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Old 2011-07-25, 14:18   Link #2881
Sinta
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Originally Posted by jzmagic View Post
Chapter 91 is boring if the spoilers are true.
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Old 2011-07-25, 14:29   Link #2882
Mentar
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Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
As Waven said, it's a matter of taste. GE follows a bit more of a rational thread than KNIM, which I enjoy. Too much in KNIM just makes me go "WTF?", while at least in GE I can understand where the characters are coming from.
Naturally you're right that it's a matter of taste. But I have to chuckle and shake my head in disbelief when you're saying that the storyline of GE is more "rational" than KNIM. I can positively assure you that I've seen almost all story elements of KNIM in real life, around me. I also have no problem whatsoever in extrapolating the motivations of the characters, even though they tend to be less obvious compared to GE. This "WTF" factor only comes in if you refuse to acknowledge/accept the explanations because you DON'T LIKE THEM. That's actually a sign of realism, by the way. Then again, more power to you.

GE has a very simple storyline. All developments are slow, explicit and obvious. Very easy to follow. Unfortunately, I do have difficulties relating GE with own real life experiences. The story's foundation only works when an extremely unusual girl (Yuki) takes an extremely unlikely interest in a very uncommon type of guy (wet noodle extreme). Did you get to know a very emotionally mature beauty to coach a can't-harm-a-fly puppy dripping pure innocence out of every pore? And then to shy back due to prior emotional traumas? Really? Sorry, can't relate.

So - it's perfectly fine to prefer the GE storyline, character and storytelling. But I have big issues _particularly_ with the "realistic" angle, because IMHO, it's not. Not in the least. And I prefer to be angry at Haruto for being a dense jerk over howling in pain about Utsumi's puppy whining.

But - as you said - personal preference.
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Old 2011-07-25, 15:55   Link #2883
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And did you know a guy who dropped his entire life to go chasing after a girl who dumped him, only to befriend and start cooking for the guy who stole his girlfriend in the first place, and then up and died?

Of course there's going to be some unrealistic stuff in manga in general. I just find GE to have more realistic tone and pacing and yes, I can related MUCH better with GE due to my experiences (I've dealt with the damaged girl thing, so I get it). KNIM, while I can relate some parts of it to my life, I can't relate any of Haruto's decisions. No one around me has ever done the kinds of things he's done. And I know perfectly well where the WTF factor comes from. I don't like the decisions the characters made and frankly, I find them all to be idiotic morons. Now, that's not to say GE doesn't have it's problems. It's WAY too angst ridden for it's own good.... I don't think there's ever been a chapter where the characters aren't agonizing over something, no matter how stupid, and spends way too much of the manga having Utsumi moping. It also has a bad habit of making Utsumi look like the bad guy, even when he's done nothing wrong.Plus, Sasuga spends too much time trolling the readers with obvious set-ups. Still, I'll take the characters growth and development over raging at Haruto and Eba for their antics any day. Though, honestly, I don't think any of the main characters of the series are all that great. Utsumi used to be in the beginning, when he was growing at a steady rate and becoming more confident, but the fact that he's been regressing into a pile of misery and worry all the time again has gotten annoying. Yuki went from being a cool, confident Ice Queen to a complete mess of a character. I understand the trauma, but it's played up so much it's starting to define her character and influence every action she makes. The manga really needs a breather.

And you always have issues with something somebody says if it's not within your line of thinking, so I'm used to it. :P
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Old 2011-07-25, 16:12   Link #2884
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KNIM

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-07-25, 16:19   Link #2885
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Well Haruto still has more spine that Utsumi however (putting that part about cooking for a guy who just stole your girlfriend to the side).

I mean he at least had balls to end up his relationship with Asuka when he realized he didnt love her - do the clean cut, yeah hurt her a lot but its a right decision. If it were Utsumi in such situation he would be clinging to her and ruining their both lives and even if she would try to end it he would still be crawling back asking to give another try and then another and then another just because he feels guilty.

Utsumi is such a disgustingly nice and helpless guy that it becomes painful to watch at him being hurt all the time.

Its like watching new born kitten being kicked with steel boots in slow motion.
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Old 2011-07-25, 17:20   Link #2886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
And did you know a guy who dropped his entire life to go chasing after a girl who dumped him,
Yep.

Quote:
... only to befriend and start cooking for the guy who stole his girlfriend in the first place,
Yep. Not the cooking part, but the befriending part.

Quote:
... and then up and died?
No. Eventually, the girl dumped both of them *lol*

Quote:
Of course there's going to be some unrealistic stuff in manga in general. I just find GE to have more realistic tone and pacing and yes, I can related MUCH better with GE due to my experiences (I've dealt with the damaged girl thing, so I get it). KNIM, while I can relate some parts of it to my life, I can't relate any of Haruto's decisions. No one around me has ever done the kinds of things he's done. And I know perfectly well where the WTF factor comes from. I don't like the decisions the characters made and frankly, I find them all to be idiotic morons.
See, THAT'S the problem. KNIM walks over your shoes more - certainly. Normal life does that too. But sorry, I find GE too artificial, and Utsumi simply rubs me all the wrong way.

Quote:
It also has a bad habit of making Utsumi look like the bad guy, even when he's done nothing wrong.
Utsumi is a doormat. In my eyes, what he's doing wrong is that he's doing NOTHING when it counts.

Quote:
Plus, Sasuga spends too much time trolling the readers with obvious set-ups. Still, I'll take the characters growth and development over raging at Haruto and Eba for their antics any day.
Growth, hm? 5 chapters ago, I'd have said that he is slowly, slooooowly developing traces of a spine. Unfortunately, the last 3 chapters undid all that.

Sorry. Utsumi is a nice boy, with an emphasis on boy. KNIM has an older character set (and target audience).
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Old 2011-07-25, 17:24   Link #2887
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Originally Posted by Sinta View Post
Mind sharing with the rest of the class?
If the spoiler were true then

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-07-25, 17:27   Link #2888
recover
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Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
If it were Utsumi in such situation he would be clinging to her and ruining their both lives and even if she would try to end it he would still be crawling back asking to give another try and then another and then another just because he feels guilty.

Utsumi is such a disgustingly nice and helpless guy that it becomes painful to watch at him being hurt all the time.

Its like watching new born kitten being kicked with steel boots in slow motion.
pure speculation - and from what ive seen, hes hardly like that anyways.

when former fat girl came on to him, pursued him constantly- Utsumi didnt toy with her or lead her on. He made himself clear that he already had someone else in mind. As big of a vagina as he is, he has demonstrated more resilience than Haruto. If Utsumi were to become LIKE haruto, he would rebound hardcore with the photography girl and officially date her (like Atsuka).

Thus far, it has yet to happen. And judging from the previous chapter, he's clearly ready to chase after Yuki.
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Old 2011-07-25, 18:53   Link #2889
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Originally Posted by recover View Post
pure speculation - and from what ive seen, hes hardly like that anyways.

when former fat girl came on to him, pursued him constantly- Utsumi didnt toy with her or lead her on. He made himself clear that he already had someone else in mind. As big of a vagina as he is, he has demonstrated more resilience than Haruto. If Utsumi were to become LIKE haruto, he would rebound hardcore with the photography girl and officially date her (like Atsuka).

Thus far, it has yet to happen. And judging from the previous chapter, he's clearly ready to chase after Yuki.
Actually Haruto didnt pursue girls that went after him if he didnt think he liked them. Utsumi didnt do it in this example either, but if he thought he liked her started an releationship and then ended up realizing the opposite - Utsu just do not have enough balls to deal with it, he would be crawling all back to her because of his consciousness. Hell he even had hard time of denying Risa though he was pretty sure he didnt like her to begin with.

Utsumi is a doormat. Haruto is hardly that really. You may like him, you may not, and he is dumb enough to deserve that, but he is not a big vagina like Utsumi.

And that he is ready to crawl after Yuki again doenst make him better. If anything it only makes him look more pathetic and desperate.

If it happens once, that I can understand - as he just swallows his pride to save something more important to him (even though he is not a fault) and that looks like self-sacrifice, but doing this so many times just reeks of having no self-respect whatsoever. Thats not salf-sacrifice anymore but just plainly being a doormat.
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Old 2011-07-25, 19:44   Link #2890
recover
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Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
Actually Haruto didnt pursue girls that went after him if he didnt think he liked them. Utsumi didnt do it in this example either, but if he thought he liked her started an releationship and then ended up realizing the opposite - Utsu just do not have enough balls to deal with it, he would be crawling all back to her because of his consciousness. Hell he even had hard time of denying Risa though he was pretty sure he didnt like her to begin with.

Utsumi is a doormat. Haruto is hardly that really. You may like him, you may not, and he is dumb enough to deserve that, but he is not a big vagina like Utsumi.

And that he is ready to crawl after Yuki again doenst make him better. If anything it only makes him look more pathetic and desperate.

If it happens once, that I can understand - as he just swallows his pride to save something more important to him (even though he is not a fault) and that looks like self-sacrifice, but doing this so many times just reeks of having no self-respect whatsoever. Thats not salf-sacrifice anymore but just plainly being a doormat.
bolded is pure speculation. it didnt happen, so ur making an assumption on what he "may" do. he rejected all of former fatty's advances, so theres no reason to believe he would treat her like how haruto treated asuka.

Yuki and her behavior, while not acceptable, is more understandable that Eba's. Eba, who disappeared without ANY notice/reason to go become the GF of some other guy is MUCH worse than Yuki's breakup.

back up just a second, and lets analyze the reason for her breaking up:

She felt that she could not satisfy Utsumi (sexually...emotionally...whatever), so instead of stepping up to the plate, she backed off in a cowardly fashion. Essentially she acted in a "fake martyr" or "self-sacrificing" manner. This has been consistent in her personality THROUGHOUT the series.

Do I like her for it? Nope, but do I blame her? Not really, as its pretty normal in actual life. People feel inadequate in a relationship and thus breakup out of love for the other person, so they can find happiness elsewhere. This DOES happen.

Skip forward again to the discussion on Eba. Now here is Eba, who was (up until the point of the disappearance) a solid female protagonist. She demonstrated few, if any, signs of being such a "flake." All of a sudden, she is gone and even though she is by some other guys bedside, Haruto chases her. He chases her mercilessly and without shame. I would not chase after such a girl.

Utsumi chasing after Yuki in this situation, this upcoming chapter...I see nothing wrong with it. Is he a pussy-whipped male teen? yes. But it is more understandable than chasing a flake and (what i consider) someone completely undeserving of trust.

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-07-25, 20:30   Link #2891
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i've read KNIM before going into GE. and i loved KNIM, but i have to agree, KNIM has a lot of "wtf" moments (i guess the mangaka really put a "lot" of sensational events)

and in my opinion, i agree to the above poster who said that GE is more realistic in a way. GE is pretty straight forward, though a little slow in movement.

making it clear. i loved them both.
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Old 2011-07-26, 00:23   Link #2892
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Quote:
Originally Posted by recover View Post
All of a sudden, she is gone and even though she is by some other guys bedside, Haruto chases her. He chases her mercilessly and without shame. I would not chase after such a girl.

Utsumi chasing after Yuki in this situation, this upcoming chapter...I see nothing wrong with it. Is he a pussy-whipped male teen? yes. But it is more understandable than chasing a flake and (what i consider) someone completely undeserving of trust.
What are you talking about? She just left one note, unclear one about breaking up and finding another guy. Of course he chases her up. I would chase her up to clear the things up. The only difference that I would not throw everything i have for that this easily. But be shure i would chase after her too. Just probably after learning the things he did I would sure as hell be acting mucgh more angry and would make a scene.

But anyone would chase after the girlfriend in such situation just to find out what the hell is going on.

For me Eba isnt more frustrating than Yuki. They are both as annoying really. The only thing aabout eba is that she looks hot (specially after the timeskip) while I feel no attraction towards the way Sasuga draws her characters.
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Old 2011-07-26, 00:44   Link #2893
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What are you talking about? She just left one note, unclear one about breaking up and finding another guy. Of course he chases her up. I would chase her up to clear the things up. The only difference that I would not throw everything i have for that this easily. But be shure i would chase after her too. Just probably after learning the things he did I would sure as hell be acting mucgh more angry and would make a scene.

But anyone would chase after the girlfriend in such situation just to find out what the hell is going on.

For me Eba isnt more frustrating than Yuki. They are both as annoying really. The only thing aabout eba is that she looks hot (specially after the timeskip) while I feel no attraction towards the way Sasuga draws her characters.
i agree. also on your 3rd paragraph. Spot on. I don't like Sasuga's artwork.
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Old 2011-07-26, 01:04   Link #2894
vansonbee
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More hate on Pastel, I am so putting it last to read.

KNIM target a older audience? I won't say if it does or not, but they haven't dwell on topic of sex, compared to GE.

I would say I enjoy GE pace of development, KNIM had the same effect at the beginning, but currently from middle arc and up, its painfully rushed to a forced "happy ending", now that everything is slow and easy for Eba/Haruto, its kind of blend w/o the unnecessary drama to create tension.
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Old 2011-07-26, 03:11   Link #2895
Merilyn Mensola
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Originally Posted by Lexxus View Post
If the spoiler were true then

Spoiler:
Spoiler:



Please..stopt o talk about KNIM..i really dislike Haruto..I don't want people to start a war on this thread as the thread KniM...thanks
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Old 2011-07-26, 03:17   Link #2896
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merilyn Mensola View Post
Spoiler:


Please..stopt o talk about KNIM..i really dislike Haruto..I don't want people to start a war on this thread as the thread KniM...thanks
Agreed, please stop talking about KNIM because there are people here, myself included, who haven't read that series and may not necessarily be interested in it.

Spoiler for New chapter:
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Old 2011-07-26, 03:38   Link #2897
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Agreed, please stop talking about KNIM because there are people here, myself included, who haven't read that series and may not necessarily be interested in it.

Spoiler for New chapter:

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Spoiler:
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Old 2011-07-26, 03:42   Link #2898
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Mensola
Spoiler:


Spoiler for New chapter:
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Old 2011-07-26, 09:46   Link #2899
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Originally Posted by vansonbee View Post
I won't say if it does or not, but they haven't dwell on topic of sex, compared to GE.
Maybe you should read KNIM agaoin. There was plenty of dwell on that issue in Asuka/Haruto relationship. It never turned into be nor it became some super trooper trauma either, but there was certainly dwell on it.
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Old 2011-07-26, 11:29   Link #2900
vansonbee
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Maybe you should read KNIM agaoin. There was plenty of dwell on that issue in Asuka/Haruto relationship. It never turned into be nor it became some super trooper trauma either, but there was certainly dwell on it.
Yup, do recall alright~, but still sad that older set characters, still don't compare to high school kids of GE
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