it was evident that she could move on. She still had a role to fulfill. There was still a place for her on the show. Seriously, if Lacus and Kira broke up, what'll happen to Lacus? I can only see her ending up going back to her old routine. Staying indoors, playing hide-and-seek with her Haro's. That's why Kira and Lacus must NEVER break up. Otherwise, she'll get demoted to a supporting character, if not an extra. And they don't want that. Because they want Kira's love interest to be dubbed as The lead female character.

I will never forgive Sumizawa if he writes the Wing girls ending up like this in FT. Never.
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Old 2011-07-20, 21:21   Link #3326
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Originally Posted by Leave The Pieces View Post

The saddest thing about SEED (and Destiny) is the fact that its writer is a woman, even. Morosawa--darn, what did she smoke? Shame on her. How could she ruin her girls like that. She's the most unprofessional writer I've seen in my life. Lacus and Cagalli, her leading ladies, even, were her biggest offenses. She derailed the latter so that the former (which she happens to be a big fangirl of) could have all the limelight for herself when they're supposed to share (like the two leading men, Kira and Athrun).
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Originally Posted by Leave The Pieces View Post

Here, I'll help you understand... she's the director's wife, that's why.
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...postcount=6240

The story behind this pic is that Morosawa claimed in an interview that Athrun and Lacus were her favorite characters, and she was rumored to have cosplayed as Lacus at her appearrances in the various anime conventions in Japan, and tried to get Fukuda to cosplay as Kira.
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Old 2011-07-21, 04:21   Link #3327
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Not to interrupt the giant character discussion, but a question for Mirei, or anyone who has access to the original text of Chapter 9- there was some mention of 'Ares' being tacked onto Epyon's name. So does that mean this is the original Epyon upgraded but a new suit, or is it still considered the same suit? Is it being referred to as Epyon or specifically Epyon Ares?

I seem to recall Epyon's normal OZ-13MS serial code being used to refer to it already which would mean it's considered the same suit, but I want to make sure for wikia purposes.

EDIT: Also, although they mention its left arm being rebuilt green, the art for these chapters clearly shows it as red... :S
Can anyone please translate what the blurb for Epyon White says on this scan? I know it's bad quality, but.. http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...34527EGW56.jpg
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Old 2011-07-21, 05:48   Link #3328
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Originally Posted by Kitsoru View Post
Not to interrupt the giant character discussion, but a question for Mirei, or anyone who has access to the original text of Chapter 9- there was some mention of 'Ares' being tacked onto Epyon's name. So does that mean this is the original Epyon upgraded but a new suit, or is it still considered the same suit? Is it being referred to as Epyon or specifically Epyon Ares?

I seem to recall Epyon's normal OZ-13MS serial code being used to refer to it already which would mean it's considered the same suit, but I want to make sure for wikia purposes.

EDIT: Also, although they mention its left arm being rebuilt green, the art for these chapters clearly shows it as red... :S
Can anyone please translate what the blurb for Epyon White says on this scan? I know it's bad quality, but.. http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...34527EGW56.jpg
What he said, If its technical data on the suit or even just information in general I'm interested.
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Old 2011-07-21, 07:38   Link #3329
IkuzeMinna
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mareike View Post
Zechs, in her living room. Noin, clad only in her bathrobe. They may have grown up together but, IDK, that much level of comfort is rather suspicious...

And yet again in her private quarters, just after she's changed clothes.
Hahaha! You know, I'm not sure what surprises and amuses me more; Noin liking to be ogled or Zechs ogling. xD

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Originally Posted by Elo the Blue View Post
As for when they were cadets at the academy, I think it was a matter of mutual comfort. Zechs wasn't going to express his personal feelings, and even though Noin probably knew that, she was happy to have him around.
Yeah but while she dressed..?

Quote:
Zechs hugging Relena couldn't be too affectionate. He still had to project the image of a cold-blooded revolutionary leader, and his subordinates were just a few feet away.
Well, he did ask Quinze if he thought him a weak man because of it. But I agree, Zechs always struck me as keeping his emotions in check. You never see him overly sad/happy/angry/whatever in any situation, unlike others.
I guess that's what you get for hanging out with Treize.

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Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
Sorry, my mistake, non- native speaker here. Happens
No harm done.

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Ahaha! Not to single her out but... Yes, she's probably the worst offender. As much as I thought she wasn't that bad of a character, until the whole Shinn debacle... she is P A T H E T I C when it comes to her supposed "skills". It's a miracle ZAFT actually pays her.
Amen.

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Even Nina and Louise don't look as bad when compared to the Seed girls.
Even a chimpanzee with one arm wouldn't look bad as a pilot compared to a person that almost got herself killed because she DANCED OFF A CLIFF. >_>

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I suggest giving the Seed girls' suits to the Wing girls and see what happens (Noin would look good in Gaia).
Seconded. And Dorothy would of course pilot the Hackatsuki. It's got her name practically written all over it. xD
Hilde would get Lunamaria's and Sally... Hmm, I wonder what Sally would do. Certainly not command the Eternal, unless you want the ship rammed into GENESIS. Man, I wanna spoof this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leave The Pieces View Post
While I agree that Relena is pretty reckless herself (like Hilde, but in her own way), which is usually soo Duo's type, the reason why I think he'd never be interested in her is because she's... so hiiiiiggghhhh, high above him. Like the song. You know? Lol.
Yup. It's interesting to note that although he is friendly toward her (he greets her good morning unlike Heero), he never calls her by her name but always "Miss"/"Young Lady" (ojousan). Even when he talks about her, he refers to her by her full name, which makes it sound rather formal. That's saying a lot considering even Quatre calls her by her name. But I don't think he's doing it on purpose because aside from that, he's as friendly toward her as to anyone else.
I like to view it as a subtle hint that Duo, consciously or not, respects her and addresses her according to her status. Heck, you can throw in an inferiority complex if you like.
Little does he know though, Relena doesn't give a rat's butt about status.

Quote:
It's unisex, haha. And I'm pretty sure a lot of producers know this. Heck, why else would they make their male characters so damn hot. They know WE are watching, too.
lol I know this isn't what you mean but the way you put it makes it sound like girls only watch Gundam for the "hot guys".
But yeah, most girls prefer shounen over shoujo simply because it's more interesting. Love triangles can only get you that far.

Quote:
It's kinda weird, she has the most number of scenes where affectionate acts were played. She gave daddy a kiss, hugged mum, got her hand held by Quatre (), got hugged by Zechs (like you just said)... and man, even Dorothy.
Ah, c'mon, are you really blaming a guy who gets treated by his army of sisters like this?

Now that's a decent reunion.

Really, Quatre grabbing Relena's hand was harmless. If we had him actually act according to his person, he'd have to greet people with kisses; a kiss on the back of a lady's hand because he's a gentleman and a kiss on a man's cheek because he's Arab. I'm pretty sure that would've weirded a lot of people out. xD

Quote:
I always thought it was the rose she was aiming for because she didn't show any disappointment when she didn't hit Une.
I always thought she was aiming for Une's chest but since Une expertly twisted out of the bullet's way in time only the rose was hit.

Quote:
The saddest thing about SEED (and Destiny) is the fact that its writer is a woman, even. Morosawa--darn, what did she smoke? Shame on her. How could she ruin her girls like that. [...] And what's worse? It backfired a hundredfold.
No, the saddest part is that it didn't backfire. For some reason, Japanese love Destiny, as evidenced by how well it sold.
I don't know what's wrong with people but it's always crap that is popular whereas the really good stuff only gets appreciated ages later. Just look at literature.

As far as strong female characters go, I don't think they're popular in Japan (and as we all know, only Japan matters ). I'm basing this assumption on popularity polls. In Sailor Moon, Mercury was the most popular character (wtf). In Naruto, Hinata is arguably more popular than Sakura. And in Gundam, Lacus always ranks higher than Cagalli. Even in GS, when most she did was sing and look pretty, she was more liked than gun-toting, jet fighter piloting rebel Cagalli.
The odd thing though is that I believe that it wasn't necessarily the guys who preferred the pink princess but the girls. At least if forums are to be trusted.

So Nishiio's question if the creators just have trouble writing female characters can be partly answered with yes, they do but that damsels-in-distress types are also what sells. To women, that is. Proof? The girls mentioned above. And if we go worldwide, Twilight. Women love that crap. From what I know that Bella chick couldn't even walk on her own without kissing the floor and people were all over her.

I don't think guys have that much trouble with strong women, either. There are just too many that have admitted to liking a girl with spunk. But I think that a lot of girls in general can't identify with them. Otherwise Relena's character wouldn't be so horribly off in fanfics (blushing and stuttering around Heero, yeah right).

And let's not forget that a damsel-in-distress also serves one very important purpose in a story: make the guy look better by rescuing her.

Last edited by IkuzeMinna; 2011-07-21 at 12:00.
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Old 2011-07-21, 07:50   Link #3330
mirei
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おじゃまします...

(regarding the questions of Kitsoru):

-I was actually wondering what 'Epyon Ares' (no idea since I haven't read the previous chapters and if ever it was mentioned before) it is because the Japanese word is "Tsuginaru tatakai" (next battle) but read as "Epyon Ares". I thought at first it's the name of the other Epyon (not Nataku). Thus, my translation stated it as the name of the other mobile armor. (To cite an example, Tallgeese (in GotL) is read as "One who creates miracles".)

But I read it again, and I think this translation is more or less precise:

Quote:
That reason is because the three-headed pterosaur, which had fixed its target, intends to have an air battle; a 'next battle' (Epyon Ares) of identical mobile armors that no one had experienced yet.
Especially when the scan of both Epyons came out, the other Epyon is simply "Gundam Epyon". And there's that idea that it is a battle between two Epyons on Mars (Ares=Mars=God of War).


-I checked again, and it really stated that the left arm is green @_@. As Duo stated that the reason was because the left arm was torn off during the EVE WARS, thus the replacement of new parts.

-The blurb states that Epyon White is Epyon no. 2; Wufei got hold of the blueprint Treize left and built it single-handedly; dragon fangs are in the right arm; beam trident in the left; it's a mobile armor that resembles a three-headed pterosaur; it is equipped with Zero system.


I hope chapter 10 scans will come out soon.

****

As for the discussions, it may be OT, but I am one person who detests/dislikes Gundam Seed franchise and only watched it only because there's 'Gundam' in the title. It was a big disappointment for me because I just couldn't like the characters no matter how hard I try to understand them D: I am not one who watches anime or reads manga for fanservice. That's why I'm always biased with Gundam Wing.

Btw, It's good to read that every scene in the GW anime is being scrutinized in the discussions here xD

I wonder if I will read something sappy soon in the next chapters of FT if Zechs and Relena or Heero and Relena have some physical reunion. I'm afraid the text will be something you see in a fanfic. Won't have qualms if it's Duo who will narrate.

Last edited by mirei; 2011-07-21 at 08:08. Reason: added some blabbings
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Old 2011-07-21, 12:31   Link #3331
Nishiio
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Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna View Post
No, the saddest part is that it didn't backfire. For some reason, Japanese love Destiny, as evidenced by how well it sold.
I don't know what's wrong with people but it's always crap that is popular whereas the really good stuff only gets appreciated ages later. Just look at literature.

As far as strong female characters go, I don't think they're popular in Japan (and as we all know, only Japan matters ). I'm basing this assumption on popularity polls. In Sailor Moon, Mercury was the most popular character (wtf). In Naruto, Hinata is arguably more popular than Sakura. And in Gundam, Lacus always ranks higher than Cagalli. Even in GS, when most she did was sing and look pretty, she was more liked than gun-toting, jet fighter piloting rebel Cagalli.
The odd thing though is that I believe that it wasn't necessarily the guys who preferred the pink princess but the girls. At least if forums are to be trusted.

So Nishiio's question if the creators just have trouble writing female characters can be partly answered with yes, they do but that damsels-in-distress types are also what sells. To women, that is. Proof? The girls mentioned above. And if we go worldwide, Twilight. Women love that crap. From what I know that Bella chick couldn't even walk on her own without kissing the floor and people were all over her.

I don't think guys have that much trouble with strong women, either. There are just too many that have admitted to liking a girl with spunk. But I think that a lot of girls in general can't identify with them. Otherwise Relena's character wouldn't be so horribly off in fanfics (blushing and stuttering around Heero, yeah right).

And let's not forget that a damsel-in-distress also serves one very important purpose in a story: make the guy look better by rescuing her.
Oh geez. My blood pressure just skyrocketed at the mention of Twilight. I won't say too much about here since it would be a little too off topic but...yeah. I want to burn every single copy of those books and feed the ashes to the author.

I don't want to get too much into the Japan vs. North America debate either but how much does culture factor in? I remember at some point in the forum (maaaaany pages ago), someone pointed out that GW did not do that well in Japan and GS did great. (I realize GW was probably up against Eva and DBZ etc. etc. at the time.)
But why do Japanese audiences just prefer girls who aren't tough? x___x Is it because of the society they're raised in? Or am I just WAY overthinking this and the reason is because the fangirls just want to be like the damsel-in-distress so they can get rescued by Prince Charming?


Quote:
Originally Posted by mirei View Post

As for the discussions, it may be OT, but I am one person who detests/dislikes Gundam Seed franchise and only watched it only because there's 'Gundam' in the title. It was a big disappointment for me because I just couldn't like the characters no matter how hard I try to understand them D: I am not one who watches anime or reads manga for fanservice. That's why I'm always biased with Gundam Wing.

Btw, It's good to read that every scene in the GW anime is being scrutinized in the discussions here xD

I wonder if I will read something sappy soon in the next chapters of FT if Zechs and Relena or Heero and Relena have some physical reunion. I'm afraid the text will be something you see in a fanfic. Won't have qualms if it's Duo who will narrate.
Dude. Brain twins! Everything I wanted to say, you said it, haha~
Actually, I didn't mind Cagalli for a bit until her character got super screwed up.
I dunno. >> I just think GW actually had some pretty deep themes about war, human nature, etc. and the pilots' loneliness really made you feel for them.
What did we get in SEED? "I don't want to fiiiigghhht *whine whine*" "Oh, WUT you slept with her? ZOMG" =____=

Haha, I wouldn't mind it either if it's still Duo's POV. ^^
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Old 2011-07-21, 13:51   Link #3332
Deacon Blues
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Ugh... this heat is killing any energy I have for manga shopping. Plus my bright idea to translate SFX was moronic! Anywho, I've ordered Frozen Teardrop 1 and 2!
__________________
「では、人間は、何故、戦うのか?
戦うことに存在意義があるのかもしれない。
戦っている人間には充実感がある。
そして、戦っている人間が汚れて見えないのも事実だ」

So why do people fight, anyway?
Perhaps the meaning of existence lies within their will to fight.
People feel a sense of accomplishment through battle.
And itís also a fact that the ones actually fighting are never perceived as being tainted.
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Old 2011-07-21, 20:46   Link #3333
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so they went there why?
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Old 2011-07-21, 21:32   Link #3334
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Ugh... this heat is killing any energy I have for manga shopping. Plus my bright idea to translate SFX was moronic! Anywho, I've ordered Frozen Teardrop 1 and 2!
Does this mean we'll see the translation soon?
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Old 2011-07-21, 22:35   Link #3335
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Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna View Post
lol I know this isn't what you mean but the way you put it makes it sound like girls only watch Gundam for the "hot guys".
Oh crap. Yeah, you're right. Saying it like that sounded pretty bad. Sorry, ladies, my bad. I never intended it to sound like I'm assuming all female fans are shallow. I was simply trying to be short (because we all know how lengthy my posts can get ). It was merely an example, you know, one of the many reasons why I think producers do know girls like to watch shounen/seinen as much as guys. Forgive me, it's just that... well, it was the easiest example to cite at the time.

Quote:
Ah, c'mon, are you really blaming a guy who gets treated by his army of sisters like this?

...

Really, Quatre grabbing Relena's hand was harmless. If we had him actually act according to his person, he'd have to greet people with kisses; a kiss on the back of a lady's hand because he's a gentleman and a kiss on a man's cheek because he's Arab. I'm pretty sure that would've weirded a lot of people out. xD
I think you misunderstood my point of citing those examples lol. It has nothing to do with Quatre or his personality/habits or anyone else's for that matter. I was simply trying to load ammo to your comment:

Quote:
Or maybe it's just Relena?
You know, seconding the motion and also adding that I noticed Relena has the most number of scenes where sweet nothings were played. I have no doubt Quatre's nice to everybody and has a soft spot for women in general. It simply wasn't lampshaded so we didn't get to see it. It was off-screen.

Quote:
No, the saddest part is that it didn't backfire. For some reason, Japanese love Destiny, as evidenced by how well it sold.

As far as strong female characters go, I don't think they're popular in Japan (and as we all know, only Japan matters )...

So Nishiio's question if the creators just have trouble writing female characters can be partly answered with yes, they do but that damsels-in-distress types are also what sells. To women, that is. Proof? The girls mentioned above. And if we go worldwide, Twilight. Women love that crap.

I don't think guys have that much trouble with strong women, either. There are just too many that have admitted to liking a girl with spunk. But I think that a lot of girls in general can't identify with them. Otherwise...

And let's not forget that a damsel-in-distress also serves one very important purpose in a story: make the guy look better by rescuing her.
THIS. This is what I was trying to say, really. Hence, these posts:

*She derailed the latter so that the former (which she happens to be a big fangirl of) could have all the limelight for herself when they're supposed to share (like the two leading men, Kira and Athrun). Seriously, what the heck?! And what's worse? It backfired a hundredfold. For me, at least.

Both chicks got derailed.
;

*Majority wins. A lot of producers will still keep on making their shounen/seinen series lead by admirable male characters and... brainless eyecandy female characters who are nothing but the males' sidekicks. Simply because, it's what the majority of the fans want.

~

Anyhow, congrats. You did a heck of a lot better job to get the point across than I did and ever will. High five!

I think it's the Japanese culture and ethics, too.
It seems to me, both their men and women... simply like seeing their women very "attached" and giving as much "assistance" as they possibly can to their men (partners, at least). You know, that women should be the subservient gender. Which is why pop female figures such as Belldandy, Chii and, yes, Lacus, most recently, top the female characters charts all the time. The thing is, Belldandy and Chii were intentionally portrayed that way. They were supposed to be exactly THAT. Lacus, however, was not. She was supposed to be the lead male's equal. Not just in terms of importance, but also in terms of function. Her function. She was supposed to be the Relena to Kira's Heero, the Hime Utsumiya to his Yuu Isami. But no. She was the (laying off Pokemon now) Yumi to his Shishio, albeit worshipped by the other characters as if she was the Kaoru to his Kenshin. What the eff. She was okay in SEED but in SEED Destiny, all I could see was a Kira Yamato subordinate. SUBORDINATE.
I am not hating on Lacus or the Japanese culture or anything, just criticising Morosawa and how she wrote the character who had A LOT of potential to be truly and unquestionably great. A female character of power and dominance. Yeah, okay, DUUHH, it's the producers' right to make their shows Japanese-friendly because, well, they're Japanese, too so it's what they themselves WANT to see and they also prioritise the preferences of their own people.

BUT it wouldn't hurt to be a little flexible, especially nowadays. They are well aware their anime (and anything related thereto) produce hit the Western market.

Thank goodness CLAMP (despite the fact that their stuff is shoujo anyway. But Chobits is an exception), Keiko Nobumoto of BONES and Hayao Miyazaki exist.

To those who think this is straying away from the topic, please bear with me. It's necessary to compare things and reference other shows and writers to illustrate a point.

All that blurb boils down to my attempt to explain why I am too critical of Sumizawa's writing--at least, this particular one at hand. I am EXTREMELY dreading for his female characters in FT. I don't want him to take the same approach in FT that Morosawa did for SEED's sequel. But looks to me, he's heading in the exact same direction that woman did. Just because that approach was what sold SEED Destiny, it doesn't mean it's what will sell Frozen Teardrop... (or maybe, it will? )

I'm almost too sure the popularity of Wing in the West... actually, no, the international popularity of Wing is one of the main reasons why he and/or Sunrise decided to resurrect the masterpiece. If not, he/they could've just made a completely new anime/manga/novel/whatever full of all the angst, drama, kissing, fanservice and female character submissive-ness that popularised SEED, Destiny, 00 and/or Geass in Japan, instead. Rather than put it in Wing's FT. Hello, it's Gundam Wing we're talking about here. The name itself guarantees them there are already audience/readers to milk money from. Outside Japan, even. Whereas making a new one with the same elements (angst, drama, fanservice, angst, angst, angst) would require promotion and advertisement.

Quote:
Relena's character wouldn't be so horribly off in fanfics (blushing and stuttering around Heero, yeah right).
For the love of...! THIS. Hallelujah!! Thank goodness someone said that. *hug*
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Old 2011-07-22, 02:05   Link #3336
Kitsoru
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Originally Posted by Aldaeus View Post
What he said,
She :U
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Originally Posted by mirei View Post
(regarding the questions of Kitsoru):

-I was actually wondering what 'Epyon Ares' (no idea since I haven't read the previous chapters and if ever it was mentioned before) it is because the Japanese word is "Tsuginaru tatakai" (next battle) but read as "Epyon Ares". I thought at first it's the name of the other Epyon (not Nataku). Thus, my translation stated it as the name of the other mobile armor. (To cite an example, Tallgeese (in GotL) is read as "One who creates miracles".)

But I read it again, and I think this translation is more or less precise:

Especially when the scan of both Epyons came out, the other Epyon is simply "Gundam Epyon". And there's that idea that it is a battle between two Epyons on Mars (Ares=Mars=God of War).


-I checked again, and it really stated that the left arm is green @_@. As Duo stated that the reason was because the left arm was torn off during the EVE WARS, thus the replacement of new parts.

-The blurb states that Epyon White is Epyon no. 2; Wufei got hold of the blueprint Treize left and built it single-handedly; dragon fangs are in the right arm; beam trident in the left; it's a mobile armor that resembles a three-headed pterosaur; it is equipped with Zero system.
Thanks! Man, it's bugging me that they're giving such seemingly random pieces of information about the Epyon's but won't decisively give info on the new suits, or even full data for the Epyons. It's less suspense now and more just... I dunno, milking it for all it's worth XD Even the tiny sneakpeaks of Epyon White... So frustrating @_@

Oh well.. hopefully we'll get MS data soon. It seems like, what with chapter 10's info, we're going to be getting more character vignettes in the next few chapters, rather than any more MS related stuff (which I also love, but...).
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Old 2011-07-22, 05:10   Link #3337
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Originally Posted by Kitsoru View Post
She :U

Thanks! Man, it's bugging me that they're giving such seemingly random pieces of information about the Epyon's but won't decisively give info on the new suits, or even full data for the Epyons. It's less suspense now and more just... I dunno, milking it for all it's worth XD Even the tiny sneakpeaks of Epyon White... So frustrating @_@

Oh well.. hopefully we'll get MS data soon. It seems like, what with chapter 10's info, we're going to be getting more character vignettes in the next few chapters, rather than any more MS related stuff (which I also love, but...).
I'll agree I want to see more of the characters, but IF by some shot in the dark we get a real view of Snow White, Warlock, Prometheus, or Scheherazade... I'd be all over it.
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Old 2011-07-22, 12:08   Link #3338
Faerie
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Simply because, it's what the majority of the fans want. Now that is just sad.
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Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna
As far as strong female characters go, I don't think they're popular in Japan (and as we all know, only Japan matters ). I'm basing this assumption on popularity polls. In Sailor Moon, Mercury was the most popular character (wtf). In Naruto, Hinata is arguably more popular than Sakura.
I wonder about this. Obviously a LOT of japanese prefer moeblobs (is this why soma had to be slaughtered??), and I can understand the average girl who is pretty bubble-headed preferring girls like Ranka, Meyrin, Luna, the twilight brat etc. based on the Mary Sue concept that you just project your own head onto them.
So if the majority of the audience/ buyers is this type of person, and let's face it, there are millions of them... it all goes down the drain.

But I had this understanding that there was a slow but sure shift away from this 8as viewers become more demanding/ intelligent). I've always preferred the strong characters in shows, who were most likely side-characters. Nowadays, we see some of these types taking centre stage instead:
Sheryl would NEVER have become the main lead/ winner of any triangle anywhere 10 years ago. Moeblob Ranka would've won easily. I think producers were surprised themselves, how the viewers (even in Japan) rejected her, and that's why the show evolved iirc?
Was so proud =)

Utena, obviously, a classic strong female lead, who beats out the likes of Sailor Mercury (WTF?? Seriously. when we were kids, we thought she was the most useless idiot of the group and everyone hated her xD), and well, everyone else out there.

Relena was way ahead of her time though, hence the hate.

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Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna View Post
Even a chimpanzee with one arm wouldn't look bad as a pilot compared to a person that almost got herself killed because she DANCED OFF A CLIFF. >_>
hahahahahahahhahahaaha THAT scene. I pushed it out of my memory. I liked Stellar's design. I wish she had gotten a chance to be a good pilot/ not braindead. Also because I really like her suit.


Quote:
Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna
Seconded. And Dorothy would of course pilot the Hackatsuki. It's got her name practically written all over it. xD
Hilde would get Lunamaria's and Sally... Hmm, I wonder what Sally would do. Certainly not command the Eternal, unless you want the ship rammed into GENESIS. Man, I wanna spoof this.
Ohhh yesss. Please. Someone make it happen=) Give Sally that horrible Orb ship Cagalli had, she can ram it into whatever she wants, no harm done.



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Originally Posted by Leave The Pieces View Post
Both chicks got derailed.[/I];
Quote:
Originally Posted by IkuzeMinna
And in Gundam, Lacus always ranks higher than Cagalli.
About Lacus. Sorry, I'm trying to structure this post,so it won't be a novel in length. it's somehow not working so well.

Tbh, I can still understand Lacus being popular AND being a strong character. True, she's completely derailed and horrible by the beginning of GSD.
When you use Seed as an example, I can see why people would prefer per to Cagalli, simply because the latter often seems helpless, basic and irrelevant in comparison to Lacus who wields some kind of supreme political power and is a great public speaker.
Imo, it's her speeches that lull you into liking her, and make you disregard everything else. Haro helps too.

I'm not going to argue that Lacus went horribly wrong, and my greatest desire is to see her go psycho evil on everyone,at least for a while, because it would be awesome. She would be SUCH a good final boss.
Cagalli had her moments, and in Seed, arguably was the better character, but her less interesting exterior and less flashy displays of power don't work in her favour as long as the director and writer are morons anyway. They could've easily brought her through as the favourite of fans, if they had wanted to.

Thing about Seed is, neither of them are bad characters per se. I like the idea of Lacus. The execution sucks, but...
She isn't completely bad imo, just what IS bad is SO bad that we can't see past it without really ignoring a lot of key plot points.

edit: haha, i got an anonymous neg rep saying "so/marie moeblobs?"- i don't care, but let me elaborate, as I feel misrepresented/ misquoted. Soma was a strong personality, feisty, focussed, no-nonsense and all around pretty awesome. Possibly THE coolest girl in 00. She wasn't even brainwashed, She was trained as a supersoldier, yeah. But she wasn't unhappy or anything.
The duo of her and Sergej had one of the best relationship dynamics of the show (if not THE best. and in a friendship/fatherly kind of way of course).
Her personality was not dangerous, unstable or out of control in any way, like Halle. Therefore, there was absolutely no reason to derail her personality, except to make it real easy to dump her together with Alle, with could've been done just the same by having her open up to him like she did to Sergej, easy, full of awesome. But it wasn't meant to be, as instead she got a personality overhaul.
DOn't get me wrong, I still like Marie, but she is a wet piece of cloth compared to kick-ass Soma, and imo her abrupt personality transformation was just to bump her popularity with the sweet-girls-loving demographic.
Could've been done so much more subtle and without rebooting her for no reason.
So, mister (or miss), I dare you to challenge this view in writing this time. Enjoy =)

Last edited by Faerie; 2011-07-22 at 18:56.
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Old 2011-07-22, 19:57   Link #3339
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Relena was way ahead of her time though, hence the hate.
This. It kind of sounds silly when one says it like that, eh? The character was way ahead of her time, which should've been considered a good thing, a "breakthrough" or something. It should've had people say "Sumizawa did well, his character was ahead of her time."

But yeah, it didn't work that way, unfortunately. There are those who liked it (myself included), but as much as I hate to admit it, they're outnumbered by those who didn't. Then again, when you think about it, most of the hate is not really because most people simply refused to consider the character is great cuz she's nothing like their cliche preferences. Most of the hate is coming from the fact that she's a girl, and a straight one at that... you know where this is going, right? Lol. I'm not saying that everyone who hates her does so because of that. It's not always the case. But most of the time, it is. Once upon a time, a friend of mine went to an anime convention where she encountered heaps of rabid 1x2 fangirls. She went with a few classmates then but alas, a cruel twist of fate stepped in, and somehow they had to "mingle" with them, along with a few others who didn't know a thing about Wing.

Apparently, there were two or three fans who belonged to the unknowing party who bashed Relena to no end, side by side with the yaoi fangirls.

The most awful thing about Relena's "condition" is that most of her haters, for some weird reason, have a massive influence on others that before these people even see Wing, they already have a negative grasp on her. They're already prejudiced and critical towards her, when they haven't even seen nothing yet. So, naturally, when they get to see something, it wouldn't register anymore. They'd refuse to acknowledge it, consciously or unconsciously.

I feel sorry for Relena, really. Why it's okay for a lot of people to bash her without having even seen Wing, I will never understand. But, as they say, there's always a silver lining. There are still a few peeps out there who have an untainted take on Relena... and Wing in general. Which makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside, haha.

Quote:
I liked Stellar's design. I wish she had gotten a chance to be a good pilot/ not braindead. Also because I really like her suit.
Me too! I loved Stellar's character design. I thought she was the prettiest SEED girl, even. Although, I have to admit, she had a little soft-porn look going on there. I was never put off by the girl just because she was a little too... say, "special" for her own good. She had a very good reason to be one. But agreed, they could've done better with her character. At the end of the day, she was there for the eyecandy. Idk, the show's just full of missed opportunities. It was promising, what with that whole Naturals vs Coordinators plot. Oh well, it's not like it's the first time I've heard of a wasted potential.

Quote:
Tbh, I can still understand Lacus being popular AND being a strong character...

...just what IS bad is SO bad that we can't see past it without really ignoring a lot of key plot points.
What you have here is a completely different comparison between Lacus and Cagalli. Nevertheless, agreed on all points. You good. In fact, I was one of those fans who preferred Lacus over Cagalli... that is, at first. But... it's a long story. XD

Anyway, what I was comparing between the two was Lacus' stance's fixation on Kira's... and Cagalli's undeniable potential to stand on her own. Without dependence whatsoever on the leading men of the show. ^_^

One last thing. If Cagalli had the huge pink hair and Lacus the little yellow hair, nothing else traded (Cagalli's still the fighter chick, Lacus the speech-y Haro miss)... I bet these girls will prefer Cagalli over Lacus. Regardless of what the characters do. Unless, that's what you meant by "less interesting exterior"? Lol

Last edited by Leave The Pieces; 2011-07-22 at 22:34. Reason: The usual...
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Old 2011-07-22, 22:14   Link #3340
Elo the Blue
Mama there goes that man!
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkullFaerie View Post
Well, coming from a sport that involves long, metallic objects very much like these, I can possibly answer that
We sometimes do this, out of impatience, or to attract attention, or out of affection while we sit around and do nothing.
I sort of imagine it's the same thing. I do this frequently to either a coach, or to someone I care for, sometimes without really taking notice of it (or without the other person taking much outward notice- be that a friend, a person of interest, or a coach). It's a little like, uhmm.. casually passing a ball if you're a volley/ basket/ tennis person.
I'd say it's simply a request for attention/ sign of affection here.
Thanks for the info.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kitsoru View Post
She :U

Thanks! Man, it's bugging me that they're giving such seemingly random pieces of information about the Epyon's but won't decisively give info on the new suits, or even full data for the Epyons. It's less suspense now and more just... I dunno, milking it for all it's worth XD Even the tiny sneakpeaks of Epyon White... So frustrating @_@

Oh well.. hopefully we'll get MS data soon. It seems like, what with chapter 10's info, we're going to be getting more character vignettes in the next few chapters, rather than any more MS related stuff (which I also love, but...).
Agreed on the frustration. The character development and story moving along is welcome, but some MS info and legitimate pictures would really make things complete.
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